The Former Trump Presidency Thread

malchior · Post by **malchior** » Mon Dec 19, 2016 7:18 pm

That's the trick - unconstitutional pretty much requires Congressional action which probably won't happen...mostly because the modern GOP is populated by spineless hypocrites. Maybe a creative lawsuit but still they are openly flexing their ability to break norms and the law now with impunity. The danger is real. It'll be interesting to see if the GSA actually challenges the lease (unless conditions change) when he is inaugurated.

Max Peck · Post by **Max Peck** » Mon Dec 19, 2016 7:20 pm

And the fat lady sings...

Donald Trump wins electoral college vote

The US electoral college has certified Donald Trump as president, despite a last-ditch effort to deny him the White House.

Six weeks after winning the polls, the Republican has secured the 270 votes needed to formalise his victory.

Electors had been flooded with emails and phone calls urging them not to support Mr Trump.

Texas ultimately put the billionaire over the 270 threshold, despite two of its electors voting against him.

The result will be officially announced on 6 January in a special joint session of Congress.

Holman · Post by **Holman** » Mon Dec 19, 2016 7:33 pm

There was never any doubt of this result.

What it does is strip the electoral college itself of legitimacy. Conceived as a way to vet the popular-vote choice for integrity and qualification and then touted as a way to protect the interests of small states, every time it has been tested it's done neither of these things.

Rip · Post by **Rip** » Mon Dec 19, 2016 8:09 pm

What is funny is that there were only two faithless electors who chose not to vote for Trump while four refused to cast their votes for Clinton.

Holman · Post by **Holman** » Mon Dec 19, 2016 8:23 pm

What's funny is that the guy elected president lost the popular vote by a margin worse than Gerald Ford's.

Rip · Post by **Rip** » Mon Dec 19, 2016 8:27 pm

Holman wrote:What's funny is that the guy elected president lost the popular vote by a margin worse than Gerald Ford's.

It might be funny if popular vote actually meant anything. It's like first downs in a football game, as long as you win no one cares how many you got.

Holman · Post by **Holman** » Mon Dec 19, 2016 8:44 pm

"Is like firsts down in game of foot ball. Long as win, no one alive cares how many is getted."

YellowKing · Post by **YellowKing** » Mon Dec 19, 2016 9:45 pm

Oh to have an alternate universe machine in which I could watch Rip's outrage as Hillary wins the electoral college thanks to Russian interference while Trump wins the popular vote by 3 million. The GOP would be shitting bricks and we'd have federal investigations for decades.

Moliere · Post by **Moliere** » Mon Dec 19, 2016 9:53 pm

tgb wrote:
malchior wrote:Ridiculous - this should be illegal
I'm pretty sure it is. Or at least unconstitutional, which amounts to the same thing.

It is too early to start the Countdown to Impeachment?

Hmmm, sounds like Clinton has her pay to play shenanigans going again. Crooked Hillary indeed!

hepcat · Post by **hepcat** » Mon Dec 19, 2016 10:33 pm

Rip wrote:
Holman wrote:What's funny is that the guy elected president lost the popular vote by a margin worse than Gerald Ford's.
It might be funny if popular vote actually meant anything. It's like first downs in a football game, as long as you win no one cares how many you got.

Obviously Trunp cares. Otherwise he wouldn't be obsessed with it and lying that he actually won it.

Rip · Post by **Rip** » Mon Dec 19, 2016 10:52 pm

YellowKing wrote:Oh to have an alternate universe machine in which I could watch Rip's outrage as Hillary wins the electoral college thanks to Russian interference while Trump wins the popular vote by 3 million. The GOP would be shitting bricks and we'd have federal investigations for decades.

That you think he won because of the Russians is entertaining.

Thanks Obama.

geezer · Post by **geezer** » Mon Dec 19, 2016 11:33 pm

Rip wrote:
YellowKing wrote:Oh to have an alternate universe machine in which I could watch Rip's outrage as Hillary wins the electoral college thanks to Russian interference while Trump wins the popular vote by 3 million. The GOP would be shitting bricks and we'd have federal investigations for decades.
That you think he won because of the Russians is entertaining.

Thanks Obama.

That you think he's qualified is unfathomable. Thanks, flyover rubes. Not necessarily deplorable - just contemptible.

tgb · Post by **tgb** » Mon Dec 19, 2016 11:35 pm

Rip wrote:
That you think he won because of the Russians is entertaining.

Nonsense. We all know why he won.

hepcat · Post by **hepcat** » Mon Dec 19, 2016 11:37 pm

Rip wrote:
YellowKing wrote:Oh to have an alternate universe machine in which I could watch Rip's outrage as Hillary wins the electoral college thanks to Russian interference while Trump wins the popular vote by 3 million. The GOP would be shitting bricks and we'd have federal investigations for decades.
That you think he won because of the Russians is entertaining.

Thanks Obama.

That you don't believe it just means Putin is smarter than you.

Now, when do we return Alaska to Russia? Putin needs payment.

$iljanus · Post by **$iljanus** » Mon Dec 19, 2016 11:46 pm

Rip wrote:
YellowKing wrote:Oh to have an alternate universe machine in which I could watch Rip's outrage as Hillary wins the electoral college thanks to Russian interference while Trump wins the popular vote by 3 million. The GOP would be shitting bricks and we'd have federal investigations for decades.
That you think he won because of the Russians is entertaining.

Thanks Obama.

Okay, okay, maybe the neo-Nazis had something to do with it too.

Max Peck · Post by **Max Peck** » Tue Dec 20, 2016 12:23 am

$iljanus wrote:
Rip wrote:
YellowKing wrote:Oh to have an alternate universe machine in which I could watch Rip's outrage as Hillary wins the electoral college thanks to Russian interference while Trump wins the popular vote by 3 million. The GOP would be shitting bricks and we'd have federal investigations for decades.
That you think he won because of the Russians is entertaining.

Thanks Obama.
Okay, okay, maybe the neo-Nazis had something to do with it too.

They prefer to be called the alt-Reich.

Rip · Post by **Rip** » Tue Dec 20, 2016 1:52 am

Don't forget the FBI.

and Weiner.

hepcat · Post by **hepcat** » Tue Dec 20, 2016 8:26 am

Don't forget the Alamo.

And cotton candy.

tgb · Post by **tgb** » Tue Dec 20, 2016 9:05 am

Max Peck wrote: They prefer to be called the alt-Reich.

I'm stealing that.

Grifman · Post by **Grifman** » Tue Dec 20, 2016 11:12 am

Rip wrote:
YellowKing wrote:Oh to have an alternate universe machine in which I could watch Rip's outrage as Hillary wins the electoral college thanks to Russian interference while Trump wins the popular vote by 3 million. The GOP would be shitting bricks and we'd have federal investigations for decades.
That you think he won because of the Russians is entertaining.

Thanks Obama.

I don't think he won because of the Russians, but if Clinton had won with Russian interference on her side, you be screaming at to top of your voice now.

tgb · Post by **tgb** » Tue Dec 20, 2016 11:13 am

I like the cut of this man's jib.

El Guapo · Post by **El Guapo** » Tue Dec 20, 2016 11:18 am

Grifman wrote: I don't think he won because of the Russians, but if Clinton had won with Russian interference on her side, you be screaming at to top of your voice now.

There's no way to know for sure, of course, but the Russian hacks successfully (further) antagonized the Sanders faction and kept a steady drip of Clinton faux corruption stories throughout October. Given the narrowness of the vote in the three critical states, I think it reasonably probable that Russia swung the election result.

Of course, you could also make the same case for the the Fucking Comey Letter (TM) swinging the election.

Holman · Post by **Holman** » Tue Dec 20, 2016 11:19 am

The problem now is that the Russians will win because of Trump.

Chaz · Post by **Chaz** » Tue Dec 20, 2016 11:23 am

They're going to be winning so much, they'll get sick of it.

Scraper · Post by **Scraper** » Tue Dec 20, 2016 12:09 pm

One thing that people on the left are failing to point out is that Clinton ran a really bad campaign. I live in Ohio. leading up to the election every single Hilary Clinton commercial I saw on TV and flyer I received in the mail from Hillary focused entirely on Trump and why he is deplorable. Not one single ad talked about Hilary and why I should vote for her. Not One. It's just downright pathetic. Her campaign thought she was going to win simply because she wasn't Trump. The reality is that Trump won because he is not Clinton.

The GOP, Fox News, Rush Limbaugh, etc have spent the better part of 20 years trying to take the Clinton's down. For many people the truth about them has become what the GOP wants it to be, not what it actually is (see Benghazi, the server, Whitewater, etc.). So Clinton absolutely had to prove herself to the masses and she didn't.

Yes Russian hacking helped to smear her and the Democrats. But don't kid yourself they were already smeared throughout the past 20 years and Russian smearing alone didn't win this election for Trump. The Democrats lost it because of their arrogance.

tgb · Post by **tgb** » Tue Dec 20, 2016 12:23 pm

Scraper wrote:One thing that people on the left are failing to point out is that Clinton ran a really bad campaign. I live in Ohio. leading up to the election every single Hilary Clinton commercial I saw on TV and flyer I received in the mail from Hillary focused entirely on Trump and why he is deplorable. Not one single ad talked about Hilary and why I should vote for her. Not One. It's just downright pathetic. Her campaign thought she was going to win simply because she wasn't Trump. The reality is that Trump won because he is not Clinton.

The GOP, Fox News, Rush Limbaugh, etc have spent the better part of 20 years trying to take the Clinton's down. For many people the truth about them has become what the GOP wants it to be, not what it actually is (see Benghazi, the server, Whitewater, etc.). So Clinton absolutely had to prove herself to the masses and she didn't.

Yes Russian hacking helped to smear her and the Democrats. But don't kid yourself they were already smeared throughout the past 20 years and Russian smearing alone didn't win this election for Trump. The Democrats lost it because of their arrogance.

I don't know what sources "on the left" you've been following, but I've been hearing almost those very words from Michael Moore, Bill Maher, and Van Jones. The three of them lean so far to the left they circle around and come back somewhere to the right of Attila the Hun.

NickAragua · Post by **NickAragua** » Tue Dec 20, 2016 1:22 pm

tgb wrote:
Scraper wrote:One thing that people on the left are failing to point out is that Clinton ran a really bad campaign. I live in Ohio. leading up to the election every single Hilary Clinton commercial I saw on TV and flyer I received in the mail from Hillary focused entirely on Trump and why he is deplorable. Not one single ad talked about Hilary and why I should vote for her. Not One. It's just downright pathetic. Her campaign thought she was going to win simply because she wasn't Trump. The reality is that Trump won because he is not Clinton.

The GOP, Fox News, Rush Limbaugh, etc have spent the better part of 20 years trying to take the Clinton's down. For many people the truth about them has become what the GOP wants it to be, not what it actually is (see Benghazi, the server, Whitewater, etc.). So Clinton absolutely had to prove herself to the masses and she didn't.

Yes Russian hacking helped to smear her and the Democrats. But don't kid yourself they were already smeared throughout the past 20 years and Russian smearing alone didn't win this election for Trump. The Democrats lost it because of their arrogance.
I don't know what sources "on the left" you've been following, but I've been hearing almost those very words from Michael Moore, Bill Maher, and Van Jones. The three of them lean so far to the left they circle around and come back somewhere to the right of Attila the Hun.

The general consensus on the left side of my facebook feed has a variety of excuses, such as "Jill Stein", "Russian Hacking/Wikileaks", "Comey Letter", "Sexism" and "Racism" (for some reason), and (in my experience) folks find it difficult to entertain the possibility that a strong enough candidate could have easily withstood swings of a couple of percentage points. When you're depending on the "news of the day" to carry your campaign, you're doing it wrong.

Edit: Right, I forgot "Electoral College".

Moliere · Post by **Moliere** » Tue Dec 20, 2016 1:40 pm

Donald Trump's sons behind nonprofit selling access to president-elect

A new Texas nonprofit led by Donald Trump’s grown sons is offering access to the freshly-minted president during inauguration weekend — all in exchange for million-dollar donations to unnamed “conservation” charities, according to interviews and documents reviewed by the Center for Public Integrity.

Are these people going to even make it to the Inauguration before being indicted? Can Trump be impeached before Jan. 20th?

malchior · Post by **malchior** » Tue Dec 20, 2016 2:11 pm

Tom Arnold claims the infamous Apprentice video with Trump dropping racial slurs and making fun of his son is in his (and possibly a lot of Hollywood's) possession.I also agree with his assertion it wouldn't have made a difference. His voters knew they were tolerating a President who said terrible things and was a terrible human being in general.

Smoove_B · Post by **Smoove_B** » Tue Dec 20, 2016 2:25 pm

For the love of Pete:

The chief of staff to Mobile Mayor Sandy Stimpson issued a public apology Sunday for his responsibility in having a cedar tree cut down at Public Safety Memorial Park Friday and transported to Ladd-Peebles Stadium as a prop during President-elect Donald Trump's rally on Saturday

Is stupidity contagious or are we just seeing birds-of-a-feather? Regardless, statements I've never been required to make:

"I now know that there are citizens who are upset and offended that a tree from a city park was used as part of the decorations for the event," Cooper said in a statement sent out to the local media. "I accept full responsibility for having this done. For this, I sincerely apologize. Going forward, I will be more sensitive to the spectrum of concerns regarding trees."

El Guapo · Post by **El Guapo** » Tue Dec 20, 2016 2:26 pm

malchior wrote:Tom Arnold claims the infamous Apprentice video with Trump dropping racial slurs and making fun of his son is in his (and possibly a lot of Hollywood's) possession.I also agree with his assertion it wouldn't have made a difference. His voters knew they were tolerating a President who said terrible things and was a terrible human being in general.

I disagree that it wouldn't have made a difference, though it depends on the timing. The Access Hollywood recording killed Trump's polling numbers - there's a big difference between knowing in an abstract way that Trump is a misogynist or a racist and hearing it clear on tape. Though from Arnold's description it sounds like Trump might have been saying this stuff clearly as a joke?

Though it what Arnold says is 100% true, it's shocking that hundreds of people in Hollywood have this recording but they couldn't get anyone to release it.

Isgrimnur · Post by **Isgrimnur** » Tue Dec 20, 2016 2:29 pm

If it was in the context of the show's production, there are probably very draconian penalties for releasing unauthorized recordings from its production. He could always try to flee to Canada with Randy Quaid.

El Guapo · Post by **El Guapo** » Tue Dec 20, 2016 2:32 pm

Isgrimnur wrote:If it was in the context of the show's production, there are probably very draconian penalties for releasing unauthorized recordings from its production. He could always try to flee to Canada with Randy Quaid.

Look, there are only going to be so many real life opportunities for Tom Arnold to save America.

Zarathud · Post by **Zarathud** » Tue Dec 20, 2016 2:42 pm

I've been blaming Clinton too. You can't stop the deplorables, Russia or conspiracy theories. You CAN control your ground game and messaging -- the Clinton campaign dropped the ball.

Ralph-Wiggum · Post by **Ralph-Wiggum** » Tue Dec 20, 2016 2:46 pm

El Guapo wrote: I disagree that it wouldn't have made a difference, though it depends on the timing.

Definitely. If the Access Hollywood tape had come out a few days before the election instead of a month before, I can't imagine that wouldn't have cost Trump at least 1%, which would have been enough to change the outcome.

LordMortis · Post by **LordMortis** » Tue Dec 20, 2016 2:47 pm

Smoove_B wrote:
"I now know that there are citizens who are upset and offended that a tree from a city park was used as part of the decorations for the event," Cooper said in a statement sent out to the local media. "I accept full responsibility for having this done. For this, I sincerely apologize. Going forward, I will be more sensitive to the spectrum of concerns regarding trees."

Because I recognize there will be no accountability, I will, in fact, accept full responsibility. That seems to be a constant political statement going back to Iran/Contra and Waco off the top of my head.

malchior · Post by **malchior** » Tue Dec 20, 2016 2:54 pm

Zarathud wrote:I've been blaming Clinton too. You can't stop the deplorables, Russia or conspiracy theories. You CAN control your ground game and messaging -- the Clinton campaign dropped the ball.

I blame Clinton too but it is more inate. She was a terrible candidate for President for personality reasons. She just doesn't have it. Doesn't take away from her abilities or accomplishments but it matters. Anyone as qualified with half an ounce of charisma probably would have beaten him.

LordMortis · Post by **LordMortis** » Tue Dec 20, 2016 3:04 pm

malchior wrote:
Zarathud wrote:I've been blaming Clinton too. You can't stop the deplorables, Russia or conspiracy theories. You CAN control your ground game and messaging -- the Clinton campaign dropped the ball.
I blame Clinton too but it is more inate. She was a terrible candidate for President for personality reasons. She just doesn't have it. Doesn't take away from her abilities or accomplishments but it matters. Anyone as qualified with half an ounce of charisma probably would have beaten him.

She was a terrible candidate for president because it was accepted by everyone but the democrat faithful that people who weren't the the democrat faithful didn't really want her to be president. I blame her for not accepting this and stepping aside, no matter how qualified she may have been, no matter how much she could have been a symbol for glass ceilings. While I think the DNC was treacherous to Bernie. Democrats gonna democrats, so I don't blame them. They can't control the Clinton machine, so all they can do is try and maximize the democratiness of the situation and the success of the party. The best they could have done, is begged Clinton to take a seat for the good of the country before she officially announced (though at that time, it would have been to make sure no one like Cruz took the oval office). I also think she blew it by not hammering supreme court from the very moment she took the nomination. That should have been a bulldog topic. I think she latched on to it but way too late.

Defiant · Post by **Defiant** » Tue Dec 20, 2016 3:06 pm

She won the popular vote by over 2%. Her tactical targeting was very poor, but she was not a terrible candidate.

El Guapo · Post by **El Guapo** » Tue Dec 20, 2016 3:25 pm

Defiant wrote:She won the popular vote by over 2%. Her tactical targeting was very poor, but she was not a terrible candidate.

Yeah, you can certainly question various strategic choices that she made, especially with the benefit of hindsight. At the same time, she won by 2% and counting, and beat Obama's 2012 vote total even though she was facing many headwinds that Obama wasn't (Russia hacking, FBI interference). There's blame to be had, but there's a limit to how bad one can objectively view her as a candidate.

For example, but for the Comey letter (outside of her control), she very likely wins the election. Her campaign is the same, but now we're talking about someone who lead in all the polls consistently from the primaries through the election.