The Trump Investigation(s) Thread

[GreenGoo]

Drumpf claims to have answered Meuller's questions "very easily" but doesn't know when he might submit them.

article

It's a test, Drumpf, but not one that is supposed to be difficult to take, dumbass.

On the plus side he claims he's writing the answers, not his lawyers.

God I so hope that's true, and that he refuses their advice regarding any alterations they might suggest.

[Max Peck]

How the Trump Administration Stepped Up Pursuit of WikiLeaks’s Assange

Soon after he took over as C.I.A. director, Mike Pompeo privately told lawmakers about a new target for American spies: Julian Assange, the founder of WikiLeaks.

Intent on finding out more about Mr. Assange’s dealings with Russian intelligence, the C.I.A. began last year to conduct traditional espionage against the organization, according to American officials. At the same time, federal law enforcement officials were reconsidering Mr. Assange’s designation as a journalist and debating whether to charge him with a crime.

Mr. Pompeo and former Attorney General Jeff Sessions unleashed an aggressive campaign against Mr. Assange, reversing an Obama-era view of WikiLeaks as a journalistic entity. For more than a year, the nation’s spies and investigators sought to learn about Mr. Assange and his ties to Russia as senior administration officials came to believe he was in league with Moscow.

Their work culminated in prosecutors secretly filing charges this summer against Mr. Assange, which were inadvertently revealed in an unrelated court filing and confirmed on Friday by a person familiar with the inquiry. Taken together, the C.I.A. spying and the Justice Department’s targeting of Mr. Assange represented a remarkable shift by both the American government and President Trump, who repeatedly lauded WikiLeaks during the 2016 campaign for its releases of Democratic emails, stolen by Russian agents, that damaged his opponent, Hillary Clinton.

A prosecution of Mr. Assange could pit the interests of the administration against Mr. Trump’s. Mr. Assange could help answer the central question of the investigation by the special counsel, Robert S. Mueller III: whether any Trump associates conspired with Russia to interfere in the presidential race. If the case against Mr. Assange includes charges that he acted as an agent of a foreign power, anyone who knowingly cooperated with him could be investigated as a co-conspirator, former senior law-enforcement officials said.

Justice Department officials did not disclose the charges against Mr. Assange on Friday, prompting speculation around Washington about their nature. The case might be tied to the hacked Democratic emails, which are part of Mr. Mueller’s evidence of the wide-ranging election interference personally ordered by President Vladimir V. Putin of Russia. The charges could also be related to WikiLeaks’s publication last year of C.I.A. tools to penetrate computers and mobile devices, the so-called Vault 7 disclosures.

[GreenGoo]

At this point I'll happily sacrifice him if it means he flips and can help Meuller in any way.

Assange has essentially zero allies at this point and he sure as heck is no Snowden.

[El Guapo]

At this point I'll happily sacrifice him if it means he flips and can help Meuller in any way.

Assange has essentially zero allies at this point and he sure as heck is no Snowden.

Yeah. I have no idea whether Assange started with good intentions, but by the 2016 election at the latest he was clearly in league with Russia and the far right in ways that Snowden never was (well, other than hanging out in Moscow these days, I suppose).

Fascinating that Pompeo's doing this, since as the article notes this is possibly contradicting Trump's interests. Though we have no idea of the nature of the charges.

[GreenGoo]

Unfortunately I seriously doubt the Russians were stupid enough to give him anything that he could use to buy a better deal for himself, although it wouldn't surprise me if he has something on drumpf and Co., although I doubt it's anything that would sway anyone. Assange isn't Russia either.

Basically he might have something that is embarrassing on drumpf, and maybe even technically illegal, but I doubt it would make any difference and I seriously doubt it would tie drumpf to Russia.

Which is too bad. It was pretty clear as you said that he was working with/for the Russians, just like drumpf.

[Max Peck]

If Assange was working as a middleman between Russia and the Trump campaign, it's possible he could provide evidence of collusion. I don't think he would voluntarily provide it, and for the time being there is no way for the Americans to lay hands on him even if they have indicted him.

To me, the primary entertainment value lies in the fact that this is not the deal Assange was hoping for when he went all-in for Trump back in 2016.

[Holman]

At this point I'll happily sacrifice him if it means he flips and can help Meuller in any way.

Assange has essentially zero allies at this point and he sure as heck is no Snowden.

It's not entirely clear that even Snowden is Snowden.

[GreenGoo]

It's not entirely clear that even Snowden is Snowden.

It's pretty clear.

[Jaymann]

It's not entirely clear that even Snowden is Snowden.

It's pretty clear.

You've been hit with the GreenGoo pedantic stick.

[GreenGoo]

You've been hit with the GreenGoo pedantic stick.

Wait.

I've been assuming you understood what pedantic means. I'm no longer sure.

[Defiant]

whoops, wrong link

[LordMortis]

link removed as you might change it as an accidental cut and paste and I won't to continue to publish what might have been an accident

???

[Defiant]

Collins breaks with Flake, refuses to compel vote on protecting Mueller

http://mainebeacon.com/collins-breaks-w ... g-mueller/

[Daehawk]

Ivanka Trump used personal account for emails about government business

So like Clinton. Will her daddy start his "Lock her up!" chant?? Or will he be a hypocrite?

[Daehawk]

[Defiant]

[Unagi]

You've been hit with the GreenGoo pedantic stick.

Wait.

I've been assuming you understood what pedantic means. I'm no longer sure.

I see what you did there.

[Carpet_pissr]

Man, that video. Trying REAL hard to temper my expectations for some decent transparency when/if this thing comes out.

[Holman]

When Mueller does his final report, will he be covering all of his conflicts of interest in a preamble, will he be recommending action on all of the crimes of many kinds from those “on the other side”(whatever happened to Podesta?), and will he be putting in statements from.....

....hundreds of people closely involved with my campaign who never met, saw or spoke to a Russian during this period? So many campaign workers, people inside from the beginning, ask me why they have not been called (they want to be). There was NO Collusion & Mueller knows it!

"SO MANY campaign workers never spoke to a Russian that you can hardly call it collusion at all!!"

The Dershowitz warning and this sweaty pushback makes me hope that something big is about to break.

[El Guapo]

Yeah, if Trump and his inner circle were colluding with Russian intelligence, how come so many low level campaign volunteers never met a Russian during the campaign?

Checkmate, Mueller.

[coopasonic]

It takes a special kind of genius... like... a stable genius!

[hepcat]

Oh man, they found the Russian prostitutes, didn't they? Please tell me they found the Russian prostitutes.

[El Guapo]

Trump reportedly submitted his written answers to Mueller recently, right? Maybe TrumpWorld is just assuming that with those answers submitted, some type of report is coming in the near future.

[GreenGoo]

Trump reportedly submitted his written answers to Mueller recently, right?

Don't think so. Last I heard, reports were that he had finished the Mueller quiz "very easily" but I have yet to hear that he has actually submitted them.

Could have missed it though.

As an aside, I'm pretty sure scope is just a mouthwash in his world.

He's actually too dumb to be loose. I want him "protected" in a home for the rest of his life, and for god's sake, don't let him have twitter access!

I have exactly zero optimism about the Mueller investigation though. I so hope my pessimism isn't warranted.

[Smoove_B]

The Dershowitz warning and this sweaty pushback makes me hope that something big is about to break.

Yeah, it really makes me wonder what he already knows and/or has seen. As previously noted, could this be the beginnings of his attempt(s) to control the narrative. I mean, he's going to bloviate on Twitter about it regardless but the idea that there's already a calculated press release that's been crafted in advance is nutty. Instead, I'd fully expect him to do other things to distract. Like maybe...support the tear gassing of women and children or ramp up how important it is to say Merry Christmas (not Happy Holidays). I dunno - just spitballing.

[Carpet_pissr]

Trump reportedly submitted his written answers to Mueller recently, right? Maybe TrumpWorld is just assuming that with those answers submitted, some type of report is coming in the near future.

Yes, he did. In crayon, of course.

(seriously, yes, he did submit answers finally)

[Kraken]

The AG decides when and if Mueller's report gets released. I'm not holding my breath.

[GreenGoo]

(seriously, yes, he did submit answers finally)

Ok, cool, thanks.

He had claimed to write the responses himself. As I said last time, God I hope so. Praise be if he refused all legal advice while doing so.

[GreenGoo]

The AG decides when and if Mueller's report gets released. I'm not holding my breath.

Only 2 years until a new AG.

...hopefully.

[El Guapo]

The AG decides when and if Mueller's report gets released. I'm not holding my breath.

I think preventing the report from reaching the public would not be an easy task. First, I would think that Mueller could just include a bunch of 'ccs when he sends the report to the AG, figuring that at least one of them will leak it (and/or publicly resign if it's not released / sent to Congress).

Second, I would think that the Democratic House would subpoena the report, and compel testimony related to the report. I imagine that the administration would fight the release, but an extended court battle over fighting the release of the report, which everyone would immediately assume must be pretty devastating especially if they're fighting its release tooth and nail, would itself be super devastating to the administration.

Finally, once it's publicly known that there is a report, I expect that the public pressure to release the report would be pretty overwhelming, even setting aside any legal battles connected to it.

It could be done, but it doesn't seem easy or painless.

[GreenGoo]

It could be done, but it doesn't seem easy or painless.

They'll just release a heavily doctored and redacted version, just like they've been doing for years now with other reports.

Still, it'll get out eventually. The question is whether it will be soon enough or after the administration has had weeks or maybe months to do damage control first. The impact of the report could easily be watered down with timing and propaganda. The propaganda campaign has been going on since before the investigation even started.

[Max Peck]

It takes a special kind of genius... like... a stable genius!

[Ralph-Wiggum]

It's worth remembering that Dershowitz has been pretty out there the last few years (at least), so I wouldn't necessarily put much stock in anything he has to say.

[GreenGoo]

It's worth remembering that Dershowitz has been pretty out there the last few years (at least), so I wouldn't necessarily put much stock in anything he has to say.

I'm unsure why he should be given any credibility at all in terms of what will be in the report. Does he have some sort of inside line that others don't?

[stessier]

I imagine that the administration would fight the release, but an extended court battle over fighting the release of the report, which everyone would immediately assume must be pretty devastating especially if they're fighting its release tooth and nail, would itself be super devastating to the administration.

Under normal circumstances, I would agree. But what possible harm would it cause this particular administration? I'm not joking - I don't think anyone would bat an eye.

[El Guapo]

It could be done, but it doesn't seem easy or painless.

They'll just release a heavily doctored and redacted version, just like they've been doing for years now with other reports.

Still, it'll get out eventually. The question is whether it will be soon enough or after the administration has had weeks or maybe months to do damage control first. The impact of the report could easily be watered down with timing and propaganda. The propaganda campaign has been going on since before the investigation even started.

Yeah, I think you're right. That's very likely what they're going to try to do, and it has a decent chance of working (where "working" would basically mean not eroding support for the President by more than a small amount).

I thought the expectation was that Mueller would likely release a report on the obstruction of justice side of the case, while still going on the rest of the case (the substantive collusion). If that's the case I imagine the administration will focus on executive power and "there was no collusion so there can be no obstruction over collusion" and the like, which would probably work just fine among Trump's base.

[El Guapo]

I imagine that the administration would fight the release, but an extended court battle over fighting the release of the report, which everyone would immediately assume must be pretty devastating especially if they're fighting its release tooth and nail, would itself be super devastating to the administration.

Under normal circumstances, I would agree. But what possible harm would it cause this particular administration? I'm not joking - I don't think anyone would bat an eye.

My rough guess, judging by similar kinds of events (e.g., the aftermath of the Comey firing) is that it would probably lower Trump's approval rating by several points while it remains in the headlines, which would be for awhile. The big risk for Trump would be that he would ultimately lose the battle, but lose it in the middle of election season, so that the report would wind up coming out in, say, summer 2020.

[YellowKing]

While I'm skeptical that the report is going to lead to what I really want - i.e. Trump being removed from office via resigning or impeachment, we still live in a political reality where actions have consequences. The mid-terms were a direct rebuke to Trump and the GOP. There's no reason to believe that a damning Mueller report would somehow help Trump in any fashion heading into the next election. It's just more gas for the fire of discontent.

Trump doesn't win re-election without the support of independents and other swing voters, period. Anything that leaves a bad taste in their mouth about him will be a net positive.

[GreenGoo]

There's no reason to believe that a damning Mueller report would somehow help Trump in any fashion heading into the next election.

While I think the above is obviously true, otherwise down is truly up and left is right, my main concern is whether the report is "damning" at all.

Without a smoking gun I'm worried that a lukewarm report might in fact help Drumpf.

I have no doubt that everything Drumpf is suspected of doing he did. He has a long history of questionable morale and ethical decision making and nearly every worst case scenario has proven to be true in the past.

I feel like a smoking gun would have wrapped up the report much earlier than now. A preponderance of evidence is only necessary if there isn't a picture of the crime being committed by subject. I don't have a lot of experience with government investigations so this is just my gut talking.

Drumpf is so unbelievably corrupt (because he doesn't know how to not be corrupt. I honestly believe he has no idea that a lot of what he does is wrong by society's standards) and so unbelievably stupid (plus he doesn't see it as wrong) that the kind of luck he must have to prevent Mueller from finding a smoking gun means there is no God. At least not a just one.

There was literally communication between the Drumpf org and an Oligarchy owned Russian bank during his campaign, and when this became public, the communication magically moved to a different computer but continued. Even when alerted that they had been detected, the best they could do was switch computers. That doesn't say a lot for the skills of those trying to hide their activities from prying eyes. I mean there is a ton of that sort of thing going on, not to mention the meetings that are public now etc.

For Mueller not to have a smoking gun would require the universe to line up in such a fashion as to warrant buying a lottery ticket. Combine that idea with my gut telling me Mueller doesn't have a smoking gun and I'm super duper pessimistic.

[Malificent]

I feel like a smoking gun would have wrapped up the report much earlier than now. A preponderance of evidence is only necessary if there isn't a picture of the crime being committed by subject. I don't have a lot of experience with government investigations so this is just my gut talking.

https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/mu ... tigations/

So there is still hope. Atthough I long ago gave up any expectations that justice would be served. I'm settling for surviving.