The Art of the Donald Trumpocalypse

Alefroth · Post by **Alefroth** » Thu Mar 31, 2016 4:24 pm

tgb wrote:If it was revealed tomorrow that this whole thing was a long con engineered by the Clintons to a)guarantee a Hillary victory and b)decimate the GOP, I wouldn't be surprised in the least. They're certainly capable of it.

I don't think that succeeds until he gets the nomination, which is starting to lose a little of it's aura of inevitability.

Alefroth · Post by **Alefroth** » Thu Mar 31, 2016 4:29 pm

Kraken wrote:The events of the past few days have persuaded me that Trump can't keep the con going through November. He's already exhausted his best material. The outrages that he needs to keep generating are getting more and more outrageous, to the point where only his most rabid followers can tolerate them. I just hope he gets the nomination before it all falls apart on him.

+1

YellowKing · Post by **YellowKing** » Thu Mar 31, 2016 4:35 pm

The problem being that Trump not getting the nomination just means that the other guy nobody can stand gets it.

Holman · Post by **Holman** » Thu Mar 31, 2016 4:42 pm

I think it falls apart for the GOP whether Trump gets the nomination or not.

The most likely scenario is that Trump rolls into the convention with a plurality but not a majority. There might be riots or there might not, but one thing certain is that many and perhaps most of Trump's supporters will not accept seeing the nomination go to someone else. In saving itself from Trump, the party will tear itself apart and the optics will be catastrophic. Giving the nom to Cruz is nothing but a surrender of the White House, and giving it to Kasich (who will be a very distant 3rd in delegates) or some White Knight looks like a palace coup by the Establishment.

At some point the RNC has to consider the effect of all this on down-ballot races. At first they were worried that the embarrassment of a Trump nomination would hurt other Republicans by tarnishing the brand, but now it seems to be dawning on them that denying Trump's plurality could cause much of it to just stay home.

Isgrimnur · Post by **Isgrimnur** » Thu Mar 31, 2016 4:56 pm

Cruz is trying to take Kasich out of the picture based on the Ron Paul rule.

GreenGoo · Post by **GreenGoo** » Thu Mar 31, 2016 5:05 pm

YellowKing wrote:The problem being that Trump not getting the nomination just means that the other guy nobody can stand gets it.

Yep. I keep forgetting, and when I remember, I'm dismayed all over again.

Archinerd · Post by **Archinerd** » Thu Mar 31, 2016 5:15 pm

GreenGoo wrote:
YellowKing wrote:The problem being that Trump not getting the nomination just means that the other guy nobody can stand gets it.
Yep. I keep forgetting, and when I remember, I'm dismayed all over again.

I think I've come to the realization that I would rather Trump be our next president than Cruz.

Kraken · Post by **Kraken** » Thu Mar 31, 2016 5:21 pm

GreenGoo wrote:
YellowKing wrote:The problem being that Trump not getting the nomination just means that the other guy nobody can stand gets it.
Yep. I keep forgetting, and when I remember, I'm dismayed all over again.

Cruz is more dangerous than Trump because Cruz is an ideologue with an agenda. For that reason (and because he lacks Trump's flair for showmanship), he should also lose by a wider margin.

Either way, the salient question is whether the R Party survives as a viable national party. Watching a major party disintegrate is a rare and fascinating thing. Their convention will either pull it out of the fire or become a fight over scraps.

tgb · Post by **tgb** » Thu Mar 31, 2016 6:00 pm

Kraken wrote: I just hope he gets the nomination before it all falls apart on him.

I think that's the plan

Fitzy · Post by **Fitzy** » Thu Mar 31, 2016 6:49 pm

YellowKing wrote:The problem being that Trump not getting the nomination just means that the other guy nobody can stand gets it.

Worse, Cruz becomes the hero who saved the Republican party and to a lesser extent, America, from Trump.

Zarathud · Post by **Zarathud** » Thu Mar 31, 2016 10:34 pm

At least the Republicans can't blame the hippie anarchists for the inevitable disaster at their convention.

Grifman · Post by **Grifman** » Fri Apr 01, 2016 12:56 am

Archinerd wrote:
GreenGoo wrote:
YellowKing wrote:The problem being that Trump not getting the nomination just means that the other guy nobody can stand gets it.
Yep. I keep forgetting, and when I remember, I'm dismayed all over again.
I think I've come to the realization that I would rather Trump be our next president than Cruz.

That's insane. His foreign policy and trade policies would be disasters. Trump would reduce our support of NATO, wants to encourage South Korea and Japan to arm themselves with nukes, he's praised Putin who seeks to weaken NATO, and he would start a series of disastrous trade wars with any nations that he thinks are beating the US that would lead to a new global recession.

He also so narcissistic that any criticism of him is "unfair", hence he's already said that he would like to restrain the press. As the Atlantic has pointed out, his poorly thought out health care "plan" would lead to more expensive and worse care for Americans. His backtracking on punishing women for abortion shows that he really doesn't think through issues, he operates off the cuff. He is temperamentally unfit to be president.

Trump would be far worse for our country than Cruz. But if you want a more dangerous world, with a new recession and worse health care, then be my guest and go for it.

Zarathud · Post by **Zarathud** » Fri Apr 01, 2016 1:03 am

Of course, you may be mocked mercilessly if you go for it. At least until Trump pries these forums from our cold, dead hands.

Jeff V · Post by **Jeff V** » Fri Apr 01, 2016 9:26 am

Archinerd wrote: I think I've come to the realization that I would rather Trump be our next president than Cruz.

Says the person who just bought a new house in Uzbekibekistan.

Archinerd · Post by **Archinerd** » Fri Apr 01, 2016 11:05 am

Grifman wrote:
Archinerd wrote:
GreenGoo wrote:
YellowKing wrote:The problem being that Trump not getting the nomination just means that the other guy nobody can stand gets it.
Yep. I keep forgetting, and when I remember, I'm dismayed all over again.
I think I've come to the realization that I would rather Trump be our next president than Cruz.
That's insane. His foreign policy and trade policies would be disasters. Trump would reduce our support of NATO, wants to encourage South Korea and Japan to arm themselves with nukes, he's praised Putin who seeks to weaken NATO, and he would start a series of disastrous trade wars with any nations that he thinks are beating the US that would lead to a new global recession.

He also so narcissistic that any criticism of him is "unfair", hence he's already said that he would like to restrain the press. As the Atlantic has pointed out, his poorly thought out health care "plan" would lead to more expensive and worse care for Americans. His backtracking on punishing women for abortion shows that he really doesn't think through issues, he operates off the cuff. He is temperamentally unfit to be president.

Trump would be far worse for our country than Cruz. But if you want a more dangerous world, with a new recession and worse health care, then be my guest and go for it.

You may have mistaken my comment as support for Trump, which it is not.

I don't actually see Trump doing half of what he says, I think he's just loves the attention and will say or do whatever it takes to keep people talking about him. Not unlike Paris Hilton, Charlie Sheen, any of the Kardashians, Miley Cyrus, etc.

I think Cruz is more likely to be able to keep the job if he were to get it and has stronger convictions on his beliefs, thus giving him a chance to enact his agenda of hate and fear.

I'll concede that you might be right though.

tru1cy · Post by **tru1cy** » Fri Apr 01, 2016 12:59 pm

Trump and Cruz would be bad for this country. Trump is an idiot and Cruz is a dangerous ideologue

hepcat · Post by **hepcat** » Fri Apr 01, 2016 1:10 pm

Trump would lose interest in actually doing the job after 1 month (if not sooner). All responsibilities would be turned over to his staff at that point, while he returned to his first love: himself.

YellowKing · Post by **YellowKing** » Fri Apr 01, 2016 1:18 pm

To illustrate how bad it is, my dad who I've spoken about many times, is hoping Hillary wins. He can not bring himself to vote for her, but he thinks both Cruz and Trump would be far more dangerous for the country.

Republicans, when you get a right-winger like my dad praying for a Hillary Clinton presidency, you have SERIOUS problems.

LordMortis · Post by **LordMortis** » Fri Apr 01, 2016 1:28 pm

RunningMn9 wrote:That is a sensible old dude.

http://www.usnews.com/news/articles/201 ... al-parties

I wasn't sure if I should put this in the Clinton thread, in the Bernie thread, or in the general election thread but then I remembered this quote so I put it here.

Young Americans don’t care much for political parties. According to the Pew Research Center, 48 percent of millennials (ages 18-33) identify as independents. That’s almost as many as identify as Democrats (28 percent) and Republicans (18 percent) put together.

Political scientists are often skeptical about the independent option in surveys. Most individuals who choose to call themselves “independents” still vote consistently with one party or the other. They are partisans except in name.

Even if that’s true, the lack of loyalty or concern for parties still has consequences. For instance, presidential primary campaigns were established to allow a party’s members to choose its candidate. But the research team at Tufts University’s Tisch College, where I study civic engagement, estimates that young Americans (18-30) have so far cast more votes for Sen. Bernie Sanders than for Hillary Clinton and Donald Trump combined.

Young people might just end up changing the landscape of politics yet and really that would be for the first time in my conscious lifetime. And I hold out hope that it will happen and it will be for the better of our country. I fully support the idea of rejection political dichotomy as a team sport and their accompanying power bases. As much as my views have changed over the years, this rejection has remained consistent.

Maybe Occupy didn't end when the weather turned cold in 2011. Maybe, it only smoldered.

Isgrimnur · Post by **Isgrimnur** » Fri Apr 01, 2016 1:32 pm

LordMortis wrote:Young Americans don’t care much for political parties. According to the Pew Research Center, 48 percent of millennials (ages 18-33) identify as independents. That’s almost as many as identify as Democrats (28 percent) and Republicans (18 percent) put together.

28 + 18 = 46

48 ... almost as much ... 28 ... and ... 18 ... put together

LordMortis · Post by **LordMortis** » Fri Apr 01, 2016 1:34 pm

Isgrimnur wrote:
LordMortis wrote:Young Americans don’t care much for political parties. According to the Pew Research Center, 48 percent of millennials (ages 18-33) identify as independents. That’s almost as many as identify as Democrats (28 percent) and Republicans (18 percent) put together.
28 + 18 = 46

48 ... almost as much ... 28 ... and ... 18 ... put together

Good thing I'm not an editor.

Jaymann · Post by **Jaymann** » Fri Apr 01, 2016 1:35 pm

Zarathud wrote:Of course, you may be mocked mercilessly if you go for it. At least until Trump pries these forums from our cold, dead hands.

If Clinton has it wrapped up before the California votes are counted, I could see voting for Drumpf just so I could say, "Don't blame me, I voted for Hitler."

Spoiler:

Moliere · Post by **Moliere** » Fri Apr 01, 2016 2:12 pm

Trump confirms it was all a joke.

tjg_marantz · Post by **tjg_marantz** » Fri Apr 01, 2016 2:33 pm

tgb · Post by **tgb** » Sat Apr 02, 2016 7:23 am

YellowKing wrote:To illustrate how bad it is, my dad who I've spoken about many times, is hoping Hillary wins. He can not bring himself to vote for her, but he thinks both Cruz and Trump would be far more dangerous for the country.

Republicans, when you get a right-winger like my dad praying for a Hillary Clinton presidency, you have SERIOUS problems.

My boss is very much like your father, but hates the Clintons so much he just couldn't bring himself to vote for her. He's decided to vote for Bernie, either as a 3rd party candidate or write-in, or just sit this one out of that's not an option.

I've been trying to convince him any of those would be a mistake.

Rip · Post by **Rip** » Sun Apr 03, 2016 12:02 pm

LordMortis · Post by **LordMortis** » Sun Apr 03, 2016 12:26 pm

Rip wrote:

I don't happen to agree with tgb, and agree with his boss (even if hate is extreme... have an overwhelming contempt for her contempt, maybe), actually, I very much understand where tgb's coming from. Though, I have until November to figure out my protest vote if it's Clinton v Trump.

It's hard to justify not voting for the horrible candidate when these people keep getting bolder and bolder and Trump is their Golden Idol:

http://www.wzzm13.com/news/local/grand- ... /106494134

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=INy4gaUrCL4

RunningMn9 · Post by **RunningMn9** » Sun Apr 03, 2016 4:50 pm

Those seem like well-educated individuals.

Chrisoc13 · Post by **Chrisoc13** » Sun Apr 03, 2016 5:29 pm

RunningMn9 wrote:Those seem like well-educated individuals.

Right? I'm kind of surprised people applauded him. The stuff in those videos and the fear of Muslims really bothers me. Even with all the other things about trump that bother me his stirring up anti-islamic sentiments is the worst.

RunningMn9 · Post by **RunningMn9** » Sun Apr 03, 2016 7:13 pm

Was there anyone in the crowd that stood up and pointed out that the meathead was an ignorant asshole? Or just clapping?

Chrisoc13 · Post by **Chrisoc13** » Sun Apr 03, 2016 9:39 pm

RunningMn9 wrote:Was there anyone in the crowd that stood up and pointed out that the meathead was an ignorant asshole? Or just clapping?

It looked like some people were objecting to what they were saying. But still this seemingly growing segment of society makes me nervous.

Moliere · Post by **Moliere** » Sun Apr 03, 2016 11:38 pm

Donald Trump Defends Proposals to Deconstruct U.S. Military Treaty With Europe

Does NATO have a place in the modern world of terrorist threats?

Kraken · Post by **Kraken** » Mon Apr 04, 2016 1:10 am

Moliere wrote:Donald Trump Defends Proposals to Deconstruct U.S. Military Treaty With Europe

Does NATO have a place in the modern world of terrorist threats?

Extorting more military spending from NATO members is not crazy talk. Dissolving the alliance is, but extreme opening positions are a valid negotiating tactic when you have the position of strength.

The world of diplomacy and the world of business negotiation don't ordinarily intersect outside of trade pacts, and the diplomats and the capitalists share the driver's seat even then. Under President Trump the businessmen will be driving.

Nice alliance we have here. Pity if something happened to it.

GreenGoo · Post by **GreenGoo** » Mon Apr 04, 2016 1:15 am

Kraken wrote:
Moliere wrote:Donald Trump Defends Proposals to Deconstruct U.S. Military Treaty With Europe

Does NATO have a place in the modern world of terrorist threats?
Extorting more military spending from NATO members is not crazy talk.

Defiant · Post by **Defiant** » Mon Apr 04, 2016 2:02 am

Make American Grapes Again

Rip · Post by **Rip** » Mon Apr 04, 2016 2:24 am

Make America Gape Again!

LordMortis · Post by **LordMortis** » Mon Apr 04, 2016 2:41 pm

Blood for the blood god!

http://www.rawstory.com/2016/04/sarah-p ... ack-trump/

On Wisconsin!

Faith of America is in you to take us forward on Tuesday; to remain strong and independent of the status quo political establishment so your vote will truly represent your optimistic spirit and desire to WORK! Hardworking Wisconsinites deserve much better than a repeat of the establishment's agenda that led to losing this great state to Obama in 2012 - by 200,000 votes!

The continued games of the permanent political class will assure a Hillary victory unless you tell them "ENOUGH!" and vote for bold, new leadership that puts your interests before party politics. Vote for your jobs and security. Vote for the first candidate since Reagan who is growing the Commonsense Conservative movement... the only one who's created middle class jobs... the only one not living off your tax dollars... the only one Wisconsin can count on to steer us away from the rocky shoals ahead.

Vote for Donald Trump on Tuesday to make America great again.

This is the message shared with diverse Wisconsin voters this weekend, including those of you I'm thrilled to see today at "Zingers and Flingers" Gun Range in Wausau today at 12:30. See you there!

(Note: I am very much pro hunter (but anti booze and hunting) but this... I don't know what this is...)

El Guapo · Post by **El Guapo** » Mon Apr 04, 2016 3:21 pm

Skulls for the skull throne!

Actually adopting that slogan might be the only thing that would make me give some consideration to voting Trump...

Jeff V · Post by **Jeff V** » Mon Apr 04, 2016 3:57 pm

The message I get from that is "Vote for Trump - your lack of jobs will be the least of your concerns. Learn to kill. KILL!"

This message approved by Americans for a Redneck Kingdom

Moliere · Post by **Moliere** » Mon Apr 04, 2016 5:00 pm

I don't see what is so "bizarre" about the Palin picture and message. It's pandering to her base that likes hunting and guns, but that's not unusual.