A Song of Ice and Fire Re-read?

[Tokek]

I just finished a re-read of the whole series on the Kindle a month or two ago.

[Chaz]

I was thinking about doing a re-read on my Kindle so I could enjoy not having to muck with the huge books. It will have to wait until I finish up with the Malazan series. Since I just started that last night, it'll be waiting a while.

[craterus]

Re-re-reading the series again, in honor of this:

Over at the Terry Brooks Forum, Shawn Speakman reports from Comic-Con, where GRRM's editor Anne Groell says she expects to get the final draft of A Dance with Dragons by October or November. Here's the relevant passage:

George has indeed passed the 1000 page mark as of last week and those are, to him according to Anne, finished pages that will not be returned to. He also has several hundred more pages of not completed chapters that every week he makes progress on. Some of those will be in Dance; others will be in the next book. Anne also thinks she'll be getting the book by October or November, which to her would probably make it a February or March 2010 release, although the progress he is making is quickly happening and she could receive it sooner if those incomplete or mostly complete chapters come together faster.

This basically confirms what GRRM has said recently, but it's good to see another source on his progress.

Yes, we've had countless 'progress! Soon now!' notes, but this one is actually from someone who actually knows what's going on other than GRRM...

Anyone else in the process of reading or re-reading the series?

Good to hear! and yes... I had taken a long break from the re-read that I started before this thread came out and just got around picking up and finishing the 3rd book - I have started the 4th book this weekend...

Breinne of Tarth just had her evil bat shield re-painted with a shield she remembers from her fathers armory... a tree with a shooting star!

sweeet...

this will be the first time i re-read the 4th book (i think) - hopefully my memory of how bad it was in comparison, is wrong...

though I have to say - GRRMs decision to have non-named based chapters is REALLY jarring... the guardsman the krakens daughter (what they have no name that we care to know??? why bother with their point of view then George?)

ugh why couldn't he have had a 5 year gap and released a book of shortstories to tell these tales in book 4?

[Odin]

I used the audiobooks to keep me awake on countless drives back and forth between Syracuse and Ithaca, and Syracuse and central Connecticut, so including the couple of times I've read the hardcovers I've technically "read" this series at least 5 times. I can't see me going back to the first three books, much as I enjoyed them, until after the series is finally completed. Without the drive-time, which I don't miss at all, it's a massive undertaking.

Good to hear from a 3rd-party that GRRM's finally nearing home plate on the next book. It's tough to think, though, that I'll have finished his next book within a week after it's published and then I'll have another 4+ year slog to get to the next one.

[Zaxxon]

Good to hear from a 3rd-party that GRRM's finally nearing home plate on the next book. It's tough to think, though, that I'll have finished his next book within a week after it's published and then I'll have another 4+ year slog to get to the next one.

I'm not as sure. I certainly wouldn't bet against a long wait, but I wouldn't bet in favor of one, either. By all accounts, GRRM's trouble with the 5-year gap, then his scrapping of literally years of work, then his massive brain block trying to split ADwD up, and finally his difficulty making the split 4th/5th book work, have contributed greatly to the delays in the last 2 books. He has a much better framework in his head for the remaining books. Assuming he doesn't decide to make crazy foundational changes, one could reasonably believe he'll have much less trouble on future books.

Second, he now has a powerful scheduling incentive in HBO. If the series bombs, this becomes moot. But if it becomes successful, you can bet your hiney that HBO will be exerting a high level of pressure to ensure that by the time the series calls for the remainder of the books, those books will be available. Assuming the series starts airing in 2010, that would make 2010 AGoT, 2011 ACoK, 2012 ASoS, 2013 AFfC, 2014 ADoD, 2015 TWoW, and 2016 ADoS. That'd give GRRM a hard-line schedule of six years to have both of the remaining books completed.

[Jeff V]

Re-re-reading the series again, in honor of this:

Over at the Terry Brooks Forum, Shawn Speakman reports from Comic-Con, where GRRM's editor Anne Groell says she expects to get the final draft of A Dance with Dragons by October or November. Here's the relevant passage:

George has indeed passed the 1000 page mark as of last week and those are, to him according to Anne, finished pages that will not be returned to. He also has several hundred more pages of not completed chapters that every week he makes progress on. Some of those will be in Dance; [b]others will be in the next book.[/b] Anne also thinks she'll be getting the book by October or November, which to her would probably make it a February or March 2010 release, although the progress he is making is quickly happening and she could receive it sooner if those incomplete or mostly complete chapters come together faster.

This basically confirms what GRRM has said recently, but it's good to see another source on his progress.

Yes, we've had countless 'progress! Soon now!' notes, but this one is actually from someone who actually knows what's going on other than GRRM...

Anyone else in the process of reading or re-reading the series?

Woo! Now that this is almost done, when hell is the next one going to be done?

[Crabbs]

I've just started re-reading A Game of Thrones in prep for the (hopeful) release of A Dance With Dragons in mid-2009. I know there's nothing official putting release at that point, but I'm tired of waiting, so I'm starting now.

You might have time to read it 2 times. Here's an e-mail I got form Amazon today...

Hello from Amazon.com.

We're writing about the order you placed on January 29 2009 (Order# xxx-xxxxxx-xxxxxxxx). Unfortunately, the release date for the item(s) listed below has changed, and we need to provide you with a new delivery estimate based on the new release date:

George R.R. Martin "A Dance with Dragons (Song of Ice and Fire)"
Estimated arrival date: October 01 2010 - October 05 2010

If you still want us to ship the delayed items when they do become available (though they may arrive later than expected) please visit this address to approve the delay:

http://www.amazon.com/gp/css/summary/ed ... xxxxxxxxxx" target="_blank

If you do not approve this delay by October 30 2009, we will cancel the item. However, if the item becomes available before that date, we will automatically ship it to you.

If there are other items in your order, they'll be shipped according to the delivery estimates listed in the order details in "Your Account" (http://www.amazon.com/your-account" target="_blank).

By approving the new delivery estimate, you are letting us know that you still want the item(s) though they may arrive later than expected. If there are other items in your order, they will ship according to the delivery estimates listed in the order details in "Your Account" (http://www.amazon.com/your-account" target="_blank).

We apologize for the inconvenience caused by this delay.

[Zaxxon]

I wouldn't put any stock in that date; Amazon has no idea.

[Crabbs]

I wouldn't put any stock in that date; Amazon has no idea.

I think that it's actually optimistic.

[Zaxxon]

I wouldn't put any stock in that date; Amazon has no idea.

I think that it's actually optimistic.

Oh I'm not saying that I think it's coming out next week--I just think that Amazon's shot in the dark is just that: a shot in the dark.

We really should start a pool on the release date, though...

[Stitch]

Christ, A Feast for Crows came out four years ago?! Martin isn't exactly at the peak of his health, for god's sake.

Kind of depressing to see one of the better throne-swapping series hurl so completely off a cliff.

[Zaxxon]

I didn't want to start a new thread for this, so here's a half-on-topic post... Suvudu.com is having a Fantasy Cage match. Jaime Lannister has been matched up with Hermione Granger. The write-up is hilarious, and GRRM's rebuttal is even better:

How we think the fight will go
Hermione had prepped even harder for this battle than she had for her O.W.L.s, and in much the same fashion—by hitting the library. She had read d’Artagnan’s Duelling for Dunces, and knew Montoya’s The Soul of a Swordsman by heart. And even though it meant learning a little Valyrian, she had memorized all of the properties of Valyrian steel. The magic that coursed within the Kingslayer’s sword would repel expelliarmus, cut through a shield charm, and rebound a blasting curse upon its caster.

And yet she was unprepared for the moment in which the golden-haired warrior strode into the clearing in the Forbidden Forest. How could she ever have swooned over Gilderoy Lockhart? Jaime’s blond hair shone even in the darkness. And his green eyes, so like the sea after a storm… For a moment, she couldn’t remember quite what she had planned to do.

Her hesitation gave Jaime just enough time to unsheathe his sword. Jaime knew he should not underestimate this little wench, with her bushy brown hair and largish front teeth, so unlike his sweet sister. He would have one shot, no easy task with his still unpracticed left hand, his useless golden right. But one quick slash would even the score.

He would take her right hand, in which she gripped that infernal wand.

Gather, Hermione, gather, she said to herself, and cried “Confundus!” just as Jaime swung his sword. The Kingslayer was not so easily confounded as that McLaggen creep, however; he did not lose his footing, nor his grip on his sword. Jaime moved into his next attack with the preternatural quickness of a Dementor, but Hermione’s avis charm proved faster. A flock of birds circled Jaime’s head and threw off his aim. But with one mercilessly accurate slash he neatly sliced through all of them and their little corpses fell to the ground.

Jaime felt a thrill of pride and power as he brought his sword back for the killing blow. And for a moment, he was sure he had her—

—But then the world suddenly turned upside down.

Hermione had to admit that Jaime was markedly less glamorous dangling upside down, his sword waving around uselessly, the victim of a Levicorpus charm. In fact, she could not quite find it within herself to finish him off. She saw in his eyes such a look of torment and sorrow that she realized how deeply misunderstood he was, how he had suffered…

Later Jaime would not even remember hearing the little witch cry “Obliviate!” But he had just one moment of consciousness—one moment, as the painful memories of his glorious past, of losing his hand, of Cersei’s face, slipped away—in which to whisper “Thank you.”

Predicted Winner: Hermione Granger (Five points to Gryffindor!)

No, no.

Jaime does not actually own a Valyrian steel sword. The blade he used to kill King Aerys is common castle-forged steel, gilded to match his golden armor. But he can certainly get hold of a Valyrian blade for the fight — Widow’s Wail, the twin to Oathkeeper, both made when his father had Ice melted down and reforged. Widow’s Wail went to Joffrey, but we all know how that turned out. Now it belongs to Tommen, but the kid’s not old enough to use it.

A sword is not enough, though. This duel is life and death. Jaime is not likely to prance into that clearing smiling and clad only in cloth. He’ll armor himself before the match. His gilded plate-and-mail (this is not a fit occasion for the white of the Kingsguard), a crimson cloak, and a shield strapped to his right arm and emblazoned with the lion of Lannister. And of course he will have a helm. Knights who enter battle without one are soon dead. He can smile at Hermione before the match, then lower his visor. The helm, of course, would be fashioned in the shape of a maned lion. (Oddly enough, the Lannister arms look a lot like those of Gryffindor, which might give Hermione a moment’s pause).

He’s not going to waste time and effort swatting at birds with his sword, either. He’s encased in gilded steel. What are they going to do, crap on him? He’ll rush right through the birds, and go straight for Hermione. A sword is not a knight’s only weapon. While she’s watching the blade, he will slam his shield right into her face, knock her off her feet. Let her try and mumble those spells with a mouthful of broken teeth.

And if somehow Granger does get off that spell (cheating, really) and turn him upside down, Jaime is more likely to undo the straps on his shield and fling it at her head then to hang there meekly waiting to die.

But hey, let’s say everything goes the way your “experts” say it will, and Hermione wins. Sad to say, she will not live long to enjoy her victory. Sometime very soon, when she least expects it, a “boy” she does not know will bump up against her in the corridors of Hogwarts… and suddenly she’ll find a dagger sliding through her ribs, right into her heart. “A Lannister always pays his debts,” Tyrion will say, as he slips back into the shadows.

[Odin]

Hah, that's pretty funny! Both the match and the fact that Martin responded.

[Kelric]

Martin's response was great. Tyrion is awesome.

[theohall]

and yet he finds it difficult to finish his book

[craterus]

and yet he finds it difficult to finish his book

maybe it will pump him up?

I don't think he lacks the ability to work... just the ability to figure out whatever corner he painted himself into with the mereeneesseeeee knot that we keep hearing about (I can only assume that in his zeal to create a parallel of an occupying power in a foreign land to show just how horrible the iraqi war is to us peons, he realized that it had no business being in a fantasy story about fire vs ice and can't find an excuse for the dragon bitch to just burn the city to the ground and move on - yet oddly wouldn't that be the most appropriate thing? Or shit - just let one of her lieutenants hang a mission accomplished banner and get her the heck out of there... )

[Zaxxon]

Suvudu Cage Match: Round 2 - Cthulhu vs Jaime Lannister

Hilariously, the voting has Lannister ahead....

Excerpt from GRRM's writeup:

"Books?" Jaime said. "How can books help me in a fight?"

"They can tell you more about this thing you're fighting." Tyrion dumped the dusty tomes down on the table.

"Cthulhu," said Jaime. "It sounds like the noise old men make when they're bringing up phelgm." He rummaged through the books with his good hand. They had odd titles, in languages he did not know, though he was not surprised his brother did. "Abdul Alhazared," he pronounced, leafing through a few pages. "This is written in gibberish. What tongue is this?"

"A fair question," said Tyrion, "to which I have no answer. That comes from the shadowlands beyond Asshai. But here, look at this. It is a translation of a translation of a translation, I understand." The dwarf flipped through the pages, until he found the one he wanted. "And there are illuminations. Here. This is Cthulhu."

Jaime stared. "That?"

"That."

"It's as big as Casterly Rock."

"Bigger. If Casterly Rock fell on its head it might not even notice."

[GreenGoo]

I don't think I've ever been in this thread. So I read Zax's quote with no context.

I just wanted to say it was completely awesome.

Also, I enjoyed the series so much that I am doing it a significant honor in my household by refusing to read it again for at least a decade. Possibly 2. If I could wipe it from my mind so I could experience it again for the first time, I would. Instead I just have to let time do its work and hope I don't die before I get another chance to read it again.

[Isgrimnur]

Instead I just have to let time do its work and hope Martin doesn't die before I get another chance to read it again.

We're all thinking it, I'm just saying it.

[Jow]

I have the great benefit of having started my first readthrough of this series fairly recently and am now about 200 pages into book 2. Loving it, though I have to be careful what I read as spoilers abound.

[GreenGoo]

I have the great benefit of having started my first readthrough of this series fairly recently and am now about 200 pages into book 2. Loving it, though I have to be careful what I read as spoilers abound.

I remember looking for something to read and hearing about this series here at OO. Well, I'd seen it referenced for quite awhile before but wasn't interested. Fantasy in general had been off my list for awhile. Too many terrible books in a row. I picked up the first book and started to read. Hmmm, I said. Got a little deeper into it and the next thing you know I'm gorging myself on the series like a starving man with a thanks giving turkey.

It's not perfect, but there were a bunch of things that lined up to make it a really excellent reading experience.

Since then I've been trying to keep an eye on the "what I'm reading" threads to hopefully catch sight of the next gem. The small problem with that is that it was based on numerous recommendations here that I picked up the Salvawhatever Dark Elf book. That book set fantasy back like a decade on my reading preference list. That thing was god awful. I'll have to be equally diligent watching for other landmines of that magnitude.

[Zaxxon]

Since then I've been trying to keep an eye on the "what I'm reading" threads to hopefully catch sight of the next gem. The small problem with that is that it was based on numerous recommendations here that I picked up the Salvawhatever Dark Elf book. That book set fantasy back like a decade on my reading preference list. That thing was god awful. I'll have to be equally diligent watching for other landmines of that magnitude.

I'm somewhat ashamed to admit that I love the Drizzt books. When I'm in the mood for something much, much, much, much lighter than GRRM, it's good filler. I wouldn't make the mistake of calling it awesome fantasy, though.

[GreenGoo]

I don't know why it offended me so badly. I hate that book and by extension the author. I still rant about it occasionally. You'd think it punched my kid in the back of the head with a set of keys.

I don't want to talk about it any more. Angry making.

[Zaxxon]

I don't know why it offended me so badly. I hate that book and by extension the author. I still rant about it occasionally. You'd think it punched my kid in the back of the head with a set of keys.

I don't want to talk about it any more. Angry making.

[GreenGoo]

I do enjoy the nearly infinite mocking that occurs around the character. So at least it isn't all bad.

[Jow]

I remember looking for something to read and hearing about this series here at OO. Well, I'd seen it referenced for quite awhile before but wasn't interested. Fantasy in general had been off my list for awhile. Too many terrible books in a row. I picked up the first book and started to read. Hmmm, I said. Got a little deeper into it and the next thing you know I'm gorging myself on the series like a starving man with a thanks giving turkey.

Funny enough, it took getting into the Game of Thrones cardgame plus having a giftcard to Barnes and Noble for me to finally check this out. My experience was similar to yours: I got through the first book in about a week, which is absolutely unheard of with me as I'm a very slow reader (partially intentionally). Being sick and at home almost all of the week certainly facilitated that, but I can't recall EVER reading a book that quickly before.

[Odin]

I adored the Drizz't books, particularly the early ones. I wasn't a huge fan of the halfling and I despised Salvatore's "Woods out Back" book(s), but I like Drizz't and Artemis Entreri.

[GreenGoo]

I adored the Drizz't books, particularly the early ones. I wasn't a huge fan of the halfling and I despised Salvatore's "Woods out Back" book(s), but I like Drizz't and Artemis Entreri.

You were probably part of the group of people who convinced me to read it.

[YellowKing]

I love the Drizzt books as well, but they are like 8th grade reading level, if that. And the editing is awful- they're full of typos.

When I just want to turn off my mind and go back to being a 14-year old kid who played D&D, they're great. But they are by no means high-quality adult fantasy.

[Odin]

Agreed - they're not great literature, just fun reads.

[GreenGoo]

Agreed - they're not great literature, just fun reads.

Heh. Not for me they weren't, and I'd say my standards aren't particularly high. I've mostly forgotten why I hated it so much, which is a good thing. But the ire it generated is still with me, which is not so good. It will however prevent me from ever picking the book back up, which is also a good thing.

Hate. It.

[Zaxxon]

Why is there no joy in your life? Think of the children!

[GreenGoo]

Why is there no joy in your life? Think of the children!

Oh, there's joy. I'm reading The Terror and The Briar King, both above average books. I just finished the Colour of Magic, the very first Disc World book. For the first time. That's right, my very first step into the Disc World world just occurred this year. I'm waiting for a Fire Upon the Deep to become available at the library.

Oh there's joy alright. Plus, as I said, the sheer amount of Drizzt jokes mocking dual sabre wielding pimply faced griefers has been incredibly enjoyable, so it's not all bad.

The best part of the Drizzt experience is that I hate Salvatore now, so every time I walk into a bookstore I immediately become angry as entire shelves and walls are dedicated to that hack assail me. And I blame everyone of you for that. STOP BUYING HIS CRAP!

For the record, I'm pretty sure I read the 1st two Drizzt books to give it a fair chance in case the first book was just an early author trying to find his legs. If only that had been the case.

Ok, going to focus on The Terror for awhile, to get that foul dark elf smell outta my brain.

[Zaxxon]

Briar King--good one.

[Kelric]

Briar King--good one.

Agreed.

[GreenGoo]

Briar King--good one.

Agreed.

It was probably the recommendations from both of you in the reading thread that even put it on my radar, so I don't hate you guys, I just wish you'd stop putting Salvatore books on the shelf and buying him mansions and stuff.

Definitely enjoying Briar King, although I'm not very far into it yet.

[Gryndyl]

I just finished the Colour of Magic, the very first Disc World book. For the first time. That's right, my very first step into the Disc World world just occurred this year.

Boy do you ever have a pile of grins just waiting for you. There's a whole lotta Discworld.

[Skinypupy]

I just finished the Colour of Magic, the very first Disc World book. For the first time. That's right, my very first step into the Disc World world just occurred this year.

Boy do you ever have a pile of grins just waiting for you. There's a whole lotta Discworld.

Some of it far better than others. I've read 10 or so Discworld books and while I get the occasional chuckle, I find myself getting bored with them pretty quickly.

[GreenGoo]

Colour of Magic was in the Teens section, for what it's worth.

It wasn't laugh out loud funny ever, I don't think. But it's "good enough" for commute reading, easily.

[Odin]

Suvudu Cage Match: Round 2 - Cthulhu vs Jaime Lannister

Hilariously, the voting has Lannister ahead....

Excerpt from GRRM's writeup:

"Books?" Jaime said. "How can books help me in a fight?"

"They can tell you more about this thing you're fighting." Tyrion dumped the dusty tomes down on the table.

"Cthulhu," said Jaime. "It sounds like the noise old men make when they're bringing up phelgm." He rummaged through the books with his good hand. They had odd titles, in languages he did not know, though he was not surprised his brother did. "Abdul Alhazared," he pronounced, leafing through a few pages. "This is written in gibberish. What tongue is this?"

"A fair question," said Tyrion, "to which I have no answer. That comes from the shadowlands beyond Asshai. But here, look at this. It is a translation of a translation of a translation, I understand." The dwarf flipped through the pages, until he found the one he wanted. "And there are illuminations. Here. This is Cthulhu."

Jaime stared. "That?"

"That."

"It's as big as Casterly Rock."

"Bigger. If Casterly Rock fell on its head it might not even notice."

For anyone who hasn't been following this, Lannister made it to the final round. He's fighting Rand Al'thor. Who, by nearly any measure ought to win, except that Lannister/Martin arranged for the battle to take place on Westeros, and a notably sneaky dwarf is helping his big brother out.

The write-up is here (with a link to the voting). I voted for Lannister mostly out of appreciation for Martin's awesome write-ups. The final one is 6500 freaking words long. As somebody said in one of the comments, "No wonder he's not done with Dance with Dragons, yet!"