Trump's Full Court Press on Tax Reform

[Zarathud]

Campaign money (Citizens United) + gerrymandering + propaganda

So sorry it's a 3 piece puzzle you can't piece together, Rip.

[Rip]

Campaign money (Citizens United) + gerrymandering + propaganda

So sorry it's a 3 piece puzzle you can't piece together, Rip.

http://thehill.com/blogs/pundits-blog/p ... ions-arent

[Isgrimnur]

Campaign money buys elections has been thoroughly debunked.

The Atlantic, 2013

In other words, as races grew tighter (few votes in the margin of victory), each vote grew more expensive. More important votes cost more.
...
In other words, there's more of a correlation between spending differential and vote differential. This supports the idea that in closer races, money makes more of a difference.
...
Most incumbent losses saw the incumbents outraised.
...
What does all of this tell us? That our shorthand for political success — more money, more votes — was validated in 2012. But what it doesn't tell us is the role of money in any particular race, nor does it tell us how outside parties, like NextGen, might have affected results (CRP only includes money raised by candidate committees) — particularly in an off-year election.

In general, elected officials are warranted in raising and spending as much money as possible.

[gbasden]

Not to mention that the GOP nakedly admitted that this bill was for their donors.

[Drazzil]

Every day, the future for our nation and our world gets bleaker and bleaker. The best thing any of us can hope for these days is to go to bed one night and just not wake up the next morning. It would be less painful than this.

I would rather live to kill my opressors thanks. Viva la Revolution.

[Holman]

Campaign money (Citizens United) + gerrymandering + propaganda

+ voter suppression

[GreenGoo]

Well there's no reason for Citizens United to be in place then, is there?

Unless you just feel that corporations have been suppressed and disenfranchised all these years, and this is just equality, finally? Hopefully someone will pay for the buses to bring them to the polling stations. Remind them they'll need their voter id in the coming elections.

As for republicans getting what they want, this is only about the GOP getting what they want. Conservatives and your average republican is getting just as screwed as the rest of you. For some reason they thought they wouldn't be. But it's most definitely not what they want. It's possible they don't understand the ramifications of what they are getting. Lord knows there is plenty of propaganda at work out there.

[Smoove_B]

If only there was a way the people could go register a protest and have those people replaced with people that make decisions they want.......

I mean...you're not wrong. Except we're not starting at zero. These individuals were allegedly put into office to represent their constituencies. Instead, they pretty clearly just voted for themselves and their financial donors. The fact that they did so without shame and in such a brazen manner suggests (to me) that they believe they are impervious to repercussions...and I think they're right. As if completely ignoring the shitshow that is President Trump wasn't enough, now they use his ability to distract to raid the coffers? F every single one of them.

[Rip]

No elected official is impervious to repercussions.

Money and dirty tricks aren't what ails the election system. Indifference is.

If this turns into as much a shit show as you guys already think it has, then the 18/20 turnout numbers will reflect whether people are going to change it or just continue sitting around and bitching about it.

[Smoove_B]

It's hard to remain hopeful when the state of Alabama is poised to elect a guy that dated teenagers when he was in his 30s simply because he has an (R) next to his name.

But generally speaking, yes, you're right. The elected officials in power right now - in particular bags of excrement like Mitch McConnell - speak more about the people that voted to put (and keep) them there than anything else. Having just come off of a NJ gubernatorial election where only about a 1/3 of the people in our state voted, I'm equally upset with those that cannot be bothered to vote. Not as much as I am with the ones that proudly vote for pedophiles, neo-nazis or Russian collaborators, but still upset.

[Rip]

I have far more respect for those that vote against me than those that fail to vote at all.

Those that vote in opposition have at least earned the right to complain and criticize.

Those that don't vote, are just the critics from Teddy's quote.

“It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood; who strives valiantly; who errs, who comes short again and again, because there is no effort without error and shortcoming; but who does actually strive to do the deeds; who knows great enthusiasms, the great devotions; who spends himself in a worthy cause; who at the best knows in the end the triumph of high achievement, and who at the worst, if he fails, at least fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who neither know victory nor defeat.”

[Kurth]

I have far more respect for those that vote against me than those that fail to vote at all.

Those that vote in opposition have at least earned the right to complain and criticize.

Those that don't vote, are just the critics from Teddy's quote.

“It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood; who strives valiantly; who errs, who comes short again and again, because there is no effort without error and shortcoming; but who does actually strive to do the deeds; who knows great enthusiasms, the great devotions; who spends himself in a worthy cause; who at the best knows in the end the triumph of high achievement, and who at the worst, if he fails, at least fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who neither know victory nor defeat.”

Yeah, yeah, yeah. I agree with the sentiment and all, but it's not like we're asking them to wrestle a bear. They just need to show up ONE freaking day of the year and fill in a bubble or punch a chad or whatever.

Voter apathy sucks.*

*And despite the putrid attempts by the right to suppress the vote, that's really no excuse.

[Fireball]

It's hard to remain hopeful when the state of Alabama is poised to elect a guy that dated teenagers when he was in his 30s simply because he has an (R) next to his name.

Roy Moore is a child rapist. The Republicans will seat him in the Senate. Raping children is fine with the GOP. Killing children by taking away their healthcare is fine with the GOP. But for the love of "god", don't tax someone's private fucking jet.

[malchior]

Taxing the private jet is "so unfair". The commercial airlines get a tax break. God forbid I have to abandon the LearJet and fly with hoi polloi. I just did a spit take with a glass of 1952 McAllan just thinking about that commonness.

[Rip]

It's hard to remain hopeful when the state of Alabama is poised to elect a guy that dated teenagers when he was in his 30s simply because he has an (R) next to his name.

Roy Moore is a child rapist. The Republicans will seat him in the Senate. Raping children is fine with the GOP. Killing children by taking away their healthcare is fine with the GOP. But for the love of "god", don't tax someone's private fucking jet.

If he raped a child I guess someone should charge him with it. As far as I know he hasn't been convicted of anything.

If we are going to just run with accusations then we have already had a rapist for POTUS years ago.

[GreenGoo]

Neither has Weinstein.

[Zarathud]

If he raped a child I guess someone should charge him with it. As far as I know he hasn't been convicted of anything.

If we are going to just run with accusations then we have already had a rapist for POTUS years ago.

By that standard you should have voted for Hillary and defended Bill until the dress. And never repeated a single cry of BENGHAZI!

There is a lot of evidence on Moore, but your bias blinds you. You can't move the goalposts on that.

[malchior]

Evidence of the sociopathic motive behind all this

https://twitter.com/BruceBartlett/statu ... 6760050688

[Rip]

If he raped a child I guess someone should charge him with it. As far as I know he hasn't been convicted of anything.

If we are going to just run with accusations then we have already had a rapist for POTUS years ago.

By that standard you should have voted for Hillary and defended Bill until the dress. And never repeated a single cry of BENGHAZI!

There is a lot of evidence on Moore, but your bias blinds you. You can't move the goalposts on that.

I would have been glad to.

Had she kicked him to the curb and supported the women who disclosed his misdeeds rather than trying to throw mud on them.

There was a mountain more evidence of Clinton's misdeeds than any on Moore. When it even approaches the same level I would be happy to turn on Moore. If you could even call it a turn because I don't like Moore. I just dislike him less than the alternative. Either way it doesn't make much difference because it isn't my call. I don't live in Alabama. Who represents them is up to them, not me.

[Ænima]

You’re a disgusting human being.

[Combustible Lemur]

If he raped a child I guess someone should charge him with it. As far as I know he hasn't been convicted of anything.

If we are going to just run with accusations then we have already had a rapist for POTUS years ago.

By that standard you should have voted for Hillary and defended Bill until the dress. And never repeated a single cry of BENGHAZI!

There is a lot of evidence on Moore, but your bias blinds you. You can't move the goalposts on that.

I would have been glad to.

Had she kicked him to the curb and supported the women who disclosed his misdeeds rather than trying to throw mud on them.

There was a mountain more evidence of Clinton's misdeeds than any on Moore. When it even approaches the same level I would be happy to turn on Moore. If you could even call it a turn because I don't like Moore. I just dislike him less than the alternative. Either way it doesn't make much difference because it isn't my call. I don't live in Alabama. Who represents them is up to them, not me.

So let's be clear, you prefer a child molester over a centrist Democrat.

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[Smoove_B]

]So let's be clear, you prefer a child molester over a centrist Democrat.

This is a thing, by the way. So let's just get the "there's no proof yet" argument out of the way. People are saying even if there was proof, it doesn't matter; this woman isn't alone.

[Rip]

If he raped a child I guess someone should charge him with it. As far as I know he hasn't been convicted of anything.

If we are going to just run with accusations then we have already had a rapist for POTUS years ago.

By that standard you should have voted for Hillary and defended Bill until the dress. And never repeated a single cry of BENGHAZI!

There is a lot of evidence on Moore, but your bias blinds you. You can't move the goalposts on that.

I would have been glad to.

Had she kicked him to the curb and supported the women who disclosed his misdeeds rather than trying to throw mud on them.

There was a mountain more evidence of Clinton's misdeeds than any on Moore. When it even approaches the same level I would be happy to turn on Moore. If you could even call it a turn because I don't like Moore. I just dislike him less than the alternative. Either way it doesn't make much difference because it isn't my call. I don't live in Alabama. Who represents them is up to them, not me.

So let's be clear, you prefer a child molester over a centrist Democrat.

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No I prefer not to call someone a child molester until there is compelling evidence that they are so. The evidence against Moore is murky at best.

[Rip]

]So let's be clear, you prefer a child molester over a centrist Democrat.

This is a thing, by the way. So let's just get the "there's no proof yet" argument out of the way. People are saying even if there was proof, it doesn't matter; this woman isn't alone.

So when are charges going to be filed?

As far as what there are people that say argument. There are people who say pretty much any crazy shit a person can dream up all the way up to and including that the earth is flat.

[Skinypupy]

No I prefer not to call someone a child molester until there is compelling evidence that they are so. The evidence against Moore is murky at best.

And if there's one thing we all know about Rip, it's that he steadfastly refuses to jump to conclusions based on "murky evidence".

[Isgrimnur]

Because if charges aren't filed, then it totally didn't happen. I'm sure that the attorneys general in Alabama are chomping at the bit to file charges against a strong political player in their state on a 38yo statutory rape case. And that's of course, if the victims are willing to press charges. Because the ship has sailed on a civil suit.

Unfortunately, Alabama has some of the shortest sexual abuse statutes of limitations in the United States. A civil sexual abuse case must be filed within:

* In childhood sexual abuse cases, two years from the victim’s 19th birthday, or
* Two years from the event in adult sexual abuse cases.

There are no exceptions to these rules for repressed memories or DNA analysis. Due to these short statutes of limitations, victims of abuse must act very quickly.

[Combustible Lemur]

]So let's be clear, you prefer a child molester over a centrist Democrat.

This is a thing, by the way. So let's just get the "there's no proof yet" argument out of the way. People are saying even if there was proof, it doesn't matter; this woman isn't alone.

So when are charges going to be filed?

As far as what there are people that say argument. There are people who say pretty much any crazy shit a person can dream up all the way up to and including that the earth is flat.

So you think it's more likely that there is a loosely organized conspiracy of Alabamans from Moore's home town, mall, offices, legal community, and local eats coalesced and instigated by the Washington post, than Moore is a creeper who likes young girls. All willing to put themselves in the national spotlight in order to smear a powerful Judge who's been fired twice in order to give a democratic candidate a long shot in Alabama for Senate.



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[hepcat]

No I prefer not to call someone a child molester until there is compelling evidence that they are so. The evidence against Moore is murky at best.

And if there's one thing we all know about Rip, it's that he steadfastly refuses to jump to conclusions based on "murky evidence".

BENGHAZI

[Skinypupy]

Orrin Hatch: "Those sick kids should start pulling themselves up by the bootstraps because we really need to give more to the 1%"

During the tax debate on Thursday evening, Senator Orrin Hatch, from Utah, commented on the Children’s Health Insurance Program (CHIP), saying that it would be funded but that the lack of funds available was problematic for CHIP.

“[L]et me tell you something: we’re going to do CHIP. There’s no question about it in my mind. It’s got to be done the right way. But we, the reason CHIP’s having trouble is because we don’t have money anymore,” Hatch continued.

“I believe in helping those who cannot help themselves, but would if they could. I have a rough time wanting to spend billions and billions and trillions of dollars to help people who won’t help themselves – won’t lift a finger – and expect the federal government to do everything,” he said, in comments that were shared by Morning Joe host Joe Scarborough over the weekend.

[GreenGoo]

You’re a disgusting human being.

The term is deplorable.

We get this from him after he tells us that social consequences and legal ones are different in the Weinstein thread.

He's just trolling.

[Smoove_B]

I know the MarketWatch calculator was posted earlier, but the Washington Post has created their own version.

[Rip]

]So let's be clear, you prefer a child molester over a centrist Democrat.

This is a thing, by the way. So let's just get the "there's no proof yet" argument out of the way. People are saying even if there was proof, it doesn't matter; this woman isn't alone.

So when are charges going to be filed?

As far as what there are people that say argument. There are people who say pretty much any crazy shit a person can dream up all the way up to and including that the earth is flat.

So you think it's more likely that there is a loosely organized conspiracy of Alabamans from Moore's home town, mall, offices, legal community, and local eats coalesced and instigated by the Washington post, than Moore is a creeper who likes young girls. All willing to put themselves in the national spotlight in order to smear a powerful Judge who's been fired twice in order to give a democratic candidate a long shot in Alabama for Senate.



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Why not? You guys didn't seem to have a problems believing that a half dozen women and numerous witnesses conspired to make people think Bill Clinton was a rapist and serial abuser of women of all ages. I don't think it is a conspiracy. I just think a handful of people that don't like Moore's politics are willing to smear him if it achieves a political goal they think is noble.

[Isgrimnur]

You guys didn't seem to have a problems believing that a half dozen women and numerous witnesses conspired to make people think Bill Clinton was a rapist and serial abuser of women of all ages.

[citation needed]

[Combustible Lemur]

]So let's be clear, you prefer a child molester over a centrist Democrat.

This is a thing, by the way. So let's just get the "there's no proof yet" argument out of the way. People are saying even if there was proof, it doesn't matter; this woman isn't alone.

So when are charges going to be filed?

As far as what there are people that say argument. There are people who say pretty much any crazy shit a person can dream up all the way up to and including that the earth is flat.

So you think it's more likely that there is a loosely organized conspiracy of Alabamans from Moore's home town, mall, offices, legal community, and local eats coalesced and instigated by the Washington post, than Moore is a creeper who likes young girls. All willing to put themselves in the national spotlight in order to smear a powerful Judge who's been fired twice in order to give a democratic candidate a long shot in Alabama for Senate.



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Why not? You guys didn't seem to have a problems believing that a half dozen women and numerous witnesses conspired to make people think Bill Clinton was a rapist and serial abuser of women of all ages. I don't think it is a conspiracy. I just think a handful of people that don't like Moore's politics are willing to smear him if it achieves a political goal they think is noble.

Has anyone here suggested Clinton wasn't a degenerate lecher. I would posit a solid percentage of our Nevermoore posters also didn't vote for Bill.

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[GreenGoo]

Yeah, Franken is accused of much worse than Moore and look at how the Dems have circled the wagons. The much reviled Pelosi is his biggest defender.

You are so full of crap Rip it's a wonder your eyes aren't brown. Your defense of Moore is to attack peoples' reactions to Clinton nearly 20 years ago instead of peoples' reactions of events going on today?

It's very clear that Moore is NOT the victim of a conspiracy. Hiding behind the legal definition of guilty makes you a rationalising scumbag.

[Blackhawk]

If he raped a child I guess someone should charge him with it. As far as I know he hasn't been convicted of anything

I'm sad for you. Troll or real, either way, I'm sad for you.

[Smoove_B]

The masks - they are completely off:

“I think not having the estate tax recognizes the people that are investing,” [Senator] Grassley said, “as opposed to those that are just spending every darn penny they have, whether it’s on booze or women or movies.”

Jesus H. Christ Iowa. This is your voice?

[Scoop20906]

I guess this will be the legacy of Trump. These human turds feel emboldened to spout this. I say Well Done Trump. Well done.


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[Kurth]

The masks - they are completely off:

“I think not having the estate tax recognizes the people that are investing,” [Senator] Grassley said, “as opposed to those that are just spending every darn penny they have, whether it’s on booze or women or movies.”

Jesus H. Christ Iowa. This is your voice?

I listened to that interview on NPR driving home Thursday night and almost lost it. It was the most unbelievable statement after even more unbelievable statement. Just fucking batshit crazy stuff from Grassley there.

[Kraken]

The masks - they are completely off:

“I think not having the estate tax recognizes the people that are investing,” [Senator] Grassley said, “as opposed to those that are just spending every darn penny they have, whether it’s on booze or women or movies.”

Jesus H. Christ Iowa. This is your voice?

The man is right. Instead of seeing a movie next month, I'm investing $22 in a coal mine.