Corona Virus: It's a Marathon, Not a Sprint

[LawBeefaroni]

I realize this is a single anecdote, but it's concerning to me that the “health be damned…I’m losing money here!” attitude is coming from not only those who are very well off and should be able to manage (yes, I get that having lots of money doesn't necessarily mean they manage it well), but from those who are healthcare providers as well.

Our employed non "front line" physicians are taking the same % haircut as the rest of the non "front line" staff. No bitching. One reason certainly is that they know there's no going back to work without the support staff.

It's certainly not lost on me that the cost to hire an RN or tech is usually at least 1x their salary, often much more. Even "just" competent front office staff can have a huge hire cost.

Lay people off to preserve doctors' salaries, get a bad rep, and then have to hire back when it's all over? Ok. Like CRNAs or billers don't have any other options but to come crawling back.

[msteelers]

When I worked in radio we had a lot of doctors come into the station. Some as guests, others paying for their own show. I got to talk and speak with all of them both on and off the air.

It was depressing how as soon as the mics were off, their attitude went from “I want to help you get healthy” to “I want to get all your money”.

[LawBeefaroni]

When I worked in radio we had a lot of doctors come into the station. Some as guests, others paying for their own show. I got to talk and speak with all of them both on and off the air.

It was depressing how as soon as the mics were off, their attitude went from “I want to help you get healthy” to “I want to get all your money”.

There are Doctors and then there are Doctor Ozes.

[Zaxxon]

There are Doctors and then there are Doctor Ozes.

This. Don't paint docs with a single brush. I know a bunch for whom money had nothing to do with their choice of profession.

[El Guapo]

There are Doctors and then there are Doctor Ozes.

This. Don't paint docs with a single brush. I know a bunch for whom money had nothing to do with their choice of profession.

I would think that working in radio would skew the percentage of Dr. Ozes that you would encounter.

[Smoove_B]

A follow up from The Atlantic (have I mentioned how awesome their coverage has been?) regarding the antibody tests:

The idea of reopening the country based on antibody tests runs into the technical limits of the tests themselves. Scientists don’t know exactly how long immunity to COVID-19 will last and what level of antibodies confers immunity. “There are just unknowns for an individual,” Gigi Gronvall, a senior scholar at the Johns Hopkins Center for Health Security and a co-author of a recent report on antibody testing, told me. “The ‘get out of jail free’ card we’re hoping for, it’s just not how it should be sold,” she said. The World Health Organization on Friday warned that issuing “immunity certificates” based on antibody testing would be premature.

...

Moreover, Osterholm said, antibody tests don’t give a snapshot of the present. It can take two weeks for a patient to develop a detectable amount of antibodies in their blood, so antibody surveys are necessarily backward-looking. But when public-health officials are deciding whether schools or businesses are safe to reopen, the key piece of information is the number of people currently infected. “I want to know what is happening now,” Osterholm said, “and antibody testing will not get that to you.”

The key strategies for stopping the disease are still the same ones experts have been promoting from the beginning: testing, contact tracing, isolating for those who test positive for COVID-19, and social distancing for everyone else. “There’s going to have to be some level of new normal for a while,” Dean said. Ongoing antibody surveys will help clarify the true scope of the pandemic and the true proportion of asymptomatic carriers, and those data can indeed help inform public-health decisions. But as far as antibody testing goes, Gronvall said, “it’s not the silver bullet for everything.”

[Zaxxon]

There are Doctors and then there are Doctor Ozes.

This. Don't paint docs with a single brush. I know a bunch for whom money had nothing to do with their choice of profession.

I would think that working in radio would skew the percentage of Dr. Ozes that you would encounter.

Indeed. Although the regular non-fantastical-land-name-sharing kind also end up on the radio quite often.

[Isgrimnur]

There are Doctors and then there are Doctor Ozes.

This. Don't paint docs with a single brush. I know a bunch for whom money had nothing to do with their choice of profession.

I would think that working in radio would skew the percentage of Dr. Ozes that you would encounter.

Self-selecting Oz-holes.

[Skinypupy]

Oh good, Trump is going to wave his magic wand and make the virus go away at meat processing plants.

Faced with worries of a meat shortage caused by the coronavirus, President Donald Trump plans to order meat-processing plants to remain open, officials said Tuesday.

Trump plans to declare meat plants as critical infrastructure, and cite the Defense Production Act to justify an order to keep them open, said two officials familiar with the discussions, speaking on condition of anonymity because the order is not yet completed. The officials said Trump could sign the order Tuesday.

I'm sure hearing they are "critical" will be very comforting to all the sick and dying employees at the plants.

[El Guapo]

https://twitter.com/MarshallCohen/statu ... 6746057733

[Isgrimnur]

Spoiler:

https://twitter.com/saraecook/status/12 ... 2721487874

[coopasonic]

He doesn't need a mask, he has God.

[Ralph-Wiggum]

They are also all standing way too close together. Maybe this is Trump's way of trying to ditch Pence before the election.

[RunningMn9]

This. For a substantial part of the population, the economic side really is as bad as a major and potentially deadly health issue.

No, it’s not. It may feel that way, but it’s not. Because financial distress isn’t contagious simply from breathing.

And financial distress is much more easily problem to solve than a deadly (and contagious) health issue.

To Smoove’s point, even if you add in the “I need this end so I can work to afford food” folks, they are still only thinking about their limited sphere, and not the impact they might have on anyone that they might pass a deadly virus to and kill.

The way through that issue isn’t opening the doors to the economy and risking everyone’s health - the way through is to figure out how to help these people through this time financially.

[Zaxxon]

True, I shouldn't have said it's as bad. That's clearly not true. But it will feel to some as though it is, and from a mental health perspective it might as well be--years or decades of work down the tubes, possibly effectively ending dreams permanently.

All's I'm saying is there's a subset of folks who I could empathize with should they be protesting. Which perhaps is a worthless position for me to post about, since it's largely not those folks doing the protesting.

And I'm fully in agreement that financially assisting these folks would have been the way to go. Rather than rewarding airlines for ruinous stock buybacks and putting out a PPP that largely benefitted those businesses not in the most dire of straits.

[gbasden]

And I'm fully in agreement that financially assisting these folks would have been the way to go. Rather than rewarding airlines for ruinous stock buybacks and putting out a PPP that largely benefitted those businesses not in the most dire of straits.

Yes, but that would require a functional government, not a kleptocracy.

[Zaxxon]

And I'm fully in agreement that financially assisting these folks would have been the way to go. Rather than rewarding airlines for ruinous stock buybacks and putting out a PPP that largely benefitted those businesses not in the most dire of straits.

Yes, but that would require a functional government, not a kleptocracy.

Uhhuh.

[Zarathud]

To cannibalize a Second Amendment argument,

When days count, the government is months away.

When days count, the Trump administration plans on never having to act or take responsibility.

Mortoned.

[Isgrimnur]

To cannibalize a Second Amendment argument,

When days count, the government is months away.

When days count, the Trump administration plans on never having to act or take responsibility.

Mortoned.

We are in the worst timeline.

[Jolor]

He doesn't need a mask, he has God.

They are also all standing way too close together. Maybe this is Trump's way of trying to ditch Pence before the election.

He is the bravest Sergeant, leading his men into battle, without his helmet! If those corona droplets think they can get him before he gets them, then they're about to get disinfected!

[noxiousdog]

True, I shouldn't have said it's as bad. That's clearly not true. But it will feel to some as though it is, and from a mental health perspective it might as well be--years or decades of work down the tubes, possibly effectively ending dreams permanently.

All's I'm saying is there's a subset of folks who I could empathize with should they be protesting. Which perhaps is a worthless position for me to post about, since it's largely not those folks doing the protesting.

And I'm fully in agreement that financially assisting these folks would have been the way to go. Rather than rewarding airlines for ruinous stock buybacks and putting out a PPP that largely benefitted those businesses not in the most dire of straits.

I'm with you. It is increasingly hard for me to justify stay at home orders for the roughly 100 Texas counties that haven't seen a covid-19 death.. or at least don't have one recorded.

It's different, for sure, for cities and especially dense areas like New York City and New Jersey. Even Austin and San Antonio. But with the r numbers around 1 ... That's one transmission per infection over 3 weeks... I think there can be some flexibility and if I weren't in a metro area, it would be very difficult for me not to be upset by it.

[Dogstar]

Remember that idea Ludlow floated about businesses getting liability immunity?

https://thehill.com/homenews/senate/495 ... -liability

Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell (R-Ky.) said Tuesday that the next coronavirus bill has to include liability protections for employers or it will not pass the Senate.

"My red line going forward on this bill is we need to provide protection, litigation protection, for those who have been on the front lines. ... We can't pass another bill unless we have liability protection," McConnell said during an interview on Fox News, calling the additional legal protections a "condition" for the bill.

If it is included, I can only hope that it's extremely limited. The potential for non-compliance with worker protection would be tremendous otherwise. Don't feel comfortable working in an environment where you might get sick? There's 20% unemployment; someone else will be willing to take that risk.

[Smoove_B]

I'm with you. It is increasingly hard for me to justify stay at home orders for the roughly 100 Texas counties that haven't seen a covid-19 death.. or at least don't have one recorded.

Good news then - the governor's orders won't feel like a threat to you:

"If you're an employer and you offer to bring your employee back to work and they decide not to, that's a voluntary quit," Iowa Gov. Kim Reynolds (R) said Friday. "Therefore, they would not be eligible for the unemployment money."

Reynolds also said employers who have workers that refuse to return should file a report with Iowa Workforce Development.

...

The situation is similar for workers in Texas, where Gov. Greg Abbott (R) on Monday gave the go-ahead for retail stores, restaurants, movie theaters and malls to reopen on Friday.

According to the Texas Workforce Commission, to qualify for unemployment benefits in the state, a worker must be “willing and able to work all the days and hours required for the type of work you are seeking."

Cisco Gamez, a Texas Workforce Commission spokesman, told the Texas Tribune that employees who choose not to return to work will become ineligible for unemployment benefits.

BLOOD FOR THE BLOOD GOD

But seriously, in comparison, figuring out how to make sure people can pay their bills and don't go hungry is unreasonable?

[Smoove_B]

Regarding Pence and not wearing a mask, he said it was because he wanted to look them "in the eye".

That's how bad things are in the administration. No one wants to tell the VP that's now how masks work. But seriously, we all know he's not wearing it because it would have hurt Trump's fe-fes.

[Unagi]

Regarding Pence and not wearing a mask, he said it was because he wanted to look them "in the eye".

That's how bad things are in the administration. No one wants to tell the VP that's now how masks work. But seriously, we all know he's not wearing it because it would have hurt Trump's fe-fes.

Perhaps he thought he was being asked why he wasn't wearing gloves ?

Spoiler:

[noxiousdog]

That's a false dichotomy. You can allow workers to choose. I wouldn't support unemployment ineligibility. But I can support a measured reopening and testing.

Asked another way, when is it safe? How long can our infrastructure supply and food chains hold up without workers?

"The meat shortage" that Tyson tried to pull was clearly bullshit, but at some point it does become an issue. Auto parts, fertilizers, internet infrastructure. Etc.

There's no vaccine coming for a year or more.... So what does measured opening look like?

Also, Texas is not opening up. Restaurants are only allowed 25% capacity. Very few other things are open. The data will then be reviewed. I think they should wait a month before further opening, but we'll see.

So far, the dire predictions for Sweden haven't come true. They have about twice the cases and deaths of other Scandinavian countries, but they have twice the population, so it's not out of line.

[Daehawk]

Who cares why he wasn't wearing a mask...he can keel over for all I care. But why did they let him in there without one. Made everyone else wear one. Its a rule at the Mayo clinic. Bowing to a despot and his lackey doesn't make them look good.

[LawBeefaroni]

Who cares why he wasn't wearing a mask...he can keel over for all I care. But why did they let him in there without one. Made everyone else wear one. Its a rule at the Mayo clinic. Bowing to a despot and his lackey doesn't make them look good.

He probably took it off for the photo. He's a vain man.

[Kraken]

Who cares why he wasn't wearing a mask...he can keel over for all I care. But why did they let him in there without one. Made everyone else wear one. Its a rule at the Mayo clinic. Bowing to a despot and his lackey doesn't make them look good.

He probably took it off for the photo. He's a vain man.

More likely the Mayo Clinic needs to have the same place at the federal trough as other hospitals are getting, and offending Trump by making his lackey conform endangers that.

Or Trump just wants to replace Pence and doesn't have the stones to fire him.

Either way, Pence doesn't make his own decisions about anything.

[Max Peck]

"The meat shortage" that Tyson tried to pull was clearly bullshit

It's bullshit that worked.

Trump orders meatpacking plants to stay open

US President Donald Trump has ordered meat processing plants to stay open to protect the nation's food supply amid the coronavirus pandemic.

He invoked a Korean War-era law from the 1950s to mandate that the plants continue to function, amid industry warnings of strain on the supply chain.

An estimated 3,300 US meatpacking workers have been diagnosed with coronavirus and 20 have died.

A White House official told US media it will work with the Department of Labor to issue guidance for vulnerable workers, such as over-65s and those with chronic health conditions, to stay at home.

The UFCW said the White House order would provide legal cover to companies in case employees catch coronavirus at work.

"We're working with Tyson," Mr Trump told reporters in the Oval Office earlier on Tuesday. "We're going to sign an executive order today, I believe, and that will solve any liability problems."

Richard Trumka, the president of the AFL-CIO union, said: "Using executive power to force people back on the job without proper protections is wrong and dangerous."

[stessier]

I'm curious about that EO. He can order the plants open, but he can't force the people to work, right? They still have the option to not go in?

[LawBeefaroni]

Another expert weighs in:

Billionaire Tesla boss Elon Musk lashed out Wednesday at lockdowns meant to contain the coronavirus in a series of early-morning Twitter posts echoing calls from protesters around the US.

“FREE AMERICA NOW,” Musk tweeted at 2:15 a.m.

The 48-year-old tech tycoon crowed “Bravo Texas!” in an earlier post hailing the Lone Star State for moving to reopen restaurants and retail stores this week. His praise came a week after Texas Lt. Gov. Dan Patrick said the state should lift restrictions because “there are more important things than living.”

[malchior]

I'm curious about that EO. He can order the plants open, but he can't force the people to work, right? They still have the option to not go in?

Correct. The plant can fire them for not reporting in most cases. That is an option even in the people's republic of NJ. But they can't stop sick outs, drag people into work against their will, etc.

[Zaxxon]

I'm curious about that EO. He can order the plants open, but he can't force the people to work, right? They still have the option to not go in?

Correct. The plant can fire them for not reporting in most cases. That is an option even in the people's republic of NJ. But they can't stop sick outs, drag people into work against their will, etc.

And they then will not qualify for unemployment in many states.

“FREE AMERICA NOW,” Musk tweeted at 2:15 a.m.

You may be surprised to learn that Elon Musk can be a major dick.

[stessier]

I'm curious about that EO. He can order the plants open, but he can't force the people to work, right? They still have the option to not go in?

Correct. The plant can fire them for not reporting in most cases. That is an option even in the people's republic of NJ. But they can't stop sick outs, drag people into work against their will, etc.

And they then will not qualify for unemployment in many states.

True, but my understanding is these plants aren't in populous areas. I guess they might get some people, but given the publicity, I can't imagine forcing the issue is going to get the desired result.

[LordMortis]

You may be surprised to learn that Elon Musk can be a major dick.

And bullheadedly arrogant in his being wrong. Still, I'm sure he has a better sense for global health and it's partnership with global business than I do. At the same time I won't put my health in the hands of his ability to push his optimistic predictions and then move on when he's so wrong he could be president.

[Unagi]

So, with the $2.2 Trillion stimulus package....

There are about 250 million Americans over the age of 18.

The math tells me that each adult could have just been given approx. $9,000.

[pr0ner]

Giving money straight to people rather than corporate bailouts is pretty much what Justin Amash has been pushing for on Twitter for weeks.

[LawBeefaroni]

Giving money straight to people rather than corporate bailouts is pretty much what Justin Amash has been pushing for on Twitter for weeks.

The money would just end up in the hands of the 1% eventually anyway. This just streamlines the process.

[Smoove_B]

Blue states want aid? Well, then they're going to need to do something about those illegals:

https://twitter.com/atrupar/status/1255224509247954944

Trump says he wants blue states to give him "sanctuary-city adjustments" in exchange for federal financial relief

Not even hiding it anymore. Racist POS, being a racist POS.