COVID-19 treatment and vaccine update thread

[Smoove_B]

Full thread:

https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1416962059967860738

He's...a bit of a wack-job and has largely fallen from grace in the greater public health community. He started his own patreon for followers to get "special information" about COVID-19.

He does sometimes share good information, but I'll wait to hear it from a chorus of others.

[Defiant]

Full thread:

https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1416962059967860738

He's...a bit of a wack-job and has largely fallen from grace in the greater public health community. He started his own patreon for followers to get "special information" about COVID-19.

He does sometimes share good information, but I'll wait to hear it from a chorus of others.

Ahh, OK, thanks. I'll update my post.

[Lorini]

Full thread:

https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1416962059967860738

He's...a bit of a wack-job and has largely fallen from grace in the greater public health community. He started his own patreon for followers to get "special information" about COVID-19.

He does sometimes share good information, but I'll wait to hear it from a chorus of others.

Lots of money in the Covid mis-information bandwagon.

[Smoove_B]

Lots of money in the Covid mis-information bandwagon.

It's just so weird because he's an epidemiologist that specializes in nutrition, not infectious diseases. I think that's another thing the general public doesn't quite grok - epidemiology is only monolithic in theory (the tools and models we use). In practice there are so many different types of epidemiologists - not only by area of expertise but by function. The people I've been listening to since March of last year are mainly infectious disease epidemiologists with backgrounds in virology and zoonotic illness. As well as the "pure" research academics that can comment on the various studies and how they were designed or the strength of their various findings. I've mentioned it before, my area of epidemiology is "shoe leather" - boots on the ground and using epi to make decisions on how to stop outbreaks based on quick calculations. I have zero epi experience in research or even in developing policy.

So it's not that Dr. Ding is even on the same level as many of the other opportunists that know nothing and are capitalizing on their celebrity. Dr. Ding is instead apparently using his broad credentials and minor celebrity status (he ran for office in PA) to command an audience that believes he is the authority on COVID-19.

It's been a weird 18 months in public health.

[LordMortis]

This is why we can't have nice things.

I hope every single $1 of his hospital and medical coverage is denied and he needs to pay it all out of pocket.

This. But it won't.

[LawBeefaroni]

Lollapalooza is 7/31-8/1. We'll see then. Or rather 3-14 days after.


And lucky me, I lead a non-profit that runs an outdoor event two weeks later. Looking at substantial losses if we have to shut it down. Made the investment when the city said "Go" after multiple discussions with the mayor's office. But may have to make the difficult decision.

Guess who isn't sleeping these days?

[Smoove_B]

I'm following the ACIP meeting updates on the status of how to handle the immunocompromised with respect to vaccination. So far I've gleaned that roughly 3% of Americans are considered immunocompromised and that they're more likely to experience breakthrough (44% of hospitalized cases in U.S. are people that are immunocompromised).

They're also noting that some HCP are now at the point of considering off-label use to provide that 3rd shot because the FDA hasn't given official guidance.

Hopefully a summary article is published, but it doesn't seem like they're taking action now and are going to talk about it again in August.

[MHS]

I'm following the ACIP meeting updates on the status of how to handle the immunocompromised with respect to vaccination. So far I've gleaned that roughly 3% of Americans are considered immunocompromised and that they're more likely to experience breakthrough (44% of hospitalized cases in U.S. are people that are immunocompromised).

They're also noting that some HCP are now at the point of considering off-label use to provide that 3rd shot because the FDA hasn't given official guidance.

Hopefully a summary article is published, but it doesn't seem like they're taking action now and are going to talk about it again in August.

I'm glad you're keeping up with this. Although it's hard to explain my sources when I discuss this with my employer, doctors, and well-meaning friends. (My boss still refers to you as Mr. Smoovebie, with no knowledge of who you are or what that means, just that I've quoted you.)

[Zaxxon]

(My boss still refers to you as Mr. Smoovebie, with no knowledge of who you are or what that means, just that I've quoted you.)

This is wonderful.

[Smoove_B]

"But someone on the internet is telling me about medical stuff and it's legit - I swear!"



I have a local health meeting next week and I'm going to put the screws to our county officials over what guidance they're providing to our schools for masking, as directed by the governor. It really continues to feel like everyone has just moved on and if they think I'm not going on the record on the need for kids in schools to be protected - and they should be advocating for it - that's absurd. The 3% number surprised me; that's not insignificant. I'll need to crunch some numbers for my state and get some back-of-the napkin data to toss in.

Regardless, I came to the conclusion a few months ago that I'm at the point in my career where I'm officially out of farks to give. I'd been playing nice for 23+ years and pussy-footing around too many things; I'm done.

[dbt1949]

Arkansas passed a law saying no more masks mandates. So there will be no mandatory masks in our schools.

[Zaxxon]

I have a local health meeting next week and I'm going to put the screws to our county officials over what guidance they're providing to our schools for masking, as directed by the governor. It really continues to feel like everyone has just moved on and if they think I'm not going on the record on the need for kids in schools to be protected - and they should be advocating for it - that's absurd.

Our district notified us yesterday that their official stance will be that masks are not required but are strongly encouraged indoors for the under-12 crowd. They'll also be keeping the frequent sanitizing of high-touch areas and attempting 3' distancing (but not guaranteeing).

This is less than we wanted (masks required) and advocated for in communications with the superintendent, but it's more than I expected to get. In June the district was communicating that this coming year would be pretty much back to normal.

Regardless, I came to the conclusion a few months ago that I'm at the point in my career where I'm officially out of farks to give. I'd been playing nice for 23+ years and pussy-footing around too many things; I'm done.

[El Guapo]

Even Massachusetts is resisting calls to reinstate school mask mandates.

I'd be shocked (and upset) if my kids' school doesn't have a mask requirement, at least for the age groups that can't be vaccinated yet, though.

I'm not exactly *surprised* by this given that we do have a GOP governor (if a sane one who understands the state that he's governing), and given that YOLO pandemic over has reached most of Massachusetts too, but still...

[Zaxxon]

I'd be shocked (and upset) if my kids' school doesn't have a mask requirement, at least for the age groups that can't be vaccinated yet, though.ill...

Good luck to you. My faith that requirements will be a thing anywhere but in deep bastions of blue is zero.

[naednek]

our kids are in school already (year round) and they require everyone to wear masks inside. outside no masks.

[El Guapo]

I'd be shocked (and upset) if my kids' school doesn't have a mask requirement, at least for the age groups that can't be vaccinated yet, though.ill...

Good luck to you. My faith that requirements will be a thing anywhere but in deep bastions of blue is zero.

My kids go to a private Jewish day school near Boston with heavily educated liberal parents. When Massachusetts got rid of the statewide mask requirement per the May CDC change, they started allowing kids to remove their masks with prior approval when outdoors. I could be wrong...but a complete mask removal would be a massive massive deal in the school community I think.

[Zaxxon]

Discussed in the NFL off-season thread, but really belongs here, too. NFL to players: fuck around and find out.

https://twitter.com/TomPelissero/status ... 35299?s=19

Thread...

[Zaxxon]

I'd be shocked (and upset) if my kids' school doesn't have a mask requirement, at least for the age groups that can't be vaccinated yet, though.ill...

Good luck to you. My faith that requirements will be a thing anywhere but in deep bastions of blue is zero.

My kids go to a private Jewish day school near Boston with heavily educated liberal parents. When Massachusetts got rid of the statewide mask requirement per the May CDC change, they started allowing kids to remove their masks with prior approval when outdoors. I could be wrong...but a complete mask removal would be a massive massive deal in the school community I think.

our kids are in school already (year round) and they require everyone to wear masks inside. outside no masks.

Bastions of blue, no?

[El Guapo]

I'd be shocked (and upset) if my kids' school doesn't have a mask requirement, at least for the age groups that can't be vaccinated yet, though.ill...

Good luck to you. My faith that requirements will be a thing anywhere but in deep bastions of blue is zero.

My kids go to a private Jewish day school near Boston with heavily educated liberal parents. When Massachusetts got rid of the statewide mask requirement per the May CDC change, they started allowing kids to remove their masks with prior approval when outdoors. I could be wrong...but a complete mask removal would be a massive massive deal in the school community I think.

our kids are in school already (year round) and they require everyone to wear masks inside. outside no masks.

Bastions of blue, no?

Yup.

[Smoove_B]

This is a mistake.

The U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention has not revised its masking guidance, even as the infectious Delta variant of COVID-19 continues to sweep the United States, driving up case counts, CDC director Rochelle Walensky said during a Thursday press call.

There should be model guidelines out *right now* that provide metrics and bench-marking (i.e. tied to data) for community masking.

To quote Dr. Harry Vanderspeigle, this is some bullshit.

[soulbringer]

This is gonna get bad again sadly. Wish people would just get the damn shot. Ive gone from Acute care RN to a Cardiology office triage RN since I still have issues from my Covid in August last year and in the past 2 weeks, the amount of under age 50 patients calling asking what to do about their heart condition, Ive got Covid is staggering.

[Rumpy]

Yeah, agreed. Those that are stalling because of "reasons" are only making it worse for everyone else. Ironically, I have a friend who's anti-vax and has told her friends she's not planning on getting it, and that it's her choice. Yet just a few days ago, she tells me she wishes things would go back to normal. I just find that so incredibly ironic.

[Isgrimnur]

Texas

Of the 8,787 people who have died in Texas due to COVID-19 since early February, at least 43 were fully vaccinated, the Texas Department of State Health Services said.

That means 99.5% of people who died due to COVID-19 in Texas from Feb. 8 to July 14 were unvaccinated, while 0.5% were the result of “breakthrough infections,” which DSHS defines as people who contracted the virus two weeks after being fully vaccinated.

The agency said nearly 75% of the 43 vaccinated people who died were fighting a serious underlying condition, such as diabetes, heart disease, high blood pressure, cancer or chronic lung disease.

Additionally, it said 95% of the 43 vaccinated people who died were 60 or older, and that a majority of them were white and a majority were men.

[Jeff V]

Biden just said if you're vaccinated, Covid won't kill you. I for one have no problem with anti-vaxxers getting what they deserve.

[ImLawBoy]

This is a mistake.

The U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention has not revised its masking guidance, even as the infectious Delta variant of COVID-19 continues to sweep the United States, driving up case counts, CDC director Rochelle Walensky said during a Thursday press call.

There should be model guidelines out *right now* that provide metrics and bench-marking (i.e. tied to data) for community masking.

To quote Dr. Harry Vanderspeigle, this is some bullshit.

[The Meal]

It was completely alien to me.

[coopasonic]

It was completely alien to me.

[FishPants]

Toronto and Peel regions (area right around Toronto) that was a hotspot (and continues to be in relation to other regions) is now reporting that 100% of Covid hospitalizations are in the unvaccinated or single dose vaccinated category. Breakthrough on 2 dosed is nil at the moment (I'm sure the odd 80+ year old will have that) -- and yet we still have raging assholes claiming "vaccines don't work!".. I'm disappointed we don't have vaccine passports, and that they aren't required to go to bars/restaurants/theatres/travel etc. It's the anti-vax folks' turn to stay home in this next wave while I get to go out and do my thing because I'm fully vaxxed.

[Jeff V]

It's the anti-vax folks' turn to stay home in this next wave while I get to go out and do my thing because I'm fully vaxxed.

Illinois seems to be trending that way, but whether they go the distance and require proof of vaccination to participate in society remains to be seen.

[Max Peck]

Is there a prize?

[Blackhawk]

Is there a prize?

The same prize the US won after WWII: Being the last man standing.

[dbt1949]

Had to take my wife to the hospital this morning. There was a lengthy delay to see a doctor. Too many Trump supporters ahead of her. Assholes.

[Rumpy]

It's the anti-vax folks' turn to stay home in this next wave while I get to go out and do my thing because I'm fully vaxxed.

And yet, like I've mentioned above, I find it incredibly ironic when some anti-vaxxers complain about wanting it to go back to normal. If only they'd realize that the one way things would go back to normal is for them to just deal with it and get the damn shots. I can understand the reluctance against the flu vaccine which is one thing, but we're dealing with a pandemic actively killing people.

And I agree about the passports. I wish they'd go ahead with them. My fear is that all the unvaccinated will come out of the woodwork now that things are all opening up, thinking they can blend in with everyone and spreading it around.

[jztemple2]

Interesting release from our county emergency management folks:

FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE
Tuesday, July 27, 2021 1:36 PM
CDC Lists Recommendations for Those Fully Vaccinated for COVID-19

BREVARD COUNTY, FL. -- The spike in COVID-19 cases has focused a lot of attention on those who have not been vaccinated. Ample supplies of vaccine are available at Florida Department of Health-Brevard (DOH-Brevard), area pharmacies, urgent cares centers and from your private physician. Residents who are ages 12 and older are recommended to get vaccinated.

The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) has provided guidance for individuals fully vaccinated for COVID-19.
Individuals are considered fully vaccinated for COVID-19 two or more weeks after they have received the second dose in a two-dose series (Moderna and Pfizer vaccine require two doses) or two or more weeks after they have received a single-dose vaccine (Janssen/Johnson & Johnson COVID-19 vaccine).

Here is an overview of the CDC Interim Public Health Recommendations for Fully Vaccinated people:
• Resume activities without wearing masks or physical distancing except where required by federal, state, local, tribal or territorial laws, rules and regulations, including local businesses and workplaces.
• Refrain from quarantine and testing following a known exposure if they remain asymptomatic.
• Resume domestic travel and refrain from testing before or after travel of self-quarantine after travel.
• Refrain from testing before leaving the United States for international travel (unless required by the destination) and refrain from self-quarantine after arriving back in the United States.
• Refrain from routine screening testing if asymptomatic and feasible.

Fully vaccinated individuals should continue to:
• Practice hand and respiratory hygiene.
• Get tested if experiencing COVID-19 symptoms.
• Follow guidance issued by individual employers.
• Follow travel requirements and recommendations.

Fully vaccinated individuals should continue to watch for symptoms of COVID-19. Regardless of vaccination status, if symptoms develop, individuals should isolate and be evaluated for COVID-19, including SARS-CoV-2 testing if indicated.

I like those "refrain" mentions, although the wording sounds a bit odd.

[Max Peck]

The most interesting part (to me, ymmv) is that they managed to put this out on the same day that the CDC updated their guidance without including the updated guidance.

Florida's "Resume activities without wearing masks or physical distancing except where required by federal, state, local, tribal or territorial laws, rules and regulations, including local businesses and workplaces." isn't quite the same as the CDC's "To maximize protection from the Delta variant and prevent possibly spreading it to others, wear a mask indoors in public if you are in an area of substantial or high transmission."

[jztemple2]

I did wonder about the timing of the announcement, coming about an hour and a half before the CDC issued their new guidelines.

[Smoove_B]

RE: Florida

https://twitter.com/cmyeaton/status/1420178087719866378

Hope is not a plan. Florida hospitalizations are at winter levels and cases continue to pile up. What's the plan?

[Pyperkub]

Note - it's not just willingly unvaxxed, I suspect:

Racial disparities in vaccination rates remain pronounced countywide. Among Latinos, 55% have received at least one dose, compared with 66% of white residents. In the Black community, that number is 46%.

The culture war gets the headlines, but the US also has an almost permanent underclass which consistently gets the shaft (but not the stick).

[Zaxxon]

Note - it's not just willingly unvaxxed, I suspect:

Racial disparities in vaccination rates remain pronounced countywide. Among Latinos, 55% have received at least one dose, compared with 66% of white residents. In the Black community, that number is 46%.

The culture war gets the headlines, but the US also has an almost permanent underclass which consistently gets the shaft (but not the stick).

Absolutely.

[Smoove_B]

The culture war gets the headlines, but the US also has an almost permanent underclass which consistently gets the shaft (but not the stick).

Yes, I've been dipping into it over in R&P. We need to spend our energy on reaching those that are having access issues and getting support to the truly hesitant.

For those that have repeatedly stated their refusal, they need to experience social and employment-based consequences.