Election integrity and the transfer of power

Jaymann · Post by **Jaymann** » Thu Oct 29, 2020 10:43 am

Kavanaugh has tipped his hand on not counting any ballots after November 3. As hideous as this is, if ALL ballots favor Biden, I'm not sure how negating the procrastinator vote is going to save Trump. Why do you think we have historically record high early voting? We're not that stupid.

Holman · Post by **Holman** » Thu Oct 29, 2020 10:44 am

https://twitter.com/politico/status/132 ... 72899?s=20

1) First place to look is Donald's pockets.

2) Expect this to be used somehow to challenge election results in Wisconsin.

LordMortis · Post by **LordMortis** » Thu Oct 29, 2020 11:16 am

And that's the question(s):

Was it an insider job?
Was it incompetence by the very people who claim to be the best at protecting against such thing?
Were they targeted by the best (usually nation states as they like to say) and are they that susceptible to attacks by the best?

And yeah, it's not a stretch for me to see someone from Don's inner circle making a grab through one channel or another.

Holman · Post by **Holman** » Thu Oct 29, 2020 11:40 am

Trump has already written off Wisconsin.

Such a coincidence that this news came out right after a very reliable poll showing Biden 17(!) points up in the state.

El Guapo · Post by **El Guapo** » Thu Oct 29, 2020 12:04 pm

Occam's razor is that the culprits are people who wanted $2.3M, and thought of Trump's reelection funds as a ripe and deserving target. Trump can easily pilfer his reelection funds by spending them on Trump properties and businesses, and lots of Trump affiliates have similar opportunities, so seems unlikely that they'd resort to this method.

malchior · Post by **malchior** » Thu Oct 29, 2020 7:11 pm

This is getting absurd.

https://mobile.twitter.com/rickhasen/st ... 2238957568

Jaymann · Post by **Jaymann** » Thu Oct 29, 2020 7:14 pm

getting

???

malchior · Post by **malchior** » Thu Oct 29, 2020 7:29 pm

This is really feeling dystopian.

https://mobile.twitter.com/kylegriffin1 ... 1741719553

Holman · Post by **Holman** » Thu Oct 29, 2020 7:36 pm

malchior wrote: Thu Oct 29, 2020 7:29 pm This is really feeling dystopian.

https://mobile.twitter.com/kylegriffin1 ... 1741719553

Today I've been texting Democrats and (young) Independents in my ward who show that they've requested a ballot but have not yet returned it. The message is to let them know it's time to drop off their ballot at the local location rather than trust the mail to get it in on time.

Even though the state SC has rules that late-arriving ballots will be counted, no one is taking chances with Trump's SC.

Octavious · Post by **Octavious** » Thu Oct 29, 2020 7:58 pm

Ya I can't help but think they are going to steal this. Kind of nice when the mail is super slow now.

malchior · Post by **malchior** » Thu Oct 29, 2020 8:56 pm

It sure appears they are going to try.

https://mobile.twitter.com/ThePlumLineG ... 1755853825

Skinypupy · Post by **Skinypupy** » Thu Oct 29, 2020 9:08 pm

Octavious wrote: Thu Oct 29, 2020 7:58 pm Ya I can't help but think they are going to steal this. Kind of nice when the mail is super slow now.

That’s the main thing fueling my ever-growing sense of dread.

While all the data points to a decisive Biden victory, none of it accounts for legal fuckery. Unless this is a complete and utter blowout for Biden (which it likely won’t be), we will be in serious trouble.

Smoove_B · Post by **Smoove_B** » Thu Oct 29, 2020 9:20 pm

It sure appears they are going to try.

Once again, it seems like PA is going to be the critical puzzle piece here. If they're focused on PA and going to use their results as a way to attack the entire voting process next week? Good grief.

Kraken · Post by **Kraken** » Thu Oct 29, 2020 9:29 pm

Their efforts to prevent us from voting didn't work. Now they have to invalidate our ballots. If SCOTUS rubber-stamps that, this country is over.

Jaymann · Post by **Jaymann** » Thu Oct 29, 2020 9:36 pm

Just a hunch, but I'm fairly sure the banks aren't interested in insurrection in the streets. I heard an interesting perspective on Brett Weinstein's podcast: Government isn't the buildings in Washington DC, it is who actually governs.

malchior · Post by **malchior** » Thu Oct 29, 2020 11:25 pm

In the world's "greatest democracy" we have major politicians piling onto the airwaves to tell voters to not mail their ballots because we don't know if they'll be counted. The world is watching. No matter what happens we have fallen greatly.

https://twitter.com/amyklobuchar/status ... 3563508737

Smoove_B · Post by **Smoove_B** » Fri Oct 30, 2020 12:04 am

malchior wrote: Thu Oct 29, 2020 11:25 pmThe world is watching. No matter what happens we have fallen greatly.

Seriously. I can only imagine what's being said behind closed doors right now around the world. Even with everything else Trump has completed screwed America on, will this final attempt to maintain power be seen as the most horrific? I mean, trying to top 225K+ deaths is something, and how the GOP has collectively rallied behind this attempt to make some votes seemingly useless is beyond comprehension.

malchior · Post by **malchior** » Fri Oct 30, 2020 6:31 am

https://mobile.twitter.com/realDonaldTr ... 5524495360

Paingod · Post by **Paingod** » Fri Oct 30, 2020 6:54 am

I'm glad he's paying attention to something. This might be the first accurate political statement he's made.

His party brought it on themselves. I think Democrats were willing to grudgingly accept his first two nominees. The last, though, in complete defiance of their own standards, broke the thin veil. With the GOP openly drawing blood, Democrats have been left with no real choice.

YellowKing · Post by **YellowKing** » Fri Oct 30, 2020 8:46 am

I think Democrats need to start throwing out the FASCIST RIGHT as often as conservatives throw out the RADICAL LEFT.

Paingod · Post by **Paingod** » Fri Oct 30, 2020 9:00 am

I still like to think of "Radical" in the 80's slang sense. He sings the high praise!

LawBeefaroni · Post by **LawBeefaroni** » Fri Oct 30, 2020 9:56 am

malchior wrote: Thu Oct 29, 2020 11:25 pm In the world's "greatest democracy" we have major politicians piling onto the airwaves to tell voters to not mail their ballots because we don't know if they'll be counted. The world is watching. No matter what happens we have fallen greatly.

FWIW, I dropped mine in the mail on Wednesday and tracking says it should be delivered today.

Carpet_pissr · Post by **Carpet_pissr** » Fri Oct 30, 2020 3:19 pm

Smoove_B wrote: Fri Oct 30, 2020 12:04 am
malchior wrote: Thu Oct 29, 2020 11:25 pmThe world is watching. No matter what happens we have fallen greatly.
Seriously. I can only imagine what's being said behind closed doors right now around the world. Even with everything else Trump has completed screwed America on, will this final attempt to maintain power be seen as the most horrific? I mean, trying to top 225K+ deaths is something, and how the GOP has collectively rallied behind this attempt to make some votes seemingly useless is beyond comprehension.

No need to imagine, let me help - and I will try to put it in a somewhat chronological order of reactions starting with the nomination of a reality TV show prick:

"(Nelson) HA HA! (points) América just nominate Donald Trumps to run for President! That's hilarious! Those crasy Americans sure love their TV and movie stars!!"
DJT closes in on Clinton
"Oh shit..do you think he could really WIN?!" Ponderous silence while the possibility sinks in and all its implications. "Well, even if he DOES win, we are SURE that the norms, institutions and Constitution of the United States will hold up against any nonsense that this shady fuck will try" (I actually heard a paraphrase of that from more than one political leader amongst our allies (at the time)).
DJT wins.
"..."
The next four years:
Verbally and legally shitting on our previous allies:
"WTF. Morons! Dicks!"
Pulling out of treaties and accords:
"OK, now you REALLY falling off cliff, America!!"
Putting refugee kids in cages, separating them from parents, and finally admitting that they can't reconnect 500+ of those kids with their parents because they can't find them. THEN saying that they probably didn't want them anyway.
"Barbarians. Cretins. Assholes! Who ARE you, America?!? Maybe it's time to implode your Statue of Liberty"
but mostly the pandemic handling:
"WAT. THE. FUCK, America?!?" Sad head shaking.

Past couple years:
"(Joey T) How YOU doin', China?"

Annnd...SCENE!

Thank you...thankyouverymuch. I'll be signing autographs in the lobby.

Skinypupy · Post by **Skinypupy** » Fri Oct 30, 2020 3:48 pm

More fuckery is afoot!

https://twitter.com/AndrewFeinberg/stat ... 0346933248

INBOX: ⁦@realDonaldTrump submits two nominations for the Federal Election Commission after it has gone most of this election cycle without a quorum.

El Guapo · Post by **El Guapo** » Fri Oct 30, 2020 4:17 pm

https://twitter.com/NateSilver538/statu ... 3375688704

I've been thinking about this. Given that Democrats have been focused on the messaging on this for awhile now, I doubt that late arriving ballots will be decisive. That is, I'm guessing that they'll still favor Biden, but given the overall margins I dobut that they'll favor him enough to change the election's outcome.

So I'm not in a huge panic about them knocking out late arriving ballots. What I am worried about is whether they'll be able to stop counting in key states on Nov. 4th.

Holman · Post by **Holman** » Fri Oct 30, 2020 4:27 pm

El Guapo wrote: Fri Oct 30, 2020 4:17 pm So I'm not in a huge panic about them knocking out late arriving ballots. What I am worried about is whether they'll be able to stop counting in key states on Nov. 4th.

What could Trump (and Kavanaugh etc) possibly use as a justification for that?

If early/mail voting was a legal option and you submitted your vote legally, why should your vote not be counted?

It would be like declaring retroactively on Nov 4 that polls actually closed at noon on the 3rd, so all afternoon votes must be discarded.

Little Raven · Post by **Little Raven** » Fri Oct 30, 2020 4:34 pm

Holman wrote: Fri Oct 30, 2020 4:27 pmWhat could Trump (and Kavanaugh etc) possibly use as a justification for that?

Even the conservatives on the Court have a pretty consistent ideology in regards to voting - they believe it's up to the States, and give States WIDE latitude in how they conduct themselves.

So we only really need to worry about states that are going to vote for Biden but have Republican dominated administrations that are inclined towards shenanigans.

Jaymann · Post by **Jaymann** » Fri Oct 30, 2020 4:36 pm

If Biden has an EC win as of the November 3 count, I can't wait until Trump insists we must count all the ballots.

El Guapo · Post by **El Guapo** » Fri Oct 30, 2020 4:41 pm

Holman wrote: Fri Oct 30, 2020 4:27 pm
El Guapo wrote: Fri Oct 30, 2020 4:17 pm So I'm not in a huge panic about them knocking out late arriving ballots. What I am worried about is whether they'll be able to stop counting in key states on Nov. 4th.
What could Trump (and Kavanaugh etc) possibly use as a justification for that?

If early/mail voting was a legal option and you submitted your vote legally, why should your vote not be counted?

It would be like declaring retroactively on Nov 4 that polls actually closed at noon on the 3rd, so all afternoon votes must be discarded.

It's a good question. There's always an argument, though. I'm guessing that it's going to be just that there's lots of fraud going on and we need to stop the vote counting until we get at the bottom of what's happening (which would be never). I don't think it's going to be easy for Trump, especially given the margin. But what I do worry about is Trump basically sending people to seize and destroy ballots in key places and stuff like that, to create a reality that gets hard to reverse.

I take some comfort that the Republicans don't control state government in a lot key states, which makes it much harder. But not impossible.

El Guapo · Post by **El Guapo** » Fri Oct 30, 2020 4:43 pm

https://twitter.com/JustinSandefur/stat ... 7640049667

In some ways I worry more about a scenario where Trump is up after election day by only +2 or +3, because if it's Trump +16 in early voting, I think everyone outside of Trumpworld will easily understand that that's not a final result ( as there's no world in which Trump actually wins PA by +16). But Trump +2 is unlikely but not impossible.

YellowKing · Post by **YellowKing** » Fri Oct 30, 2020 4:51 pm

Either way, the right-wing narrative is going to be that the Democrats "stole" Pennsylvania and thus the entire election was a fraud.

Holman · Post by **Holman** » Fri Oct 30, 2020 4:54 pm

The one bright spot is that the PA Governor, SecState, AG, and Supreme Court are all in Democratic hands.

Oh, and the Lt Governor is this guy, who could probably curb-stomp vote interferers without breaking a sweat:

El Guapo · Post by **El Guapo** » Fri Oct 30, 2020 5:21 pm

Also, "just" stealing PA is probably not going to be enough to swing the election.

Smoove_B · Post by **Smoove_B** » Fri Oct 30, 2020 5:54 pm

(insert WTF gif here)

https://twitter.com/kylegriffin1/status ... 4880169984

Breaking on @MSNBC
: A new emergency appeal has been filed in the Supreme Court challenging Minnesota's policy on face masks at polling places.

Little Raven · Post by **Little Raven** » Fri Oct 30, 2020 6:08 pm

Here's the PDF of the ruling from the lower court.

Essentially, the Minnesota Voters Alliance are arguing that they can't vote because Minnesota law states the following:

A person whose identity is concealed by the person in a public place by means of a robe, mask, or other disguise, unless based on religious beliefs, or incidental to amusement, entertainment, protection from weather, or medical treatment, is guilty of a misdemeanor.

Which, fair enough, it does. But the governor has ordered a mask mandate for all indoor spaces. So they can't wear a mask and they can't not wear a mask, and so (they argue) they're being denied their right to vote.

However, nobody is enforcing the anti-mask law at the moment, so Federal court ruled against them, since they could not establish standing due to a lack of injury. Now they're kicking it up the chain.

Good luck with that.

El Guapo · Post by **El Guapo** » Fri Oct 30, 2020 6:10 pm

Also COVID masks don't conceal anyone's identity.

Little Raven · Post by **Little Raven** » Fri Oct 30, 2020 6:11 pm

El Guapo wrote: Fri Oct 30, 2020 6:10 pmAlso COVID masks don't conceal anyone's identity.

Eh, I dunno about that. Some of the masks I see around Austin are pretty concealing. Not everyone wears the tiny ear-loop numbers

Smoove_B · Post by **Smoove_B** » Fri Oct 30, 2020 6:38 pm

Never before have so many been so concerned about the ability to vote. If they're so worried, maybe the Minnesota Voter's Alliance should get some UN observers in.

Defiant · Post by **Defiant** » Fri Oct 30, 2020 7:34 pm

https://twitter.com/kionnemcghee/status ... 0413215744

Raw footage of mailroom in post office here in Miami Dade. Source revealed “mail in ballots are within these piled up in bins on the floor. Mail has been sitting for over week!.”

Smoove_B · Post by **Smoove_B** » Fri Oct 30, 2020 7:39 pm

I was just about to come in to post this. Maybe in addition to the UN observers, we need to mobilize the National Guard to help with the sorting of mail?

This is absolutely absurd. Absurd!