[Pizza Wars 2013] Chicago style vs New York style

[Jeff V]

Unfortunately, my local Dominicks doesn't carry the "Classic" any more.

I believe this problem will resolve itself in a few short weeks.

[LawBeefaroni]

Unfortunately, my local Dominicks doesn't carry the "Classic" any more.

I believe this problem will resolve itself in a few short weeks.

Of course, I'll most likely have to find a new grocery store anyway due to Dominicks pulling out of Chicago.

Which reminds me, there's a Dominicks across the street from my office. It's freaking great, I can do grocery shopping at lunch, keep a jar of pickles in the fridge at work, etc. It's a banging store, it does a great business with all the high-rise condos and hotels/tourists. Dominick's is selling in pieces and I'm sure this is one of their gems.

There's a Mariano's a few blocks away so I don't see them buying it. Maybe Trader Joe's but it's way bigger than their usual footprint. If they turn it into anything but a grocery I'll be very sad.

[ImLawBoy]

Mariano's announced they were buying 11 stores. I thought I heard that Whole Foods was actually picking up four, but I haven't seen anything on that.

[Jeff V]

I've not heard that Trader Joe's was in the market to buy any of them -- Whole Foods more likely since they can do full size.

The other day, I stopped into the Naperville Dominick's on Ogden and N. Aurora. That store is so far unclaimed. It's convenient for me to stop by on the way home, but I can't say I've ever seen the place remotely busy and much of that large strip mall is vacant. Mariano's is taking a store in Aurora, not far from where I live but not convenient (never went to the Dominicks there, never been to a Mariano's though so I might check it out). There's a Jewel already less than a mile down Ogden (actually, one in each direction, about the same distance) and a Whole Foods on 75th street, maybe 4 miles away.

I'm actually surprised to see Jewel buying some of them; I think they are very much in the same predicament. I used to prefer death to going to Jewel on a weekend afternoon, when you could plan to spend 30 minutes or more in the checkout line after spending way too much time shopping in crowded aisles. Now I'll go there and find cashiers waiting for a customer to come by.

The successful stores these days...the ones I shop in (and deal with the crowds) all have a wider selection of produce, better prices on produce, and a wider variety of ethnic food options. Overall prices are usually lower (except Whole Foods), and some like Trader Joe's don't run sales but keep prices manageable. Meijer and Target do better with the one-stop-shop niche that the big grocery stores used to command even if their non-food offerings were on the slim side. I'm not ready throw Walmart into that mix...the "grocery" selection at every Walmart I've been to has been heavy on snacks and soda, pitiful in everything else (especially meat and produce).

[Odin]

Arise! From the NY Daily News:

"Chicago-style pizza ‘shouldn’t be called pizza,’ Supreme Court Justice Antonin Scalia says"

Causing me to further suspect that at least one member of the SCOTUS is on OO.

[Isgrimnur]

Arise! From the NY Daily News:

"Chicago-style pizza ‘shouldn’t be called pizza,’ Supreme Court Justice Antonin Scalia says"

Causing me to further suspect that at least one member of the SCOTUS is on OO.

FTFY

[Odin]

That's odd. I wonder what happened to my link? Thanks, Isg.

[LawBeefaroni]

I've not heard that Trader Joe's was in the market to buy any of them -- Whole Foods more likely since they can do full size.

It's going to be a Whole Foods, opening sometime in 2015. WTF is that? A year? It better have indoor skiing and a green roof for grazing the fresh beef.

"Chicago-style pizza ‘shouldn’t be called pizza,’ Supreme Court Justice Antonin Scalia says"

Causing me to further suspect that at least one member of the SCOTUS is on OO.

Hey, he's consistent. It didn't exist 200 years ago so it shouldn't exist now.

[JSHAW]

I had my first BAD experience with what was suppose to be Chicago Deep Dish pizza last week.

5 minutes from my house there's a restaurant called "---- Chicago Dog". Left off the first word for anonymity sake.

They specialize in Chicago Hot Dogs, and burgers but they have prominently on their menu "chicago deep dish pizza". They
make a point of saying ON the menu that you will THINK you're in Chicago by ordering and eating their deep dish pizza.

I was expecting it to look something like these pics below...






But this is what I got...actual pictures from my IPhone









I ordered 2 of their large 14" pizza's, specifically said DEEP DISH pizza, one cheese, one pepperoni. Wait time was 30 minutes and
I'd be by to pick them up.

Get there, pay for them, come back home.

Get home, open box. SHOCK

Where's my deep dish pizza? Look at the pics. Nothing's deep except the wall around the rim that looks like high rise crust,
which then falls into a valley of thin crust with tomato, cheese, and parmesean cheese on top (yuck!, I hate parmesean cheese).

I attemp to eat a slice. Not bad, but not what I thought I just paid $35 bucks for. The pepperoni pizza, no sight of any pepperoni
on it at all. My wife, wouldn't touch the pizza. She looked at it, smelled it, saw nothing but the tomato that was smeared on top
and she said, "at this point I'd rather just eat taco bell".

I call up the manager, explain that I think they sold me 2 thin crust pizza's, and he's clearly giving me his take on what Chicago
Deep Dish pizza is there. I see this isn't going anywhere, so I told him I'd like for the owner to give me a call the next day, give him my number, and say thanks and bye.

Next day, Owner calls up. We discuss the pizza's I received. He gives me his definition of what Chicago Deep Dish pizza is, said that I am 1 in a 1000 customers that doesn't like their pizza, and it never happens that someone doesn't like their product. He states they use the most expensive ingriedients available, that people in this area (NC) that are FROM Chicago think his pizza is authentic and tastes great.

He states that he thinks I was expecting one thing, and got something different, and that my expectations were too high. I said, OK, I can settle for that. He offers to refund my money, which I took him up on. I had the 2 pizza's saved in my fridge, knew thats's where I was going to take this, to refund city. I retrieve them from fridge, drive them over. Wife of owner is there, we greet each other, nice lady. She looks at pizza, yes that's our pizza. I said I didn't want to get into a debate about the pizza, I had spoke to her husband and
he said he'd refund my money. She say's sure. She's very nice and pleasant, I'm on my best behavior, just want to get refund and beat it.

She say's maybe I'll come back and try a burger or dog. I say "maybe I will", and I tip out the door.

SO...moral to this story for me is. GO to CHICAGO and get the real thing, in person. OR...

A friend of mine that is the executive chef at Davidson College told me that there's a place in Chicago, Giordano's, that
ship's pie's out, over the internet. Might try that in the future. I've never had a pizza shipped to me from out of state.

I sent all my phone pic's of the pizza to the exec. chef from Davidson that night, asked him "does this look like deep dish pizza in your professional experience?". His response was "I don't know where you got that from, but you got ripped off". He specifically mentions
Giordano's and said "you should have to eat deep dish with a fork and knive, and after 2 slices you might be full", which is exactly
what I was expecting the night I ordered, but didn't get.

Oh well...live and learn.

[Unagi]

Lou Malnati's (of Chicago) will send you (have for over 20 years, pretty sure, back when no one did) their deep-dish pizzas fed-ex (frozen, clearly).

I'd recommend them, but haven't actually sampled it for a very long time (cause I get the real thing)

[LawBeefaroni]

I attemp to eat a slice. Not bad, but not what I thought I just paid $35 bucks for. The pepperoni pizza, no sight of any pepperoni
on it at all. My wife, wouldn't touch the pizza. She looked at it, smelled it, saw nothing but the tomato that was smeared on top
and she said, "at this point I'd rather just eat taco bell".

I call up the manager, explain that I think they sold me 2 thin crust pizza's, and he's clearly giving me his take on what Chicago
Deep Dish pizza is there. I see this isn't going anywhere, so I told him I'd like for the owner to give me a call the next day, give him my number, and say thanks and bye.

Next day, Owner calls up. We discuss the pizza's I received. He gives me his definition of what Chicago Deep Dish pizza is, said that I am 1 in a 1000 customers that doesn't like their pizza, and it never happens that someone doesn't like their product. He states they use the most expensive ingriedients available, that people in this area (NC) that are FROM Chicago think his pizza is authentic and tastes great.

I'm not a lover of the Chicago Deep Dish but I can tell you that ain't it.

The sauce/cheese presentation somewhat resembles Chicago Deep Dish at some places but that's about it. It looks like it was prepared in a "deep dish" but the pizza is anything but deep. Nor does it look like it could even pass as an attempt at the Chicago Pan style (Pequod's, et al).

[Odin]

Sixty bucks for two frozen pizzas is a little rich for my blood.

[ImLawBoy]

Waaay too much bread in those crusts.

This looks about right.

I give the place you tried credit for trying to get the crust right - the best Chicago style pizza doesn't have a terribly thick, bready crust. It should probably be a bit thicker than that, though, and they really fell down on the filling. Chicago style does tend to do the filling backwards with the tomato sauce on top of the mozzarella, but it will also be topped with some Parmesan. If you don't want that on your pie, you should specifically request it not be on there.

BTW, some people love Giordano's, but I'm not a big fan. I will note that they do stuffed pizza, not Chicago style deep dish. I find their crust to be too bready.

[LawBeefaroni]

Sixty bucks for two frozen pizzas is a little rich for my blood.

That's actually about the going rate in-person down here. I guess it all depends on how they cook up after being frozen.

[Trent Steel]

Lou Malnati's (of Chicago) will send you (have for over 20 years, pretty sure, back when no one did) their deep-dish pizzas fed-ex (frozen, clearly).

I'd recommend them, but haven't actually sampled it for a very long time (cause I get the real thing)

I was all excited to place an order, but after looking at the pictures on their site, there seems to be little filling. Similar to what JSHAW experienced.

Oh well.

[$iljanus]

I attemp to eat a slice. Not bad, but not what I thought I just paid $35 bucks for. The pepperoni pizza, no sight of any pepperoni
on it at all. My wife, wouldn't touch the pizza. She looked at it, smelled it, saw nothing but the tomato that was smeared on top
and she said, "at this point I'd rather just eat taco bell".

I call up the manager, explain that I think they sold me 2 thin crust pizza's, and he's clearly giving me his take on what Chicago
Deep Dish pizza is there. I see this isn't going anywhere, so I told him I'd like for the owner to give me a call the next day, give him my number, and say thanks and bye.

Next day, Owner calls up. We discuss the pizza's I received. He gives me his definition of what Chicago Deep Dish pizza is, said that I am 1 in a 1000 customers that doesn't like their pizza, and it never happens that someone doesn't like their product. He states they use the most expensive ingriedients available, that people in this area (NC) that are FROM Chicago think his pizza is authentic and tastes great.

I'm not a lover of the Chicago Deep Dish but I can tell you that ain't it.

The sauce/cheese presentation somewhat resembles Chicago Deep Dish at some places but that's about it. It looks like it was prepared in a "deep dish" but the pizza is anything but deep. Nor does it look like it could even pass as an attempt at the Chicago Pan style (Pequod's, et al).

I'm not from Chicago but from my visits there and after sampling their deep dish pizza your pics are like someone opening up a package of Oreo cookies and finding all the creamy middle licked out. I wonder if their "Chicago Hot Dog" has ketchup?

[LordMortis]

Sixty bucks for two frozen pizzas is a little rich for my blood.

That's actually about the going rate in-person down here. I guess it all depends on how they cook up after being frozen.

Two XL coming in at 24" x 18" 15 slice Detroit Deep Dish pizzas with everything (10 toppings) would be crazy expensive, and too steep for my blood, is under $50. 30 slices of a Jet's 10 is enough to feed a small army of Trent Steels or even a few chaosravens.

[ImLawBoy]

Lou Malnati's (of Chicago) will send you (have for over 20 years, pretty sure, back when no one did) their deep-dish pizzas fed-ex (frozen, clearly).

I'd recommend them, but haven't actually sampled it for a very long time (cause I get the real thing)

I was all excited to place an order, but after looking at the pictures on their site, there seems to be little filling. Similar to what JSHAW experienced.

Oh well.

Lou's pizza is roughly equivalent to the Geno's East pizza you had when you visited (although I actually prefer Lou's). I think they both broke off of Uno's and claim to be the true originators of the style.

[Lordnine]

Lou Malnati's (of Chicago) will send you (have for over 20 years, pretty sure, back when no one did) their deep-dish pizzas fed-ex (frozen, clearly).

I'd recommend them, but haven't actually sampled it for a very long time (cause I get the real thing)

I actually tried these having never tried Chicago style pizza and it was probably the most vile pizza I have ever eaten. Overwhelming and bitter tomato sauce was all I could taste. I ended up scraping most of the sauce off but the pepperoni underneath was almost tasteless and definitely not spicy. The crust was OK I guess...

To be fair I didn't care much for "authentic" New York style pizza either. I'm just going to clock it up to Vermonters make/like pizza different from everyone else.

[LawBeefaroni]

Two XL coming in at 24" x 18" 15 slice Detroit Deep Dish pizzas with everything (10 toppings) would be crazy expensive, and too steep for my blood, is under $50. 30 slices of a Jet's 10 is enough to feed a small army of Trent Steels or even a few chaosravens.

Yeah, but when Trent is in town, bartenders hand out free cheeseburger deep dish pies.



I think the going rate for a large "Chicago Style" at Gino's or Giordano's or Lou's down here is like $35. After tax and you're looking at $40. But that's usually enough for 4 people with an extra slice or two.

[Trent Steel]

Two XL coming in at 24" x 18" 15 slice Detroit Deep Dish pizzas with everything (10 toppings) would be crazy expensive, and too steep for my blood, is under $50. 30 slices of a Jet's 10 is enough to feed a small army of Trent Steels or even a few chaosravens.

Yeah, but when Trent is in town, bartenders hand out free cheeseburger deep dish pies.

Wherever I go, it's like I have an inside connection.

And this blows Smoove's mind.

[ImLawBoy]

I think the going rate for a large "Chicago Style" at Gino's or Giordano's or Lou's down here is like $35. After tax and you're looking at $40. But that's usually enough for 4 people with an extra slice or two.

Just checked, and Lou's is $20 for a large sausage (or pepperoni, but true Chicagoans would go for the sausage).

[Isgrimnur]

What breed of sausage is typical?

[ImLawBoy]

For deep dish, it should be a mild Italian sausage. It's spread in the pizza as a layer, not nuggets, so it's better to use a mild sausage so as not to overwhelm everything.

[LawBeefaroni]

I think the going rate for a large "Chicago Style" at Gino's or Giordano's or Lou's down here is like $35. After tax and you're looking at $40. But that's usually enough for 4 people with an extra slice or two.

Just checked, and Lou's is $20 for a large sausage (or pepperoni, but true Chicagoans would go for the sausage).

Nice. I just looked at the local Giordanos and it's is $27 for large +1 item. So also lower than I expected. Maybe I need to tip less at carryout.

[cheeba]

ImLawBoy, did you ever eat at the Uno's in A^2? I always thought that was pretty damn good stuff, but I hear a lot of people poo pooing Uno's franchises. Of course back then I used to consider pop tarts a meal, so any real food I ate might have seemed overly impressive.

[ImLawBoy]

I did eat there a couple of times, but the crust in the franchise locations is different from the crust in the original location. I always called it Bisquick crust at the franchises. It's flufflier and lacks the snap of original Uno's (or Lou's or Geno's).

[Jeff V]

Yeah, the Unos franchises are ok when you anywhere but Chicago since chances are slim that better options are available. But it doesn't really compare with the real thing...partly because to get the real thing, you need to stand in line, out in the cold for up to 2 hours, at which point just about anything vaguely pizza-like will seem to be the best ever.

[El Guapo]

I recently ate a banana ham curry pizza. It was delicious.

[Jeff V]

I recently ate a banana ham curry pizza. It was delicious.

Admit it, you pull those words out of some sort of dictionary randomizer.

[LordMortis]

I recently ate a banana ham curry pizza. It was delicious.

A banana peppers and ham pizza would be delicious. Peppercino is a great topping to mix with meat on pizza and is integral to a garbage pizza. Oddly enough, it's not the best topping on a strictly vegetable pizza.

I can't speak for curry. I hate the smell and don't remember ever eating it in anything, much less pizza. A curry smelling pizza would totally turn me off.

[El Guapo]

I recently ate a banana ham curry pizza. It was delicious.

Admit it, you pull those words out of some sort of dictionary randomizer.

My daughter had a playdate and the mother made this. The mother is from Sweden, where this pizza is evidently wildly popular.

As to whether the Swedes got it from a randomizer or from a poor translation, I cannot say.

[Unagi]

My daughter had a playdate and the mother made this. The mother is from Sweden, where this pizza is evidently wildly popular.

Confirmed.

[LordMortis]

Well banana and curry, sure. But ham on pizza, who ever heard of that?

[AWS260]

Lou Malnati's (of Chicago) will send you (have for over 20 years, pretty sure, back when no one did) their deep-dish pizzas fed-ex (frozen, clearly).

I'd recommend them, but haven't actually sampled it for a very long time (cause I get the real thing)

About a decade ago, I ordered some frozen deep-dish from Lou Malnati's. They ship it packed in dry ice, which in my case was just barely enough to keep it mostly-frozen by the time it arrived at my apartment.

As I vaguely recall, it was on the one hand delicious, because I hadn't had proper deep dish in ages, and on the other hand clearly inferior to the real deal hot from the oven at Lou's.

It cost way more than I should be spending on food, but I was drunk, bored, and had internet access, which is frequently a recipe for ordering something online that I don't need.

[El Guapo]

My daughter had a playdate and the mother made this. The mother is from Sweden, where this pizza is evidently wildly popular.

Confirmed.

Are you angling to take over Isgrimnur's job around here?

[JSHAW]

All 3 of the stock photo's of deep dish I pulled off of Google images, just to show pics of what I was expecting to receive here
in North Kaka-lackie.

Back in the 70's NC had a chain called Godfathers, some still know of it because of the presedential candidate back in the last
election Herman Cain was, or is it's CEO. Don't know if he was when it was in Charlotte NC back in the 70's, doesn't matter now.

Anyhoo, Godfather's had deep dish, and it was awesome. Pretty much everything I had my current craving for last week, but that
didn't happen.

$15 for a large pizza is about normal in these parts. So $34 for 2 large from the imposter chicago dog place last week I wouldn't have had a problem with, IF they would have had REAL deep dish pizza.

The fact that my wife told me don't worry about getting a refund I had a big problem with. To me it was in the realm of being blasphemous to the name and label of what a deep dish pizza IS, to call what I got by that name. $34 in my garbage bin because they didn't know how to make it? Not bloody likely!

So not getting my money refunded wasn't an option for me. I wanted the owner to know, and I told him what my chef friend from davidson had said about his product during our conversation. I didn't post the entire phone conversation for the sake of brevity, but
he didn't seem annoyed or pissed that someone thought his chicago deep dish WASN'T.

Even though I was disappointed with his product I admired him for sticking up for his product. He thought his stuff was tha' bomb, so
he can keep on thinking that. I just don't have to believe it was.

I don't forsee traveling to Chicago just to get a deep dish pizza, so a fedex frozen will probably be the option I choose.
1 will do to start. Probably go with Giordano's, and then some of the other places mentioned after the first Giordano's
arrives. That's a weekend project for the near future. Order it and try to time it to arrive on friday or saturday night.

You guy's probably don't know this about me but Pizza, and Steak are my favorite things to eat. I freakin' LOVE PIZZA!!!

My area has several great NY style pizza places, which I know and frequent several times a month. The local grocery store
did a recent remodel and they make their own NY Style there in the store. They call it "the pizza bar" and I started buying
it once a week. We call it pizza night in our household. LOVE pizza night.

Thanks for the comments guy's. I appreciate the feedback on tha' deep dish. Guess I'm gonna have to put my cravings for that
style on the backburner...for now.

[hentzau]

We do Chicago style pizza night on Friday night at OctoCon...

[Odin]

a fedex frozen will probably be the option I choose. 1 will do to start.

You'd better clear some space in your freezer, because at both of the places mentioned in this thread, the smallest order you can do is two (for $60, including, I believe, shipping).

[LawBeefaroni]

You guy's probably don't know this about me but Pizza, and Steak are my favorite things to eat. I freakin' LOVE PIZZA!!!

Lots of places around here offer Italian beef as a topping. With Italian sausage (loose style)? Yes please. Mmmmmmmmotherfukcingsogood.