[WW] Wolves of the Crimson Moon

LordMortis · Post by **LordMortis** » Fri Aug 31, 2007 3:02 pm

I want to go ahead and do the same thing and let it all hang out as you did Unagi but I am afraid the wolf will use my suspicions against me. I think that would be one of the potentially cool things with all of us announcing our roles. It has the possbility of narrowing the targets down something fierce.

I like the idea so much that I would force the issue by announcing my role, but the problem is that the last time I got cocky and forced an issue, I was wrong with my arrogance against Ralph Wiggum and Chaos Raven and PR_GMR. (I still think what I did was really right and everyone else made the wrong play, but that's neither here nor there)

Kraegor · Post by **Kraegor** » Fri Aug 31, 2007 3:19 pm

sitting on your role forever, eh LM? rather amusing considering what's left. if you have something to disclose it would be useful to do it now. Waiting till tomorrow would be a huge mistake. there's gunshy and then there's batshit terrified.

there's 2 turns left (max). It ends today. Or tomorrow.

Unagi · Post by **Unagi** » Fri Aug 31, 2007 3:25 pm

Kraegor wrote:
LordMortis wrote: A third seer coming out, just screams of more problems to me.
I was going to do it but ya'll killed Remus in a chain vote during the night/early morning.
Put simply just as "we" do not know who the seer is, neither did the wolves. I wanted more time to cause a panic. But nope ya'll had to prematurely hang remus.

What a strange thing to claim and/or do.
Not sure how this could possibly help the village - had you claimed Seer last night, that would have been a 'wolf' thing to do, not a villager's inclination. Villagers are trying to simplify things - Wolves go for the 'cause panic'.

The wolves know when they have killed the Seer, and that is perhaps their main priority. Not killing Remus on night 1 was not how 2 wolves wondering if Remus was the real Seer would have approached night 1.
You saying that you were going 'Fake Seer' on our second night in order to confuse the wolfs totally ignores that the wolves (or wolf) seems to have passed on their chance to be confused by Remus's 'Fake Seer'... I think the wolves knew they got the Seer lynched on day 1.

LordMortis · Post by **LordMortis** » Fri Aug 31, 2007 3:44 pm

Kraegor wrote:sitting on your role forever, eh LM? rather amusing considering what's left. if you have something to disclose it would be useful to do it now. Waiting till tomorrow would be a huge mistake. there's gunshy and then there's batshit terrified.

there's 2 turns left (max). It ends today. Or tomorrow.

I'm thinking I'm happy to disclose what I am. I'm happy to go first. I'm not happy to do it while a wolf shrouds himself in mystery and then comes out later armed with knowing who's dead and knowing how to play us against each other after we start making declarations. I also think I have a bead on who's who.

Rather than consider that there's only two turns left to find a wolf. Consider how stating our positions potentially forces the wolves to hide in a smaller pool. For instance if two masons came out, they would gauruntee that one of them would be the next target but they would also narrow our lynching from choices to three today. And if we fail, our choice is 50/50. But by the same token, if the masons don't come out and one of them gets pushed toward the edge they can claim 100% immunity after the accusations have flown.

Which is the better way to go? Is there a better opition? I don't know. I think making role claims today is better than potentially worrying about them tomorrow when they will only be meaningful if both masons are alive, but even if role revelation is the best way to go, I'm not sure how to go about doing it in the best way.

What would you have me do? Do you want me to come out right now?

Unagi · Post by **Unagi** » Fri Aug 31, 2007 4:01 pm

I think it's best for things to develop the most today, gives the village 2 shots at finding the wolf.

I'd like to hear a little more from Austin before LordMortis claims his ROLE. I'd sorta like to hear from Austin in regards to where he is leaning on who's what, etc. Also, if it wouldn't risk anything, I'd like to hear how he was made to be certain I was a powerless villager. (although, perhaps that should wait)... however, perhaps that, along with the mason(s) would shore up a block of non-wolves.

What the wolf does when LordMortis reveals his ROLE will also be interesting. Would the wolf challenge it and claim the same role?

Kraegor · Post by **Kraegor** » Fri Aug 31, 2007 9:56 pm

eel wrote:The wolves know when they have killed the Seer,

interesting. I was not aware of that. yeah that woulda really fubared my plan.

I'm the last mason. The other was pr0ner. simple enough to discern when one bothers to notice voting patterns. And the fact that not once did pr0ner try to get me lynched. I personally thought his lack of animosity towards me was a rather large tell, but perhaps that's cuz I'm the one he always attacks :p

As for my seer plan, the goal was simple. I would claim seer. I was expecting Remus to manage a wagon on me. I'm fairly easy to wagon since I tend to walk the line. Anywho once the wagon started to form I felt there would be data to work off of, at which point pr0ner would come to my rescue by acknowledging my PM. From there it likely would have led to Remus' lynch anyways...but I was counting on the initial wagon on me to provide something more for today's events. I was also planning on being dead, but pr0ner would be alive and already trusted. Hence the overall goal being one step farther than we are now.

of course in the end it only works if the wolves bought it. The fact that they know the identity of the eaten destroys it's efficacy pretty solidly but only if Grund was the seer.

LM wrote:
I'm not happy to do it while a wolf shrouds himself in mystery and then comes out later armed with knowing who's dead and knowing how to play us against each other after we start making declarations. I also think I have a bead on who's who.

yes you've been hedging for a while now.

you have a bead do you LM? fine if you are the priest what did you discover?

Unagi is looking like a rather obvious wolf. Especially with his change in behavior after Remus died.

As for you LM, your hedging makes me suspicious simply because it comes off exactly as you have just outlined. You want to tease but make no commitment until you know what everyone else will say. hence another wolf. You've been hinting at ability for 2 days and yet remained alive. pr0ner hinted at nothing and got eaten. How did you become a lower profile target than pr0ner? The only reason pr0ner became a viable target is if the wolves connected him to me, by the obvious means I listed above. But if you are the priest, why would the wolves go for a mason first?

Austin and st_dysan have been virtually silent which leads to even more doubt since IF Grund and Remus were both innocent....we've never even been remotely on track and Austin/dysan just sat back and let things play out.

What I do know for certain is the 4 of you all voted to lynch Remus and Grund. I did not vote for either. Nor did pr0ner.

Hence, my concerns about 2 wolves. I see 2 sets of paired behavior. Where is coincidence and where is intent?

Kraegor · Post by **Kraegor** » Fri Aug 31, 2007 10:01 pm

hah wait a sec. my plan still woulda worked. Grund and Remus were lynched. The wolves knew nothing of their Identities.

got me confused for a sec there Unagi. the only possible roles the wolves are aware of are priest/mason.

LordMortis · Post by **LordMortis** » Sat Sep 01, 2007 2:10 am

I'm a little lit but as we are all almost all out now anyway, I'm a regular villager. I'd have said so first but I guess I was hedging. I peg you as an alleged mason but I actually pegged Kelric as your partner. Even if you pushed yourself to lynching and came out alone I don't see the wolves countering your claim. I put st_dysan as our alleged preist and pr0ner as regular villager. My thoughts on st_dysan and his allusions to more detail have strengthened my confidence in him as priest... or wolf in priests clothes. I was kinda hoping to hear st_dysan's revelations before you came out.

That leaves me, Unagi, and Austin as normal villagers and quite frankly the choice of three for best to lynch. I know I'm not wolf, so I won't go for me but you can't know that. My thought is quite frankly that one of the three of us get voted down today. If the wolf dies, great. Otherwise, you probably die in the night and then tomorrow it could be anyone of three remaining. When it's all said and done the village is still favored.

As I peg Unagi and Austin as the highest potential for bad guys, my assumption is that I will go today as they will go after me. *shrug*

Anyhoo. My cards are on the table. So, as I won't forgive myself if Austin is the bad guy and makes it to the end again, my token vote is for Austin.

Unagi · Post by **Unagi** » Sat Sep 01, 2007 12:41 pm

Kraegor wrote:I'm the last mason. The other was pr0ner. simple enough to discern when one bothers to notice voting patterns.

This could be true, but it smells a little bit like Remus' claim to have PMed Kelric ("ahh shucks, 'so-in-so' died, he was my proof!"). As long as Austin and st_dysan don't chime in as Seer, Priest, or Mason - I would have to believe your claim to be true. But it's horrible luck that pr0ner died and now we can't actually verify it. (However, collectively - the rest of us can, I think.) So - hopefully we'll be able to verify this before the day is done.

Kraegor wrote: As for my seer plan, the goal was simple. I would claim seer. I was expecting Remus to manage a wagon on me. I'm fairly easy to wagon since I tend to walk the line. Anywho once the wagon started to form I felt there would be data to work off of, at which point pr0ner would come to my rescue by acknowledging my PM. From there it likely would have led to Remus' lynch anyways...but I was counting on the initial wagon on me to provide something more for today's events. I was also planning on being dead, but pr0ner would be alive and already trusted. Hence the overall goal being one step farther than we are now.

My biggest problem with that plan is that it kinda doesn't make that much sense. If we were looking at 2 wolves left, just how many days did you think we had to screw around with round 3 of 'figure out the Seer'. If we were looking at 2 wolves left, that would mean 4 villagers dead right now, and we'd of had 2 masons and the seer left who couldn't figure out who the wolves were until it was just them left !? really? I'll be reasonable and agree this doesn't say that you are a wolf - but I think enaging in the 'role confusion' game is a gambit, especially in a game like this where the seer could have been lynched on day 1, and only the wolves know it.

Kraegor wrote: of course in the end it only works if the wolves bought it. The fact that they know the identity of the eaten destroys it's efficacy pretty solidly but only if Grund was the seer.

I don't think it makes sense for the mason to fake seer. Perhaps I'm looking at this wrong, but if someone starts to claim a bunch of different roles, that's just bound to cause confusion and misdirection. Isn't that what people are always saying is the job of the wolves?

Kraegor wrote:Unagi is looking like a rather obvious wolf. Especially with his change in behavior after Remus died.

err, my change in behavior? I'd actually say your behavior has been the one that has changed, but - well, I'd bet we're both right. Since Remus was lynched you've had a lot say. Before that - not that much really.

Kraegor wrote:What I do know for certain is the 4 of you all voted to lynch Remus and Grund. I did not vote for either. Nor did pr0ner.
Hence, my concerns about 2 wolves. I see 2 sets of paired behavior. Where is coincidence and where is intent?

I am amazed that you think we got 2 wolves left. Clearly it would be really slick (and fun to imagine) 2 wolves watching us argue who to lynch first, 'Villager 1' or 'Villager 2', but I think this was a showdown between Wolf-1 and our brave selfless Seer. I agree that their is a lot of pairing of behaviors (a lot of people voted for both Grund and Remus), but I think that's because there was a strong case for tying their fates together.

Grund was not a villager faking seer. Nor was Remus. I'm fairly convinced of that. That is indeed at the heart of my whole position here.
It leads to them being (collectively) Wolf-1 and the Seer. If I combine that into everyone's claims... I am left with:

Grundbegriff - Wolf-1 / Seer
Kelric - UNKNOWN villager (Apparently Priest)
Remus West - Wolf-1 / Seer
pr0ner - Mason (unverified) (dead men tell no tales)
Kraegor - Mason (unverified) (shared doubt on all, perhaps most on Unagi)
LordMortis - villager (unverified) (vote stands on Austin)
Unagi - villager (unverified) (thrown accusation at Kraegor)
Austin - villager (unverified)
st_dysan - UNKNOWN (has made no claim, potentially Wolf-2)

So, if everyone were telling the truth (hardy har), this would be where it stands right now.

I'm very interested to hear st_dysan's claim.
I'm also interested to hear Austin's analysis.
Both will be interesting.

st_dysan · Post by **st_dysan** » Sat Sep 01, 2007 6:54 pm

Unagi has some interesting ideas above me... I'm not sure where my prejudice lies.. with grund and RW gone.... the vocalness of the group has left.

Once again I'm less vocal this time as my internet time is limited with the new job but its the weekend so I'm a little more free.

Unagi · Post by **Unagi** » Sat Sep 01, 2007 7:31 pm

So st_dysan, you don't care to join in revealing your role then?

Unagi · Post by **Unagi** » Sun Sep 02, 2007 2:04 pm

LordMortis, your vote hinges on st_dysan being the priest then? or?

LordMortis · Post by **LordMortis** » Mon Sep 03, 2007 2:45 pm

Unagi wrote:LordMortis, your vote hinges on st_dysan being the priest then? or?

Hinges? No. My vote is that, unless something else comes up, I'll be annoyed if Austin lives until the end and turns out to be a wolf. I just put st_dysan on the priest from his silence and that was strengthened by

Guys...I'm following but busy at work.. will make a more substantial post tnight.

Unfortunately the more substantial post never happened, so I don't know where to put him. The more substantial post never happening is not something I am comfortable with, actually.

Austin · Post by **Austin** » Mon Sep 03, 2007 3:42 pm

I am back and unpacking. My Internet wasn't as available as I thought it was going to be. I'll catch up and check in ASAP.

Austin · Post by **Austin** » Mon Sep 03, 2007 4:13 pm

It's got to be Lord Mortis or St Dysan. More analysis coming.

Unagi · Post by **Unagi** » Mon Sep 03, 2007 4:15 pm

LordMortis wrote:
Unagi wrote:LordMortis, your vote hinges on st_dysan being the priest then? or?
Hinges? No. My vote is that, unless something else comes up, I'll be annoyed if Austin lives until the end and turns out to be a wolf. I just put st_dysan on the priest from his silence and that was strengthened by

Guys...I'm following but busy at work.. will make a more substantial post tnight.
Unfortunately the more substantial post never happened, so I don't know where to put him. The more substantial post never happening is not something I am comfortable with, actually.

Well, here is the thing though.

If Kelric was not the priest, and you believe that Kraegor is a Mason with pr0ner - st_dysan is either a Wolf or a 'normal villager'... Hence, he should be included in your Austin, Unagi, LordMortis line-up (as the undeclared Priest).

I think it would be weird for the Priest to have not chimed in yet, so I think the following is more likely:

If Kelric was the priest, then we've got st_dysan sitting here amongst a proclaimed Mason and three proclaimed 'normal villagers', and he didn't feel compelled to at the very least proclaim 'normal villager' too.

I'm also not quite over my Kraegor suspisions, even though his claim of Mason is uncontested (and hence, I'll soon just need to accept it)...

If st_dysan claims priest, I'm inclined to run with these two thoughts:
1) He a liar. The priest was Kelric (hence the silence) and st_dysan is the wolf and I was right about Austin's "Noel" hint.
2) He's the priest and Kelric was perhaps Mason-1, leaving my thoughts on Kraegor in place (killing both Masons, he knew the role was safe to fake).

If st_dysane claims villager
1) He is a liar. He has never made any claims thus far and has made very few meaningful posts.
2) Austin is a liar. Grundbegriff had him nailed right out of the gate and we'd be fools not to lynch him one of these 2 nights.
3) LordMortis is a liar. I will admit that I've been focused elsewhere with my accusations and as such, I feel a little exposed on the LordMortis front. If you end up being the wolf, I think you played the game well. The main thing making me doubt your villager claim (over Austin and myself), is just that you never claimed it before - and it's a fairly easy/safe thing to claim (*especially if you are).
4) I am the liar. Well, clearly I am not inclined to accuse myself - so I will just offer up a modest defense here... My lynching votes, I feel, were all in line with Grundbegriff's original analysis, and I wouln't have played that differently (actually, perhaps I would start with Remus next time, just because I think he was the wolf, and we'd have been more assured that we had the Seer+Wolf-1 if 'the other guy' died the following night.) My analysis has been honest and transparent. I'm not trying to muddy the waters or 'cause panic'.

Austin · Post by **Austin** » Mon Sep 03, 2007 5:10 pm

LordMortis wrote:
Anyhoo. My cards are on the table. So, as I won't forgive myself if Austin is the bad guy and makes it to the end again, my token vote is for Austin.

If you were in the unpowered innocent club you probably wouldn't vote for me. I'd like to see what st_dysan claims. (of course I'm reading backwards and all around so maybe I'll get to it)

Austin · Post by **Austin** » Mon Sep 03, 2007 5:16 pm

It also seems on a quicky type backward read that Mortis suggests coming out with roles but doesn't himself until others have. Like he's looking for who might contradict him. Lord Mortis gets my vote for now, but it's for punctuation right now and I'm not looking for a bunch of votes on him until st_dysan comes out with his role.

st_dysan · Post by **st_dysan** » Mon Sep 03, 2007 5:37 pm

It seems to me from the preceeding posts, that the prevailing thought is that there is one wolf left... Am I reading those right.. because I'm not so sure that is the case.

LordMortis · Post by **LordMortis** » Mon Sep 03, 2007 6:09 pm

1) The only way Kreagor is a liar is if both masons were eaten or if there is a mason (or two) out there to call him on it. The only way both masons were eaten is if we have a living priest who would assuredly know this and would have called Kreagor to the mat.

2)

Austin wrote:If you were in the unpowered innocent club you probably wouldn't vote for me. I'd like to see what st_dysan claims. (of course I'm reading backwards and all around so maybe I'll get to it)

And yet I am.

It also seems on a quicky type backward read that Mortis suggests coming out with roles but doesn't himself until others have. Like he's looking for who might contradict him.

Way back on day one I would have come out had three people claimed to be unpowered. That's why I was so inquisitive to people having claimed a lack of power much. The hope was that we could have started narrowing things down right there. But that conversation got stopped with the push for Remus and then Grund claiming that he was lieing.

I would have been happy to have come out earlier today. I didn't want others to come out before me, I wanted commitment so we could piece together backwards those must be not be wolves. However, I don't know what the specials know, so I was not going to attempt force them out. Why jump at a mason when he could stay hidden and be proven true if everyone jumped on him? What if two masons lived? Our strength would have been huge.

LordMortis · Post by **LordMortis** » Mon Sep 03, 2007 6:17 pm

st_dysan wrote:It seems to me from the preceeding posts, that the prevailing thought is that there is one wolf left... Am I reading those right.. because I'm not so sure that is the case.

That has been my assumption. I don't think it's reasonable to assume that neither Grund nor Remus was a wolf. Between you and Kreagor you've got me going through my head over and over how it would be possible for two people to come forward as seers and neither one be a wolf and I'm just not seeing it. I'm not seeing it as much as I'm not seeing one of them being the seer. I'm not infallible though. Walk me through it.

Unagi · Post by **Unagi** » Mon Sep 03, 2007 6:46 pm

LordMortis wrote:Way back on day one I would have come out had three people claimed to be unpowered. That's why I was so inquisitive to people having claimed a lack of power much. The hope was that we could have started narrowing things down right there. But that conversation got stopped with the push for Remus and then Grund claiming that he was lieing.

Actually, 3 people did claim 'unpowered' on day 1.
Grundbegriff, Austin, and Me.

LordMortis · Post by **LordMortis** » Mon Sep 03, 2007 7:14 pm

Unagi wrote:
LordMortis wrote:Way back on day one I would have come out had three people claimed to be unpowered. That's why I was so inquisitive to people having claimed a lack of power much. The hope was that we could have started narrowing things down right there. But that conversation got stopped with the push for Remus and then Grund claiming that he was lieing.
Actually, 3 people did claim 'unpowered' on day 1.
Grundbegriff, Austin, and Me.

So did Kelric. That's when I tried I was asking how sure people were they unpowered. (I missed you

) And that's when I started to ask questions. And that's when things went against Remus and then against Grund.

Unagi · Post by **Unagi** » Mon Sep 03, 2007 8:44 pm

LordMortis wrote:
st_dysan wrote:It seems to me from the preceeding posts, that the prevailing thought is that there is one wolf left... Am I reading those right.. because I'm not so sure that is the case.
That has been my assumption. I don't think it's reasonable to assume that neither Grund nor Remus was a wolf. Between you and Kreagor you've got me going through my head over and over how it would be possible for two people to come forward as seers and neither one be a wolf and I'm just not seeing it. I'm not seeing it as much as I'm not seeing one of them being the seer. I'm not infallible though. Walk me through it.

Yeah st_dysan, please do walk me through it too.

This makes no sense to me (clearly, it's 'technically possible', it just makes No Sense).

Why would either of them have been so vocal, clear, and adament about it being critical that we all understand one was Seer, one was Wolf if these were actually villagers pretending to be Seer.

I think if someone began (Remus in this case) as Faking Seer, and and then another chimed in as Seer... That original person would use language like "well, I guess we can't be sure who the Seer really is then..."

Not things like:

grundbegriff wrote:I want you, and everyone, to come to the conclusion that I have the strongest imaginable motivation for wanting the Village to win, and for doubting that Remus is the Seer, as he claims.
I'm the Seer. That's how I know with 100% certainty that Remus West is lying.

clearly the wolf wouldn't have a problem making this lie. A villager would be setting the village up for disaster with this being a totally false claim.

Or then there is:

Remus West wrote:As I see it you have two choices, me or Grund. Killing anyone else settles nothing. If you lynch me then you will have to lynch Grund tomorrow. If we lynch Grund then I get eaten tonight and you can take a shot at the last wolf tomorrow.

As I am sure we all can recall - Remus was actually NOT eaten. He actually lied about sending a PM to Kelric, later admitted to that lie - so he could point out that his 'scan' revealed pr0ner as being innocent. That night, pr0ner died.
So... The wolves are killing pr0ner, for no apparent reason - but just magically decided that Remus must have been faking Seer and isn't worth a mauling!? C'mon !?

Look. Neither Remus nor Grund was a 'normal villager' faking Seer. It makes ZERO sense. None.

Frankly, if either of them was faking Seer - I'll go out on a limb and say 'Thanks for ruining the chances of the Villagers'. And this should go down in the books for "how not to fake Seer as a normal villager".

Honestly - I can't for a minute imagine that we don't have 1 Wolf dead. (and 1 Seer).

Lets attack it from the other angle.

Lets see how this works out:
Grundbegriff: Villager 1
Kelric: Priest
Remus West: Villager 2
pr0ner: Mason 1
- - - - - - - - -
LordMortis: Villager 3
Kraegor: Mason 2
st_dysan: Seer ????
Unagi: Wolf 1
Austin: Wolf 2

I've been kind and slapped 'Wolf 1 and Wolf2' on Austin and I.

I guess that means that st_dysan has been the Seer all along.
Or maybe Kelric was our Seer, and st_dysan is the Priest?

Either way - we should ask st_dysan right now. Which is it!? Are you Wolf, Villager, Seer, or Priest !?

Austin · Post by **Austin** » Mon Sep 03, 2007 9:25 pm

I'd really like to know who the third unpowered is. I'm 95% sure on Unagi and I think he sees what I'm talking about. If I'm wrong, I'm wrong but from my perspective Mortis and st_dysan are the best bets. I'm trying not to get drawn too much into what-if's and little side tracks.

I believe the seer is dead and Remus or Grund was a wolf. (and one a seer) I believe the priest is dead and that Pr0ner was a mason as is Kraegor. Nobody has been stepping up to claim otherwise on any of them. If I'm wrong and we lose I'll be happy to shift blame to specials that stayed hidden when it was the worst play and/or people who faked things unnecessarily. I believe that Unagi is an unpowered and if I'm misreading some of his antics, it's a big miss on me but like I said, I'm 95% sure.

How's tha math work right now? Can we afford a miss or is this it? If we can miss once, I don't care who we kill today so long as it's one of the two.

Unagi · Post by **Unagi** » Mon Sep 03, 2007 10:19 pm

1 Wolf = 2 chances.
2 Wolves = We're fucked. (actually, I think we'd still have 2 shots, but if we still have 2 wolves - we've proven we can't figure crap out and the chances that we get them both are horrid.

Frankly, I feel basically the same way you do Austin. Except that - and I can't begin to tell you how much I regret to say this - I haven't a clue how you are sure I am an unpowered, and hence - I'm only about 60% sure you are a villager... actually - maybe more like 40%. But I am even less sure about LordMortis (lets call it 35%), and st_dysan's inability to actually post anything meaningful has me at about 5% sure he's not a wolf.

I'd lean toward a st_dysan lynching today if I had to make the vote. And, well - I guess if he doesn't say a thing more - I may as well...

st_dysan (not trying to run him up either, just want to force the point here).

Unagi · Post by **Unagi** » Mon Sep 03, 2007 10:21 pm

And then, as I send that post I say to myself, 'Why aren't you more concerned about LordMortis's "pass" on st_dysan...'

LordMortis,
Why aren't you including st_dysan on your list of 'baddies' again?

Austin · Post by **Austin** » Mon Sep 03, 2007 10:27 pm

Unagi wrote: Frankly, I feel basically the same way you do Austin. Except that - and I can't begin to tell you how much I regret to say this - I haven't a clue how you are sure I am an unpowered, and hence - I'm only about 60% sure you are a villager... actually - maybe more like 40%.

Interesting. I'll chalk it up to you being new and not noticing the difference. But like I said, if I'm wrong, it's a big miss. I'm guessing on whether he did the same for other unpowereds also so I might be misreading something. /shrug.

Unagi · Post by **Unagi** » Tue Sep 04, 2007 12:42 am

Oh, actually then...
We are on the same page. I still have some doubts that I will bring up after this game is over regarding this.

But back to the lynching.

You've convinced (perhaps taking horrible advantage of my newness) me that I am focused on Kraegor, LordMortis, and st_dysan.

I probably need to drop the Kraegor ideas as it would seem he's a mason. Since no other Mason stepped up we can be sure they are either both dead - or Kraegor is being truthful. Since no Priest has shown up, Kelric was most likely it - and that shores up the only other option for Mason-2. so, Kraegor is clear in my books right now.

LordMortis is perhaps playing this so passively that he is indeed our wolf.

st_dysan. I am reluctant to pressume someones guilty due to a lack of any information pointing anywhere. I'm not sure if he's lurking and not posting, or simply away attending something important like work or family. I am going to withdraw st_dysan for now, until we hear perhaps one more thing from him.

st_dysan · Post by **st_dysan** » Tue Sep 04, 2007 8:21 am

I'm just a villager, I believe Remus was a wolf and grund was prob a seer or priest.. but prob the seer as he claimed. I'm still not sure where my biases lie now...but I can assure you I'm just a villager.

Austin · Post by **Austin** » Tue Sep 04, 2007 8:42 am

Well at this point then I'll vote with Unagi and Kraegor. Kraegor will have to trust that Ug and I know what we're talking about and/or will the other villager. I still think Remus might be the best bet but it could well be dysan too.

Edit: I also find Mortis' continued "I'm voting for Remus, I'm voting for Remus day 1, Day 1 Remus, Kill him Day 1" repetition to be solid wolf play if they were both wolves.

LordMortis · Post by **LordMortis** » Tue Sep 04, 2007 9:01 am

Unagi wrote:Frankly, if either of them was faking Seer - I'll go out on a limb and say 'Thanks for ruining the chances of the Villagers'. And this should go down in the books for "how not to fake Seer as a normal villager".

That would be my thought as well. It creates too much chaos. And how in the heck would you then trust a third seer coming out?

and I can't begin to tell you how much I regret to say this - I haven't a clue how you are sure I am an unpowered, and hence - I'm only about 60% sure you are a villager...

Austin's implying that we all received the same message from Raven revealing the nature of our non roles and that you used that terminology to hint whom you are. He then wanted to make it public that he understood you as a message to the third non roled.

LordMortis,
Why aren't you including st_dysan on your list of 'baddies' again?

I'm not sure what you are getting at. The only baddies on my was Austin. (except for Grund or Remus)

st_dysan wrote:I'm just a villager, I believe Remus was a wolf and grund was prob a seer or priest.. but prob the seer as he claimed. I'm still not sure where my biases lie now...but I can assure you I'm just a villager.

Well, that changes things. withdraw Austin. I was waiting for the big revelation. It was honestly my hope that you would come out as the priest and reveal that Kelric was the other mason, have Kreagor back you, still have no one come out to dispute your claims and we could know that you and Kreagor are not wolves.

With no revelation my hope in you goes down dramatically. So now we have four unpowered villagers left out of three. I guess that sort of implies that Kelric was the priest and pr0ner was a mason. That sorta sucks. I am certain where my baises lie now but I'm still not even close to certain of who a wolf is short of not Kreagor.

(BTW, if Grund and Remus were both not wolves and Kelric and pr0ner were masons making two wolves alive and Kreagor one of them, we are exactly totally and completely fucked, which is exactly the sort of reason why I can't the two a human one of them playing that game.)

Austin · Post by **Austin** » Tue Sep 04, 2007 9:08 am

LordMortis wrote:
Austin's implying that we all received the same message from Raven revealing the nature of our non roles and that you used that terminology to hint whom you are. He then wanted to make it public that he understood you as a message to the third non roled.

Definitely Lord Mortis

LordMortis · Post by **LordMortis** » Tue Sep 04, 2007 10:19 am

Austin wrote:
LordMortis wrote:
Austin's implying that we all received the same message from Raven revealing the nature of our non roles and that you used that terminology to hint whom you are. He then wanted to make it public that he understood you as a message to the third non roled.

Definitely Lord Mortis

Definately, huh? And when tomorrow comes and you are still alive, what then, Austin?

Austin · Post by **Austin** » Tue Sep 04, 2007 10:21 am

All I can say is that, I in fact have a power. I am the local butcher and I can cut meat really thin. What's your power? I'm guessing Unagi is a construction worker or roofer of of sort and his power is placing shingles nice and even.

Kraegor · Post by **Kraegor** » Tue Sep 04, 2007 10:47 am

LM wrote: It was honestly my hope that you would come out as the priest and reveal that Kelric was the other mason, have Kreagor back you, still have no one come out to dispute your claims and we could know that you and Kreagor are not wolves.

why would I back a priest that says Kelric is a mason?

Kraegor · Post by **Kraegor** » Tue Sep 04, 2007 10:49 am

Austin wrote:Well at this point then I'll vote with Unagi and Kraegor. Kraegor will have to trust that Ug and I know what we're talking about and/or will the other villager. I still think Remus might be the best bet but it could well be dysan too.

You consider Remus the best bet as the other villager? wanna elaborate?

Austin · Post by **Austin** » Tue Sep 04, 2007 10:53 am

Kraegor wrote:
Austin wrote:Well at this point then I'll vote with Unagi and Kraegor. Kraegor will have to trust that Ug and I know what we're talking about and/or will the other villager. I still think Remus might be the best bet but it could well be dysan too.
You consider Remus the best bet as the other villager? wanna elaborate?

Sorry... mixed up the names. I get them Michigan folks crossed at times. I meant I still think Mortis is our best bet (for wolf).

Unagi · Post by **Unagi** » Tue Sep 04, 2007 11:24 am

OK, I am on board with joining a vote with Kraegor and you, Austin (that is, if Kraegor will have us.)

Between st_dysan and LordMortis, I think you may have got it Austin... (in that it is LordMortis) Last night I re-read the whole thread with that in mind (Remus + LordMortis) and it looked possible. LordMortis did a good job trying to stay neutral in his key desicions. He was often asking the whole village to help him make his decision - fairly effective at making himself seem hardly in control of his own actions.
His initial vote for Remus would have been his fall back position, in fact - while re-reading the posts - - You can almost get a sense for when Remus was resolved to being lynched, and perhaps told LordMortis to just lay it on thick against me now...

st_dysan isn't yet a sure thing in the way that Austin and I are fairly sure we are under-powered, so I still hold some suspicions against him.

My main hope, Austin, is that we get Kraegor on board. I worry that he thinks there could be 2 wolves yet, perhaps now that st_dysan hasn't claimed Priest nor Seer - we can all agree 1 wolf is dead ??

I think LordMortis finally got tangled in his own web of deception when he wrote (regarding st_dysan):
[quote=LordMortis]It was honestly my hope that you would come out as the priest and reveal that Kelric was the other mason, have Kreagor back you, still have no one come out to dispute your claims and we could know that you and Kreagor are not wolves. [/quote]
Cause, um - it doesn't make much sense (unless LordMortis merely stated that poorly and didn't actually mean what it says.)

Anyhow, I will throw down my vote for LordMortis. Lets see how this goes.

Provided we aren’t lynched, I will say that I can guarantee that Kraegor, Austin, or myself dies tonight (unless the game ends with the LordMortis lynching, which I think there is a strong chance it will).

Unagi · Post by **Unagi** » Tue Sep 04, 2007 12:32 pm

Austin wrote:I'm guessing Unagi is a construction worker or roofer of of sort and his power is placing shingles nice and even.

Sorta. As I said - I am the local thatcher. My ability is to repair the roofs.

(LOL - ok, wow - I finally get the 'Becky' joke Grundbegriff had on me a million years ago.)