The Former Trump Presidency Thread

[YellowKing]

I'm assuming we'll get the usual from the Trump supporters on this board: deafening silence or quick drive by quips.

It doesn't surprise me. The Trump voters I know in real life don't seem too keen on talking about their choice either.

[raydude]

Here's a thought:

Trump can't fire Pence. But what if Trump's base is incited to hate Pence? A la this clip:


This could be a long-term strategy to get rid of two birds with two impeachments. Say Democrats control the House. Trump is impeached. Then the GOP base, which by this time holds Pence in contempt because he didn't have Trump's back, wants Pence out - so they signal their congresspeople that they want Pence impeached by any means possible. To which the Democrats go, 'oh, alright, if you insist."

EDIT: Hmmm. Video can't initialize. Any thoughts on how I can fix this?

[Kraken]

As for this "member of the resistance", this person just made it more difficult for the more responsible people within the White House to try and keep shit from blowing up. Hope the future book deal is worth it.

Yeah, I almost believe that the author is actually a Bannon or Javanka loyalist out to trigger a purge of the remaining old-guard GOP within the administration. I just can't quite convince myself that anyone on the NYT editorial board (presumably there must be at least one key person on the board who knows the author's identity in order for them to print the op-ed in the first place) would choose to be complicit in such a deception.

Now that this is a major news story, the newsroom is undoubtedly working hard to uncover the leaker's identity...which is known to the op-ed staff. It's a good example of the firewall that newspapers strive for between the two departments. The answer's right down the hall, and they ain't gonna get it there.

That last line is why the op-ed was probably a disastrous idea. You've confirmed the worst of Trump's instincts, and he now has something to point to in order to justify some of his extreme actions.

I agree - that is why I don't think it was Coats or anyone at his level. It was probably a higher level staffer -- someone inexperienced or dumb enough not to look down the board and see the damage this would do.

Nobody ever pays attention to what Melania's doing.

[GreenGoo]

We all know Trump is not a conservative. It’s crap to say that 40 years of conservative politics inexorably led to Trump. That’s counterfactual BS for the base.

But who cares? That's not the take away from the article or even important. Instead of focusing on the absolute facts in the article, you're focusing on the author using those facts for a political conclusion and disagreeing with it. The article is the point. The "conclusion" that the author reaches is not the point of the article. Whether his conclusion is valid or not does not invalidate the article itself. Personally I think you're just as wrong as he is, but that's a different topic.

It's like listening to a long report on climate change at the end of which the author concludes that it's all Hillary's fault. Don't lose sight of the report because you disagree with an opinion voiced at the end of it.

Pyper has this to say which I think is true, but I haven't been paying attention for that long. Personally I don't think these comments apply to the Bush years, but I do think they apply to the Obama years, and I don't see how anyone could argue that they don't apply to the current administration.

I'll give Frum an incomplete. What he fails to mention is that the GOP gave up on any sense of Duty years ago, and instead opted for cowardice.

Especially anyone in the Trump administration.

[GreenGoo]

I'm assuming we'll get the usual from the Trump supporters on this board: deafening silence or quick drive by quips.

It doesn't surprise me. The Trump voters I know in real life don't seem too keen on talking about their choice either.

That's the real problem. All past bun fights aside, Drumpf is a very real, almost existential problem for the US. That requires real political discourse across the aisle, but both sides have been trained to shout sound bites at each other and call it discourse.

I think the left leaning people on this board are, for the most part, less guilty of this than most, but it does happy. Personally I wouldn't shout any of my favourite crticisms of Drumpf in a serious conversation. I'm just venting my spleen, but vomiting all over the table is not how you get reasoned discussion and I wouldn't normally do it. I am susceptible to being trolled however, so if the other side doesn't play nice than it's probably 50/50 that I don't play nice either.

[El Guapo]

I've been puzzling over my long standing connection between Alabama football and how it's tied to a Democrat in the White House. Particularly how the last couple years have been an outlier.

Well.... now I'm thinking it's no accident that Alabama has just discovered Tua, which is an incredible talent, at the moment all of this stuff is blowing up surrounding Trump.

I am curious what you make of "all of this stuff" surrounding Trump.

Here, I'll save you the trouble.

"Hey Rip, :fistbump:"

It's a real question. You're not gonna believe this, but we don't have an oversupply of Alabama conservatives on this board. So I'm sort of curious what the temperature / mood is on Trump given the news of the past couple months.

[YellowKing]

Yeah I'm genuinely curious. I like hearing both sides, assuming the other side is living in reality and discussing facts, not Breitbart conspiracy theories.

[Skinypupy]

I've been puzzling over my long standing connection between Alabama football and how it's tied to a Democrat in the White House. Particularly how the last couple years have been an outlier.

Well.... now I'm thinking it's no accident that Alabama has just discovered Tua, which is an incredible talent, at the moment all of this stuff is blowing up surrounding Trump.

I am curious what you make of "all of this stuff" surrounding Trump.

Here, I'll save you the trouble.

"Hey Rip, :fistbump:"

It's a real question. You're not gonna believe this, but we don't have an oversupply of Alabama conservatives on this board. So I'm sort of curious what the temperature / mood is on Trump given the news of the past couple months.

I know, I was just being a smart-ass.

I see most of the GOP talking points via my conservative family members on social media, and expect that MSD would likely mirror that. I could be wrong though.

[Fireball]

Screw that, the party is rotten and needs to be chucked. The Dems too. The current dominant two-parry paradigm is just broken. We can start over with the Muzzlegumps and the Swangerfroods for all I care, we just need to wipe the slate.

The tree of liberty needs to be refreshed from time to time with the career change of entrenched, lazy, leeching politicians.

The next breed will be straight-up wearing their corporate sponsorships on their jackets.

What's needed is a massive overhaul of campaign finance and lobbying disclosure laws. Then let's see who decides to stick around--the worst offenders will bolt immediately.

A lot of the Dem challengers this year, including many who are out-raising Republican incumbents, are eschewing contributions from corporate PACs. Many are refusing to take money from Leadership PACs run by other members of Congress. If they get elected without corporate money, there's a good chance they continue to refuse to take it once elected. That could lead to more and more Democrats refusing to take money from corporate PACs. Things could move swiftly at that point.

[GungHo]

The summary of the anonymous op-ed piece in the morning Axios email had some interesting nuggets of information.

He should be paranoid. In the hours after the New York Times published the anonymous Op-Ed from "a senior official in the Trump administration" trashing the president, two senior administration officials reached out to Axios to say the author stole the words right out of their mouths.

"I find the reaction to the NYT op-ed fascinating — that people seem so shocked that there is a resistance from the inside," one senior official said. "A lot of us [were] wishing we’d been the writer, I suspect ... I hope he [Trump] knows — maybe he does? — that there are dozens and dozens of us."

Why it matters: Several senior White House officials have described their roles to us as saving America and the world from this president.

A good number of current White House officials have privately admitted to us they consider Trump unstable, and at times dangerously slow. But the really deep concern and contempt, from our experience, has been at the agencies — and particularly in the foreign policy arena. For some time last year, Trump even carried with him a handwritten list of people suspected to be leakers undermining his agenda.

"He would basically be like, 'We’ve gotta get rid of them. The snakes are everywhere but we’re getting rid of them,'" said a source close to Trump. Trump would often ask staff whom they thought could be trusted. He often asks the people who work for him what they think about their colleagues, which can be not only be uncomfortable but confusing to Trump: Rival staffers shoot at each other and Trump is left not knowing who to believe. Officials describe an increasingly conspiracy-minded president:

"When he was super frustrated about the leaks, he would rail about the 'snakes' in the White House," said a source who has discussed administration leakers with the president. "Especially early on, when we would be in Roosevelt Room meetings, he would sit down at the table, and get to talking, then turn around to see who was sitting along the walls behind him." "One day, after one of those meetings, he said, 'Everything that just happened is going to leak. I don’t know any of those people in the room.' ... He was very paranoid about this."

The Times Op-Ed reinforces everything Trump instinctively believes.

That last line is why the op-ed was probably a disastrous idea. You've confirmed the worst of Trump's instincts, and he now has something to point to in order to justify some of his extreme actions.

This scares me the most, that trump now has real proof of the 'Deep State' (let's not quibble with the facts that's it's not really) he'll feel justified in doing anything. And no one, least of all that idiot, knows what that'll be.

I also hate the fact that this turns trump into a least a shadow of a sympathetic figure. He is the duly elected president and he can now legitimately complain 'hey look People I can't do the job you elected me to do.'.

If they don't enact the 25th amendment ASAP this will just fester and I think, turn into a strength for trump. It gives back to him credibility and legitimacy that he, himself, undermines on a daily basis.

[Max Peck]

Perhaps Kim is providing Trump with tips on how to deal with the reactionary running-dog traitors in his administration.

https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/sta ... 4010663937

[Defiant]

A government photographer edited official pictures of Donald Trump’s inauguration to make the crowd appear bigger following a personal intervention from the president, according to newly released documents.

link

[Smoove_B]

Now that Kavanaugh is almost confirmed, it doesn't surprise me that people are starting to speak out and question whether or not Trump is actually capable of being President (he's not). Why is just starting over the last few weeks? Because the GOP managed to (presumably) lock in two Supreme Court Justices under the Trump administration. It's more than they could have ever imagined possible. Once that's officially done and the "liberal agenda" is no longer threatening GOP dogma, Trump's usefulness to them will have ended. Bank on it.

[GreenGoo]

Perhaps Kim is providing Trump with tips on how to deal with the reactionary running-dog traitors in his administration.

Holy freakin' hell the man is mentally handicapped. How else can you explain tweets like this?

His own people are leaking like a sieve (no rats leaving yet) so he's gonna hold up a character reference from one of the more ruthless, dangerous, untrustworthy dictators who are on record as considering the US of A the source of all the worlds woes as some sort of evidence things aren't completely off the rails at this point?!

I mean, wtf is going on? I mean it. Wtf?

[malchior]

Now that Kavanaugh is almost confirmed, it doesn't surprise me that people are starting to speak out and question whether or not Trump is actually capable of being President (he's not). Why is just starting over the last few weeks? Because the GOP managed to (presumably) lock in two Supreme Court Justices under the Trump administration. It's more than they could have ever imagined possible. Once that's officially done and the "liberal agenda" is no longer threatening GOP dogma, Trump's usefulness to them will have ended. Bank on it.

If they do try...it'll go badly for them. That idiotic base belongs to Trump. And the mid-terms are coming. Any damage they do to Trump splashes back on them at a critical time. I think they'll go dark as possible, batten the hatches, and wait the storm out. Any 'attack' on Trump will begin after the mid-terms at least. That way also gives them an opportunity to target the Presidency again directly if need be.

[GreenGoo]

Bank on it.

No thanks.

However, witnessing drumpf's demise with be pure orgasmic schadenfreude for the entire, lengthy process. We might be seeing cracks, but until there are official actions being taken against him, I'm still waiting not so patiently.

[Smoove_B]

Oh, no one is going to do anything but if things start moving forward somehow or they actually start losing elections, it won't matter to them - because the plan all along was to lock up the Supreme Court. That's what they'll campaign on to try and stay in power but if it doesn't work they'll at least know that anything the Democrats try to do (health care, gun control, etc...) will stand a chance of being struck down. They're getting ready to embrace losing the battle because they've won the war (in their minds).

So to bring this back to where I jumped in, "people talking" about Trump - doesn't matter. The bigger picture agenda is about to be realized so anything he does or says is just gravy - particularly if it "triggers the libs". That's where we're at.

[El Guapo]

Perhaps Kim is providing Trump with tips on how to deal with the reactionary running-dog traitors in his administration.

Holy freakin' hell the man is mentally handicapped. How else can you explain tweets like this?

His own people are leaking like a sieve (no rats leaving yet) so he's gonna hold up a character reference from one of the more ruthless, dangerous, untrustworthy dictators who are on record as considering the US of A the source of all the worlds woes as some sort of evidence things aren't completely off the rails at this point?!

I mean, wtf is going on? I mean it. Wtf?

It's not very complicated. This is the core of Trump's worldview.

(1) Donald Trump is the greatest bestest person on the planet, and is accordingly the best at everything.
(2) Anyone who acknowledges this self-evident Truth is by definition smart and good, and anyone who disagrees is by definition stupid or lying;
(3) Chairman Kim has acknowledged this truth
(4) Therefore Chairman Kim is smart and good.

QED.

[hepcat]

Wait a minute....Barron has been curiously quiet on this matter. I wonder if HE'S Deep Gullet.

[El Guapo]

Screw that, the party is rotten and needs to be chucked. The Dems too. The current dominant two-parry paradigm is just broken. We can start over with the Muzzlegumps and the Swangerfroods for all I care, we just need to wipe the slate.

The tree of liberty needs to be refreshed from time to time with the career change of entrenched, lazy, leeching politicians.

The next breed will be straight-up wearing their corporate sponsorships on their jackets.

What's needed is a massive overhaul of campaign finance and lobbying disclosure laws. Then let's see who decides to stick around--the worst offenders will bolt immediately.

A lot of the Dem challengers this year, including many who are out-raising Republican incumbents, are eschewing contributions from corporate PACs. Many are refusing to take money from Leadership PACs run by other members of Congress. If they get elected without corporate money, there's a good chance they continue to refuse to take it once elected. That could lead to more and more Democrats refusing to take money from corporate PACs. Things could move swiftly at that point.

How significant is the cash that they are foregoing? I admire the stance, but do worry about whether they are handicapping themselves as a result.

[Paingod]

How significant is the cash that they are foregoing? I admire the stance, but do worry about whether they are handicapping themselves as a result.

I hope they're not thinking "Pft. This is gonna be easy. I don't need that money."

Did they learn nothing from Hillary?

[GreenGoo]

Drumpf holding up Kim's confidence in him for public viewing while this is in the news.

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/09/06/us/p ... ment.html

[Holman]

Drumpf holding up Kim's confidence in him for public viewing while this is in the news.

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/09/06/us/p ... ment.html

Pffft. That was under Obama.

Obama's failing America was weak and deserved whatever Chairman Kim was dishing out. Sad!

[Fireball]

Screw that, the party is rotten and needs to be chucked. The Dems too. The current dominant two-parry paradigm is just broken. We can start over with the Muzzlegumps and the Swangerfroods for all I care, we just need to wipe the slate.

The tree of liberty needs to be refreshed from time to time with the career change of entrenched, lazy, leeching politicians.

The next breed will be straight-up wearing their corporate sponsorships on their jackets.

What's needed is a massive overhaul of campaign finance and lobbying disclosure laws. Then let's see who decides to stick around--the worst offenders will bolt immediately.

A lot of the Dem challengers this year, including many who are out-raising Republican incumbents, are eschewing contributions from corporate PACs. Many are refusing to take money from Leadership PACs run by other members of Congress. If they get elected without corporate money, there's a good chance they continue to refuse to take it once elected. That could lead to more and more Democrats refusing to take money from corporate PACs. Things could move swiftly at that point.

How significant is the cash that they are foregoing? I admire the stance, but do worry about whether they are handicapping themselves as a result.

Well, since most of them are out-raising their Republican opponents, whatever cash they are foregoing is being more than made up from other sources.

[GreenGoo]

It's not very complicated. This is the core of Trump's worldview.

(1) Donald Trump is the greatest bestest person on the planet, and is accordingly the best at everything.
(2) Anyone who acknowledges this self-evident Truth is by definition smart and good, and anyone who disagrees is by definition stupid or lying;
(3) Chairman Kim has acknowledged this truth
(4) Therefore Chairman Kim is smart and good.

QED.

I'm not surprised that Drumpf thinks it's awesome. I'm confused why he advertised it to the twitterverse like it completely redeems him in the public eye after all this bad press he's been getting. Surely he's not so delusional that he thinks the American people think character references from Kim are worth the bytes they're composed of? He's, literally, an Enemy of America. Putin isn't even this clearly a "bad guy" when it comes to America and the American people.

It's a character reference from a Bond villain, for god's sake.

[YellowKing]

I just don't see any way, given the latest damning news, that Trump lasts two more years. Maybe it's just wishful thinking, but the thought of literally going through historically significant (in a bad way) presidential news EVERY WEEK until 2020 just makes me sick to my stomach.

And let's face it - the Trump news cycle has only gotten worse over time. I just finished the James Comey book and it seems almost quaint that we used to think that it was an example of "explosive revelations."

[Sepiche]

I just finished the James Comey book and it seems almost quaint that we used to think that it was an example of "explosive revelations."

Ah, those were the good times in the long, long ago.

[hepcat]

Either Trump will split or our country will. Well, more than it already has. I'm thinkin' revolution, which is scary. But I'm starting to realize he's entrenched himself so far into the psyche of his followers that they'll do anything to keep him in power at this point.

[Holman]

It's not very complicated. This is the core of Trump's worldview.

(1) Donald Trump is the greatest bestest person on the planet, and is accordingly the best at everything.
(2) Anyone who acknowledges this self-evident Truth is by definition smart and good, and anyone who disagrees is by definition stupid or lying;
(3) Chairman Kim has acknowledged this truth
(4) Therefore Chairman Kim is smart and good.

QED.

I'm not surprised that Drumpf thinks it's awesome. I'm confused why he advertised it to the twitterverse like it completely redeems him in the public eye after all this bad press he's been getting. Surely he's not so delusional that he thinks the American people think character references from Kim are worth the bytes they're composed of? He's, literally, an Enemy of America. Putin isn't even this clearly a "bad guy" when it comes to America and the American people.

It's a character reference from a Bond villain, for god's sake.

In Trumpland, Kim's flattery proves Trump diplomatic prowess. Trump broke through the barriers and has made North Korea friendly, something no previous president could manage. He probably deserves two Nobels for it, at least.

[hepcat]

As long as Kim flatters Trump, he'll get away with anything. It reminds me of that South Park episode with the Japanese businessmen trying to get away with something by flattering their hosts/victims.

[LawBeefaroni]

It's not very complicated. This is the core of Trump's worldview.

(1) Donald Trump is the greatest bestest person on the planet, and is accordingly the best at everything.
(2) Anyone who acknowledges this self-evident Truth is by definition smart and good, and anyone who disagrees is by definition stupid or lying;
(3) Chairman Kim has acknowledged this truth
(4) Therefore Chairman Kim is smart and good.

QED.

I'm not surprised that Drumpf thinks it's awesome. I'm confused why he advertised it to the twitterverse like it completely redeems him in the public eye after all this bad press he's been getting. Surely he's not so delusional that he thinks the American people think character references from Kim are worth the bytes they're composed of?

He's creating his own reality. He's not trying to fool everyone else, he's fooling himself.

[YellowKing]

But I'm starting to realize he's entrenched himself so far into the psyche of his followers that they'll do anything to keep him in power at this point.

I'm still convinced the vast majority of Republicans don't truly support Trump, and most know that he's an incompetent idiot. There have just been too many leaks of "water cooler" conversations that support it.

I will never underestimate a politician's ability to flip-flop. All these folks kissing his ass today will be loudly proclaiming how they "knew it all along" once the Mueller shoe drops.

This goddamned court seat is the golden prize. Once they have that, watch how fast Trump's stock drops.

I know people say "but yet 40% of the public still supports him!" Yes, but throughout history 40% approval HAS NEVER BEEN GOOD. It means a significant majority of the country thinks YOU SUCK. It's not like the rules of politics suddenly changed and 40% is the new 80%. Trump's approval is toxic from an election standpoint, and it's only going to get worse.

[malchior]

Oh, no one is going to do anything but if things start moving forward somehow or they actually start losing elections, it won't matter to them - because the plan all along was to lock up the Supreme Court. That's what they'll campaign on to try and stay in power but if it doesn't work they'll at least know that anything the Democrats try to do (health care, gun control, etc...) will stand a chance of being struck down. They're getting ready to embrace losing the battle because they've won the war (in their minds).

So to bring this back to where I jumped in, "people talking" about Trump - doesn't matter. The bigger picture agenda is about to be realized so anything he does or says is just gravy - particularly if it "triggers the libs". That's where we're at.

Oh yeah - true. Plus they know that they'll likely be able to run or obstruct at least one chamber of Congress even with a shrinking minority.

[Holman]

This goddamned court seat is the golden prize. Once they have that, watch how fast Trump's stock drops.

I doubt it. Turning on Trump alienates the base and wins them nothing. They really can't go back.

They're going to dig in their heels and hope to bury RBG for the Triple Crown.

[GreenGoo]

He's creating his own reality. He's not trying to fool everyone else, he's fooling himself.

Why do it in front of millions of people then?

It's easier to believe everyone loves you if you don't talk to them.

[malchior]

I know people say "but yet 40% of the public still supports him!" Yes, but throughout history 40% approval HAS NEVER BEEN GOOD. It means a significant majority of the country thinks YOU SUCK. It's not like the rules of politics suddenly changed and 40% is the new 80%. Trump's approval is toxic from an election standpoint, and it's only going to get worse.

It isn't that 40% is good - it is that he has 80% of the base. And he is a kingmaker. That is why they all kiss his ring. He controls all their political fates. Add that he is a imbecile with an inferiority complex and a short temper and it explains so much of their behavior. Unless he loses the base he will face no true opposition. And they aren't going anywhere. I believe that no matter what Mueller reveals it won't be enough. That is why he is impervious. They built a cult. They just didn't get the cult leader they expected.

[LawBeefaroni]

He's creating his own reality. He's not trying to fool everyone else, he's fooling himself.

Why do it in front of millions of people then?

It's it easier to believe everyone loves you if you don't talk to them?

Hey, he's he self-delusional one, not me. I don't know how it works but it does. I mean maybe the fact that he knows that his tweets get in front of 100M people is enough for him to believe they're true. And it's not like he listens to any criticism. He stopped doing that long ago.

It's, "I said this, a bunch of people backed me on it, no one denied it except Fake News. So what I said is true!"

[Blackhawk]

It seems that if the Rs slowly and deliberately leaked just the right bits about Trump (there have to be hundreds of anti-conservative things he's tried that they kept secret, perhaps even goading him into more), then publicly objected to each one, looking like conservative champions, they could slowly swing the 40%'s loyalty off of Trump himself and onto the party. That would free them to move against Trump before he 'compromises conservative values.'

[Holman]

He's creating his own reality. He's not trying to fool everyone else, he's fooling himself.

Why do it in front of millions of people then?

It's easier to believe everyone loves you if you don't talk to them.

Narcissism is about constant and constantly escalating reinforcement and aggrandizement.

Imagine being a narcissist with a Twitter following in the millions.

[Holman]

It seems that if the Rs slowly and deliberately leaked just the right bits about Trump (there have to be hundreds of anti-conservative things he's tried that they kept secret, perhaps even goading him into more), then publicly objected to each one, looking like conservative champions, they could slowly swing the 40%'s loyalty off of Trump himself and onto the party. That would free them to move against Trump before he 'compromises conservative values.'

The base isn't looking for "conservative champions." This isn't about philosophy of government.

Trump tells them they're right and smart to hate the people they hate, and he does it loudly and openly. The old conservative champions only hinted at it.

Why would this base give that up?