The Former Trump Presidency Thread

Kraken · Post by **Kraken** » Fri Dec 08, 2017 5:28 pm

Octavious wrote: Fri Dec 08, 2017 2:13 pm Captain dumbass tweeted a poll that shows him at 45% approval rating. Not only is he cherry picking a random poll, but 45% isn't good. The average I'm seeing is that he's at like 35-38%. Which is still batshit crazy high for how shitty he's been.

30% say that nothing he can say or do will lose their support, so he's only swaying like 5-8% of those who can be swayed. That makes me feel a little better.

Isgrimnur · Post by **Isgrimnur** » Fri Dec 08, 2017 6:46 pm

The Hill

The Department of Transportation (DOT) posted a notice on the Federal Register this week that it is withdrawing the proposed rule, along with another plan to force air carriers to disclose how much revenue they make from charging other ancillary fees.

The administration, which has made easing regulatory burdens for businesses a top priority, said the rules would have “limited public benefit.”

Airlines are already required to disclose information about optional service fees on their websites. But consumer groups say it’s still difficult for passengers to compare airfare ticket prices, fees and associated rules, and have pushed for more transparency at the start of the process.

And while airlines are required to disclose to federal regulators how much money they make from baggage fees, they are not required to report how much they charge for “optional” services, such as carry-on bags, seat selection and priority boarding, which have grown in recent years.

Defiant · Post by **Defiant** » Fri Dec 08, 2017 7:59 pm

Kraken wrote: Fri Dec 08, 2017 5:28 pm
Octavious wrote: Fri Dec 08, 2017 2:13 pm Captain dumbass tweeted a poll that shows him at 45% approval rating. Not only is he cherry picking a random poll, but 45% isn't good. The average I'm seeing is that he's at like 35-38%. Which is still batshit crazy high for how shitty he's been.
30% say that nothing he can say or do will lose their support, so he's only swaying like 5-8% of those who can be swayed. That makes me feel a little better.

30% likely won't be his floor. For all that I dislike this president, we haven't really felt any serious damage yet (not counting Puerto Rico). When the economy goes south or healthcare premiums jump up dramatically or something along those lines, his approval rating will likely go down further than that. But that probably won't deter him - he'll probably thinks that if he hits zero, it'll wrap around and come out the other side, and he'll have 90+% approval.

Kraken · Post by **Kraken** » Fri Dec 08, 2017 8:19 pm

Defiant wrote: Fri Dec 08, 2017 7:59 pm
Kraken wrote: Fri Dec 08, 2017 5:28 pm
Octavious wrote: Fri Dec 08, 2017 2:13 pm Captain dumbass tweeted a poll that shows him at 45% approval rating. Not only is he cherry picking a random poll, but 45% isn't good. The average I'm seeing is that he's at like 35-38%. Which is still batshit crazy high for how shitty he's been.
30% say that nothing he can say or do will lose their support, so he's only swaying like 5-8% of those who can be swayed. That makes me feel a little better.
30% likely won't be his floor. For all that I dislike this president, we haven't really felt any serious damage yet (not counting Puerto Rico). When the economy goes south or healthcare premiums jump up dramatically or something along those lines, his approval rating will likely go down further than that. But that probably won't deter him - he'll probably thinks that if he hits zero, it'll wrap around and come out the other side, and he'll have 90+% approval.

Yeah, many people call him the Worst President Ever, and I can sure understand why. He's an awful person with no redeeming qualities. But objectively speaking, he hasn't come close to the damage that Bush did...and that's only comparing him to recent presidents. We've had some real disasters if you go farther back. His hero Andy Johnson, for one.

I'm sure he has the capacity to claim that title if he lasts three more years, but he ain't there yet.

Sepiche · Post by **Sepiche** » Fri Dec 08, 2017 8:37 pm

Kraken wrote: Fri Dec 08, 2017 8:19 pm Yeah, many people call him the Worst President Ever, and I can sure understand why. He's an awful person with no redeeming qualities. But objectively speaking, he hasn't come close to the damage that Bush did...and that's only comparing him to recent presidents. We've had some real disasters if you go farther back. His hero Andy Johnson, for one.

I'm sure he has the capacity to claim that title if he lasts three more years, but he ain't there yet.

I don't know... I grant you when the history is written the Iraq War and its follow on effects might ultimately give the "crown" to Bush, but I think you might be underestimating the damage Trump is doing to many government institutions and the long term effects of the seeds of chaos he's planted in the Republican party.

Obviously no way of knowing how much damage Trump's actions will cause, but the potential is immense.

Defiant · Post by **Defiant** » Fri Dec 08, 2017 8:45 pm

Sepiche wrote: Fri Dec 08, 2017 8:37 pm
I don't know... I grant you when the history is written the Iraq War and its follow on effects might ultimately give the "crown" to Bush, but I think you might be underestimating the damage Trump is doing to many government institutions and the long term effects of the seeds of chaos he's planted in the Republican party.

Oh, there's no doubt that he (and/or congress) has done or is on the way to do a lot of damage on our institutions (and norms), but I guess my point is that we haven't felt the consequences of that, yet (aside from the mental stress we've had to endure with this administration, I suppose, something his supporters haven't had to deal with, cause they see it as "winning")

malchior · Post by **malchior** » Fri Dec 08, 2017 9:16 pm

Bush did a lot of damage but I think the damage Trump has done is delayed. i think Trump has already committed more major strategic blunders that are on scale with Iraq. For example, the action he took on TPP has major implications that will likely take a decade to shake out.

Our trust throughout Europe has been badly damaged. Not irreparably but Bush / Obama / Trump shows we don't elect leadership they can believe in. On top, Rex has undermined our foreign influence in general. And there is much more. I don't see how he won't be seen as dog shit as a human *and* a President.

Also it is hard to compare him to Andrew Johnson IMO because we were hardly the dominant world power when the nation split.

YellowKing · Post by **YellowKing** » Fri Dec 08, 2017 11:57 pm

Let's also not forget we've had less than a year of Trump. You can't compare that to 8 years of Bush.

Patience, young grasshopper. Trumps fuck-uppery is in its infancy.

noxiousdog · Post by **noxiousdog** » Sat Dec 09, 2017 12:48 am

Trump makes the damage Bush did internationally look like child's play. It's one thing to get in a one time event that you can say "oops" to. It's another completely to abandon your allies, cozy up to your enemies, and tear up financial treaties.

RunningMn9 · Post by **RunningMn9** » Sat Dec 09, 2017 1:59 am

Yeah, if anything Trump makes Bush look like a magnificent President. History will be far kinder to GWB than liberals will believe, and will be far worse to Trump. No matter what he does from a policy perspective, history will regard him as the least competent man that has ever served in the office. The damage he is doing will take decades to fix.

hepcat · Post by **hepcat** » Sat Dec 09, 2017 7:27 am

I’m already nostalgic for George W. Bush.

Holman · Post by **Holman** » Sat Dec 09, 2017 8:25 am

History will be kind to GWB only in that he tried to uphold the norms of the Republic and act like a president, but his reputation will suffer by Obama being an improvement in every way.

Policy-wise, Bush was a disaster, and his invasion of Iraq was easily America's greatest foreign blunder in a century. If Bush is forgiven that, it will be because the blame gets offloaded onto Cheney.

Bush gets credit for basic decency, and his response to 9/11 was humane and right in its overt rejection of bigotry. Every prominent Republican in any office since then has been worse.

geezer · Post by **geezer** » Sat Dec 09, 2017 8:42 am

Holman wrote: Sat Dec 09, 2017 8:25 am Policy-wise, Bush was a disaster, and his invasion of Iraq was easily America's greatest foreign blunder in a century. If Bush is forgiven that, it will be because the blame gets offloaded onto Cheney.

However one might judge the rest of the GWB presidency, the case could be made that Iraq is the biggest foreign blunder in our history, and that’s not recency bias talking.
It’s not just that the action itself has been so utterly devastating, but also that the outcome should have been crystal clear AND that it was so entirely unnecessary.

Sort of like Korea will be

Max Peck · Post by **Max Peck** » Sat Dec 09, 2017 11:47 am

History will be kind to whoever wins the culture war; to the victor go the laurels.

Zaxxon · Post by **Zaxxon** » Sat Dec 09, 2017 11:56 am

This is fine. (Detail on the crazy pants coal bailout that is likely going to be smashed through in early 2018 despite near-universal objection, similar to other Trump initiatives like net neutrality repeal and tax 'reform'.)

malchior · Post by **malchior** » Sat Dec 09, 2017 1:07 pm

It is somewhat (un)funny to me that many of these initiatives are basically central planning e.g. not market based reforms. The tax reform is dressed up as a market reform but on the back of an economic theory that has 40 years of evidence that show it doesn't work. It just happens to concentrate wealth and therefore political power. What is sort of interesting to me is that this is in many ways similar to what the United States pushed as economic policy in Latin America to prop up friendly authoritarian regimes.

Holman · Post by **Holman** » Sun Dec 10, 2017 8:00 pm

This is worrying: Lindsey Graham has flipped to Trump loyalist overnight.

link

link

Everyone knows the confrontation is coming. Trump's team is more and more exposed to legal jeopardy, and the pushback (firing Mueller, pushing to restrict journalists) will be our institutions' greatest test since the Civil War.

That a prominent semi-NeverTrumper like Graham is now currying administration favor is a bad sign.

Pyperkub · Post by **Pyperkub** » Sun Dec 10, 2017 9:19 pm

malchior wrote:It is somewhat (un)funny to me that many of these initiatives are basically central planning e.g. not market based reforms. The tax reform is dressed up as a market reform but on the back of an economic theory that has 40 years of evidence that show it doesn't work. It just happens to concentrate wealth and therefore political power. What is sort of interesting to me is that this is in many ways similar to what the United States pushed as economic policy in Latin America to prop up friendly authoritarian regimes.

You're making the mistake of believing they are being truthful about trickle down economics, when it is far more likely that is just a story being used further the aim of an oligarchical state.

Holman · Post by **Holman** » Sun Dec 10, 2017 10:23 pm

Holman wrote: Sun Dec 10, 2017 8:00 pm This is worrying: Lindsey Graham has flipped to Trump loyalist overnight.

link
link
link

Everyone knows the confrontation is coming. Trump's team is more and more exposed to legal jeopardy, and the pushback (firing Mueller, pushing to restrict journalists) will be our institutions' greatest test since the Civil War.

That a prominent semi-NeverTrumper like Graham is now currying administration favor is a bad sign.

...Developing consensus is that Graham is flattering Yuge Leader so he can be Secretary of State.

Or even Defense. Graham has gone out of his way to parrot Trump's threats against NK lately, while Mattis seems muted.

malchior · Post by **malchior** » Mon Dec 11, 2017 8:39 am

Graham has always been a snake in the grass so his flip is a bad sign. It shows that Trump has likely successfully consolidated power. Graham usually doesn't make mistakes about when to strike.

pr0ner · Post by **pr0ner** » Mon Dec 11, 2017 9:50 am

I guess when Graham said during the primaries that we would be destroyed if we nominate Trump, by "we" he means his integrity?

All Mitt Romney did was have dinner with Trump when Sec. State was available and people still bring it up as a knock on him. Graham has gone full Trump; it's far worse.

Carpet_pissr · Post by **Carpet_pissr** » Mon Dec 11, 2017 10:08 am

Wow. One round of golf and a tasty morsel as a treat and the lap dog has already found a new lap, now that his old master is going away. Sad! And: BAD DOG!

Guess it's time to fire off another email to his office, if they haven't blocked me by now (likely they stopped reading my stuff several blistering (but polite!) emails ago).

GreenGoo · Post by **GreenGoo** » Mon Dec 11, 2017 10:14 am

Those tweets were gross. Might as well include a pic of giving drumpf a handjob, it was so transparent.

msteelers · Post by **msteelers** » Mon Dec 11, 2017 10:15 am

Holman wrote: Sun Dec 10, 2017 10:23 pm ...Developing consensus is that Graham is flattering Yuge Leader so he can be Secretary of State.

Or even Defense. Graham has gone out of his way to parrot Trump's threats against NK lately, while Mattis seems muted.

I have to believe that this is the case. It's easier for me to believe that Graham sees the writing on the wall and wants a way out of the Senate.

Remus West · Post by **Remus West** » Mon Dec 11, 2017 10:23 am

I wonder if this is what it feels like to be Venezuelan under Maduro?

Holman · Post by **Holman** » Mon Dec 11, 2017 10:49 am

link

The NYT story referenced here ran two days ago.

Trump tweeted about it just now because it was being talked about on TV.

Smoove_B · Post by **Smoove_B** » Mon Dec 11, 2017 10:52 am

Instead of the bomber in the NYC Port Authority, this is what he needs to comment on this morning?

msteelers · Post by **msteelers** » Mon Dec 11, 2017 10:55 am

Smoove_B wrote: Mon Dec 11, 2017 10:52 am Instead of the bomber in the NYC Port Authority, this is what he needs to comment on this morning?

He won't comment unless it turns out the bomber is Muslim.

Edit: Fox News just reported on the radio that the bomber was inspired by ISIS.

El Guapo · Post by **El Guapo** » Mon Dec 11, 2017 11:10 am

Reports are that the guy had an explosive device strapped to him. Also had seen that only he got hurt - was that right? Presumably went off prematurely.

tgb · Post by **tgb** » Mon Dec 11, 2017 11:50 am

Oh please let him call Don Lemon a Fake Negro.

El Guapo · Post by **El Guapo** » Mon Dec 11, 2017 11:59 am

tgb wrote: Mon Dec 11, 2017 11:50 am Oh please let him call Don Lemon a Fake Negro.

???

msteelers · Post by **msteelers** » Mon Dec 11, 2017 12:02 pm

Heard a sound byte from Lyndsey Graham that he doesn't want the bombing suspect to hear "you have the right to remain silent". He wants him held as an enemy combatant.

So we're tossing the rule of law out the window now. That's great.

El Guapo · Post by **El Guapo** » Mon Dec 11, 2017 12:04 pm

msteelers wrote: Mon Dec 11, 2017 12:02 pm Heard a sound byte from Lyndsey Graham that he doesn't want the bombing suspect to hear "you have the right to remain silent". He wants him held as an enemy combatant.

So we're tossing the rule of law out the window now. That's great.

While he has his moments of sanity, Lindsey Graham is at his craziest when it comes to terrorism.

pr0ner · Post by **pr0ner** » Mon Dec 11, 2017 12:07 pm

Because there are Trump Tweets for everything:

From the NYT article:

Watching cable, he shares thoughts with anyone in the room, even the household staff he summons via a button for lunch or for one of the dozen Diet Cokes he consumes each day.

Tareeq has been retweeting a bunch of Trump tweets:

https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/sta ... 9159154688

https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/sta ... 3850653696

https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/sta ... 7930648577

https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/sta ... 8816188417

pr0ner · Post by **pr0ner** » Mon Dec 11, 2017 12:08 pm

El Guapo wrote: Mon Dec 11, 2017 12:04 pm
msteelers wrote: Mon Dec 11, 2017 12:02 pm Heard a sound byte from Lyndsey Graham that he doesn't want the bombing suspect to hear "you have the right to remain silent". He wants him held as an enemy combatant.

So we're tossing the rule of law out the window now. That's great.
While he has his moments of sanity, Lindsey Graham is at his craziest when it comes to terrorism.

Yeah, that behavior is not out of the norm for him.

Alefroth · Post by **Alefroth** » Mon Dec 11, 2017 12:53 pm

Holman wrote: Mon Dec 11, 2017 10:49 am
link

The NYT story referenced here ran two days ago.

Trump tweeted about it just now because it was being talked about on TV.

He watches all of them.

Kraken · Post by **Kraken** » Mon Dec 11, 2017 2:38 pm

pr0ner wrote: Mon Dec 11, 2017 9:50 am I guess when Graham said during the primaries that we would be destroyed if we nominate Trump, by "we" he means his integrity?

All Mitt Romney did was have dinner with Trump when Sec. State was available and people still bring it up as a knock on him. Graham has gone full Trump; it's far worse.

The transition to a one-party state is well underway. Once they're sure that Democrats are permanently locked out of power at the federal level (and next November will be the test of that), Republicans can begin to purge the disloyal from their own ranks. Graham apparently thinks it's not too late to pledge fealty to the winning side.

tgb · Post by **tgb** » Mon Dec 11, 2017 2:48 pm

El Guapo wrote: Mon Dec 11, 2017 11:59 am
tgb wrote: Mon Dec 11, 2017 11:50 am Oh please let him call Don Lemon a Fake Negro.
???

If CNN is fake news.......

Carpet_pissr · Post by **Carpet_pissr** » Mon Dec 11, 2017 2:51 pm

Not sure about CNN's real to fake news ratio, but I certainly would categorize them as overly sensational, and are pretty far down on my list of goto news sources if I want something more than just a headline.

Kurth · Post by **Kurth** » Tue Dec 12, 2017 1:37 am

Carpet_pissr wrote: Mon Dec 11, 2017 2:51 pm Not sure about CNN's real to fake news ratio, but I certainly would categorize them as overly sensational, and are pretty far down on my list of goto news sources if I want something more than just a headline.

Agreed. They've lost so much credibility in my mind. Just sensationalist click-bait garbage half the time. Their website is the worst!