Overlords Investment Conclave [OIC] Recruitment Thread

LawBeefaroni · Post by **LawBeefaroni** » Fri Dec 18, 2015 6:17 pm

LordMortis wrote:So
2) How do I go about finding out the proper REIT? I'm thinking safe. I don't want to babysit it. I want to dump money into it and not touch it for years. So I'm thinking like FRT, who have been in business for years and years and years. But then I see cheap stocks that have been around for like five or six year with huge returns like NCT or ORC and then I remember how dumb I am.

Don't go confusing yield with return.

ORC is paying a 17% yield because it hasn't yet adjusted proportionately to its 30% loss this year. You'd have made around $1.75 in dividends per share and lost around $4 in share price.

FRT pays around 2%. Investors accept lower yield for FRT because it's less of a risk and has a chance of capital appreciation (increase in share price). In 2015 it's up around 11%

So ORC has a current 17% yield and yet, even with the dividend, has lost its investors around 18% in 2015. FRT has a 2% yield and has made investors round 13% in the same time period.

EDIT:Oh, and I just noticed that ORC is a mortgage REIT. Very different than FRT or NCT, who I think make their money of real estate income and possibly sales.

LordMortis · Post by **LordMortis** » Mon Jan 04, 2016 11:02 am

2016 contribution made. Specifically in VT world market index and the FRT REIT.

Prepare for the nose dive.

noxiousdog · Post by **noxiousdog** » Mon Jan 04, 2016 12:53 pm

I have done a 180 on Amazon, but it's very hard to explain. The short version is Amazon Web Services is going to be the Wal-mart of all infrastructure and services. They are going to put Oracle out of business. They are going to put nearly every data center out of business.

They came into our office and did a presentation and blew us away. Their services are easy to use, responsive, better for accounting, and they provide great service.

Oracle is valued at 152B and that is Amazon's competitor. Not Wal-mart.

There may or may not be any value in retail, but then they may turn into a middle-man and delivery company.

AWS is big though and by saying "Look, we run Amazon retail on our services. We can run your company too." they have a great marketing too.

LordMortis · Post by **LordMortis** » Wed Jan 06, 2016 3:18 pm

LordMortis wrote:2016 contribution made. Specifically in VT world market index and the FRT REIT.

Prepare for the nose dive.

Last night NBR was saying it is probably time to start preparing for a bearish market. What have the last 15 months been, if not bearish?

Isgrimnur · Post by **Isgrimnur** » Wed Jan 06, 2016 3:23 pm

Flat.

LordMortis · Post by **LordMortis** » Fri Jan 15, 2016 12:57 pm

Baton down the hatches. I spent money I couldn't afford and bought more F. 5% plus the plans for unscheduled dividends and I couldn't say no. Kiss it all goodbye.

It's time really really really rebuild my savings and stop contributing wallstreet.

LawBeefaroni · Post by **LawBeefaroni** » Fri Jan 15, 2016 1:22 pm

LordMortis wrote:Baton down the hatches. I spent money I couldn't afford and bought more F. 5% plus the plans for unscheduled dividends and I couldn't say no. Kiss it all goodbye.

It's time really really really rebuild my savings and stop contributing wallstreet.

The special dividend is a safe way for Ford to pay shareholders but not commit going forward.

Monday is a market holiday and today is options expiration so maybe not the best day to do it, but what the hell, in for 40 more.

LordMortis · Post by **LordMortis** » Fri Jan 15, 2016 1:42 pm

LawBeefaroni wrote:today is options expiration .

That's the sort of stuff I need to learn and haven't. Not that I want to buy and sell options but understanding their timing and learning how much is on the market seems like something I should know.

I do really need to stop buying though. Prices keep going down, so I keep buying more and losing more equity. NBR expert said another 15% should be expected and others say burn it all down. My paper losses right now are staggering and I fear my tax bill is going to be way higher for dividend income.

I'm learning expensive lessons, but I haven't lost nothing until I pull money or someone goes out of business right?

stessier · Post by **stessier** » Fri Jan 15, 2016 1:56 pm

I don't know about your income bracket or just how much your dividends are, but I've found the tax bill is really pretty minor. But then, I'm not play in the 10s of thousands of dividends.

LordMortis · Post by **LordMortis** » Fri Jan 15, 2016 2:02 pm

stessier wrote:I don't know about your income bracket or just how much your dividends are, but I've found the tax bill is really pretty minor. But then, I'm not play in the 10s of thousands of dividends.

This will be the first year I get meaningful dividends but for me 100s of dollars is meaningful and paying taxes on 100s of dollars still needs to be accounted for.

I dream of 10s of thousands of dollars in dividends. I soooo want to retire. Damn you powerball. Another $2 bites the dust.

LordMortis · Post by **LordMortis** » Wed Jan 20, 2016 12:10 pm

LordMortis wrote:Baton down the hatches. I spent money I couldn't afford and bought more F. 5% plus the plans for unscheduled dividends and I couldn't say no. Kiss it all goodbye.

It's time really really really rebuild my savings and stop contributing wallstreet.

And at another 3.5% drop on oil craziness, I picked up some VT today. I'm just watching it all wash away.

Nothing is gained or lost until I sell
Nothing is gained or lost until I sell
Nothing is gained or lost until I sell

stessier · Post by **stessier** » Wed Jan 20, 2016 12:24 pm

Well, unless your concern goes under anyway.

LordMortis · Post by **LordMortis** » Wed Jan 20, 2016 12:27 pm

stessier wrote:Well, unless your concern goes under anyway.

QUIET YOU!

Carpet_pissr · Post by **Carpet_pissr** » Wed Jan 20, 2016 1:09 pm

Yeah, after this week, pretty sure we will start seeing many more of the smaller oil related companies filing for bankruptcy, maybe even some of the mid sized. Or get bought out.

Keep an eye on the debt-to-EBITDA ratio for any oil/energy concerns (producers) you are holding.

Also, heard yesterday that at the current sub-$30 price per barrel, the barrels now cost more than the oil inside! Wow.

LordMortis · Post by **LordMortis** » Wed Jan 20, 2016 1:20 pm

I have not oil funds, but I do have a number of index funds that are oil heavy.

My one energy security is in propane (FGP) and it's been more downhill ever since I first bought my first shares 15 months ago. Just brutal.

LawBeefaroni · Post by **LawBeefaroni** » Mon Jan 25, 2016 4:34 pm

Got my tickets for the DIS annual shareholder meeting in March.

Love it when they move ASHMs to Chicago.

LawBeefaroni · Post by **LawBeefaroni** » Wed Jan 27, 2016 12:42 pm

Bought more BA today, sold some CVLT.

LordMortis · Post by **LordMortis** » Wed Jan 27, 2016 3:42 pm

I'm over spent into this dip already. I'd love to be throwing around more money but I'm already in too deep or my savings is already too shallow, however you want to look at it.

It's really really too bad, as I am pretty well committed to dividend stocks, rather than growth stocks and there are a lot of stocks large cap stocks paying between 3.5 and 5% after this dip that I'd love to throw money in to. Sitting at the top of my list have been VZ, LNVGY, and UNP (Verizon, Lenovo, and U Pac) but by the time I rebuild my savings and hedge with increasing my index based positions I think this opportunity will have passed. I think the window for Verizon may have already passed... But then what do I know. I don't have time to do due diligence. (though even with my FGP blunder, I am outperforming my 401K, which is to say I'm losing a smaller percentage of my money than my 401K is losing for my retirement)

LordMortis · Post by **LordMortis** » Thu Jan 28, 2016 12:30 pm

If F continues to slide, I'm going to triple down on the crazy when I get paid tomorrow with money I really really shouldn't be pulling from savings. As shares plummet, Dividend strength is up to 6.5% and their posting $.47 per share profit in the 4th quarter.

If payday were today, I'd already be in... because I'm stupid that way.

Edit: Bye Bye. The $11.2x I was drooling over is back up to over $11.7x

LawBeefaroni · Post by **LawBeefaroni** » Mon Feb 01, 2016 10:34 pm

IBT wrote:Alphabet Inc. (GOOG) just knocked Apple Inc. (AAPL) off its pedestal as the world’s most valuable publicly traded company. The share price of the firm formerly known as Google popped in after-hours trading Monday following a strong earnings report, sending its market capitalization to $550 billion. By comparison, Apple’s market cap is currently $538.7 billion.

Pyperkub · Post by **Pyperkub** » Thu Feb 04, 2016 7:56 pm

Chief Justice Roberts sells MS stock as 360 defect case arrives @ the Supreme Ct.

Supreme Court Chief Justice John Roberts has sold between $250,000 and $500,000 worth of Microsoft stock, according to an Associated Press report out today. It's the largest single stock sale by anyone on the court in more than a decade.

The large stock sale is news in part because the high court agreed a few weeks ago to take a case involving alleged defects in Microsoft's Xbox 360 console. Assuming that Roberts sold all his Microsoft stock, that means he won't have to withdraw from the case.

interesting.

LordMortis · Post by **LordMortis** » Fri Feb 05, 2016 4:07 pm

SPY continues to take a beating. Now is about the time I wish I had money to put into my indexes, SPY,VTI, and VT.

But I'm still tapped out and will be for a while to come.

The horrible thing is when I finally build a savings I won't have the patience to wait for these dips.

grumpy · Post by **grumpy** » Sat Feb 06, 2016 6:05 pm

LordMortis wrote:SPY continues to take a beating. Now is about the time I wish I had money to put into my indexes, SPY...

Depending on your objectives, you might find VOO a better fit for a long term S&P500 ETF. It's the same underlying index, but half the expense ratio. It's smaller and less liquid, but this probably doesn't matter to you.

Isgrimnur · Post by **Isgrimnur** » Sat Feb 06, 2016 8:13 pm

After reviewing the tax docs, I noticed that my post-tax direct deposit had been going into my rollover IRA, and the fact that the contributions were showing up in Box 1 of my 5498 rather than Box 10 for Roth contributions means the potential for double taxation.

Ah, well, I doubt the pittance in contributions is going to matter. I've now set up a new Roth IRA to take those deposits so that I get the proper credit going forward.

Carpet_pissr · Post by **Carpet_pissr** » Fri Feb 12, 2016 12:09 pm

Looks like 2020 or even later before oil recovers to more normal levels for those of you sitting on E&P "names" (ugh).

Isgrimnur · Post by **Isgrimnur** » Fri Feb 12, 2016 12:17 pm

Maybe those corps should diversify into renewables.

The Meal · Post by **The Meal** » Fri Feb 12, 2016 12:46 pm

Carpet_pissr wrote:Looks like 2020 or even later before oil recovers to more normal levels for those of you sitting on E&P "names" (ugh).

Really enjoyed this piece.

LordMortis · Post by **LordMortis** » Fri Feb 12, 2016 4:56 pm

The Meal wrote:Really enjoyed this piece.

One of us picked a really bad time to start investing in their retirement and that's sort of the story of his fiscal life.

LordMortis · Post by **LordMortis** » Thu Mar 03, 2016 4:52 pm

The aggregate of my initial foray into the investment world over the last 16+ months is approaching a 0% return. I feel like I am winning at the craps table and should take all my bets down and just ask for a comped dinner at the buffet.

That's probably not how things are supposed to work, huh?

At the moment, I am doing way better than the offerings given to me in 401k and for what a the pro did for my 3rd party investments over that same 16+ month period but that's because F went from Icy cold to way hot for reasons I can comprehend. The day after F paid us all an extra $.20 dividend, we jump from like $12 to $13 and it's still been rising. I won't complain.

Also gas is back up to nearly $2 a gallon. Coincidence?

LawBeefaroni · Post by **LawBeefaroni** » Thu Mar 03, 2016 5:34 pm

LordMortis wrote: The day after F paid us all an extra $.20 dividend, we jump from like $12 to $13 and it's still been rising. I won't complain.

Record auto sales in the US in 2015 I think.

Loved that dividend (it was actually $0.40, not $0.20). Every 35 or so shares got you a free share in a DRIP.

LordMortis · Post by **LordMortis** » Thu Mar 17, 2016 2:21 pm

If you don't count that I had to pay taxes on dividends then I am actually up for the first time since I don't know when! FGP has been killing me. Right now, that and SPY are the only things I am down on, but it's FGP that is the brutal killer.

Edit: And back down again...

Cortilian · Post by **Cortilian** » Mon Mar 28, 2016 5:19 pm

Does anyone know of a location for a good Fixed Index Annuity Calculator? We are having to put a significant sum of money from my wife's old workplace and this is one of the options being offered to us but all the calculators I have found are for regular annuities or just don't work.

Please my Google-Fu is weak.

Also, I have never heard of a Fixed Index Annuity before this. This money would be for income post-retirement and wouldn't be touched for 15 years. Opinions on this product is greatly appreciated. It honestly seems too good to be true from what the investment adviser is saying. The company the annuity is with is Allianz,

Thanks.

Carpet_pissr · Post by **Carpet_pissr** » Mon Mar 28, 2016 5:41 pm

Cortilian wrote: The company the annuity is with is Allianz,

oof.

Let me guess, they told you there was no downside, only upside with the FIA?

And I say "oof" because I've heard about the company's sleazy-esque sales tactics (and products, like this one).

LordMortis · Post by **LordMortis** » Mon Mar 28, 2016 6:45 pm

Carpet_pissr wrote:
Cortilian wrote: The company the annuity is with is Allianz,
oof.

Let me guess, they told you there was no downside, only upside with the FIA?

And I say "oof" because I've heard about the company's sleazy-esque sales tactics (and products, like this one).

I went to look up Allianz Annuity Reviews and google autofilled scam in before I typed reviews. Backing out of that, these were the top two items

http://www.startribune.com/a-split-deci ... /64089107/

http://www.investmentnews.com/article/2 ... y-platform

Anyhoo

http://www.annuityfyi.com/fixed-indexed ... d-indexed/

From the sound of it, you are purchasing and insurance plan the the S&P (or similar index) will go up. If it doesn't then you get some sort of minimum payment. This is all balanced by a high commission on your investment. When your index is doing good you make less money to cover the costs of paying when your index is not doing good.

I don't think there are calculators, only an in depth understanding of the cost of doing business and the costs of having security against a down market.

RunningMn9 · Post by **RunningMn9** » Tue Mar 29, 2016 7:00 am

Wasn't there someone here schilling for these a while back?

Cortilian · Post by **Cortilian** » Tue Mar 29, 2016 9:09 am

Thanks folks. I was away from the internet much of yesterday. Yeah, I've been looking them up and reading articles on them. I'll probably go with a traditional IRA. The one thing I don't like with the fixed index annuity is that when disbursements start you can only take 5% a year out. So if the fund generates 5% the balance stays the same until you die. However, when you do die, you do not get the full value of the IRA, just the cash surrender value which is much less from what I have read.

That just seems a little odd to me.

stessier · Post by **stessier** » Tue Mar 29, 2016 9:38 am

Are you saying that 5% is how you think a traditional IRA works? Because that isn't right at all.

LordMortis · Post by **LordMortis** » Tue Mar 29, 2016 9:56 am

Cortilian wrote:Thanks folks. I was away from the internet much of yesterday. Yeah, I've been looking them up and reading articles on them. I'll probably go with a traditional IRA. The one thing I don't like is that when disbursements start you can only take 5% a year out. So if the fund generates 5% the balance stays the same until you die. However, when you do die, you do not get the full value of the IRA, just the cash surrender value which is much less from what I have read.

That just seems a little odd to me.

I'm still on the low end of huge learning curve when it comes to learning how to set up a retirement but that doesn't even sound like it's in the ballpark of correct.

https://www.irs.gov/Retirement-Plans/Pl ... tributions

1) Do the research before you rollover but do it quickly. There are lots of rules and timelines and different kinds of rolloevers
2) I think you are confusing minimum distribution and how they work. Eventually you will get to an age were you will be forced to withdraw from your IRA. That does not defines maximums but rather the minimum you must pull every year.

https://www.irs.gov/Retirement-Plans/Pl ... %28RMDs%29

Cortilian · Post by **Cortilian** » Tue Mar 29, 2016 10:01 am

stessier wrote:Are you saying that 5% is how you think a traditional IRA works? Because that isn't right at all.

Edited to clarify my post. Was only talking about the fixed index annuity. They do limit the maximum amount you can take out. If you choose to take out more they penalize you.

LordMortis · Post by **LordMortis** » Tue Mar 29, 2016 10:07 am

Cortilian wrote:
stessier wrote:Are you saying that 5% is how you think a traditional IRA works? Because that isn't right at all.
Edited to clarify my post. Was only talking about the fixed index annuity. They do limit the maximum amount you can take out. If you choose to take out more they penalize you.

Oh, then never mind.