[Health] The Infectious Diseases Thread

[em2nought]

In Florida, especially in the winter, the case could be made that the restaurant business is already hugely federally supported because most business is senior citizens spending social security money they've received that was well above the amount they paid into the system since they got in early on that ponzi scheme.

[Blackhawk]

So the governor of Indiana announced yesterday that we'd be easing things starting tomorrow. His plan, the restrictions, and the contingencies upon COVID-19 numbers are sound. Part of what happens - starting tomorrow - is that non-essential local travel is allowed, and social gatherings up to 25 people are acceptable with 6' separation at all times. People can visit parks and can boat, but playgrounds, pools, and campgrounds are all closed.

Michelle works at a state park. Here is how the public is interpreting that:

Every state park is absolutely slammed. They're having to do crowd control all over the place to get people separated. In one park they had to call in the Conservation Officers (park rangers) after over 100 people tried to crowd onto the suspension bridge at the same time. This bridge:

Spoiler:

And this is before the order even goes into effect. Humanity is too stupid to survive.

[Smoove_B]

And this is before the order even goes into effect. Humanity is too stupid to survive.

Yeah, NJ is opening up this weekend at State and County parks as well and I predict there's going to be problems. Has the park service considered drones? There are a few larger communities in NJ that are now using drones for crowd control via police departments. They have sirens or horns equipped and they're using them to hover over crowds that develop and reminding them to disperse. Seems like a smart way to use the tech and it keeps the officers out of harms way while being able to cover a much larger area.

[Unagi]

We are moving into a world where unmanned drones fly over head and announce “Disperse...” to a group of people.

Just kinda feels like something I don’t want to normalize.

[Smoove_B]

Yeah, it's weird but when the alternative is this:



I'm going to side with the safety of public officials first. Blue lives matter....until they don't.

[Unagi]

Yeah. I must say I agree.

But, I can’t imagine it sits well with a certain element, like the one pictured.

It won’t be long, if I’m not too late, before someone builds a drone that is designed to take-out government drones of this caliber. (Or other devices , even if it just the sport of slingshots or bottle throwing. )

[Smoove_B]

We're definitely living in interesting times. Between the use of drones to enforce public health rules, I'm watching as the use of technology to trace people starts to bubble up into the public consciousness. We've been tracking diseases with technology for decades (and in ways that people probably don't realize), but now that there's talk of using cellphones it will absolutely be something that causes outrage - I'm seeing it already. But the same people that complain about the government tracking everything you do go on Facebook or Instagram and post highly personal information unprompted. We're watching.

[Anonymous Bosch]

It won’t be long, if I’m not too late, before someone builds a drone that is designed to take-out government drones of this caliber. (Or other devices , even if it just the sport of slingshots or bottle throwing. )

Standard laser pointers are more than sufficient to take down most drones:

How Chilean Protesters Took Down a Drone With Standard Laser Pointers

Video of Chilean protesters using beams of green light to ground a police drone made the rounds on social media Wednesday. But those aren’t tractor beams or Green Lantern rings—the protesters appear to be using run-of-the-mill laser pointers to take down law enforcement-grade technology. How does that work?

Chilean protesters took to the streets last month to speak out against a proposed increase in public transit fares, though the demonstrations have now turned into a countrywide expression of anger over low wages and inequality.

Video posted to Reddit late Tuesday appears to show training laser pointer pens on a police drone in an attempt to bring it to the ground. As more light beams make contact with the unmanned aerial system, or UAS, it falters, then almost escapes before a coordinated effort brings it slowly to Earth.

The laser pointers could have taken down the drone in the video in one of two ways, according to Christopher Williams, CEO of Citadel Defense Company, which is working with Customs and Border Protection to deploy anti-drone “bubbles” along the border.

If the drone was being flown manually by an operator watching through a first-person video, the bright lights might have blinded the camera, causing the operator to lose control. Alternatively, “low powered lasers have the ability to interfere with [infrared] landing sensors,” as well as the downward-facing cameras that detect obstacles below, “forcing a landing or uncontrolled drone behavior,” Williams said.

Commentators on Reddit offered a third possibility: that the combined heat from all those laser pointers was enough to melt internal wiring or cause the battery to give out.

[Blackhawk]

Yeah. I must say I agree.

But, I can’t imagine it sits well with a certain element, like the one pictured.

It won’t be long, if I’m not too late, before someone builds a drone that is designed to take-out government drones of this caliber. (Or other devices , even if it just the sport of slingshots or bottle throwing. )

That element already have those devices. In fact, they're probably carrying them in that picture.

[stessier]

SC is mostly opened at this point. The last few things closed should be opening Monday. Restaurants are still at 25% occupancy. My wife had to go to Sams today - she said it was packed and few were social distancing and only a couple masks were seen.

This will be intersting.

[Daehawk]

I think as a species humans are heading for a dead end.

[gameoverman]

We should make wristbands that people have to wear when they go in some public building. The band will give off a disgusting odor and make an unbearable screeching noise when it detects it is too close to another wristband. Between the odor and the noise no one will want to get too close to another person. The bands could be removed when you leave.

[LawBeefaroni]

Michelle works at a state park. Here is how the public is interpreting that:

Every state park is absolutely slammed. They're having to do crowd control all over the place to get people separated. In one park they had to call in the Conservation Officers (park rangers) after over 100 people tried to crowd onto the suspension bridge at the same time. This bridge:

Spoiler:

And this is before the order even goes into effect. Humanity is too stupid to survive.

https://twitter.com/lost808s/status/125 ... 59555?s=21

[Sudy]

We should make wristbands that people have to wear when they go in some public building. The band will give off a disgusting odor and make an unbearable screeching noise when it detects it is too close to another wristband. Between the odor and the noise no one will want to get too close to another person. The bands could be removed when you leave..

Just temporarily ban the sale of soap?

Between COVID, a back injury, and what may be depression relapse, I've left the apartment twice in the past three weeks (to go to the local deluxe pharmacy). While I'm tired of hearing people say it, as an introvert/depressive this really isn't an experience largely out of the norm for me. While I do very much miss seeing green things full of life, I don't understand this obsessive need so many have to go to the park/beach/have large get-togethers. In the past decade, I've gone far longer than six weeks without leaving my house for anything other than work and necessary shopping on many occasions. And no, I don't wear that as some kind of strange badge of honour. I feel extremely isolated much of the time. It is what it is. Yet on a material level I still have so much more than some. I just wish I could effectively trade some of that for mental health and happiness.

[Blackhawk]

A nurse friend just told me that if you're tired of people not giving you six feet when you shop, just put on a set of scrubs. They'll all give you ten feet! You'll have aisles to yourself. She even said that one person fell into a clothes rack trying to get out of her way.

[gameoverman]

We should make wristbands that people have to wear when they go in some public building. The band will give off a disgusting odor and make an unbearable screeching noise when it detects it is too close to another wristband. Between the odor and the noise no one will want to get too close to another person. The bands could be removed when you leave..

Just temporarily ban the sale of soap?

Between COVID, a back injury, and what may be depression relapse, I've left the apartment twice in the past three weeks (to go to the local deluxe pharmacy). While I'm tired of hearing people say it, as an introvert/depressive this really isn't an experience largely out of the norm for me. While I do very much miss seeing green things full of life, I don't understand this obsessive need so many have to go to the park/beach/have large get-togethers. In the past decade, I've gone far longer than six weeks without leaving my house for anything other than work and necessary shopping on many occasions. And no, I don't wear that as some kind of strange badge of honour. I feel extremely isolated much of the time. It is what it is. Yet on a material level I still have so much more than some. I just wish I could effectively trade some of that for mental health and happiness.

For me it's not so much about get togethers as it is about business and choice. I'd like to choose what I'm going to do today, I'd like to have choices. If everything is locked down, technically I can still choose but it's from a limited set of options. For many of these choices to be viable, public places need to be open including various types of businesses. You know how it is, no one ever mentions going to the beach. Then one day it's announced that the beaches are closed and suddenly all these people are saying "But I wanted to go to the beach!". Human psychology.

[Daehawk]

Im tired of hearing Covid and contact tracing.

[em2nought]

A nurse friend just told me that if you're tired of people not giving you six feet when you shop, just put on a set of scrubs. They'll all give you ten feet! You'll have aisles to yourself. She even said that one person fell into a clothes rack trying to get out of her way.

I bet it works even better if you put some fake blood and guts on the scrubs. I wish I'd bought that set I was planning to use for a Halloween costume now.

Nobody wearing masks in Florida at gas stations except me today.

[Skinypupy]

Im tired of hearing Covid and contact tracing.

I'm with you.

Sadly, there's a large segment of the population who thinks that ignoring all virus-related info because they're personally tired of hearing about it will somehow make it all just go away, rather than getting exponentially worse.

Sounds like a solid plan.

[Zaxxon]

Im tired of hearing Covid and contact tracing.

[gameoverman]

Im tired of hearing Covid and contact tracing.

There was a time after 9/11 where it seemed like every tv show or movie that had firefighters in it referenced those attacks. It got old for me real quick. So I can relate to the feeling of getting tired of constantly hearing about the thing everyone else is obsessed with. Give it 15 or 20 years and it'll go away.

[Sudy]

Personally it's "flatten the curve" that drives me up the wall. I get it; that's the term. It succinctly explains the goal of what we're doing. But all the officials and PSAs spout it constantly. The hashtag is everywhere. It reminds me of some of the more conservative churches I attended when I was growing up... I find certain Christian terminologies and platitudes to be so antiquated or grating. To the community, internally, they're meaningful and comforting. But it drives the outsiders away. If I weren't a Christian, singing "washed in the blood of the lamb" would scare and confuse the hell out of me.

And then there's the being talked down to... "Visiting your aunt for tea is NOT social distancing!" "Playing ultimate frisbee with strangers at the park is NOT social distancing!" "Romancing swarthy vagrants wholesaling belt sanders out of an IKEA shopping cart behind the Taco Bell is NOT social distancing!"

[Zaxxon]

My favorite that's currently making the rounds is 'flattening the curve does not reduce the area under the curve.'

Which is... true, as far as it goes, but obtusely misleading.

[Sudy]

Article on a local news site reads, "Provinces set to ease restrictions Monday as death toll increases"....



Edit: OK... I realize, logically, the count is going to continue to "increase" even if the daily death toll decreases to 1%. But obviously the phrasing doesn't imply a sustained reduction.

[Zaxxon]

Article on a local news site reads, "Provinces set to ease restrictions Monday as death toll increases"....

Yeah, 24 states are opening up in some form. Zero have a sustained drop in cases meeting federal guidelines.

[Daehawk]

Some guy was fussing saying the government didn't have the right to tell him what to do. People like that I hope they all go out and buy a farm. Its the children and other people they take with them I hate to see. If you could just gather the stupid together and hit delete it would be nice.

Heck I even worry for my pets. They can get it and with me going out Im probably the only one they would get it from. I try to be careful but theres only so much I can do when others are out without masks, not going one way in the aisles like intelligent folk, and not distancing themselves. I even sanitize my shoe soles.

[LawBeefaroni]

Article on a local news site reads, "Provinces set to ease restrictions Monday as death toll increases"....

Yeah, 24 states are opening up in some form. Zero have a sustained drop in cases meeting federal guidelines.

They are making the assumption,.or the gamble, that since deaths are generally a training indicator of infections, that we will see a decrease in deaths. On the assumption/gamble that infections are down.

[YellowKing]

There is still some debate on whether states like NC which are opening based on data are still doing so prematurely. But let's just say for the sake of argument that the trend breaks our way and moving into a Phase 1 is justified.

I have ZERO faith that people, when they hear "easing of restrictions," are going to still follow phase 1 guidelines. Social distancing, masks, etc.

After the governor announced moving into phase 1 last week, I've seen a noticeable uptick in people just doing whatever the hell they want. I drove by the park yesterday and there was a group of 20-30 people sitting together on the grass within 2-3 feet of each other. The stores were freaking PACKED and almost nobody had masks on.

This is a dimmer switch, not a light switch, and people can't seem to grasp that.

[Kraken]

I'm seeing an emerging consensus that these early openings will keep new infections simmering over the summer, setting the stage for a major outbreak in the fall. Because it will coincide with flu season, that might dwarf the original outbreak. We still just don't know enough about the virus to say what it's going to do months from now.

For my part, I'm not happy about the clampdown, but I'm willing to stick with it until the infection rate's on a clear downslope.

[dbt1949]

With social distancing going I guess I'll go back to being a recluse.

[gameoverman]

I realize there are a lot of ways this can go, but looking at January-May so far I don't see any point where it went the optimum way for humanity. It spread around the world. It's killed thousands of people. It forced us to shut down human contact as well as the world economy. We can't even have frickin' sports!

So...it's difficult for me to believe the summer heat will help knock it down enough that we can't start a slow return to normal and by the time next flu/cold season rolls around this virus is a mild annoyance at most. That would mean everything went humanity's way from now on, I don't know about you but I don't think we're gonna roll sevens from here on out.

[Kraken]

Humanity's mileage has varied. A few countries handled it well. Ours is writing a new textbook on "Don't do this." Others (in Africa, S America, Middle East) have barely begun to grapple and/or aren't saying. I hope those places that did it right or are still fighting the good fight (mostly in Asia and Europe) can become oases of stability, because much of the world still has a wild ride ahead.

[Paingod]

Up here in Maine we're on "Stage 1" of re-opening, where less essential but still important businesses are cracking open doors. That includes the eye care clinics I work for. They're working to keep the number of patients per hour lower, but extending hours to try and regain profitability as quickly as possible.

NPR was running a story this morning about researchers monitoring anonymised cell phone data - specifically location data - to see that people pretty much lost their goddamn minds on May 1st and everywhere the social distancing measures are breaking down. Even in "locked down" states, people were going out more. I can easily attest that over the last two weeks up here, cars were returning to the road in force despite still being locked down.

Thankfully, we're still under 1200 confirmed cases and 60 deaths, with over 700 known recovered.

The tourist industry that the state relies on for survival has pretty much been killed by the governor, though, when she said anyone entering the state from anywhere else for the next couple months (at least) needed to go through a 14 day quarantine before venturing out. No one comes here for the quarantine view. They typically come for a 3 to 9 day vacation.

[Ralph-Wiggum]

I'm going into the office/lab on Wednesday for the first time since March 17 (and only second time ever since I just started a new job). We've spent much of the last two weeks developing protocols for people working at the office. In general, the building can never be at more than 25% capacity, people are confined to working in their office and or lab that no one else is allowed to enter, everything needs to be wiped down whenever entering or leaving a room, and people are strongly encouraged to wear masks when not in their office. So it seems like we're all taking decent precautions, although of course there aren't any precautions that are better than working from home. Fortunately, I'm expected/planning to be at the office fair infrequently; basically, any time I'm just working on my computer I am allowed to work from home.

[AWS260]

This is excellent: All your questions about the pandemic, answered. Sort of.

A: You went to the beach? The park? What were you thinking? There are hundreds of people there! Go home. Be with your kids. Do you have kids?

P: Yes.

A: Well, make sure they keep up with school. Keep up with their worksheets and Zoom, and check their work, and keep them off screens, and go outside, and don’t worry about school. It’s a pandemic, after all.

P: Um. Many of the things you just said sound contradictory.

A: Not at all. I’ll rephrase: Your kids are living through a crisis. It’s all right if they feel anxious, or if you can’t maintain routines or keep up with regular school schedules. Just make sure they don’t fall behind, and remember that kids thrive on routine. So stick to a schedule, but give them space, and stay inside, and go outside, and use technology to connect with teachers and friends, and limit screen time.

P: Wait. So …

[Kraken]

Even in "locked down" states, people were going out more. I can easily attest that over the last two weeks up here, cars were returning to the road in force despite still being locked down.

I've noticed traffic picking up some in MA, too, even though we're still notching up to 2,000 new cases and 150 deaths per day. April's weather was basically March, and people are champing at the bit now to enjoy some real spring sunshine. But I think seeing other states ease up is making us incautious here, too, as everyone's getting a bit stir crazy.

I'm planning to make another 2-week grocery run on Wednesday, and I need to seek out plants for my garden this week, too.

[hitbyambulance]

even here in 'stay-at-home-Seattle' the increased road traffic has been noted. time to up the death count...

[stessier]

From 538 - why scientists don't think COVID was man-made.

[em2nought]

That's not to say it wasn't being held/studied in a lab, just that they didn't make/alter it themselves before they (accidentally?) let it get out.

[gbasden]

Yes, their cunning master plan was to release a virus to infect the city that they and their families live in.

Brilliant!