Chevy Bolt EV

[Zaxxon]

Can neither confirm nor deny.

[stessier]

It's been 6 months of ownership today, so time for an energy update. Turns out my wife really likes driving it...probably because her car is old and she's afraid it's trying to kill her. As a result, we've driven it way more than I expected. I thought we'd end up around 12,000 miles for the year. Not so much.

For the energy, I only started tracking after the first 1242 miles, so the numbers should be close but aren't perfect. For the gas prices, every day I charged the car, I recorded the gas price at the station I used to use and I'm assuming a car getting 40mpg for comparison (which was what I traded in). Finally, we used free public charging twice for a total of less than 20kWh.

Total miles driven - 9162

Total energy miles tracked (used for all calculations below) - 7920

Total kWh used (per the car) - 1947.6
Miles / kWh - 4.067
Residential Electricity cost - $0.12924 / kWh
Total electrical cost - $251.7078
cost / mile = $0.03178

Total kWh charged (per JuiceBox) - 2076.5
Miles / kWh charged - 3.814
Residential Electricity cost - $0.12924 / kWh
Total Charging cost - $268.3669
charged cost / mile = $0.03388

Average charger efficiency - 93.8%

Fuel Savings = Total Estimated ICE Cost - Total Charging cost
Fuel Savings = $397.24 - $268.37 = $128.87


For the Tesla owners, the efficiency numbers are
Reported by car - 245.88 Wh/mile
Charged - 262.19 Wh/mile

I drive like a grandma, too.

[Zaxxon]

Awesome! Time to replace your wife's car with an EV.

[stessier]

Awesome! Time to replace your wife's car with an EV.

I'm trying! I'm hoping the Model Y will excite her (and me) to at least get her on board with an electric SUV. We can't buy until mine is paid off in 4 years, so I've got some time to work on her and for the options to expand.

[Zaxxon]

Awesome! Time to replace your wife's car with an EV.

I'm trying! I'm hoping the Model Y will excite her (and me) to at least get her on board with an electric SUV. We can't buy until mine is paid off in 4 years, so I've got some time to work on her and for the options to expand.

I'm in a similar boat convincing the wife. She likes the 3, but isn't quite sure she's ready to not have an ICE in the garage at all. Hopefully another road trip into the boonies this summer will convince her (last summer was the Dakotas; this summer is Utah).

[stessier]

She likes the 3, but isn't quite sure she's ready to not have an ICE in the garage at all.

This is it exactly. I try to mention that there is always the rental option if it came down to that, but she's unconvinced. They say it takes two years for a person to change their mind. I'm hoping that is accurate.

[Zaxxon]

She likes the 3, but isn't quite sure she's ready to not have an ICE in the garage at all.

This is it exactly. I try to mention that there is always the rental option if it came down to that, but she's unconvinced. They say it takes two years for a person to change their mind. I'm hoping that is accurate.

Yeah, my wife currently drives the PHEV (~15-mile all-electric range) daily for her 55-mile commute. Even if we did need ICE capability for a once-a-year road trip, I'd much rather pay to rent one than use gasoline unnecessarily for those other 51 weeks. The fuel savings alone would largely cover that rental.

[Zaxxon]

Per InsideEVs, the Bolt had 2166 sales in the US in March, up from 1774 last March. Will be interesting to see how this proceeds over the next few months as the Volt inventory dies out.

[stessier]

They do pretty good, but have been known to change their numbers quite a bit over time. GM stopped reporting month-by-month sales and switched to quarters like Tesla, so that number could go in either direction when GM reports later this month.

[Zaxxon]

They do pretty good, but have been known to change their numbers quite a bit over time. GM stopped reporting month-by-month sales and switched to quarters like Tesla, so that number could go in either direction when GM reports later this month.

True for the first two months of the quarter, but not for the quarter as a whole. As such, their Q1 totals are straight from GM (reported this AM). 4,316 Bolts for Q1.

[stessier]

They do pretty good, but have been known to change their numbers quite a bit over time. GM stopped reporting month-by-month sales and switched to quarters like Tesla, so that number could go in either direction when GM reports later this month.

True for the first two months of the quarter, but not for the quarter as a whole. As such, their Q1 totals are straight from GM (reported this AM). 4,316 Bolts for Q1.

Ah, thought it was in 2 more weeks. Thanks, my bad.

[stessier]

Not sure if anyone else here bought one, but there is a recall going on to address the fires. There is no fix yet, but they recommend charging to only 90%. The recall right now is to go to the dealership and have them flash an update to impose that limit. If you don't do that, don't charge to 100% and don't park in your garage. They are hoping for a fix after the first of the year sometime. The effected vehicles are limited to 2017-2019 model years with the batteries built outside the US (so not the newer 66 kWh ones).

The message boards are suggesting a link between this issue and the Kona fire issues as LG Chem had a hand in both batteries. It will be interesting to see what they come up with because a permanent 10% loss in range is going to tick a lot of people off.

[Isgrimnur]

It will be interesting to see what they come up with because a permanent 10% loss in range is going to tick a lot of people off.

Hello, class action lawsuit.

[Zaxxon]

Bronx cheer for GM, everybody...

G.M. Drops Its Support for Trump Climate Rollbacks and Aligns With Biden https://nyti.ms/35VppnG

[Zaxxon]

Updated Bolts detailed (out this summer):

"The Chevy Bolt is now a compact SUV with 250 miles of range and ‘hands-free’ driving - The Verge" https://www.theverge.com/platform/amp/2 ... rice-specs

[Zaxxon]

Putting this here as I think it's the best thread we have for it... Like I've been saying each time Ford steps up their announced EV investments, there's a lot more of this coming.

GM significantly bumps up its planned EV development budget. (Up 30% from November's announcement, and 75% from the early-2020 announcement)

Makes sense that the big traditional automakers are announcing these in on-the-surface-impressive numbers, then progressively and repeatedly stepping them up--they're all going to end up putting mind-boggling $$ into BEV development while their combustion business steadily degrades (had to work really hard not to use the word 'burns' there), and admitting that all up front would probably have caused a mass investor stroke.

Now when do we get to see the electric Silverado? Last I heard was 2023 or 2024, I think. I wonder if that's still the case given that Ford will have consumed a bunch of the EV-ready traditional pickup market by then, and Tesla/Rivian will have scooped up most of the more adventurous EV-ready pickup folks next year, too. I'm sure there will be plenty of pickup buyers, but you'd think GM would not want to lag Ford by 1-2 years.

[LordMortis]

I wonder if GM will swoop in and re-integrate Lordstown and get them out of their financial troubles. If RIDE is having the problems investor skeptics keep saying it is having while it is still basically in production as I type, who would be a better fit than GM? Heck, I'd think Lordstown is probably still fully intertwined in GM's ERP.

Edit, heh, google says

https://www.freep.com/story/money/cars/ ... 704361002/

June 15

When asked if GM would be willing to invest more capital in the startup, GM spokesman Jim Cain said, "We are comfortable with our current relationship with Lordstown Motors and don't envision changing it, but we are willing to listen to proposals that make sense for both.”

[Zaxxon]

What a mess...

GM issues second recall of Chevy Bolt EVs after vehicles catch fire

In the meantime, can't park indoors or charge overnight, shouldn't deplete below 70 miles range or charge above 90%, should plug in after every drive.

[Paingod]

shouldn't ...charge above 90%, should plug in after every drive.

So... sit there and watch the car charge until it gets to 89% and pull the plug. That sounds less than ideal. I always leave my phone plugged in overnight, and that sits right next to me on my desk.

[LordMortis]

http://octopusoverlords.com/forum/viewt ... 5#p2835605

[Zaxxon]

shouldn't ...charge above 90%, should plug in after every drive.

So... sit there and watch the car charge until it gets to 89% and pull the plug. That sounds less than ideal. I always leave my phone plugged in overnight, and that sits right next to me on my desk.

You can set it to stop at 90 automatically.

http://octopusoverlords.com/forum/viewt ... 5#p2835605

The recall is new news since then. Hot off the presses this am.

[stessier]

Huh, was expecting the announcement after the market close, not so early in the morning. The fires seem to be disproportionately happening to model 2019 made in the last half of 2018 (so the start of the production run). That would be my car. Hopefully that means I move to the top of the replacement list. It could take them years to do them all.

The wording is interesting though - I bet they try to not replace all the modules. There are 6 modules in each battery. I bet they try to run a diagnostic and only replace some of them. Although, given how the software update didn't work so great, perhaps not. Would be nice to have a brand new battery pack (although over 40k miles I had only been able to detect about 2kW loss in a 60kW pack).

[Zaxxon]

I've seen lots of comments about people pressing GM and getting buyback or MSRP swap offers. Were I in your shoes, that's what I'd be doing. You're right that this is not likely to be something they resolve quickly on the affected cars.

Edit - #petpeevealert kWh, not kW.

[stessier]

I've seen lots of comments about people pressing GM and getting buyback or MSRP swap offers. Were I in your shoes, that's what I'd be doing. You're right that this is not likely to be something they resolve quickly on the affected cars.

Thanks. I'm on a message board where all that stuff is tracked. Seems like they adhere closely to the state's lemon laws. You might be shocked to learn that SC's is quite poor - only 1 year and 12k miles (I'm at 2.11 years and 43k miles). I'll probably still try and start a claim, but most people have been told no.

Edit - #petpeevealert kWh, not kW.

[Zaxxon]

I've seen lots of comments about people pressing GM and getting buyback or MSRP swap offers. Were I in your shoes, that's what I'd be doing. You're right that this is not likely to be something they resolve quickly on the affected cars.

Thanks. I'm on a message board where all that stuff is tracked. Seems like they adhere closely to the state's lemon laws. You might be shocked to learn that SC's is quite poor - only 1 year and 12k miles (I'm at 2.11 years and 43k miles). I'll probably still try and start a claim, but most people have been told no.

Edit - #petpeevealert kWh, not kW.

That's bonkers. This isn't a typical lemon case. Perhaps if they won't make you an offer, you can counter-offer with a liability acceptance for them to sign in the event your car ignites.

I'm sure you have it well in hand, but I've gone through this in the past with another OEM--it wasn't until I moved up to the point of formal email+snail-mail letter to the manufacturer's corporate folks and the dealer's GM that I got movement. Once I did that, it moved pretty quickly, though. FWIW, Colorado's lemon law is pretty similar to yours.

Bottom line is that you now have an EV that is gimped by 30% of its range and by GM's own advice is unsafe to park inside your home structure. If you can't work a buy-back out of that, something's wrong.

[stessier]

I've seen lots of comments about people pressing GM and getting buyback or MSRP swap offers. Were I in your shoes, that's what I'd be doing. You're right that this is not likely to be something they resolve quickly on the affected cars.

Thanks. I'm on a message board where all that stuff is tracked. Seems like they adhere closely to the state's lemon laws. You might be shocked to learn that SC's is quite poor - only 1 year and 12k miles (I'm at 2.11 years and 43k miles). I'll probably still try and start a claim, but most people have been told no.

Edit - #petpeevealert kWh, not kW.

That's bonkers. This isn't a typical lemon case. Perhaps if they won't make you an offer, you can counter-offer with a liability acceptance for them to sign in the event your car ignites.

I'm sure you have it well in hand, but I've gone through this in the past with another OEM--it wasn't until I moved up to the point of formal email+snail-mail letter to the manufacturer's corporate folks and the dealer's GM that I got movement. Once I did that, it moved pretty quickly, though. FWIW, Colorado's lemon law is pretty similar to yours.

Bottom line is that you now have an EV that is gimped by 30% of its range and by GM's own advice is unsafe to park inside your home structure. If you can't work a buy-back out of that, something's wrong.

Are you sure you aren't reading/posting on the other message board as well? I'll be sure to update as things go along. Back in the Spring when people were doing it, when there were relatively few trying, it was taking 8-12 weeks. I'm thinking they might be a bit more backed up now...

[Zaxxon]

Are you sure you aren't reading/posting on the other message board as well? I'll be sure to update as things go along. Back in the Spring when people were doing it, when there were relatively few trying, it was taking 8-12 weeks. I'm thinking they might be a bit more backed up now...

I'm not even sure what board you're referring to. My instance was with Volvo.

[stessier]

Are you sure you aren't reading/posting on the other message board as well? I'll be sure to update as things go along. Back in the Spring when people were doing it, when there were relatively few trying, it was taking 8-12 weeks. I'm thinking they might be a bit more backed up now...

I'm not even sure what board you're referring to. My instance was with Volvo.

Sorry - bad joke. Your wording is identical to the most common opinions I'm ready.

[Zaxxon]

Are you sure you aren't reading/posting on the other message board as well? I'll be sure to update as things go along. Back in the Spring when people were doing it, when there were relatively few trying, it was taking 8-12 weeks. I'm thinking they might be a bit more backed up now...

I'm not even sure what board you're referring to. My instance was with Volvo.

Sorry - bad joke. Your wording is identical to the most common opinions I'm ready.

I'm not sure whether that indicates wisdom or terrible, horrible, very bad, no good advice.

[stessier]

Some more information from Electrek.

We reached out to GM for comment, and they have been very responsive this morning which is great to see. Here’s what we know so far:

The recalled population includes vehicles where cells where made at LG plant in Ochang, Korea. We don’t think every vehicle within recall population had defective batteries. The defect is the simultaneous presence of two rare manufacturing defects in the same battery cell. We believe if customers follow the steps we are suggesting while they wait to complete the new recall repair that should mitigate any battery safety risk.

The spokesperson also mentioned that GM is still working around the clock on the recall update to finalize the details.

Full text of the recall N212343880 is available here, or through checking your VIN on the Chevy Bolt EV Recall website.

The big questions, with some answers from GM
Q: Are all you just replacing some modules, all modules, or entire batteries?

A: Up to and including all modules in the pack, if necessary.

Q: Will you replace all 2017-2019 Korean-produced batteries or just some?

A: The same vehicle population that was affected by the original recall will have replacements. While we are finalizing the repair remedy for the new recall, we will be replacing defective battery modules in the recall population. The final repair might end up including the entire pack or just defective modules or a single module. It is safe to assume that most owners will have something (i.e. module(s)) replaced.

Q: Is there going to be any more diagnostics that can detect these problems?

A: While our existing software diagnostics and battery inspections have been successful, that remedy does not appear to have been fully effective at addressing the safety risk in all vehicles.

Q: What are the two defects that were found?

A: We are unable to provide this information.

Q: How long will this recall program take?

A: We will notify customers when replacement parts are ready.

Q: What can we do to ensure that no batteries catch on fire in the meantime?

A: (Refer to the 3 points in the recall announcement text above)

[stessier]

I got the official email. Amusingly, the MyChevy app still says I have no issue (unless I go to the specific "check for recall" button).

You are an important part of the journey to an all-electric future, and we are humbled that you chose to be on that journey with Chevrolet. As part of GM's commitment to safety, experts from GM and LG have identified the simultaneous presence of two rare manufacturing defects in the same battery cell as the root cause of battery fires in certain Chevrolet Bolt EVs. As a result, GM will be conducting a new recall for the previous population of Bolt EVs (2017-2019) to address the risk of battery fires in these vehicles.

As part of this recall, GM will replace defective battery modules in your vehicle. We will notify you when replacement parts are ready. While we prepare to conduct this recall, we are asking you to take the following steps until the new remedy has been performed:

1. You should, whether or not you received the current software update, return your vehicle to the 90% state of charge limitation using Hilltop Reserve mode (for 2017-2018 model year vehicles) or Target Charge Level mode (for 2019 model year vehicles). If you are unable to successfully make these changes, or do not feel comfortable making these changes, we ask you to visit your dealer to have these adjustments completed.
2. Additionally, we ask that you charge your vehicle after each use and avoid depleting your battery below approximately 70 miles of remaining range, when possible.
3. Out of an abundance of caution, you should continue to park your vehicle outside immediately after charging and do not leave your vehicle charging overnight.

In the meantime, if you have not visited your dealer to receive the advanced diagnostics software, you should visit your nearest Chevrolet EV dealer to obtain the update. After obtaining the software, you should still limit your state of charge to 90% and otherwise follow the advice above.

We understand that trust is earned and not given, and we are devoted to validating your trust by making this process as seamless as possible. This starts with a timely repair experience that supports your needs. Chevrolet's transition to an all-electric future is predicated on our relentless desire to do the right thing, and I want to thank you for putting your trust in our brand.
Questions or concerns?

• View Recall Notice Details Online ›
  OR
• Contact the Chevrolet EV Concierge at 1-833-EVCHEVY (available Monday through Friday from 8–12 a.m. ET; Saturday and Sunday from 12–9 p.m. ET)
  OR
• Contact your preferred Chevrolet EV dealer

Steve Hill
Steve Hill
U.S. Vice President, Chevrolet

[stessier]

Got this letter yesterday.



There is apparently a pilot program that will be addressing the highest risk vehicles first (manufacture date 10/18-11/18) as early as the first week of September, then expanding out. My manufacture date is 8/18. Assuming the new batteries are actually the fix (there was a fire in a 2020 Bolt this week - no news on if the car was damaged before going up), it'll be nice to be getting a brand new pack and warranty.

[Zaxxon]

An 8% capacity boost is a nice bonus.

[Zaxxon]

What's another billion among friends?

[Zaxxon]

More on potential causes.

[Zaxxon]

Production halted until at least mid-September, waiting on LG.

[Zaxxon]

GM advising some Bolt EV owners to park 50 feet away from other cars.

This is really getting absurd. If folks don't want a buyback, that's fine. But the fact that it's apparently not an offered option to every Bolt owner at this point is crazy. Were I an owner I'd be determining proper compensation with my attorney if a buyback was not on the table for my car.

[stessier]

There have been some very amusing posts on the Bolt messages boards about this. One suggestions is that we should have to put NFPA labels on our windshields to let everyone know they are a fire hazard. Another suggestion was that we had to drive around with traffic cones and caution tape to block off the spaces next to us in a 50ft radius since we can park in the middle of nowhere and still have someone park next to us. There was another one that really got a laugh, but I'm not going to repeat.

As for the buyback track - easier said than done. It's taking people months and they base it on the state's lemon laws. South Carolina is horrible in this regard - I'd probably get enough to cover the loan (currently 25% of the original sales price), but nowhere near what I've put into it or enough to get something to replace it (which would be a Model 3 or perhaps Y). So I sit and wait.

[Unagi]

There was another one that really got a laugh, but I'm not going to repeat.

I'm going to suggest that you only brought it up so that I would press you.

C'mon! tell us the inappropriate one!

[Zaxxon]

There was another one that really got a laugh, but I'm not going to repeat.

I'm going to suggest that you only brought it up so that I would press you.

C'mon! tell us the inappropriate one!

Seconded.

As for the buyback track - easier said than done. It's taking people months and they base it on the state's lemon laws. South Carolina is horrible in this regard - I'd probably get enough to cover the loan (currently 25% of the original sales price), but nowhere near what I've put into it or enough to get something to replace it (which would be a Model 3 or perhaps Y). So I sit and wait.

I know, and that's my point. You don't have a lemon, you have a vehicle that GM is quite clearly suggesting is a major fire hazard. The initial 'don't charge to 100%' and avoiding deep discharge-to-full charges unsupervised were one thing. 'Don't park inside anywhere, even in a parking garage' and 'keep 50 feet away from all other vehicles when parking' are quite another.

GM continuing to slow-roll this while people are deprived of major functionality (parking at home!), and are unable to fix or sell their vehicles is a whole other category than owner X having a lemon. The inevitable class-action lawsuits will be un-fun for GM. I understand they're in a very tough position, but at this point it's going to cost GM and/or LG a major percentage of all the money they've received selling Bolts either way. It seems that making owners whole wouldn't be a huge increase in that cost. We'll see.

What pushed me to this view is seeing Nikki Gordon-Bloomfield losing it. She's one of the most level-headed people in the BEV space, she and her spouse are long-time dual-Bolt owners who initially were super-patient with GM, and she's had it. That tells me that we're well past 'reasonable to wait and let it play out' territory.

Of course I don't have a Bolt and am viewing all of this from the periphery, so it's entirely possible I'm misreading it.