Battle of the Presidents

[Remus West]

I would have apologized right up until the "fuck you". At that point I just felt like you are over tired and taking a game way too seriously. Take a deep breath, get some sleep, and know that everyone here hopes things go better for you moving forward.

[El Guapo]

So..... moving on. Question for Moliere:

When Reagan scans at night, will he receive his answer (and thus have it be at least possible to report it to the village) before the kill happens? I know that the order is this:

Reagan scans;
Roosevelt protects;
Democrats attack.

So that the scan happens first. What I'm wondering is whether it's at least possible for him to report it before he dies if he's the night kill. If so, does that depend on him getting his scan in before the kill order comes in, or if all of the special orders come in at roughly the same time will they all execute in quick succession (before he can report)?

In thinking through the rez option, one of the possibilities is keeping it around to use on Reagan (or TR) if they bite it. Question is whether we can get another scan out of Reagan if so.

[El Guapo]

I suppose rezzing Lassr would make him a surefire conversion target if they haven't used it yet, since they could be guaranteed that he's not protected today. Not that that's so bad since they're pretty unlikely to fail when they convert anyway.

[Moliere]

So..... moving on. Question for Moliere:

When Reagan scans at night, will he receive his answer (and thus have it be at least possible to report it to the village) before the kill happens? I know that the order is this:

Reagan scans;
Roosevelt protects;
Democrats attack.

So that the scan happens first. What I'm wondering is whether it's at least possible for him to report it before he dies if he's the night kill. If so, does that depend on him getting his scan in before the kill order comes in, or if all of the special orders come in at roughly the same time will they all execute in quick succession (before he can report)?

In thinking through the rez option, one of the possibilities is keeping it around to use on Reagan (or TR) if they bite it. Question is whether we can get another scan out of Reagan if so.

Reagan will get his scan results even if he is the night kill target. He won't be able to report the scan to the group unless he is rezzed by Lincoln. Does that answer your question? I'm not making it dependent on who gets their night order in first.

[Scoop20906]

I suppose rezzing Lassr would make him a surefire conversion target if they haven't used it yet, since they could be guaranteed that he's not protected today. Not that that's so bad since they're pretty unlikely to fail when they convert anyway.

Hmmm. Pretty much anyone we rez is a very likely candidate for conversion then.

[Scoop20906]

If Lincoln doesn't rez today what are the odds he will be killed tonight? I know the odds go up over the game. Rezing seems like something we should use early to me.

I vote we rez Lassr now.

[El Guapo]

I suppose rezzing Lassr would make him a surefire conversion target if they haven't used it yet, since they could be guaranteed that he's not protected today. Not that that's so bad since they're pretty unlikely to fail when they convert anyway.

Hmmm. Pretty much anyone we rez is a very likely candidate for conversion then.

Yeah. Actually I suppose that it's not literally guaranteed since Lassr could be TR. But Lassr getting converted isn't really a problem exactly (beyond the conversion getting used at all, anyways), it really just means that using the rez doesn't get us any trusteds. And there's a reasonable chance that the wolves have already used their conversion anyways.

I'm inclined to use the rez now on Lassr now as well, I think.

[El Guapo]

One question Moliere: if the democrats convert Reagan, can he then scan the Republicans (for Roosevelt and Lincoln)?

[Moliere]

One question Moliere: if the democrats convert Reagan, can he then scan the Republicans (for Roosevelt and Lincoln)?

If Reagan is converted he is allowed to scan, but his results still only report whether someone is a Republican or Democrat.

[Vorret]

Also remember that rezzing will reveal one more republican on top of whoever is rezzed.

If we assume that the convertion has not been used yet, it also reduces the pool of people for our remaining specials to hide in (night kill or conversion), the more I think about it, the more I believe it's a good idea to use it now that way it will create 2 trusted republican

[Chaosraven]

Yeah. Actually I suppose that it's not literally guaranteed since Lassr could be TR.

unlikely, as he would have protected himself first night

[Remus West]

Also remember that rezzing will reveal one more republican on top of whoever is rezzed.

If we assume that the convertion has not been used yet, it also reduces the pool of people for our remaining specials to hide in (night kill or conversion), the more I think about it, the more I believe it's a good idea to use it now that way it will create 2 trusted republican

That sentence reads as though you feel it is good to reduce the pool of shadows for our specials to hide within.

[Vorret]

Also remember that rezzing will reveal one more republican on top of whoever is rezzed.

If we assume that the convertion has not been used yet, it also reduces the pool of people for our remaining specials to hide in (night kill or conversion), the more I think about it, the more I believe it's a good idea to use it now that way it will create 2 trusted republican

That sentence reads as though you feel it is good to reduce the pool of shadows for our specials to hide within.

Oops, you're right. I started typing at work and got distracted by someone else and never finished my sentence. Was supposed to continue saying that it also reduces the hiding place for the democrats, since there's only two of them (maybe 3) right now it's quite hard to luck out and find them, by revealing two known, our scanner is less likely to miss.

[Scoop20906]

It would make sense for Reagan to not scan Lassr if we Rez him since he would have to be shoot sooner or later, correct?

[Vorret]

It would make sense for Reagan to not scan Lassr if we Rez him since he would have to be shoot sooner or later, correct?

uh?

[Remus West]

It would make sense for Reagan to not scan Lassr if we Rez him since he would have to be shoot sooner or later, correct?

uh?

I believe that Scoop is suggesting that if we rez'd Lassr then the Dems would certainly convert him. He ignores that our rezzer could be converted or the conversion could already have been used.

All of this is why I am against rezzing Lassr. With the conversion being an anytime ability (which I wish I had read before because making it usable at anytime makes an already extremely powerful ability even more powerful and I would have mentioned that before we began) anyone we rez or out gets about three seconds of trust before they need to be monitored the same way everyone else is until Reagan tells us he has found the convert and then gets himself killed to prove he was Rep when he told us.

[Vorret]

Interesting point, it's true that converting Lassr would be a wise move but not converting it may be just as wise. We can't trust him no matter what and they get to keep their conversion.

Never thought of it that way.

[Remus West]

Interesting point, it's true that converting Lassr would be a wise move but not converting it may be just as wise. We can't trust him no matter what and they get to keep their conversion.

Never thought of it that way.

If we preset our course towards lynching Lassr after rezzing him then not converting him is a double win for them. We use our rez and lynch one of our own.

[Scoop20906]

Interesting point, it's true that converting Lassr would be a wise move but not converting it may be just as wise. We can't trust him no matter what and they get to keep their conversion.

Never thought of it that way.

That's was my point. Whomever we rez, until we know we killed Clinton can never be trusted.

Remus, the most important thing in favor of rez now is Lincoln can be killed during the night if he isn't Lassr or Newcastle and already dead.

[Remus West]

Interesting point, it's true that converting Lassr would be a wise move but not converting it may be just as wise. We can't trust him no matter what and they get to keep their conversion.

Never thought of it that way.

That's was my point. Whomever we rez, until we know we killed Clinton can never be trusted.

Remus, the most important thing in favor of rez now is Lincoln can be killed during the night if he isn't Lassr or Newcastle and already dead.

So could Reagan. Should he come forward now? Should Teddy? Dying in the night is a risk we all take (well, most of us). If that is your only reason for thinking we should use the ability then I disagree.

1) El Guapo
2) Scoop20906
3) Vorret
4) Qantaga
5) bb2112
6) Lassr - dead in night - rezzable
7) Remus West
8 )Chaosraven
9) tru1cy
10) RMC
11) theohall
12) triggercut
13) J.D.
14) Newcastle - lynched - perma dead per request

We are at 12 with, presumably, 1 scan.
12 either 10/2 or 9/3 split
Day 2 lynch - miss 9/2 or 8/3
Night 2 kill - 8/2 or 7/3 with 2 scans 6 needed for majority


If after night 2 We Rez someone
11 players with 2 scans, an outted Lincoln, a rezzed Republican, a Teddy shot, and outted Reagan. That gives us the 6 we need for majority assuming no overlap in the scans and specials. The convert places all of that in limbo but if all three specials live through this next night......

The other thing to consider is that, although we get to our 6, they also have a berserker which will again reduce the numbers so depending on lynch order (or who Teddy shoots) the numbers change.

Looking at that, I remain against the rez today.

Also, it is not until we know we killed Clinton. The convert is an anytime ability. I assume it won't work after voting has closed but up until he gets the noose he can try on anyone so if he gets to n-1 there is no reason for him not to go after a convert.

That last thing is something I keep meaning to look back at day 1 regarding.

[Qantaga]

Ugh. So, meeting my Wed deadline meant that I was graced with helping someone else meet their Friday deadline. Yee-haw.

Thank God, I am now finally home and will be until Jan. 3. Hallelujah.

Back to page 1, I go. I'll have thoughts tonight. No more ez-mating for me.

[Remus West]

No more ez-mating for me.

So....you are saying you were ez-mating? How very interesting.

[RMC]

No more ez-mating for me.

So....you are saying you were ez-mating? How very interesting.

I thought ez-mating just meant you were minimally posting. Is there something else that it means?

[Remus West]

No more ez-mating for me.

So....you are saying you were ez-mating? How very interesting.

I thought ez-mating just meant you were minimally posting. Is there something else that it means?

The term came from Ezmate (side note: Wonder what ever happened to him. Be really neat if he showed up to play again.) playing and letting us all know exactly where he was and what was limiting his time through out the game. He was a wolf. Originally the term meant you were sharing your "busy doing X" stories to avoid being thought a wolf due to limited participation. I think it has since become more of an anyone sharing their busy doing story so I'm not really suspecting him so much as giving him a hard time about using that term the "new" way.

[RMC]

No more ez-mating for me.

So....you are saying you were ez-mating? How very interesting.

I thought ez-mating just meant you were minimally posting. Is there something else that it means?

The term came from Ezmate (side note: Wonder what ever happened to him. Be really neat if he showed up to play again.) playing and letting us all know exactly where he was and what was limiting his time through out the game. He was a wolf. Originally the term meant you were sharing your "busy doing X" stories to avoid being thought a wolf due to limited participation. I think it has since become more of an anyone sharing their busy doing story so I'm not really suspecting him so much as giving him a hard time about using that term the "new" way.

Ahh...

[Scoop20906]

Well, one fly in your ointment Remus. We don't learn the role of democrats we kill. Unless Reagan scans them first we won't know unless it's the zerker. Correct?

[Scoop20906]

Good to have you back, Q. We need your input.

[Remus West]

Well, one fly in your ointment Remus. We don't learn the role of democrats we kill. Unless Reagan scans them first we won't know unless it's the zerker. Correct?

Not a fly in my ointment. You were the one that said it was until we knew we killed Clinton. I was merely correcting you. Unless Reagan identifies the convert for us we will never know between Clinton and the Berserker.

Unless, of course, we kill 2 Dems with no berserker kill and the game is still going. At that point we will know we got both Clinton and his patsy.

[Scoop20906]

It seems we are on opposite ends here. You say we should wait until we identify Clinton and are safe to rez.

I say waiting adds to the risk that Lincoln is killed at night and therefore doesn't get to use his very useful power.

I'm sure there is a middle ground but you seem to be arguing that Lincoln wait until a very unlikely situation occurs (two dead demos with no zerker attack).

I'm fine with Lincoln waiting but I hope he doesn't wait for your scenario to occur. That will probably be way too late.

[Remus West]

It seems we are on opposite ends here. You say we should wait until we identify Clinton and are safe to rez.

No. I said we should not do it today. I laid out a scenario where it would be a near lock on the game if we wait until tomorrow and the specials are all alive.

I say waiting adds to the risk that Lincoln is killed at night and therefore doesn't get to use his very useful power.

As mentioned that is a risk we take every night. The risk tonight is only very slightly less than last night.

I'm sure there is a middle ground but you seem to be arguing that Lincoln wait until a very unlikely situation occurs (two dead demos with no zerker attack).

I have no idea where you got that idea. The only scenario I laid out with the two dead demos was where we would know we had gotten the convert. That had nothing to do with Lincoln coming forward or not.

I'm fine with Lincoln waiting but I hope he doesn't wait for your scenario to occur. That will probably be way too late.

Good thing you're fine with his waiting as the choice is his.

[Vorret]

So, if Lincoln was to rez someone, I think the best thing to do would be to announce it right after a lynch, that way the rezzee can be protected , avoid being converted that night and the next day.

Would that work or I'm missing something here?

[Scoop20906]

Just expressing my opinion since nothing else seems to be going on.

[Remus West]

So, if Lincoln was to rez someone, I think the best thing to do would be to announce it right after a lynch, that way the rezzee can be protected , avoid being converted that night and the next day.

Would that work or I'm missing something here?

Other than leaving Lincoln himself open for conversion/night kill? No. Nothing at all. Oh, also, can he even use the rez during the night or is it a day only power?

[bb2112]

As I said, I agree with the waiting thing, unless Lincoln is Q, El G, or Remus. Otherwise I think he should step forward now.

[Moliere]

So, if Lincoln was to rez someone, I think the best thing to do would be to announce it right after a lynch, that way the rezzee can be protected , avoid being converted that night and the next day.

Would that work or I'm missing something here?

Other than leaving Lincoln himself open for conversion/night kill? No. Nothing at all. Oh, also, can he even use the rez during the night or is it a day only power?

The rez can happen at any time, but the Teddy protection has to wait until the night and can't be repeated two days in a row.

[RMC]

I am always opposed to having our specials out themselves, unless there is a reason. I think waiting is the best course of action, and if I was a special I would not out myself.

That being said, I would lynch BB, and that is where my vote is.

Let's kill someone prior to Christmas time! Come on, then we can rez someone at Easter, since I think this game will take that long.

[bb2112]

That being said, I would lynch BB, and that is where my vote is.

Ha, see! This proves I'm not evil.

[Remus West]

As I said, I agree with the waiting thing, unless Lincoln is Q, El G, or Remus. Otherwise I think he should step forward now.

I don't like the narrowing focus of that statement.

[El Guapo]

As I said, I agree with the waiting thing, unless Lincoln is Q, El G, or Remus. Otherwise I think he should step forward now.

Why would Lincoln step forward if he's one of Qantaga, Remus, or me?

[RMC]

As I said, I agree with the waiting thing, unless Lincoln is Q, El G, or Remus. Otherwise I think he should step forward now.

Why would Lincoln step forward if he's one of Qantaga, Remus, or me?

BB said you three were the most likely to get lynched at night...