The Trump Investigation(s) Thread

Ralph-Wiggum · Post by **Ralph-Wiggum** » Mon Sep 24, 2018 3:31 pm

El Guapo wrote: ↑Mon Sep 24, 2018 12:53 pm If he was going to fire him, wouldn't he have done it today? Not sure what the point would be of kicking the can down to Thursday from Trump's perspective, unless the point is to extend negotiations on terms on which Rosenstein would be willing to resign.

Can Kelly fire Rosenstein or does it have to be Trump? If the latter, that would explain why he wasn't fired today (i.e. they hoped he would resign but when he didn't Kelly couldn't fire him). So I think it's still about 50/50 that Trump will fire Rosenstein on Thursday. Plus, that'll be another distraction to take the news focus away from Ford's testimony that day.

Smoove_B · Post by **Smoove_B** » Mon Sep 24, 2018 3:34 pm

Ralph-Wiggum wrote: ↑Mon Sep 24, 2018 3:31 pmSo I think it's still about 50/50 that Trump will fire Rosenstein on Thursday. Plus, that'll be another distraction to take the news focus away from Ford's testimony that day.

Don't forget, Lumpy told Trump explicity last week not to fire Rod - it was a trap. And since we also know they talk just about every night via telephone, I'm feeling confident our President is going to follow the orders of a TV personality.

malchior · Post by **malchior** » Mon Sep 24, 2018 3:44 pm

As an aside, fuck the NY Times. They had to know this was a dangerous story to publish. On top they likely mis-framed the nature of the comment to maximize the damage. Bloody idiots. They've been consistently making bad calls time after time for years now.

Holman · Post by **Holman** » Mon Sep 24, 2018 4:24 pm

Ralph-Wiggum wrote: ↑Mon Sep 24, 2018 3:31 pm
El Guapo wrote: ↑Mon Sep 24, 2018 12:53 pm If he was going to fire him, wouldn't he have done it today? Not sure what the point would be of kicking the can down to Thursday from Trump's perspective, unless the point is to extend negotiations on terms on which Rosenstein would be willing to resign.
Can Kelly fire Rosenstein or does it have to be Trump? If the latter, that would explain why he wasn't fired today (i.e. they hoped he would resign but when he didn't Kelly couldn't fire him). So I think it's still about 50/50 that Trump will fire Rosenstein on Thursday. Plus, that'll be another distraction to take the news focus away from Ford's testimony that day.

Trump never fires anyone himself. He's a wimp like that.

I'm sure at some point a letter over his signature would be produced if necessary, but firings in his administration so far have come via staff or even his lawyer.

I'm sort of halfway wondering if the plan today was for Kelly to fire Rosenstein but Kelly balked at the order.

Ralph-Wiggum · Post by **Ralph-Wiggum** » Mon Sep 24, 2018 9:49 pm

Most of the firings so far have been people working in the WH. As Chief of Staff, Kelly is technically in charge of those people and so has firing power. I would be surprised if Kelly could fire someone in the DoJ without at least, as you say, something signed by Trump. So it seems like the WH leaked the idea of Rosenstein resigning, hoping that would pressure him to do so. But Rosenstein refused, Kelly didn’t have the authority to actually fire him himself, and Trump wasn’t in DC to do it.

malchior · Post by **malchior** » Tue Sep 25, 2018 1:38 am

Ralph-Wiggum wrote: ↑Mon Sep 24, 2018 9:49 pm Most of the firings so far have been people working in the WH. As Chief of Staff, Kelly is technically in charge of those people and so has firing power. I would be surprised if Kelly could fire someone in the DoJ without at least, as you say, something signed by Trump. So it seems like the WH leaked the idea of Rosenstein resigning, hoping that would pressure him to do so. But Rosenstein refused, Kelly didn’t have the authority to actually fire him himself, and Trump wasn’t in DC to do it.

Maybe but why would physically being in DC matter hypothetically speaking? He doesn't even need to talk to him. There is more to this. I would lean towards making a show of things to distract from Kavanaugh but that seems incomplete too.

Holman · Post by **Holman** » Tue Sep 25, 2018 6:41 am

Ralph-Wiggum wrote: ↑Mon Sep 24, 2018 9:49 pm Most of the firings so far have been people working in the WH. As Chief of Staff, Kelly is technically in charge of those people and so has firing power. I would be surprised if Kelly could fire someone in the DoJ without at least, as you say, something signed by Trump. So it seems like the WH leaked the idea of Rosenstein resigning, hoping that would pressure him to do so. But Rosenstein refused, Kelly didn’t have the authority to actually fire him himself, and Trump wasn’t in DC to do it.

Per Sarah Sanders (I know, I know), Trump and Rosenstein spoke on the phone yesterday morning. He could have fired him then.

Paingod · Post by **Paingod** » Tue Sep 25, 2018 6:52 am

Holman wrote: ↑Tue Sep 25, 2018 6:41 amTrump and Rosenstein spoke on the phone yesterday morning. He could have fired him then.

Which would require some measure of spine. He prefers to tell someone else to do it, and then watch it unfold on Fox & Friends.

Carpet_pissr · Post by **Carpet_pissr** » Tue Sep 25, 2018 7:14 am

And then deny knowing about it when confronted by the person (Omarosa) “What?! No, I didn’t know! Wow, I don’t love hearing that”

LawBeefaroni · Post by **LawBeefaroni** » Tue Sep 25, 2018 9:39 am

Paingod wrote: ↑Tue Sep 25, 2018 6:52 am
Holman wrote: ↑Tue Sep 25, 2018 6:41 amTrump and Rosenstein spoke on the phone yesterday morning. He could have fired him then.
Which would require some measure of spine. He prefers to tell someone else to do it, and then watch it unfold on Fox & Friends.

That's why he did The Apprentice. A show presenting a scared-to-fire, horrible failure of a businessman as an estute, ruthless "You're fired!" ass kicker. His other reality show pitches were "Giant Hands" and "Sexually Attractive."

Like 8-10 years ago I got into it with some stock shillers trying to sell DKAM based on it's new Trump Vodka. They brought in all these Trump supporters who saw him through the lens of The Apprentice. Like this totally detached from reality view of the man. Looking through 20/20 hindsight, his rise was almost inevitable. So I tried to warn them (I initially got into debunking that thing when a relative said he was "on to a sure thing") but to no avail.

Here's one of the ads for the stuff. Tell me that isn't eerie. It's basically the answer to the collusion question. In a vodka ad.

Anyway, the fools jumped in listen lost a ton of money when the vodka was a bust but it pales in comparison to what we're all going to lose on this one.

LordMortis · Post by **LordMortis** » Tue Sep 25, 2018 10:35 am

That ad should be everywhere!

Skinypupy · Post by **Skinypupy** » Tue Sep 25, 2018 11:24 am

LawBeefaroni wrote: ↑Tue Sep 25, 2018 9:39 am Here's one of the ads for the stuff. Tell me that isn't eerie. It's basically the answer to the collusion question. In a vodka ad.

Damn, you weren't kidding.

That's Trump's entire administration distilled to its essence in 30 seconds: Russians, money, women, Trump ego, and failure.

El Guapo · Post by **El Guapo** » Tue Sep 25, 2018 10:10 pm

Skinypupy wrote: ↑Tue Sep 25, 2018 11:24 am
LawBeefaroni wrote: ↑Tue Sep 25, 2018 9:39 am Here's one of the ads for the stuff. Tell me that isn't eerie. It's basically the answer to the collusion question. In a vodka ad.
Damn, you weren't kidding.

That's Trump's entire administration distilled to its essence in 30 seconds: Russians, money, women, Trump ego, and failure.

I'm interested in the vodka, but I'm unsure whether it is premium enough. I wish the ad would have addressed that.

Chaz · Post by **Chaz** » Tue Sep 25, 2018 10:13 pm

Trump selling vodka and wine and touting it as super great is really funny considering he famously doesn't drink.

Not that there's anything wrong with not drinking, but if I'm looking for someone who can tell me what the best wine or vodka is, I'm not going to run out and ask the dude who doesn't touch the stuff for his opinion.

Kraken · Post by **Kraken** » Tue Sep 25, 2018 11:16 pm

Chaz wrote: ↑Tue Sep 25, 2018 10:13 pm Trump selling vodka and wine and touting it as super great is really funny considering he famously doesn't drink.

Not that there's anything wrong with not drinking, but if I'm looking for someone who can tell me what the best wine or vodka is, I'm not going to run out and ask the dude who doesn't touch the stuff for his opinion.

"Welch's Grape Jelly with Alcohol": How Trump's Horrific Wine Became the Ultimate Metaphor for His Presidency

After the deadly Charlottesville riots, Donald Trump responded by . . . plugging his family winery in Virginia. Aided by an expert oenophile, the author takes the bait—and tastes the pain.

This is a fun read if you missed it the first time around.

Carpet_pissr · Post by **Carpet_pissr** » Wed Sep 26, 2018 9:04 am

Good read. I went to that vineyard a few years ago (before the election and before anyone thought he had a reasonable shot), and it was just OK. Some beautiful scenery, for sure, but wine just ok to mediocre. I didn’t taste anything I felt like spitting out though.

I much prefer dry wines to sweet, but don’t remember any fruit bombs, or crazy high sense of alcohol.

I do remember chatting with one of the server/taster girls and they kept emphasizing the whole operation was ERIC’s, not his Dad’s.

Paingod · Post by **Paingod** » Wed Sep 26, 2018 9:12 am

Carpet_pissr wrote: ↑Wed Sep 26, 2018 9:04 amI do remember chatting with one of the server/taster girls and they kept emphasizing the whole operation was ERIC’s, not his Dad’s.

I'm willing to bet that all of his children have high-level directives that employees need to make sure people know who's in charge. Trump casts a huge shadow and likes to claim anything with his name on it is in his empire. I wouldn't want to live in a shadow like that, either.

LordMortis · Post by **LordMortis** » Fri Sep 28, 2018 11:12 am

Wasn't Rosenstein supposed to get fired yesterday? I thought the Senate panel was supposed to be cover that. If it was, then it was damned good cover.

hepcat · Post by **hepcat** » Fri Sep 28, 2018 11:14 am

He was able to get in a spit shine on Trump's favorite shoes this morning, so he's got a slight reprieve. Now, if he were to make Trump a really good BLT, he might make it to next Saturday.

Blackhawk · Post by **Blackhawk** » Fri Sep 28, 2018 11:22 am

LordMortis wrote: ↑Fri Sep 28, 2018 11:12 am Wasn't Rosenstein supposed to get fired yesterday? I thought the Senate panel was supposed to be cover that. If it was, then it was damned good cover.

Meeting was postponed due to Kavanaugh.

El Guapo · Post by **El Guapo** » Fri Sep 28, 2018 12:07 pm

Blackhawk wrote: ↑Fri Sep 28, 2018 11:22 am
LordMortis wrote: ↑Fri Sep 28, 2018 11:12 am Wasn't Rosenstein supposed to get fired yesterday? I thought the Senate panel was supposed to be cover that. If it was, then it was damned good cover.
Meeting was postponed due to Kavanaugh.

He wasn't going to fire him yesterday regardless. Monday (following the NYT report on Friday) was the day that it was going to happen, if it was going to happen - that's when the headlines would have been "Trump fires Rosenstein because of wiretapping comments". Now the headlines would just be "Trump fires Rosenstein, threatening Mueller investigation" or the like. I think the most logical conclusion of Monday's events is that Trump's people decided that they couldn't fire Rosenstein (that it would be too risky).

Now, if Republicans hold both chambers of Congress in November, he's going to be fired in a hot minute.

Skinypupy · Post by **Skinypupy** » Fri Sep 28, 2018 12:18 pm

An e-mail invite for the 35th annual Foreign Corrupt Practices Act Conference just showed up in my e-mail today. The keynote speaker (on Nov 27)...Rod Rosenstein.

Oh, the irony.

Pyperkub · Post by **Pyperkub** » Mon Oct 01, 2018 12:48 pm

Enough wrote: ↑Fri Jul 13, 2018 1:41 pm Oh and now I am sure we will quickly see Newt Gingrich and the rest of the alt right come out and admit they had it all wrong on Seth Rich?

Not until they are sued and forced to admit that they published/pushed baseless conspiracy theories:

The conservative Washington Times has issued a retraction and apology in today's edition to Aaron Rich, the brother of murdered Democratic National Committee staffer Seth Rich. Aaron Rich sued the paper after it published an editorial this past March that suggested he had downloaded emails from DNC servers and turned them over to Wikileaks in exchange for money. The retraction and apology are part of a settlement,

Enough · Post by **Enough** » Mon Oct 01, 2018 6:13 pm

Pyperkub wrote: ↑Mon Oct 01, 2018 12:48 pm
Enough wrote: ↑Fri Jul 13, 2018 1:41 pm Oh and now I am sure we will quickly see Newt Gingrich and the rest of the alt right come out and admit they had it all wrong on Seth Rich?
Not until they are sued and forced to admit that they published/pushed baseless conspiracy theories:

The conservative Washington Times has issued a retraction and apology in today's edition to Aaron Rich, the brother of murdered Democratic National Committee staffer Seth Rich. Aaron Rich sued the paper after it published an editorial this past March that suggested he had downloaded emails from DNC servers and turned them over to Wikileaks in exchange for money. The retraction and apology are part of a settlement,

And not surprisingly,

https://twitter.com/KFILE/status/1046834885200171008

Pyperkub · Post by **Pyperkub** » Mon Oct 01, 2018 6:32 pm

Sounds about like what a lizard would do....

Smoove_B · Post by **Smoove_B** » Tue Oct 02, 2018 11:45 am

Oh, hey, nothing to look at here - just some commentary about how Mitch McConnell responded to the director of the CIA telling him about the Russian involvement with our democratic process in 2016:

Yikes. WaPo's @GregPMiller describes a tense moment from 2016 involving a CIA director trying to sound the alarm on Russia and a senior U.S. senator wanting none of it...

Paingod · Post by **Paingod** » Tue Oct 02, 2018 11:53 am

The GOP's blindness to truth can only be likened to a religious zeal. Like an unshakable faith in a god, they have developed an unshakable faith in their political righteousness. Anything that threatens that TRUTH, in their mind, is an insult and cannot be. There is no openness to debate. There is no reason. There is no room for questioning. There is only REPUBLICAN.

I'm willing to bet you can trigger the same parts of their brains when you start discussing or questioning their religious beliefs and political ones. The two have merged.

Archinerd · Post by **Archinerd** » Tue Oct 02, 2018 12:16 pm

Fundamentalism is one of the better governments because you get maintenance free Fanatics military unit. With a strong army we can just conquer the Wonders we want instead of building them ourselves.

El Guapo · Post by **El Guapo** » Tue Oct 02, 2018 12:19 pm

Paingod wrote: ↑Tue Oct 02, 2018 11:53 am The GOP's blindness to truth can only be likened to a religious zeal. Like an unshakable faith in a god, they have developed an unshakable faith in their political righteousness. Anything that threatens that TRUTH, in their mind, is an insult and cannot be. There is no openness to debate. There is no reason. There is no room for questioning. There is only REPUBLICAN.

I'm willing to bet you can trigger the same parts of their brains when you start discussing or questioning their religious beliefs and political ones. The two have merged.

It's more that the GOP is now dominated by this Randian mindset that holds that the most important thing in politics is to protect the creative industrious few (the 'makers') from the depradations and theft of the masses (the 'takers'). Under this mindset democracy is inherently somewhat suspect, and far from the highest good, because it's constantly in danger of being corrupted by the more numerous masses by voting themselves the benefits of the work of the industrious few (which is little more than legalized theft).

Hence, why would McConnell or the GOP intervene to stop the Russians from interfering in the election, when the Russians were helping to elect the candidate who would better protect the industrious few from the rapacious masses?

Skinypupy · Post by **Skinypupy** » Tue Oct 02, 2018 12:27 pm

El Guapo wrote: ↑Tue Oct 02, 2018 12:19 pm
Paingod wrote: ↑Tue Oct 02, 2018 11:53 am The GOP's blindness to truth can only be likened to a religious zeal. Like an unshakable faith in a god, they have developed an unshakable faith in their political righteousness. Anything that threatens that TRUTH, in their mind, is an insult and cannot be. There is no openness to debate. There is no reason. There is no room for questioning. There is only REPUBLICAN.

I'm willing to bet you can trigger the same parts of their brains when you start discussing or questioning their religious beliefs and political ones. The two have merged.
It's more that the GOP is now dominated by this Randian mindset that holds that the most important thing in politics is to protect the creative industrious few (the 'makers') from the depradations and theft of the masses (the 'takers'). Under this mindset democracy is inherently somewhat suspect, and far from the highest good, because it's constantly in danger of being corrupted by the more numerous masses by voting themselves the benefits of the work of the industrious few (which is little more than legalized theft).

Hence, why would McConnell or the GOP intervene to stop the Russians from interfering in the election, when the Russians were helping to elect the candidate who would better protect the industrious few from the rapacious masses?

"There are two novels that can change a bookish fourteen-year old's life: The Lord of the Rings and Atlas Shrugged. One is a childish fantasy that often engenders a lifelong obsession with its unbelievable heroes, leading to an emotionally stunted, socially crippled adulthood, unable to deal with the real world.

The other, of course, involves orcs."

I'm sure the quote has been around forever, but I saw it for the first time over the weekend.

msteelers · Post by **msteelers** » Tue Oct 02, 2018 12:48 pm

Smoove_B wrote:Oh, hey, nothing to look at here - just some commentary about how Mitch McConnell responded to the director of the CIA telling him about the Russian involvement with our democratic process in 2016:

Yikes. WaPo's @GregPMiller describes a tense moment from 2016 involving a CIA director trying to sound the alarm on Russia and a senior U.S. senator wanting none of it...

What do we know about the author? Is he reputable? That might have to be the next book purchase.

Also, I thought we already knew McConnell shot down any public statements by the Obama administration.

Smoove_B · Post by **Smoove_B** » Tue Oct 02, 2018 12:55 pm

I mean...he's won two Pulitzer prizes. You can read more about the book here:

Based on interviews with hundreds of people in Trump’s inner circle, current and former government officials, individuals with close ties to the White House, members of the law enforcement and the intelligence communities, foreign officials, and confidential documents, The Apprentice offers striking new information about:

The hacking of the Democrats by Russian intelligence.

Russian hijacking of Facebook and Twitter.

National Security Adviser Michael Flynn’s hidden communications with the Russians.

The attempt by Jared Kushner, Trump’s son-in-law, to create a secret backchannel to Moscow using Russian diplomatic facilities.

Trump’s disclosure to Russian officials of highly classified information about Israeli intelligence operations.

Trump’s battles with the CIA and the FBI and fierce clashes within the West Wing.

Trump’s efforts to enlist the director of national intelligence and the director of the National Security Agency to push back against the FBI’s investigation of his campaign.

The mysterious Trump Tower meeting.

The firing of FBI Director James Comey.

The appointment of Mueller and the investigation that has followed.

The internal battles within Trump’s legal camp.

And Trump’s jaw-dropping behavior in Helsinki.

El Guapo · Post by **El Guapo** » Tue Oct 02, 2018 12:56 pm

I mean, sure, but he hasn't won *three* Pulitzers?

Unagi · Post by **Unagi** » Tue Oct 02, 2018 1:02 pm

Archinerd wrote: ↑Tue Oct 02, 2018 12:16 pm Fundamentalism is one of the better governments because you get maintenance free Fanatics military unit. With a strong army we can just conquer the Wonders we want instead of building them ourselves.

GreenGoo · Post by **GreenGoo** » Tue Oct 02, 2018 1:33 pm

El Guapo wrote: ↑Tue Oct 02, 2018 12:56 pm I mean, sure, but he hasn't won *three* Pulitzers?

More importantly, has drumpf weighed in on it? Unless he says something like "Their quotes were made up frauds, a con on the public. Likewise other stories and quotes. <insert journalist name here> is a Dem operative? Notice timing?", I think it's a pass. The only way to know if it's the truth is if drumpf goes on record that it's not. If drumpf doesn't lose his shit in public, it's probably not worth reading.

Carpet_pissr · Post by **Carpet_pissr** » Tue Oct 02, 2018 3:25 pm

I actually heard the Head Turd say something to the effect of "The Democrats are trying to burn the country to the ground!" today or yesterday.

Some tricksy Trump whisperer is quite aware of the "they want to burn it all down" meme used to describe Deplorables, and now he's using it agin' us! Uncool, man, UNCOOL!

Man, there is so much vitriol toward Democrats/liberals/progressives in the R party right now, it's unbelievable. The anger is coming out of their eyes, and other orifices, willy nilly: Lindsey "Evil Babyface" Graham, Brett "Broham" Kavanaugh, uhhhh...who else. The Judge lady on Fox news. These people are SEETHING with bile and rancor.

Holman · Post by **Holman** » Tue Oct 02, 2018 4:00 pm

Carpet_pissr wrote: ↑Tue Oct 02, 2018 3:25 pm I actually heard the Head Turd say something to the effect of "The Democrats are trying to burn the country to the ground!" today or yesterday.

Some tricksy Trump whisperer is quite aware of the "they want to burn it all down" meme used to describe Deplorables, and now he's using it agin' us! Uncool, man, UNCOOL!

Man, there is so much vitriol toward Democrats/liberals/progressives in the R party right now, it's unbelievable. The anger is coming out of their eyes, and other orifices, willy nilly: Lindsey "Evil Babyface" Graham, Brett "Broham" Kavanaugh, uhhhh...who else. The Judge lady on Fox news. These people are SEETHING with bile and rancor.

"I hate the people you hate!" is how Trump won 2016.

There's no reason for them to believe hate won't sell again.

Fitzy · Post by **Fitzy** » Tue Oct 02, 2018 4:19 pm

Daddy’s money, tax evasion, and outright fraud.

I’m shocked he wanted his finances off limit to examination.

Also why couldn’t the NYT have done this before the election?

Blackhawk · Post by **Blackhawk** » Tue Oct 02, 2018 4:30 pm

Carpet_pissr wrote: ↑Tue Oct 02, 2018 3:25 pm
Man, there is so much vitriol toward Democrats/liberals/progressives in the R party right now, it's unbelievable.

Take it to the streets and it goes both ways. The way to guarantee our downfall is to win in 2018/20, then spend the next few years stigginit to the Republicans.

gbasden · Post by **gbasden** » Tue Oct 02, 2018 4:40 pm

Blackhawk wrote: ↑Tue Oct 02, 2018 4:30 pm
Carpet_pissr wrote: ↑Tue Oct 02, 2018 3:25 pm
Man, there is so much vitriol toward Democrats/liberals/progressives in the R party right now, it's unbelievable.
Take it to the streets and it goes both ways. The way to guarantee our downfall is to win in 2018/20, then spend the next few years stigginit to the Republicans.

Guilty. I know I shouldn't, but I want bad things to happen to McConnell, Trump and the rest of the Republican assholes. I've never felt the kind of long-running rage I do right now.