Corona Virus: It's a Marathon, Not a Sprint

[Jeff V]

I've not dined in a restaurant since the day before lock-down mid-March. There's been no reason since then to convince me otherwise.

[malchior]

The "hottest" table in my town is walking distance from my house. Everyone is talking about how good it is on FB and the parking lot is full. I can basically see it across the lake from me. And that's about as close to it as I'm willing to get.

[Smoove_B]

My in-laws are teachers deep in MAGA, PA and they're under the impression that they'll be required to provide in-person instruction 5 days a week starting in a few weeks. There's no way to maintain 6+ feet of social distancing based on classroom size so they're lowering it to ~4ft. I guess they're just waiting to hear back from the virus to see if that's acceptable.

[Anonymous Bosch]

My in-laws are teachers deep in MAGA, PA and they're under the impression that they'll be required to provide in-person instruction 5 days a week starting in a few weeks. There's no way to maintain 6+ feet of social distancing based on classroom size so they're lowering it to ~4ft. I guess they're just waiting to hear back from the virus to see if that's acceptable.

No known case of teacher catching coronavirus from pupils, says scientist

There has been no recorded case of a teacher catching the coronavirus from a pupil anywhere in the world, according to one of the government’s leading scientific advisers.

Mark Woolhouse, a leading epidemiologist and member of the government’s Sage committee, told The Times that it may have been a mistake to close schools in March given the limited role children play in spreading the virus.

Schools in England are preparing to reopen in full from September. Some primary year groups were invited back for lessons before the summer holidays but most pupils have had no face-to-face teaching for four months.

“One thing we have learnt is that children are certainly, in the 5 to 15 brackets from school to early years, minimally involved in the epidemiology of this virus,” Professor Woolhouse, an infectious disease epidemiologist at Edinburgh University, said. “They are probably less susceptible and vanishingly unlikely to end up in hospital or to die from it.

“There is increasing evidence that they rarely transmit. For example, it is extremely difficult to find any instance anywhere in the world as a single example of a child transmitting to a teacher in school. There may have been one in Australia but it is incredibly rare.

“There are certain environments where this virus transmits very well and children are not present in these environments.”

[YellowKing]

I'd also expect if schools are so dangerous, that we'd be hearing of daycare outbreaks all over the country. The daycares have never closed here, and I'm sure daycare teachers who have been working every day since the pandemic started are rolling their eyes at the teacher complaints about going back to the classroom.

This is why I've been a bit defensive with family about my decision to send the kids back to school. They're in daycare now and have been for weeks - the fact is that they're going to he MORE safe at school because masks and social distancing will be required.

And even though it's not fair to extrapolate my personal experience to teachers as a whole, we had a bad experience in March where "remote learning" was the teacher dumping a week's worth of homework on the kids, setting up a once a week Zoom call, then going to the beach and posting pictures sipping margaritas. So I feel a twinge of "boo hoo cry me a fucking river" when I hear a teacher complain about having to actually do their job. Again, I know that's not fair and doesn't apply to all teachers, or even a majority of them. But again, was just a bad experience that really rubbed me the wrong way. On top of that, my wife works administratively in the front office of the school, and has been on site almost the entire pandemic meeting with multiple parents and staff every single day. So she has ZERO sympathy for them.

[Smoove_B]

No known case of teacher catching coronavirus from pupils, says scientist

I mean, I guess technically correct is still the best kind of correct, even in a pandemic. I have no doubts we're going to find out so much more, here in America.

And even though it's not fair to extrapolate my personal experience to teachers as a whole, we had a bad experience in March where "remote learning" was the teacher dumping a week's worth of homework on the kids, setting up a once a week Zoom call, then going to the beach and posting pictures sipping margaritas.

Yeah, that's unacceptable. My SIL has lupus (no, really, it's lupus) so I'm a bit concerned she's going to be indoors all day and in close contact with adults and kids; it's less than ideal.

As was pointed out to me earlier today, everyone screaming about how important socialization is for kids didn't really have much to say about Sandy Hook or how kids need to sit through active shooter drills as part of their "socialization" now in schools.

I've said it before - I don't think indoor dining, bars or other indoor activities should be permitted at this time; it's inviting trouble. I think 6/7/8 and HS should likely be remote and we should likely be prioritizing K-5 kids being in school, but only if a community's transmission rate is low.

There's no easy answer here.

[Zaxxon]

As was pointed out to me earlier today, everyone screaming about how important socialization is for kids didn't really have much to say about Sandy Hook or how kids need to sit through active shooter drills as part of their "socialization" now in schools.

Oh, I assure you I have a lot to say about that, too...

[gilraen]

I'd also expect if schools are so dangerous, that we'd be hearing of daycare outbreaks all over the country. The daycares have never closed here, and I'm sure daycare teachers who have been working every day since the pandemic started are rolling their eyes at the teacher complaints about going back to the classroom.

The major difference here is the age of the kids and the number of children in the room. The younger the child, the quicker the immune system response. They are almost guaranteed to have a fever or any other symptoms really quickly, where either parents keep them home or the daycare turns them away at the door.

Also, daycares allow a lot fewer kids in a room than a public school would have in a classroom.

[RunningMn9]

YK, I would also consider that for the most part, most areas of the country ain’t seen nothing yet. You guys have had kids in day care, but that was while the virus wasn’t really circulating in your state. When the country shut down in March, there weren’t 70000 new cases per day.

Kids not transmitting the virus in April, when they were either at home, or in parts of the country with low levels of the virus is not the same thing necessarily as when they are sent back into incubators with 70k to 80k new daily cases or worse.

[YellowKing]

YK, I would also consider that for the most part, most areas of the country ain’t seen nothing yet. You guys have had kids in day care, but that was while the virus wasn’t really circulating in your state. When the country shut down in March, there weren’t 70000 new cases per day.

And to be fair, I'm only looking at this through the prism of NC, where masks, social distancing, drastically reduced class sizes, etc. are going to be enforced. It's certainly not that way in all states, and there is no way in hell I would condone sending kids back to full classrooms and no precautions as the White House is seemingly suggesting.

[Kasey Chang]

In California, Newsom is hoping to re-open the hair salons... If they can find an outdoor location and everybody had to stay masked. That does me no good as there are no "outdoor locations" in Chinatown available.

[Combustible Lemur]

YK, I would also consider that for the most part, most areas of the country ain’t seen nothing yet. You guys have had kids in day care, but that was while the virus wasn’t really circulating in your state. When the country shut down in March, there weren’t 70000 new cases per day.

And to be fair, I'm only looking at this through the prism of NC, where masks, social distancing, drastically reduced class sizes, etc. are going to be enforced. It's certainly not that way in all states, and there is no way in hell I would condone sending kids back to full classrooms and no precautions as the White House is seemingly suggesting.

For me as a teacher,

I want to do as much as I can to make the situation better. I'm preparing my course load to be all three online, in person, or some hybrid. I will be teaching some combination thereof I just applied to teach extra online classes because 20 - 30 percent of parents have already said they aren't comfortable with in person.

However;
EVERY major city in Texas just ordered morgue trucks because we're full up.
Band and football are already in practice and there are reports that they're ignoring social distancing.
I have two 70+ year olds inside my house, not to mention Keri working full time, so we may need to rent an apartment so keep her parents safe. Instead of some modified version of school it's all day everyday including meals.
Yes there are cleanings and social distancing but class changes as of now are still 2000 kids passing through the same hall in a short period of time. Then sitting in closed rooms for an hour then remixing 7 times a day.
I don't trust republican governors AT All to not lie and put my familys life at risk if they think it will make them look good.
It's a cluster right now with a lot of people trying hard but not asking the right questions or understanding how biology or causality works.

A colleague is going ahead with in person rehearsals and productions because her kids responded they'd be willing to. Kids want to please and help.
I almost guarantee you she did not ask them if they were willing to take on the responsibility of potential killing a member their best friends family.



Sent from my SM-N975U using Tapatalk

[GungHo]

I'd also expect if schools are so dangerous, that we'd be hearing of daycare outbreaks all over the country. The daycares have never closed here, and I'm sure daycare teachers who have been working every day since the pandemic started are rolling their eyes at the teacher complaints about going back to the classroom.

This is why I've been a bit defensive with family about my decision to send the kids back to school. They're in daycare now and have been for weeks - the fact is that they're going to he MORE safe at school because masks and social distancing will be required.

And even though it's not fair to extrapolate my personal experience to teachers as a whole, we had a bad experience in March where "remote learning" was the teacher dumping a week's worth of homework on the kids, setting up a once a week Zoom call, then going to the beach and posting pictures sipping margaritas. So I feel a twinge of "boo hoo cry me a fucking river" when I hear a teacher complain about having to actually do their job. Again, I know that's not fair and doesn't apply to all teachers, or even a majority of them. But again, was just a bad experience that really rubbed me the wrong way. On top of that, my wife works administratively in the front office of the school, and has been on site almost the entire pandemic meeting with multiple parents and staff every single day. So she has ZERO sympathy for them.

Totally anecdotal but my youngest's daycare shut down the second week he was back. They closed everything down in March and we put him back in the last week of May. We paid thru August but we've kept him home anyway.

I think the take home message is nobody knows for sure.


Edit : I saw a study that was done in South Korea that showed kids ages 10+ were as effective a spreading vector as adults while kids under that age were not. Google it and I'm sure you'll see the study. Interesting results whatever your personal decisions ultimately are.

[Max Peck]

Edit : I saw a study that was done in South Korea that showed kids ages 10+ were as effective a spreading vector as adults while kids under that age were not. Google it and I'm sure you'll see the study. Interesting results whatever your personal decisions ultimately are.

Older Children Spread the Coronavirus Just as Much as Adults, Large Study Finds

In the heated debate over reopening schools, one burning question has been whether and how efficiently children can spread the virus to others.

A large new study from South Korea offers an answer: Children younger than 10 transmit to others much less often than adults do, but the risk is not zero. And those between the ages of 10 and 19 can spread the virus at least as well as adults do.

The findings suggest that as schools reopen, communities will see clusters of infection take root that include children of all ages, several experts cautioned.

“I fear that there has been this sense that kids just won’t get infected or don’t get infected in the same way as adults and that, therefore, they’re almost like a bubbled population,” said Michael Osterholm, an infectious diseases expert at the University of Minnesota.

“There will be transmission,” Dr. Osterholm said. “What we have to do is accept that now and include that in our plans.”

[El Guapo]

I'd also expect if schools are so dangerous, that we'd be hearing of daycare outbreaks all over the country. The daycares have never closed here, and I'm sure daycare teachers who have been working every day since the pandemic started are rolling their eyes at the teacher complaints about going back to the classroom.

This is why I've been a bit defensive with family about my decision to send the kids back to school. They're in daycare now and have been for weeks - the fact is that they're going to he MORE safe at school because masks and social distancing will be required.

And even though it's not fair to extrapolate my personal experience to teachers as a whole, we had a bad experience in March where "remote learning" was the teacher dumping a week's worth of homework on the kids, setting up a once a week Zoom call, then going to the beach and posting pictures sipping margaritas. So I feel a twinge of "boo hoo cry me a fucking river" when I hear a teacher complain about having to actually do their job. Again, I know that's not fair and doesn't apply to all teachers, or even a majority of them. But again, was just a bad experience that really rubbed me the wrong way. On top of that, my wife works administratively in the front office of the school, and has been on site almost the entire pandemic meeting with multiple parents and staff every single day. So she has ZERO sympathy for them.

Totally anecdotal but my youngest's daycare shut down the second week he was back. They closed everything down in March and we put him back in the last week of May. We paid thru August but we've kept him home anyway.

I think the take home message is nobody knows for sure.


Edit : I saw a study that was done in South Korea that showed kids ages 10+ were as effective a spreading vector as adults while kids under that age were not. Google it and I'm sure you'll see the study. Interesting results whatever your personal decisions ultimately are.

FWIW I was texting with a friend of mine who lives in the DC area. He said that his daycare opened up again, but they declined to send their daughter back. Apparently it just shut down again after a couple weeks due to a coronavirus case.

[El Guapo]

The major testing companies in MA according to the Boston Globe are facing backlogs due to the sheer number of out of state tests being sent to them.

Fuck you, maskless red state leeches.

There's some talk amongst my in-laws about all getting testing and then renting a house in Stowe or the like to hang out for a week or so. Trying to figure out if that's feasible - if the delays are long / unpredictable seems unlikely to work, since we'd have to keep the kids indoors 24/7 (instead of letting them run around inthe garden and parks nearby) for it to mean much.

[gbasden]

We were trying to plan a short getaway within the state of MA since are neighboring states consider us a pariah state but after reading in the Boston Globe that there's up to a 1 week turnaround for test results in MA we decided that a staycation with some nice day trips is the way to go.

Such an epic fail all around in this country.

Yeah, I'd like to get away somewhere, but we're not going anywhere even for a day trip right now. How can we be so completely fail as a country?

[em2nought]

It's a strange world. Democrats are suddenly worried about the old "racist" people who they can't stand going to Thanksgiving Dinner with, and on the other hand Republicans are in a rush to get students back into the classrooms with their raging "leftist" teachers. Maybe it's just a ploy to expose those Marxists to the virus and knock a few off. I wonder if it crossed Cuomo's mind that he might be reducing the Republican voter rolls by sending covid-19 into the nursing homes?

[Paingod]

I'd also expect if schools are so dangerous, that we'd be hearing of daycare outbreaks all over the country. The daycares have never closed here, and I'm sure daycare teachers who have been working every day since the pandemic started are rolling their eyes at the teacher complaints about going back to the classroom.

I'd disagree.

While we got a couple of random illnesses when our kids went to daycare, we were hit with a staggering surge in sickness when they went to public schools - especially in the first few grade levels. It was a night and day switch. I think daycares having such small (physically and numerically), static populations contributes to their relative safety. In a public school you've got the potential for hundreds or even thousands of children from multiple walks of life overlapping in the same spaces, hallways, desks, and tables.

No, I wouldn't want to be a teacher when schools open this fall.

[malchior]

I'd also expect if schools are so dangerous, that we'd be hearing of daycare outbreaks all over the country. The daycares have never closed here, and I'm sure daycare teachers who have been working every day since the pandemic started are rolling their eyes at the teacher complaints about going back to the classroom.

The other thing to consider that it did already happen but it flew under the radar. Young kids react differently and day care workers average age is under 40. Also, in many states the lock downs shut down day care for a month or more when it was raging initially.

[Formix]

Edit : I saw a study that was done in South Korea that showed kids ages 10+ were as effective a spreading vector as adults while kids under that age were not. Google it and I'm sure you'll see the study. Interesting results whatever your personal decisions ultimately are.

Older Children Spread the Coronavirus Just as Much as Adults, Large Study Finds

In the heated debate over reopening schools, one burning question has been whether and how efficiently children can spread the virus to others.

A large new study from South Korea offers an answer: Children younger than 10 transmit to others much less often than adults do, but the risk is not zero. And those between the ages of 10 and 19 can spread the virus at least as well as adults do.

The findings suggest that as schools reopen, communities will see clusters of infection take root that include children of all ages, several experts cautioned.

“I fear that there has been this sense that kids just won’t get infected or don’t get infected in the same way as adults and that, therefore, they’re almost like a bubbled population,” said Michael Osterholm, an infectious diseases expert at the University of Minnesota.

“There will be transmission,” Dr. Osterholm said. “What we have to do is accept that now and include that in our plans.”

I posted that article to our local school district's FB page, and it actually came up during the school boards discussion when they were deciding if they were reopening or not. Discouragingly though, the medical expert they had discounted it as being too limited in scope.....65,000 seems like pretty big to me considering we're only months into this thing. Also, surprisingly the Board decided to go Option C (all virtual here in NC) until October when they would revisit. This surprised me since the poll they ran the month prior showed overwhelming support for in-person, and overwhelming non-support for virtual. So apparently you can be surrounded by Trumpalos and your school board still makes reasoned decisions. They said their main reason was the the hybrid model had way too many variables that they just couldn't confidently predict and still be keeping the kids and staff safe. Color me pleasantly surprised. I'd be doubly surprised if NC looks any better in late September than it does now considering how murky things are going to be once flu season starts.

[YellowKing]

Thanks for the feedback, everyone.

I'll have to say the decision making has been tough (as I'm sure it is for all parents). My wife hung up on my mom last night after my mom questioned her decision to let the kids go back. So it's getting tense up in here.

My daughter's principal called the other night and left a lengthy voice mail urging parents to respect each others' decisions regarding whether or not to send their kids back, and I was really grateful for that. Everybody has their own circumstances that are going to drive their decision-making, and everyone is going to have a different level of risk-tolerance.

No matter what you decide, you've got half the population questioning your parental skills, and it's a terrible position to be in.

[Zaxxon]

No matter what you decide, you've got half the population questioning your parental skills, and it's a terrible position to be in.

I saw a meme that I am failing to re-find now, but it hit home. Something like

How to react to a parent's choice regarding the upcoming school year:

In-person learning: "That must have been a very difficult choice. I support your decision and am here for you if you need anything."
Remote learning: "That must have been a very difficult choice. I support your decision and am here for you if you need anything."
Homeschooling: "That must have been a very difficult choice. I support your decision and am here for you if you need anything."

[malchior]

No matter what you decide, you've got half the population questioning your parental skills, and it's a terrible position to be in.

I saw a meme that I am failing to re-find now, but it hit home. Something like

How to react to a parent's choice regarding the upcoming school year:

In-person learning: "That must have been a very difficult choice. I support your decision and am here for you if you need anything."
Remote learning: "That must have been a very difficult choice. I support your decision and am here for you if you need anything."
Homeschooling: "That must have been a very difficult choice. I support your decision and am here for you if you need anything."

I'd add, "If you want to be mad at anyone about this, direct your anger at the leaders who failed our children in the first place."

[Octavious]

Ya the whole this is rough as it puts parents into making choices they never thought they would have to make. Right now it looks like they will be doing a hybrid plan, but I'm not exactly sure what they are doing for busing. There's 100% no way she can go if there isn't busing back and forth and that was one of the things they were asking about in the survey.

It just sucks that it's her freshman year where it's a whole new school and a lot more responsibility. So far everything has been super easy for her and I fear that having a hybrid plan + a boatload of honors classes will be really hard to manage. I fucking hate everyone that still supports this ahole. If we had anyone else in charge we would be much more organized and it likely would have never have gotten anywhere nearly as bad.

[Malificent]

My daughter was a junior counselor at a summer camp this summer. They only had kids 9+. They wore masks, they did social distancing, enhanced cleaning procedures, etc. It went fine for about a month and a half. Then one of the other counselors got covid from somewhere (they didn't know where) and the camp shut down, everyone had to get tested, etc.

This is why I'm not real confident in opening schools back up. What happens when a teacher gets covid? Or someone handling lunches? Or a janitor? Do you shut down and quarantine just the teacher's class? The whole school? A week? Two weeks?

Duke has returned to school and they have an app (that looks like it was developed for the health side and is being adapted) that requires you to enter symptoms and if any symptom matches, then you have to wait for a call from someone to get more context before you're allowed to go into the office. Which is great. But my boss, for example, is nearly 50 and went on a hiking trip over the weekend. They reported muscle aches and the app told them not to come into the office. Older people naturally experience symptoms that could be covid. Do you have more substitute teachers available for all these delay and outages? Do all students fill out the app? Parents fill out for their kids? It feels like this is the level necessary to keep things safe, but is it sustainable? I don't know. I'm just glad I'm not in charge of logistics.

[Paingod]

How to react to a parent's choice regarding the upcoming school year:

In-person learning: "That must have been a very difficult choice. I support your decision and am here for you if you need anything."
Remote learning: "That must have been a very difficult choice. I support your decision and am here for you if you need anything."
Homeschooling: "That must have been a very difficult choice. I support your decision and am here for you if you need anything."

I agree with this. I don't fault people who make the choice to send their kids back when schools open simply because I'm willing to bet that was the best solution for their family in an array of unpleasant choices.

My wife has already signed our kids up for an accredited homeschooling course for at least the next school year. The structure fits with her ability to juggle two kids with online classes, and doesn't rely on the public school teachers and school district providing us with whatever mish-mash of resources and scheduling they can offer.

While she would love to send them back to get socialization and give her some sanity during the day, we're concerned with the great Petri dish experiment of 2020 that's about to take place. We can afford (both time and money) to keep them out of school, so we will.

[Isgrimnur]

Fort Worth

Tarrant County’s top health authorities announced Tuesday that local public and non-religious private schools will only be able to provide online classes for the first six weeks of the 2020-21 school year — until at least Sept. 28 — because of the rising cases of coronavirus.

The announcement affects Fort Worth, Arlington and all local school districts.

The goal is to keep students at home until several weeks after the Sept. 7 Labor Day holiday to avoid a potential spike in cases that could quickly spread through schools. There have been 22,665 positive cases of COVID-19, which includes 304 deaths, in Tarrant County as of Tuesday.

“This is a moment in time like nothing I’ve seen,” Catherine Colquitt, Tarrant County’s public health authority and medical director, said during the Tarrant County Commissioners meeting. “We all feel we have to do something.

“If we don’t make some effort to delay the openings, we might jeopardize our capacity to care for people.”
...
The order, which goes into effect immediately and runs through 11:59 p.m. on Sept. 27, says schools shouldn’t open for in-person schooling except for:

▪ Teachers and staff may conduct online classes from school if they use face coverings and social distance;

▪ School-sponsored events such as sports, band, choir and more may take place remotely or outdoors with social distancing, face coverings and other safety protocols in place;

▪ Special education may occur when necessary at schools with social distancing and face coverings; and

▪ Students who don’t have access to a computer or Internet access may learn at school.

This order does not affect private, religious schools.

[LawBeefaroni]

Sending the boy back to preschool was easy. It's a small school, teacher to student ratio is like 4:1, it's on a hospital campus with all the associated resources, and nearly all the students are children of healthcare professionals. They have a very organized pickup/dropoff.


Sending the older kid back to CPS in the fall? Much tougher decision.

[LawBeefaroni]

This order does not affect private, religious schools.

Huh?

[Isgrimnur]

Texas.

[Skinypupy]

We got all our info yesterday, and have to make our live/virtual decision by the 31st. The district has some good protocols in place for going back in person...none of which I can see surviving the first 10 minutes of the day with 800 elementary school kids.

We do have the option to go fully virtual, but once we make that decision, we're locked into it until January. I'm honestly worried about both my kid's and my wife's ability to manage virtual school. They all damn near killed each other in the spring, and that was only for a couple months. That said, the district hasseemingly done a good job overhauling the virtual learning process, so maybe it'll be better.

Mrs Skinypupy really (like really, really) wants them to go back in person. I'm leaning towards virtual, as I think the risk is simply too high.
Not for the kids necessarily, but for the teachers, for us, for the grandparents. I honestly have no idea what to do here.

Democrats are suddenly worried about the old "racist" people who they can't stand going to Thanksgiving Dinner with

Just because I think many members of my family are racist assholes doesn't mean I literally want them to die.

[Remus West]

My daughter was a junior counselor at a summer camp this summer. They only had kids 9+. They wore masks, they did social distancing, enhanced cleaning procedures, etc. It went fine for about a month and a half. Then one of the other counselors got covid from somewhere (they didn't know where) and the camp shut down, everyone had to get tested, etc.

This is why I'm not real confident in opening schools back up. What happens when a teacher gets covid? Or someone handling lunches? Or a janitor? Do you shut down and quarantine just the teacher's class? The whole school? A week? Two weeks?

Duke has returned to school and they have an app (that looks like it was developed for the health side and is being adapted) that requires you to enter symptoms and if any symptom matches, then you have to wait for a call from someone to get more context before you're allowed to go into the office. Which is great. But my boss, for example, is nearly 50 and went on a hiking trip over the weekend. They reported muscle aches and the app told them not to come into the office. Older people naturally experience symptoms that could be covid. Do you have more substitute teachers available for all these delay and outages? Do all students fill out the app? Parents fill out for their kids? It feels like this is the level necessary to keep things safe, but is it sustainable? I don't know. I'm just glad I'm not in charge of logistics.

I'd also like to know how they plan on figuring sick days. Am I spending a sick day when they tell me to stay home because of muscle cramp? If so, do I get a lot more of them this year to cover for that or should I plan on not only working in riskier conditions but getting my pay docked as well?

[Enough]

My daughter was a junior counselor at a summer camp this summer. They only had kids 9+. They wore masks, they did social distancing, enhanced cleaning procedures, etc. It went fine for about a month and a half. Then one of the other counselors got covid from somewhere (they didn't know where) and the camp shut down, everyone had to get tested, etc.

This is why I'm not real confident in opening schools back up. What happens when a teacher gets covid? Or someone handling lunches? Or a janitor? Do you shut down and quarantine just the teacher's class? The whole school? A week? Two weeks?

Duke has returned to school and they have an app (that looks like it was developed for the health side and is being adapted) that requires you to enter symptoms and if any symptom matches, then you have to wait for a call from someone to get more context before you're allowed to go into the office. Which is great. But my boss, for example, is nearly 50 and went on a hiking trip over the weekend. They reported muscle aches and the app told them not to come into the office. Older people naturally experience symptoms that could be covid. Do you have more substitute teachers available for all these delay and outages? Do all students fill out the app? Parents fill out for their kids? It feels like this is the level necessary to keep things safe, but is it sustainable? I don't know. I'm just glad I'm not in charge of logistics.

I'd also like to know how they plan on figuring sick days. Am I spending a sick day when they tell me to stay home because of muscle cramp? If so, do I get a lot more of them this year to cover for that or should I plan on not only working in riskier conditions but getting my pay docked as well?

That's happening to so many parents I know. With remote learning they don't have anything but leave to use to cover their time doing home-schooling activities and childcare so they are taking it on the chin. Then if they send the kids to school, they likely will whipsaw back and forth from open and closed at some schools likely being just as disruptive to family lives (and of course kids bring home stuff all the time). It's hard to see any right strategy for these parents, many of my friends are choosing in-person learning as they economically don't have another choice. This is o nee of those times as a childless couple we do not envy parents for one second.

[Zaxxon]

That's happening to so many parents I know. With remote learning they don't have anything but leave to use to cover their time doing home-schooling activities and childcare so they are taking it on the chin. Then if they send the kids to school, they likely will whipsaw back and forth from open and closed at some schools likely being just as disruptive to family lives (and of course kids bring home stuff all the time). It's hard to see any right strategy for these parents, many of my friends are choosing in-person learning as they economically don't have another choice. This is o nee of those times as a childless couple we do not envy parents for one second.

It also gets even more complicated because if (when) there's an incident at the school where your kid was potentially exposed and has to quarantine, then by definition you also have potentially been exposed and need to quarantine.

[RunningMn9]

Also, in many states the lock downs shut down day care for a month or more when it was raging initially.

Keep in mind that when it was “raging” initially, it was raging in only two states. Everyone else shut down because of what was happening in NY and NJ, but the virus was not circulating in their states anywhere near as much as it was here. So their data from March through June really doesn’t mean much to me.

If NY/NJ day care stayed open throughout and didn’t see any cases come out of that, that would be different. But we shut all of that down completely. As did countries with the raging outbreaks (Italy, etc.).

I genuinely have no idea what will happen if they cram schools full of kids - except that we already know what happens when we cram schools full of kids. They turn into disease factories, as every single parent that has ever sent their kids into a school knows.

Maybe in 2020, the grand irony is that THIS is the one highly contagious disease that schools don’t send home. That would certainly be an odd development.

[LordMortis]

Keep in mind that when it was “raging” initially, it was raging in only two states. Everyone else shut down because of what was happening in NY and NJ, but the virus was not circulating in their states anywhere near as much as it was here. So their data from March through June really doesn’t mean much to me.

Kinda sorta. Ohio shut down because the owner of Blue Jackets said "recommendation? Oh, then we choose not to take it." Michigan made a recommendation because Ohio did. We locked down because that weekend 10s of thousands 20somethings took the recommendation to mean go party in the streets of Detroit. Recommendations happened because of NY I think, but the lockdowns happened because of the reaction to the recommendations.

[El Guapo]

It just seems like for a decent-sized school, even if the school does everything right, at least one parent or kid in the school community is going to contract coronavirus. And that's not necessarily through the school. And when that happens, what does the school do? Essentially by definition that parent will have had contact with their kid, and that kid will have had contact through the school with a huge chunk of the school population. So does the school shut down at that point, at least temporarily? If so, opening at all seems temporary and mostly pointless. If not, then it seems like we're inevitably creating major disease vectors.

[Enough]

It just seems like for a decent-sized school, even if the school does everything right, at least one parent or kid in the school community is going to contract coronavirus. And that's not necessarily through the school. And when that happens, what does the school do? Essentially by definition that parent will have had contact with their kid, and that kid will have had contact through the school with a huge chunk of the school population. So does the school shut down at that point, at least temporarily? If so, opening at all seems temporary and mostly pointless. If not, then it seems like we're inevitably creating major disease vectors.

That is exactly the plan for our school district. Two infections in 14 days means a cluster and they shut er' down for a couple of weeks for deep cleaning and go back again in theory. It's nutso.

[El Guapo]

It just seems like for a decent-sized school, even if the school does everything right, at least one parent or kid in the school community is going to contract coronavirus. And that's not necessarily through the school. And when that happens, what does the school do? Essentially by definition that parent will have had contact with their kid, and that kid will have had contact through the school with a huge chunk of the school population. So does the school shut down at that point, at least temporarily? If so, opening at all seems temporary and mostly pointless. If not, then it seems like we're inevitably creating major disease vectors.

That is exactly the plan for our school district. Two infections in 14 days means a cluster and they shut er' down for a couple of weeks for deep cleaning and go back again in theory. It's nutso.

It's just hard for me to understand how this can work unless we either accept elevated risk of disease spread and death, OR basically put each kid and teacher in a cone of silence at school.