Political Randomness

[Isgrimnur]

The media sucks for in-depth coverage, and the reading public sucks for taking even what little detail there is in news stories. You'll get no argument from me.

[Rip]

This is ridiculous.

The G7/8 summit regularly brings in over 200,000 protestors. Some of which are simply anarchists/hoodlums looking to destroy under the cover of legitimacy. The one in Toronto resulted in only 25 arrests.

How is any of this different?

But no, yeah, BLM is an unreasonable response to being shot without cause far too frequently and the whole thing is a cover for racist criminals to beat up white people.

You are right, they should arrest more of them as well.

[Rip]

This is ridiculous.

The G7/8 summit regularly brings in over 200,000 protestors. Some of which are simply anarchists/hoodlums looking to destroy under the cover of legitimacy. The one in Toronto resulted in only 25 arrests.

How is any of this different?

But no, yeah, BLM is an unreasonable response to being shot without cause far too frequently and the whole thing is a cover for racist criminals to beat up white people.

Without cause? Shooting an armed and fleeing multiple time felon is without cause?

[Isgrimnur]

Shooting a fleeing person is without cause.

[GreenGoo]

The KKK would never get coddled the way these and other urban rioters have been. We shouldn't just be appalled and clean up, they need to be punished so that others know protesting in that fashion is unacceptable no matter the cause.

Coddled like the right wing extremists who sized a government building in Oregon to incite a violent overthrow of the US government?

Or do we just go after the minority rioters in the cities? Never mind that attitude is the reason they're so upset and rioting....

Pretty sure those people were prosecuted. Heck they killed a couple of them as I recall. That said I don't recall them burning down businesses or assaulting reporters, etc.

No, but they pointed loaded weapons at cops with their fingers on the triggers and they didn't get shot. Seems to me that's more coddled that shooting a guy lying on the ground with his empty hands in the air. That (concept) is the entire reason BLM exists.

But that's me.

[LordMortis]

Shooting a fleeing person is without cause.

'cause they ran?

[GreenGoo]

Without cause? Shooting an armed and fleeing multiple time felon is without cause?

This is bigger than Milwaukee.

[hepcat]

Shooting a fleeing person is without cause.

Rip often confuses reality with tv. On tv it's perfectly acceptable for cops to shoot at a fleeing suspect running towards a crowd of innocent bystanders.

[Isgrimnur]

Shooting a fleeing person is without cause.

'cause they ran?

Because they do not represent an immediate threat. If there are other circumstances, then the math changes. But you do not get to shoot someone merely because they are fleeing apprehension.

[Rip]

Shooting a fleeing person is without cause.

Shooting a fleeing felon in possession of an illegal stolen firearm is not without cause.

An unidentified 24-year-old male officer, chased after one of the suspects. During the chase, the 23-year old male suspect pulled out a stolen pistol that was fully loaded with stolen ammunition. The officer ordered the suspect to drop the gun. The suspect did not drop the gun, and the officer fatally shot him.

You can't get much more textbook cause than that.

[Isgrimnur]

Shooting a fleeing felon in possession of an illegal stolen firearm is not without cause.

"Possession" does not change the metrics. He could be strapped like Rambo. If he does not draw the weapon, he does not qualify as a significant threat. At the point he draws on the officer, he's no longer fleeing, now is he?

See, that would be part of the whole 'changing math' to which I referred. His mere possession of the firearm doesn't give carte blanche to gun him down. Drawing it in a manner that could be construed as a threatening act changes the situation.

Oh, and how was the officer to know at the time that the firearm and the ammunition were stolen? That's crappy journalism.

[GreenGoo]

Oh, and how was the officer to know at the time that the firearm and the ammunition were stolen? That's crappy journalism.

I enjoyed that part as well.

Personally, I'm pretty sure the ammo had been dipped in unholy water.

[Rip]

At what point did I or the reporter suggest the officer knew at the time the gun and ammunition were stolen? Stating that it was doesn't imply the officer was or should have been aware of that fact.

[Isgrimnur]

They don't. It's bad storytelling.

An unidentified 24-year-old male officer, chased after one of the suspects. During the chase, the 23-year old male suspect pulled out a stolen pistol that was fully loaded with stolen ammunition. The officer ordered the suspect to drop the gun. The suspect did not drop the gun, and the officer fatally shot him.

"Upon investigation, it was determined that the firearm and the ammunition were stolen at the same/different time in a previous incident."

[GreenGoo]

They don't. It's bad storytelling.

Exactly. But if read as written, it implies that omg not only is he pulling a stolen weapon out of his pants, it's loaded with stolen! ammo!

[Rip]

They don't. It's bad storytelling.

Exactly. But if read as written, it implies that omg not only is he pulling a stolen weapon out of his pants, it's loaded with stolen! ammo!

But if it was or wasn't stolen is totally irrelevant. A cop is no more/less justified shooting someone. The fact it was stolen is only of importance after the fact in trying to understand what motivated the suspect to flee and to disregard orders to drop the weapon. It would seem the knowledge that he was about to go to jail for a lot longer than his previous visits made him to push the line in hopes of escaping or he was about to begin shooting it out. Textbook case of the proper use of deadly force.

It is amazing at just how good rioters are at picking the worst cases to riot about. I have no doubt there are cases where being upset and protesting is very justified. Once again this isn't one of them.

[GreenGoo]

They don't. It's bad storytelling.

Exactly. But if read as written, it implies that omg not only is he pulling a stolen weapon out of his pants, it's loaded with stolen! ammo!

But if it was or wasn't stolen is totally irrelevant.

It's irrelevant in pretty much any context. Why the writer decided to add it is beyond me. What are the other options? He stole the gun but the ammo is completely legit? The gun is legit but it's loaded with stolen ammo?

I'm making fun of the writer because his inclusion of whether the ammo is stolen in the gun that the suspect pulled out is weird. Particularly in the narrative he wrote. That's all.

You and Isgrim are free to have at it.

[Isgrimnur]

He's missing my point about generalities (possibly deliberately) to make his point about this specific case.

The suspect drew a weapon while resisting arrest. It's a good shoot, assuming the facts are as stipulated.

[GreenGoo]

He's missing my point about generalities (possibly deliberately) to make his point about this specific case.

The suspect drew a weapon while resisting arrest. It's a good shoot, assuming the facts are as stipulated.

Yeah, that's between you two. I just jumped in to opine about the scary bullets, which were STOLEN, apparently.

[Combustible Lemur]

For every racist, violent black protestor that rioted in Milwaukee and yelled "kill the white people", there were far more many black citizens appalled by their actions that gathered the next day to help clean up.

Just as I don't assume that the KKK represents the future of white America, I refuse to assume that fringe elements within the black community represent theirs.

I should certainly hope so. I don't assume that either. The KKK would never get coddled the way these and other urban rioters have been. We shouldn't just be appalled and clean up, they need to be punished so that others know protesting in that fashion is unacceptable no matter the cause.

The fact that you would compare the KKK'S level public disdain directly to the social group rioting as a fairly direct result of hundreds of years of oppression persecution, and instutional abuse and marginalization often at the hands of said Klan so that you might make a witty contrarian statement is repugnant and disgusting. You should feel shame.

But it's all good. You do you.

[Kraken]

He's missing my point about generalities (possibly deliberately) to make his point about this specific case.

The suspect drew a weapon while resisting arrest. It's a good shoot, assuming the facts are as stipulated.

Yeah, that's between you two. I just jumped in to opine about the scary bullets, which were STOLEN, apparently.

At gunpoint?

[hepcat]

Sigh...my rabidly right coworker is now posting numerous links to articles about the 5 deaths that Hillary has caused. All of which are easily proven false with even a minor google search of any news site not linked to proven conspiracy theorists.

Not even Rip is that disconnected from reality.

Oh, he did take a break for a few minutes yesterday to post his thoughts on "the traitor in chief" (his favorite term for the POTUS) and "his race war in Milwaukee".

[Isgrimnur]

Stay classy, Koch brothers:

Though they still refuse to support Trump, the Kochs apparently feel they have to do something with their $750 million budget to influence voters. Beyond focusing on down-ballot races, they're also revving up a new (probably) anti-electric car and (definitely) pro-fossil fuel front group as part of their ongoing efforts documented by the new microsite, Kochs vs. Clean. Teased last February, publicly announced on Saturday and exposed by DeSmog's Sharon Kelly on Sunday, the "Fueling U.S. Forward" group seeks to get the public emotionally invested in fossil fuels as being "pro-human."

To do so, it will deploy the kind of doublespeak propaganda that we've come to expect from these entrenched interests, if its name or debut are any indication. As described in the post you should just go read at DeSmog, the president and CEO of the new group told the crowd at the Red State 2016 gathering that not only are fossil fuels all the usual talking points of "reliable, abundant, efficient," but also they are "sustainable."

Which, of course, is as backwards as can be. Not only are fossil fuels finite resources that will at some point be depleted if we continue business-as-usual, but they're also mostly responsible for that little old thing called climate change. So even if they were a renewable resource, they still wouldn't be sustainable indefinitely, in that if we continue burning them, it would render the planet incapable of sustaining human life.
...
Though those who oppose renewables may not be nationally successful, they are finding wins at the state level. Case in point: The coal-heavy Wyoming, where state legislators are considering a massive tax increase on wind power as a major new project is being developed.

[GreenGoo]

Sigh...my rabidly right coworker is now posting numerous links to articles about the 5 deaths that Hillary has caused. All of which are easily proven false with even a minor google search of any news site not linked to proven conspiracy theorists.

Not even Rip is that disconnected from reality.

Oh, he did take a break for a few minutes yesterday to post his thoughts on "the traitor in chief" (his favorite term for the POTUS) and "his race war in Milwaukee".

Is this at work? I'm not sure what I'd do if that were the case but going to HR about the hostile work environment is probably an option. Obviously I don't know your office dynamics so there might be complications to that approach, but geez, constantly being bombarded with conspiracy-level propaganda would ruin anyone's day after awhile.

If this is just facebook on his own time, just pull the cord and unfriend him. What's the worst that can happen?

[coopasonic]

If this is just facebook on his own time, just pull the cord and unfriend him. What's the worst that can happen?

Unfollow, not unfriend. He won't even know.

[GreenGoo]

If this is just facebook on his own time, just pull the cord and unfriend him. What's the worst that can happen?

Unfollow, not unfriend. He won't even know.

Sounds good. I'm not on facebook.

If Ninjas are an option, I might choose that approach, depending on level of obnoxiousness (which seems pretty high in this case).

[LordMortis]

Sigh...my rabidly right coworker is now posting numerous links to articles about the 5 deaths that Hillary has caused. All of which are easily proven false with even a minor google search of any news site not linked to proven conspiracy theorists.

Not even Rip is that disconnected from reality.

Oh, he did take a break for a few minutes yesterday to post his thoughts on "the traitor in chief" (his favorite term for the POTUS) and "his race war in Milwaukee".

At least they post links to articles and not just jpegs with no links to articles.

Only now, apparently it's becoming a thing to post articles for their titles and not actually reading them, so they may as well just be jpegs.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the ... ing-study/

For a while FB was letting you edit the captions on new links. I was having a veritable hoot with that before that went away.

[hepcat]

If this is just facebook on his own time, just pull the cord and unfriend him. What's the worst that can happen?

Unfollow, not unfriend. He won't even know.

I did that quite some time ago. But I'm a glutton for punishment and check in every now and again to see how far he's gone down the rabbit hole. In all fairness, he's not harassing me with anything. He knows I disagree with almost everything he says, and he's surprisingly polite about it when I see him.

Now, if I were to get in his face about politics though, that would not end well.

Let this be a lesson to everyone. Try to avoid friending coworkers on facebook.

[malchior]

If this is just facebook on his own time, just pull the cord and unfriend him. What's the worst that can happen?

Unfollow, not unfriend. He won't even know.

I was just talking to my wife about this - she does this all the time. I personally just ignore the posts and sometimes pay just enough attention to loosely know what people are talking about - no matter how crazy. Ozymandias style.

[AWS260]

I personally just ignore the posts and sometimes pay just enough attention to loosely know what people are talking about - no matter how crazy. Ozymandias style.

And on the feed, these words appear:
My name is Ozymandias, King of Facebook;
Look on my Memes, ye Mighty, and despair!
Nothing beside remains. Round the decay
Of that colossal Wreck, boundless and bare
The lone and level sands stretch far away.

[Smoove_B]

Wow, I've now been able to understand two references in my lifetime to Ozymandias (here and a song by Sting) - my high school English teacher would be proud.

[Blackhawk]

Wow, I've now been able to understand two references in my lifetime to Ozymandias (here and a song by Sting) - my high school English teacher would be proud.

You haven't seen Watchmen?

[Smoove_B]

Crap! That's three. Memory not so great today. Still nice to know "When am I ever going to need to know this?" actually has an answer.

[Defiant]

Never read the Tripod trilogy?

[Isgrimnur]

New Jersey

New Jersey on Tuesday became the third state in the nation to put a law on its books to oppose a movement that encourages a boycott of Israeli goods and services.

Gov. Chris Christie signed into law a bipartisan measure that bars the state's public worker pension fund from investing in companies that refuse to do business with Israel.

The Garden State joins Florida and Illinois, which have similar laws. It's a public pushback against businesses participating in the Palestinian-led "Boycott, Divestment and Sanctions" movement.

The BDS movement is a global campaign to put pressure on Israeli to stop "colonizing Palestinian land, discriminating against Palestinian citizens of Israel and denying Palestinian refugees the right to return to their homes."

"This legislation officially distances New Jersey from the (BDS movement)," Christie said.
...
Under the law, the state Division of Investments would be barred from investing public workers' $72 billion pension fund in these companies and dump any of these existing holdings within 18 months.

[Smoove_B]

Oh, that's great. Now our pubic pension problems and property tax issues are totally fixed. Thanks Chris Christie!

[Defiant]

New Jersey on Tuesday became the third state in the nation to put a law on its books to oppose a movement that encourages a boycott of Israeli goods and services.

Eh? There are more than that. (IIRC, CA, CO, SC, NY, and others passed similar laws)

[Smoove_B]

An article (linking to) The Brainwashing of My Dad. Perhaps some of you can relate:

Last night I watched the documentary The Brainwashing of My Dad, about a family man’s rightwing radicalization. The filmmaker traces her father’s descent from a free-loving personality to an angry, embittered devotee of conservative media out of touch with reality.

The film paints a clear picture of just how damaging the ubiquity and ferocity of conservative doctrine can be.

...

When exactly did freedom of information come to mean dissemination of disinformation?

When corporate conservatives targeted the Fairness Doctrine, a policy that required media outlets to be accountable and represent all points of view.

The doctrine was problematic because it worked.

You can’t manipulate the masses by showing all viewpoints. Thus, conservatives saw to its abolition, which may prove to be a far greater detriment to a free society than the repeal of the Glass-Steagall Act that led to the financial crisis

.

[Max Peck]

In what is now non-Trump-related news, Paul Manafort states "I did not have relations with that government."

The FBI and U.S. Justice Department are investigating possible U.S. ties to alleged corruption involving the former president of Ukraine, including the work of firms headed by political operatives Paul Manafort and Tony Podesta, CNN reported on Friday, citing multiple U.S. law enforcement officials. The broad-based investigation was looking into whether U.S. companies and the financial system were used to enable corruption by the party of former pro-Russian Ukrainian president Viktor Yanukovych, CNN said.

A person who answered a telephone number for Manafort said Manafort was not available for comment. The person, who said he was an associate of Manafort and who gave his name only as David, referred queries to a lawyer in Washington, who did not immediately respond to a phone call and an email. In response to a report in the New York Times on Monday, Manafort denied any impropriety in a statement. "I have never received a single 'off-the-books cash payment' as falsely 'reported' by The New York Times, nor have I ever done work for the governments of Ukraine or Russia," he said. The New York Times reported that he had received cash payments worth more than $12 million over five years that were itemized on secret ledgers belonging to Yanukovich's Party of Regions.

Manafort, who resigned as chairman of Republican presidential nominee Donald Trump's campaign on Friday, had not been the focus of the probe, CNN said, citing the officials. The probe was looking at the work of other firms linked to the former Ukrainian government, including the Podesta Group, a lobbying and public relations company headed by Tony Podesta, whose brother John Podesta is chairman of the campaign to elect Democratic Party presidential nominee Hillary Clinton. Manafort's attorney Richard Hibey did not immediately respond to a request for comment. The FBI declined to comment, CNN reported.

[Max Peck]

U.S. judge seeks criminal contempt charges against Arizona sheriff
Can you guess which Arizona sheriff?

Spoiler:

A federal judge recommended on Friday that prosecutors bring criminal contempt charges against Arizona lawman Joe Arpaio, finding that the controversial sheriff had violated court orders stemming from a 2007 racial profiling case. U.S. District Court Judge Murray Snow also urged criminal contempt charges against Arpaio's second-in-command, Gerard Sheridan, along with Maricopa County Sheriff's Captain Steve Bailey and an Arpaio attorney, Michele Iafrate. In a written order, Snow asked federal prosecutors to file contempt charges for three alleged violations by Arpaio, who styles himself as "America's toughest sheriff" and has built a national reputation for strong rhetoric and aggressive actions to crack down on undocumented immigrants.