Trump vs. Biden - the Final Showdown

malchior · Post by **malchior** » Tue Oct 13, 2020 2:18 pm

Yeah seeing Olbermann is really out of touch. While I mostly agree with the sentiment he absolutely did deliver a 'bothsides' argument when his side is clearly 90+% at fault. I think it falls pretty flat for that reason.

El Guapo · Post by **El Guapo** » Tue Oct 13, 2020 2:20 pm

malchior wrote: Tue Oct 13, 2020 2:18 pm Yeah seeing Olbermann is really out of touch. While I mostly agree with the sentiment he absolutely did deliver a 'bothsides' argument when his side is clearly 90+% at fault. I think it falls pretty flat for that reason.

Yup.

Relative to the modern GO,P the statement was a masterclass in statesmanship. Relative to what Romney should be saying and doing, it's pathetic.

Defiant · Post by **Defiant** » Tue Oct 13, 2020 2:25 pm

Of what little I've seen of Olbermann (which is very little), he probably deserves to be on the list, but Hannity, Carlson and a slew of other commentators from the right definitely deserve to (and a few others on the left do, as well).

Defiant · Post by **Defiant** » Tue Oct 13, 2020 2:26 pm

El Guapo wrote: Tue Oct 13, 2020 2:15 pm https://twitter.com/jonathanchait/statu ... 4483552259

malchior · Post by **malchior** » Tue Oct 13, 2020 2:27 pm

Defiant wrote: Tue Oct 13, 2020 2:25 pmOf what little I've seen of Olbermann (which is very little), he probably deserves to be on the list

'Very little' is the point. Someone who got shitcanned from serious journalism and runs a Youtube channel now that he is done calling color commentary on balls and strikes amidst a pandemic is being compared to some of the highest rated people on tv newstainment. It's an extreme reach.

RunningMn9 · Post by **RunningMn9** » Tue Oct 13, 2020 2:32 pm

Mitt Romney is so distraught that he will continue to do the exact same things he was already doing.

Like, if you are upset, how about DOING SOMETHING. Putting out a statement that you’re upset isn’t doing something.

Defiant · Post by **Defiant** » Tue Oct 13, 2020 2:41 pm

malchior wrote: Tue Oct 13, 2020 2:27 pm
Defiant wrote: Tue Oct 13, 2020 2:25 pmOf what little I've seen of Olbermann (which is very little), he probably deserves to be on the list
'Very little' is the point. Someone who got shitcanned from serious journalism and runs a Youtube channel now that he is done calling color commentary on balls and strikes amidst a pandemic is being compared to some of the highest rated people on tv newstainment. It's an extreme reach.

Except for me, it has more to do with not really ever having watched much msnbc or fox (especially since cutting the cord years ago).

Smoove_B · Post by **Smoove_B** » Tue Oct 13, 2020 2:57 pm

RunningMn9 wrote: Tue Oct 13, 2020 2:32 pm Mitt Romney is so distraught that he will continue to do the exact same things he was already doing.

Exactly. Stop issuing statements and wringing your hands. F-ing do something. Anything.

Ralph-Wiggum · Post by **Ralph-Wiggum** » Tue Oct 13, 2020 3:11 pm

I have slightly more respect for Romney than the other GOP senators since he at least voted to convict Trump. But having to throw in a few libs in that statement so he could both-sides it was pretty weak.

Holman · Post by **Holman** » Tue Oct 13, 2020 3:57 pm

Ralph-Wiggum wrote: Tue Oct 13, 2020 3:11 pm I have slightly more respect for Romney than the other GOP senators since he at least voted to convict Trump.

On one count. He did the minimum possible right thing.

Ralph-Wiggum · Post by **Ralph-Wiggum** » Tue Oct 13, 2020 4:32 pm

Holman wrote: Tue Oct 13, 2020 3:57 pm
Ralph-Wiggum wrote: Tue Oct 13, 2020 3:11 pm I have slightly more respect for Romney than the other GOP senators since he at least voted to convict Trump.
On one count. He did the minimum possible right thing.

Which was more than any other GOP senator. It's all relative, right?

Alefroth · Post by **Alefroth** » Tue Oct 13, 2020 4:56 pm

Holman wrote: Tue Oct 13, 2020 3:57 pm
Ralph-Wiggum wrote: Tue Oct 13, 2020 3:11 pm I have slightly more respect for Romney than the other GOP senators since he at least voted to convict Trump.
On one count. He did the minimum possible right thing.

Knowing that he could freely do it without any real effect.

Holman · Post by **Holman** » Tue Oct 13, 2020 5:17 pm

Ralph-Wiggum wrote: Tue Oct 13, 2020 4:32 pm
Holman wrote: Tue Oct 13, 2020 3:57 pm
Ralph-Wiggum wrote: Tue Oct 13, 2020 3:11 pm I have slightly more respect for Romney than the other GOP senators since he at least voted to convict Trump.
On one count. He did the minimum possible right thing.
Which was more than any other GOP senator. It's all relative, right?

Only if virtue is bounded by the range of GOP behavior.

Zaxxon · Post by **Zaxxon** » Tue Oct 13, 2020 5:44 pm

Hopefully you are all tuning in for Trek the Vote in 16 minutes.

Grifman · Post by **Grifman** » Tue Oct 13, 2020 11:46 pm

After dipping as low as 83%, the Biden is now back up to 91% probability of an EC victory in The Economist forecast:

https://projects.economist.com/us-2020- ... /president

malchior · Post by **malchior** » Wed Oct 14, 2020 8:32 am

This could go in the 4th Estate thread but I just plopped some malpractice there that doesn't align 100% with this story.

As previously noted after Trump dropped out of the 2nd debate, Biden booked a town hall with ABC at that time slot. Now it has been announced that NBC is running a *COMPETING* townhall with Trump at the same time. How is that in the public interest?

https://twitter.com/NBCNews/status/1316335796102848515

stessier · Post by **stessier** » Wed Oct 14, 2020 8:36 am

malchior wrote: Wed Oct 14, 2020 8:32 am How is that in the public interest?

It let's those who want to hear Trump speak on the issues in a Town Hall setting the opportunity?

It's just counterprogramming. The Biden hall is exclusive to ABC, right? I don't see a problem with it.

malchior · Post by **malchior** » Wed Oct 14, 2020 8:37 am

stessier wrote: Wed Oct 14, 2020 8:36 am
malchior wrote: Wed Oct 14, 2020 8:32 am How is that in the public interest?
It let's those who want to hear Trump speak on the issues in a Town Hall setting the opportunity?

It's just counterprogramming. The Biden hall is exclusive to ABC, right? I don't see a problem with it.

The problem isn't that Trump gets a town hall. The question is why is is *competing* at the same time? They could have run it Friday or Saturday or Sunday or at a different time slot.

Defiant · Post by **Defiant** » Wed Oct 14, 2020 8:39 am

malchior wrote: Wed Oct 14, 2020 8:32 am
As previously noted after Trump dropped out of the 2nd debate, Biden booked a town hall with ABC at that time slot. Now it has been announced that NBC is running a *COMPETING* townhall with Trump at the same time. How is that in the public interest?

It allows Undecideds to play Choose Your Own Town Hall.
Undecideds leaning towards Biden will be able to watch Biden answer questions, and it will help convince them to vote for Biden.
Undecideds leaning towards Trump will be able to watch Trump avoid answering questions, and it will help convince them to vote for Biden.

malchior · Post by **malchior** » Wed Oct 14, 2020 8:41 am

Defiant wrote: Wed Oct 14, 2020 8:39 am
malchior wrote: Wed Oct 14, 2020 8:32 am
As previously noted after Trump dropped out of the 2nd debate, Biden booked a town hall with ABC at that time slot. Now it has been announced that NBC is running a *COMPETING* townhall with Trump at the same time. How is that in the public interest?
It allows Undecideds to play Choose Your Own Town Hall.
Undecideds leaning towards Biden will be able to watch Biden answer questions, and it will help convince them to vote for Biden.
Undecideds leaning towards Trump will be able to watch Trump avoid answering questions, and it will help convince them to vote for Biden.

LOL. Perhaps.

Holman · Post by **Holman** » Wed Oct 14, 2020 8:42 am

stessier wrote: Wed Oct 14, 2020 8:36 am
malchior wrote: Wed Oct 14, 2020 8:32 am How is that in the public interest?
It let's those who want to hear Trump speak on the issues in a Town Hall setting the opportunity?

It's just counterprogramming. The Biden hall is exclusive to ABC, right? I don't see a problem with it.

The public interest would be served by the town hall debate that Trump is ducking out of.

These aren't reciprocal events. Trump quit the original format because he was afraid to share a stage and prefers a rally.

Biden needs to invite Trump back to the original format. Make him decline again.

Defiant · Post by **Defiant** » Wed Oct 14, 2020 8:42 am

Of course, you could always create your own debate.

Tune into the Biden town hall, and every 10 seconds or so when Biden is speaking, flip to the Trump town hall and then back again.

stessier · Post by **stessier** » Wed Oct 14, 2020 8:49 am

Defiant wrote: Wed Oct 14, 2020 8:42 am Of course, you could always create your own debate.

Tune into the Biden town hall, and every 10 seconds or so when Biden is speaking, flip to the Trump town hall and then back again.

stessier · Post by **stessier** » Wed Oct 14, 2020 8:50 am

malchior wrote: Wed Oct 14, 2020 8:37 am
stessier wrote: Wed Oct 14, 2020 8:36 am
malchior wrote: Wed Oct 14, 2020 8:32 am How is that in the public interest?
It let's those who want to hear Trump speak on the issues in a Town Hall setting the opportunity?

It's just counterprogramming. The Biden hall is exclusive to ABC, right? I don't see a problem with it.
The problem isn't that Trump gets a town hall. The question is why is is *competing* at the same time? They could have run it Friday or Saturday or Sunday or at a different time slot.

Because networks are a business and they are in the business of getting ratings.

malchior · Post by **malchior** » Wed Oct 14, 2020 8:50 am

Holman wrote: Wed Oct 14, 2020 8:42 am
stessier wrote: Wed Oct 14, 2020 8:36 am
malchior wrote: Wed Oct 14, 2020 8:32 am How is that in the public interest?
It let's those who want to hear Trump speak on the issues in a Town Hall setting the opportunity?

It's just counterprogramming. The Biden hall is exclusive to ABC, right? I don't see a problem with it.
The public interest would be served by the town hall debate that Trump is ducking out of.

These aren't reciprocal events. Trump quit the original format because he was afraid to share a stage and prefers a rally.

Biden needs to invite Trump back to the original format. Make him decline again.

Too late I presume. This is sort of the distillation of it. There is no doubt in my mind that Trump shopped his own town hall around and demanded it be competing. Only NBC was cynical enough to accept it. The entire point is so that Trump can make some statement on Friday how his ratings were better. It's all 'moron politics' but why does everyone play into this chaos?

stessier wrote: Wed Oct 14, 2020 8:50 amBecause networks are a business and they are in the business of getting ratings.

Of that there is no doubt but I did ask how is it in the public interest.

Defiant · Post by **Defiant** » Wed Oct 14, 2020 8:53 am

stessier wrote: Wed Oct 14, 2020 8:50 am
malchior wrote: Wed Oct 14, 2020 8:37 am
stessier wrote: Wed Oct 14, 2020 8:36 am
malchior wrote: Wed Oct 14, 2020 8:32 am How is that in the public interest?
It let's those who want to hear Trump speak on the issues in a Town Hall setting the opportunity?

It's just counterprogramming. The Biden hall is exclusive to ABC, right? I don't see a problem with it.
The problem isn't that Trump gets a town hall. The question is why is is *competing* at the same time? They could have run it Friday or Saturday or Sunday or at a different time slot.
Because networks are a business and they are in the business of getting ratings.

Are they trying to get higher ratings, or prevent ABC from getting higher ratings?

Because if you want higher ratings, I would imagine holding it at a different (yet similar) time would get higher ratings, because some people would want to watch both.

LawBeefaroni · Post by **LawBeefaroni** » Wed Oct 14, 2020 8:56 am

Grifman wrote: Tue Oct 13, 2020 11:46 pm After dipping as low as 83%, the Biden is now back up to 91% probability of an EC victory in The Economist forecast:

https://projects.economist.com/us-2020- ... /president

Still in my bunker. If NASA identified a 100km asteroid with a 9% chance of hitting the Earth, we'd be building spaceships for Bruce Willis and Liv Tyler right now.

stessier · Post by **stessier** » Wed Oct 14, 2020 8:56 am

Defiant wrote: Wed Oct 14, 2020 8:53 am
stessier wrote: Wed Oct 14, 2020 8:50 am
malchior wrote: Wed Oct 14, 2020 8:37 am
stessier wrote: Wed Oct 14, 2020 8:36 am
malchior wrote: Wed Oct 14, 2020 8:32 am How is that in the public interest?
It let's those who want to hear Trump speak on the issues in a Town Hall setting the opportunity?

It's just counterprogramming. The Biden hall is exclusive to ABC, right? I don't see a problem with it.
The problem isn't that Trump gets a town hall. The question is why is is *competing* at the same time? They could have run it Friday or Saturday or Sunday or at a different time slot.
Because networks are a business and they are in the business of getting ratings.
Are they trying to get higher ratings, or prevent ABC from getting higher ratings?

Because if you want higher ratings, I would imagine holding it at a different (yet similar) time would get higher ratings, because some people would want to watch both.

They are out to win the time slot, right? So definitely to beat ABC.

LawBeefaroni · Post by **LawBeefaroni** » Wed Oct 14, 2020 8:57 am

stessier wrote: Wed Oct 14, 2020 8:56 am
They are out to win the time slot, right? So definitely to beat ABC.

Exactly, it's the only "win" he can get right now.

Unagi · Post by **Unagi** » Wed Oct 14, 2020 8:59 am

Well, like a normal debate - I would have liked to have thought that all the networks were going to show Biden’s townhall.

stessier · Post by **stessier** » Wed Oct 14, 2020 8:59 am

LawBeefaroni wrote: Wed Oct 14, 2020 8:56 am
Grifman wrote: Tue Oct 13, 2020 11:46 pm After dipping as low as 83%, the Biden is now back up to 91% probability of an EC victory in The Economist forecast:

https://projects.economist.com/us-2020- ... /president
Still in my bunker. If NASA identified a 100km asteroid with a 9% chance of hitting the Earth, we'd be building spaceships for Bruce Willis and Liv Tyler right now.

Ben Affleck. Liv stayed behind and gets to look very concerned in Mission Control.

malchior · Post by **malchior** » Wed Oct 14, 2020 8:59 am

LawBeefaroni wrote: Wed Oct 14, 2020 8:57 am
stessier wrote: Wed Oct 14, 2020 8:56 am
They are out to win the time slot, right? So definitely to beat ABC.
Exactly, it's the only "win" he can get right now.

For Trump it's a win -- no matter the outcome -- and the media wins by keeping us divided and bickering so they can sell us chaos.

Unagi · Post by **Unagi** » Wed Oct 14, 2020 8:59 am

And it should have always just been called the debate and trumps podium should have been left empty.

Defiant · Post by **Defiant** » Wed Oct 14, 2020 9:05 am

Unagi wrote: Wed Oct 14, 2020 8:59 am And it should have always just been called the debate and trumps podium should have been left empty.

That would just leave people with a positive impression of Trump, though.

"He's so much more mature and showing so much more willpower than usual by not interrupting Biden. Today is the day he really became President!"

Unagi · Post by **Unagi** » Wed Oct 14, 2020 9:06 am

Lol

Or more seriously, made people realize how nice things are without his mouth running.

A bit like SNL’s remote control skit

LordMortis · Post by **LordMortis** » Wed Oct 14, 2020 9:29 am

Holman wrote: Wed Oct 14, 2020 8:42 am
stessier wrote: Wed Oct 14, 2020 8:36 am
malchior wrote: Wed Oct 14, 2020 8:32 am How is that in the public interest?
It let's those who want to hear Trump speak on the issues in a Town Hall setting the opportunity?

It's just counterprogramming. The Biden hall is exclusive to ABC, right? I don't see a problem with it.
The public interest would be served by the town hall debate that Trump is ducking out of.

These aren't reciprocal events. Trump quit the original format because he was afraid to share a stage and prefers a rally.

Biden needs to invite Trump back to the original format. Make him decline again.

I don't know about what's what, but if Trump ducked out of the Townhall and NBC decides to show him, where he controls everything, after ducking out, NBC are dead to me. I was just getting ready to switch to Comcast after two decades of calling them the Devil. That is now off the table.

Holman · Post by **Holman** » Wed Oct 14, 2020 9:31 am

NBC brought you The Apprentice, and The Apprentice brought you the Sith Lord.

Ralph-Wiggum · Post by **Ralph-Wiggum** » Wed Oct 14, 2020 9:50 am

Per the equal time rule, doesn't this mean that Trump and Biden should be able to request another townhall (or other event) on the other network?

Little Raven · Post by **Little Raven** » Wed Oct 14, 2020 9:56 am

Finally, a poll that puts Trump on top!

A new poll published by I24News and conducted by the Direct Falls Research Institute on Monday found that 63.3% of Israelis prefer the reelection of incumbent US President Donald Trump, compared to 18.8% whom prefer former Vice President and Democratic challenger Joe Biden. Respondents indicated that a majority believe Trump will be a better president for the State of Israel, a minority of Israelis said the same about Biden. 10.4% of respondents said that both candidates would be equally good for the State of Israel, while 3.1% said neither.

Blackhawk · Post by **Blackhawk** » Wed Oct 14, 2020 10:10 am

The real impact of Trump's town hall is that it prevents Trump supporters from hearing Biden's message. Just like the debate. If Team Trump prevents them from hearing Biden's message, they don't have to worry about them changing their minds.