[Health] The Infectious Diseases Thread

[gameoverman]

So the US doesn't have enough for 3 days but they will donate to foreign countries. FU razer

I think anything useful, masks/equipment/vaccine, should be shared around the world. The reason this virus spread so far, so fast is because we live in an interconnected world. We're all in this together. This is an opportunity to build closer ties which will help us rebuild after this is over. If we act in bad faith now it will be remembered later.

[Daehawk]

The cyclists are out today riding. They ride by here all year in the good days. They just passed. there wasn't 100 this time though. Looked like about 15-20 but they were bunched up close. Their fancy expensive bikes and spandex trying to be all super healthy. Bah humbug.

[Zaxxon]

https://www.polygon.com/2020/3/19/21187 ... s-shutdown

Ok, then, GameStop.

I mean, I get why they are taking this position--their business was doomed anyway, and riding the slow decline to closing. The COVID shutdown just greatly accelerates that, so they literally have nothing to lose by staying open, other than sullying GameStop's good na---eh, I can't even finish that sentence.

I feel doubly sorry for the employees, who now in addition to working in a doomed job are also now at higher-than-needed health risk.

[Daehawk]

Always said they were scummy. I did wonder about them yesterday when I got a new sales ad email.

[Daehawk]

Looks like checks for those under $75,000 a year will be $1200

Also I totally disagree on putting up Christmas lights. 1. It to me would seem petty and ignorant to put up happy lights of a happy holiday with so much grief, worry and death going on. And 2. when Christmas does get here instead of it being the normal Christ and fun holiday it normally would be it would just be a reminder of these dark times and again the deaths.

[Jeff V]

https://www.polygon.com/2020/3/19/21187 ... s-shutdown

Ok, then, GameStop.

I mean, I get why they are taking this position--their business was doomed anyway, and riding the slow decline to closing. The COVID shutdown just greatly accelerates that, so they literally have nothing to lose by staying open, other than sullying GameStop's good na---eh, I can't even finish that sentence.

I feel doubly sorry for the employees, who now in addition to working in a doomed job are also now at higher-than-needed health risk.

Not sure when, but the Game Stop my nephew works at announced it is closing so he's soon to be jobless. His brother also works retail and is banned from work for a week due to sniffles. They share an apartment and will have no income for a bit.

[Blackhawk]

https://www.polygon.com/2020/3/19/21187 ... s-shutdown

Ok, then, GameStop.

I mean, I get why they are taking this position--their business was doomed anyway, and riding the slow decline to closing. The COVID shutdown just greatly accelerates that, so they literally have nothing to lose by staying open, other than sullying GameStop's good na---eh, I can't even finish that sentence.

I feel doubly sorry for the employees, who now in addition to working in a doomed job are also now at higher-than-needed health risk.

In business, out of business. Doesn't matter. They've lost my business.

Not that I gave them much anymore anyway.

[Defiant]

IMPORTANT: CA, CO, CT, DC, MD, MA, NV, NY, RI & WA residents can still #GetCovered via Special Enrollment Periods!

People in the following states can still get enrolled in ACA (Obamacare)

[Kurth]

Unemployment is going to be massive. This from Oregon.live:

New unemployment filings totaled 18,500 Tuesday – more in a single day than any week during the Great Recession, according to state economists.

The state’s restaurant and bars employed 155,000 before the coronavirus outbreak prompted Gov. Kate Brown to order them all closed in hopes of containing the contagion. Theaters, museums, hotels and many stores are shutting down, too.

Tough times are ahead.

[gameoverman]

Unemployment is going to be massive. This from Oregon.live:

New unemployment filings totaled 18,500 Tuesday – more in a single day than any week during the Great Recession, according to state economists.

The state’s restaurant and bars employed 155,000 before the coronavirus outbreak prompted Gov. Kate Brown to order them all closed in hopes of containing the contagion. Theaters, museums, hotels and many stores are shutting down, too.

Tough times are ahead.

I'm kinda wondering how long people who still have jobs, and people who are still getting paid even if they aren't going to work(like teachers), will get paid. I can't help think that a lot of tax money goes to paying lots of people. Everything shut down means far less in taxes will be collected. You can't get blood from a rock. At some point either there will be no money to pay people OR they'll need to start printing money like crazy. Before this, people debated the idea of universal income because maybe some percentage of people were no longer needed for labor and thus would have no jobs anyways. That was when most other people had jobs that did pay. What happens when you have entire communities where no one is getting paid? Tough times might be an optimistic outcome.

[Daehawk]

1/3 of the restaurant industry workers are out of work.

[Skinypupy]

From the restaurant folks that I've talked to, it's all about giving their folks at least some sort of income while this (hopefully) stabilizes and they are allowed to reopen. They lay everyone off so they can collect unemployment, with the intent of immediately hiring everyone back once the restaurant reopens. Not everyone will be re-hired and there will obviously be some shuffling between restaurants, but you get the general idea.

The difficulty is that an increasing number of these places simply won't be reopening, and that list keeps growing the longer this thing goes.

[Smoove_B]

[Isgrimnur]

USA Today

California Gov. Gavin Newsom unveiled an alarming projection: More than half the 40-plus million people in his state will contract COVID-19 in the next eight weeks.
...
Earlier on Thursday, Italy's death toll surpassed China's, Saints coach Sean Payton became the first known case of COVID-19 in the NFL and U.S. health officials warned the coronavirus can be dangerous for young people too, as the life-altering pandemic continued to rattle the world.
...
The global death toll passed 9,800; there were more than 240,000 confirmed cases. In the U.S., deaths jumped to 200 across 22 states – including the first reported fatalities in Connecticut, Michigan, Missouri and Pennsylvania. There were more than 13,000 confirmed cases, up from about 1,600 a week earlier, when there were 40 reported deaths.

I went out to stock up on booze and brought back dinner for myself and the wife.

The MIL decided that she had cabin fever, so she went out for ... some reason. Oh, and then her son came over so she could give him money.

[Kasey Chang]

According to local news, there are now 460+ confirmed COVID-19 cases in the SF Bay Area. That's like... HALF of all the cases in California.

[Daehawk]

Ya my news said something about 3/4 of all infections are in about 13 counties in 3 states..Washington, California, and New York.

[dbt1949]

As more tests become available the higher out state count goes. We're liable to rival China when the tests become more available.
But as least our people have toilet paper.

[Apollo]

Someone needs to develop a hood (similar to a gas mask but smaller, lighter and more comfortable) that people can wear and still do their jobs (most jobs at least) comfortably during epidemics like this. Then you would simply require all personnel to wear this hood while at work. This would be enough to prevent the majority of illnesses from spreading while allowing your business to keep operating.

IMHO, the most important lesson of this pandemic will be that you can't simply shut everything down for months anytime a dangerous new ailment appears. The economic damage will be too great. We desperately need to find ways for most businesses to stay open during future epidemics.

[Blackhawk]

I would think it would be easier to design a hood to keep microbes out (positive pressure) than to keep them in.

[Smoove_B]

You cannot put hoods on people (that would work) without giving them medical clearance to wear them. They also would need to be monitoring that they work and are being maintained properly. Wearing any type of SCBA is a pain in the ass and it potentially stresses your heart and respiratory system. I've also known people that didn't realize they were claustrophobic until they climbed inside an NBC suit or put a face mask on. They are miserable devices and should only be used for short term effort when necessary. I trained (and was certified to wear) NBC gear in the event of an emergency and I thank my lucky stars it was never required. Those suits are hell on earth.

[gameoverman]

A Glendora resident, Glendora being where I live, died of COVID-19 and he was only 34. He went to Orlando on business, then Disney World where he started to show symptoms. I think it's possible he was infected before he left, but there are lots of people from around the world at Disney parks.

click to read

I feel bad for him because that's too young to lose your life. He had asthma and 'battled' testicular cancer in case you're wondering and don't have time to read the article.

[LawBeefaroni]

Someone needs to develop a hood (similar to a gas mask but smaller, lighter and more comfortable) that people can wear and still do their jobs (most jobs at least) comfortably during epidemics like this. Then you would simply require all personnel to wear this hood while at work. This would be enough to prevent the majority of illnesses from spreading while allowing your business to keep operating.

IMHO, the most important lesson of this pandemic will be that you can't simply shut everything down for months anytime a dangerous new ailment appears. The economic damage will be too great. We desperately need to find ways for most businesses to stay open during future epidemics.

The answer won't be to wear a mask at work. It will be to work from home. Expect a lot more permanent WFH after this, as well as more jobs with WFH contingencies.

Jobs that require on-site presence may have some changes but it won't be to wear hazmat gear every time there's an illness going around.

[Daehawk]

[The Meal]

A Glendora resident, Glendora being where I live, died of COVID-19 and he was only 34. He went to Orlando on business, then Disney World where he started to show symptoms. I think it's possible he was infected before he left, but there are lots of people from around the world at Disney parks.

click to read

I feel bad for him because that's too young to lose your life. He had asthma and 'battled' testicular cancer in case you're wondering and don't have time to read the article.

On Sunday, March 15, Lauren Ghazarian posted a “timeline recap” of her brother’s condition. She said he flew to Orlando from Los Angeles on March 2 for a business trip but extended it by two days to visit Disneyworld and Universal Studios. She said he was healthy when he left for Orlando.

Jeffrey Ghazarian first developed a cough on March 7 and coughed up blood on March 8, according to the timeline post. He flew back to Los Angeles on March 9, where he was admitted to the emergency room with a high fever and later diagnosed with pneumonia.

MHS, myself, and our daughter departed Orlando on March 2nd after spending the weekend at Universal Studios. Other than playing poker with friends on March 5 and a Glaucoma test at my eye doctor on 3/13, I've basically sheltered in place. MHS had a work trip that took her through Vegas and Massachusetts from 3/5 to 3/14 and she has sheltered in place since getting home last Saturday morning. Our daughter has worked as a barista and made a few outside-her-home required trips.

None of us are exhibiting any symptoms, but hearing of this man's case makes me feel that it's a nearer thing than any of us would like. All three of us are in high-risk categories (them: immunosuppressant drugs, me: severe asthma).

[Paingod]

Stopped at the gas station this morning for my weekly top-off before the weekend. The two other patrons there at the pumps didn't bat an eye at me getting gas while wearing a latex glove, and I didn't stare at theirs. The convenience store is still open, and I noted not a single person in there was wearing gloves. Not the cashier, not a single patron. I grimaced as one guy firmly gripped the door handle and pulled it open.

Some people are getting it. Others aren't.

NPR is running stories on kids who are testing positive but showing absolutely no signs of illness (not even a sneeze), and talked with one "in her 40's and healthy" survivor who was laid out flat for two weeks while her body recovered, talking about her experience. She started with a fever and aches, then brain fuzziness and sinus involvement and is now recovering with a persistent dry cough. It sounds miserable.

Meanwhile, in Italy. Hospital view of the virus, showing many patients and their care.

[em2nought]

So blood type "might" be a factor in whether you get COVID-19 or not https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101 ... 20031096v1

CONCLUSION People with blood group A have a significantly higher risk for acquiring COVID-19 compared with non-A blood groups, whereas blood group O has a significantly lower risk for the infection compared with non-O blood groups.

[hepcat]

I would take any of these articles with a huge grain of salt. Especially ones that clearly state they’ve not been peer reviewed.

[Blackhawk]

Our state still has guidelines, but the county issued travel alerts last night that essentially create a lock down.

T-9 months until the Millennials give us Boomers 2.0.

[Zaxxon]

I think it may have been mentioned at one point up-thread, but F@H is now working COVID-19 projects. We have a small team going (241653). I joined this AM. As a side-benefit, it helps heat my office...

[stessier]

I'm still betting on SC issuing orders like California by Monday.

I think people are finally mostly agreeing on flattening the curve, but don't really realize yet that is going to extend the time that this goes on. We aren't going to hit that 70% herd immunity for a long time.

I think the Olympics aren't happening this year. I think schools and colleges are going to be doing e-learning in the fall. I don't think the NFL or college football (or any other college sport) will play this year.

[Max Peck]

The convenience store is still open, and I noted not a single person in there was wearing gloves. Not the cashier, not a single patron. I grimaced as one guy firmly gripped the door handle and pulled it open.

AFAIK, there isn't anything wrong with not wearing gloves as long as you don't touch your face and wash your hands when given the opportunity.

[Paingod]

The convenience store is still open, and I noted not a single person in there was wearing gloves. Not the cashier, not a single patron. I grimaced as one guy firmly gripped the door handle and pulled it open.

AFAIK, there isn't anything wrong with not wearing gloves as long as you don't touch your face and wash your hands when given the opportunity.

While I know that rationally, I'm not up for trying to spend the next 18 months trying to avoid my face. I prefer to keep areas free of potential infection instead. To that end, I'm careful about where my hands go as well as trying to keep my hands clean. If I handle a door at the store, then get in my car and drive off, I've contaminated my steering wheel, stick shift, and car door handle. Tomorrow when I get in the car I may forget I did that and rub my eyes if they itch.

[LawBeefaroni]

Some people are getting it. Others aren't.

And it probably has little to do with glove use.

[Paingod]

Some people are getting it. Others aren't.

And it probably has little to do with glove use.

By "it" I didn't mean the virus, but rather the social distancing and awareness of what they're coming into contact with.

[Blackhawk]

FWIW, 90% of the people you see wearing gloves don't even know how to take them off without contaminating themselves anyway.

[Max Peck]

I guess whatever works for you works for you. The only place I consider "safe" is the interior of my apartment (and even here, I'm trying to train myself to keep my paws away from my face as much as possible). When I return home, I remove my outerwear and put it in the closet, which I assume to be contaminated -- nothing there is touched until the next time I suit up to head out. Then I scrub my hands. When I'm out and about, I assume my hands are contaminated from the point that I grab my boots to start suiting up and I consciously avoid touching my face from that point until I return. If I had a car, I'd have to replicate that decontamination effort to some degree every time I entered or left the vehicle in order to let my guard down while in the vehicle, but since I don't my situation is a little less complicated.

My system works for me, right up until it doesn't and I get sick of course. My working assumption is that I will get sick eventually because if nothing else I'll eventually slip up, at which point I transition to the self-isolation protocol and hope for the best. Given that I haven't had so much as one cold in the 6 years since I retired and only ever had the seasonal flu twice in the last 30 or so years, I'm mildly hopeful that my innate social distancing and personal hygiene habits will give me a bit of an edge.

[Kraken]

The convenience store is still open, and I noted not a single person in there was wearing gloves. Not the cashier, not a single patron. I grimaced as one guy firmly gripped the door handle and pulled it open.

AFAIK, there isn't anything wrong with not wearing gloves as long as you don't touch your face and wash your hands when given the opportunity.

While I know that rationally, I'm not up for trying to spend the next 18 months trying to avoid my face. I prefer to keep areas free of potential infection instead. To that end, I'm careful about where my hands go as well as trying to keep my hands clean. If I handle a door at the store, then get in my car and drive off, I've contaminated my steering wheel, stick shift, and car door handle. Tomorrow when I get in the car I may forget I did that and rub my eyes if they itch.

I have a big ol' canister of Clorox wipes in my car for that reason. Every time I get in, I wipe down the steering wheel, shift knob, door handle, seat belt buckle, and turn signal.

[Kraken]

My system works for me, right up until it doesn't and I get sick of course. My working assumption is that I will get sick eventually because if nothing else I'll eventually slip up, at which point I transition to the self-isolation protocol and hope for the best. Given that I haven't had so much as one cold in the 6 years since I retired and only ever had the seasonal flu twice in the last 30 or so years, I'm mildly hopeful that my innate social distancing and personal hygiene habits will give me a bit of an edge.

Experts believe that 60-70% of us will eventually contract the virus. We're just trying to stretch "eventually" out as long as possible, ideally until we have treatments and a vaccine.

[Max Peck]

Yeah, I know. I'm just saying that I'm working to slow that process down for myself, and am not pretending that I can stay uncontaminated forever. I just do what I can do to not be a disease vector while waiting for the boffins to develop a vaccine (i.e. delay becoming infected, then self-isolate when I do become sick).

[Paingod]

Rolling the dice that the office manager that violated my personal space bubble yesterday...

• ...has a garden variety flu.
• ...ate something she shouldn't have.
• ...has a nasty cold that suddenly sprung up overnight.

She's been told to stay home with her fever this morning and not come in as scheduled. Yesterday she pressed me to set up the company email for her on her phone, which put her almost elbow to elbow with me while I was taking care of it and handling her phone extensively. I washed my hands vigorously twice after the encounter, but I've heard seemingly "healthy" people can spread this via the air (source NPR; a writer in Washington state is recovering, and is certain she infected others she shared a table with at lunch a couple days before she started feeling ill; 4 of them later got sick).