Shootings

LordMortis · Post by **LordMortis** » Fri Dec 03, 2021 3:33 pm

Smoove_B wrote: Fri Dec 03, 2021 2:33 pm But if you believe that you need a gun to be loaded and ready to use at all times? I don't know how you can possibly ...

raise children. But that's me. I live a fantasy world, I guess. Since coming in from the sticks I can't remember a time where I haven't had neighbors that haven't gotten in to internal disputes that would have me curled in to a ball as a child.

Smoove_B · Post by **Smoove_B** » Fri Dec 03, 2021 3:54 pm

It's much worse than I even imagined

https://twitter.com/nwarikoo/status/1466818598006104066

Lt. Tim Willis:
On the morning of 11-30, the day of the shooting, Ethan's teacher was alarmed by a note by him that contained a drawing of a handgun with text: "The thoughts won't stop. Hep me." Also had drawing of a bullet with words: "Blood everywhere."

Isgrimnur · Post by **Isgrimnur** » Fri Dec 03, 2021 4:11 pm

Awesome mental health resources we have these days. But I'm sure parents know best what's their schizophrenic children.

LawBeefaroni · Post by **LawBeefaroni** » Fri Dec 03, 2021 4:18 pm

Apparently the parents have fled.

Octavious · Post by **Octavious** » Fri Dec 03, 2021 4:26 pm

Well they handled this super well. They couldn't have kept an eye on the parents?

What a shit show.

Isgrimnur · Post by **Isgrimnur** » Fri Dec 03, 2021 4:26 pm

NBC News

The shooting happened just before 1 p.m. McDonald said that after news broke that there was an active shooter at the high school, Jennifer Crumbley texted her son at 1:22 p.m., "Ethan, don't do it."

Around 1:37 p.m., James Crumbley realized the gun — which was kept in an unlocked drawer in their bedroom — was missing and called police to say that he thought his son might be the shooter, according to McDonald.

The Crumbleys have not cooperated with authorities, nor have they given their son permission to talk with investigators, as is required for minors in Michigan, the county sheriff said.

LawBeefaroni · Post by **LawBeefaroni** » Fri Dec 03, 2021 4:36 pm

Octavious wrote: Fri Dec 03, 2021 4:26 pm Well they handled this super well. They couldn't have kept an eye on the parents? What a shit show.

At his arraignment, they attended via zoom. Not totally unusual these days but they were in a moving vehicle which is a bit of a red flag. You'd think you'd pull over at the very least for your son's multiple homicide arraignment.

Octavious · Post by **Octavious** » Fri Dec 03, 2021 4:38 pm

LawBeefaroni wrote: Fri Dec 03, 2021 4:36 pm
Octavious wrote: Fri Dec 03, 2021 4:26 pm Well they handled this super well. They couldn't have kept an eye on the parents? What a shit show.
At his arraignment, they attended via zoom. Not totally unusual these days but they were in a moving vehicle which is a bit of a red flag. You'd think you'd pull over at the very least for your son's multiple homicide arraignment.

Seriously? Guess they were halfway to Canada by then. Was that a moose in the background? No....

Alefroth · Post by **Alefroth** » Fri Dec 03, 2021 4:38 pm

Geez, now a high school in my town is in lockdown because someone apparently airdropped a photo of a gun.

LordMortis · Post by **LordMortis** » Fri Dec 03, 2021 4:38 pm

https://www.detroitnews.com/story/news/ ... 855814002/

That agreement with attorney Shannon Smith was sometime in the morning, McCabe said around 2 p.m. Friday.

“Our last conversation with the attorney was that she had been trying to reach them by phone and text, and they were not responding,” he said.

McCabe said Fugitive Apprehension Team officers still were out searching for the couple as of mid-afternoon Friday. The Crumbley family owns a 2021 white Kia Seltos with the license plate DQG5203, according to Michigan Secretary of State records.

Their case is charged in 52-3 District Court in Rochester Hills, and an arraignment is tentatively set for 4 p.m. Friday.

Isgrimnur · Post by **Isgrimnur** » Fri Dec 03, 2021 4:56 pm

With the car's infotainment center, the car won't be too hard to find.

Smoove_B · Post by **Smoove_B** » Fri Dec 03, 2021 5:00 pm

I'm still trying to process that their 15 year old is in police custody and their gut reaction is...to flee? Parents of the year. This kid had no chance.

Octavious · Post by **Octavious** » Fri Dec 03, 2021 5:04 pm

Well I mean they know the kid is screwed.

Zaxxon · Post by **Zaxxon** » Fri Dec 03, 2021 5:08 pm

Smoove_B wrote: Fri Dec 03, 2021 5:00 pm I'm still trying to process that their 15 year old is in police custody and their gut reaction is...to flee? Parents of the year. This kid had no chance.

Even before the fleeing, that was clear (just don't get caught text). But absolutely. Burn em both.

LordMortis · Post by **LordMortis** » Fri Dec 03, 2021 5:23 pm

the DetNews link appear to be updated

On Thursday night, we contacted the Oakland County prosecutor to discuss this matter and to advise her that James and Jennifer Crumbley would be turning themselves in to be arraigned," lawyers Shannon Smith and Mariell Lehman told The Detroit News. "Instead of communicating with us, the prosecutor held a press conference to announce charges."

"The Crumbleys left town on the night of the tragic shooting for their own safety. They are returning to the area to be arraigned. They are not fleeing from law enforcement despite recent comments in media reports."

They left town without contacting that authorities... for their own safety... I can definately see where they'd fear for their own safety. But then they're all guns are their safety, right?

malchior · Post by **malchior** » Fri Dec 03, 2021 5:30 pm

https://twitter.com/labboypro/status/14 ... 1950318593

LawBeefaroni · Post by **LawBeefaroni** » Fri Dec 03, 2021 5:47 pm

malchior wrote: Fri Dec 03, 2021 5:30 pm https://twitter.com/labboypro/status/14 ... 1950318593

Looks like that Sheriff is a 4-star general and an admiral so I'm inclined to believe him.

Smoove_B · Post by **Smoove_B** » Fri Dec 03, 2021 6:13 pm

https://twitter.com/RadioFreeTom/status ... 0163405825

The mother wrote an open letter to Trump talking about how they were suffering, the father was disabled, they couldn't afford a tutor for their son. But they got a 9mm on Black Friday and they're on the run in a 2021 Kia. Because globalization or something.

Isgrimnur · Post by **Isgrimnur** » Fri Dec 03, 2021 6:26 pm

Raw Story

The mother of Michigan school shooting suspect Ethan Crumbley — 43-year-old Jennifer Crumbley — penned an open letter to then-president-elect Donald Trump in 2016, thanking him for "allowing my right to bear arms."
...
In November 2016, Jennifer Crumbley posted her open letter to Trump on her blog, the Daily Beast reported. Her husband, James Crumbley, wrote above a link to his wife's open letter on Facebook, "My wife can be spot on. Sometimes."

Five years can make a bit of a difference.

Holman · Post by **Holman** » Fri Dec 03, 2021 7:18 pm

LawBeefaroni wrote: Fri Dec 03, 2021 5:47 pm Looks like that Sheriff is a 4-star general and an admiral so I'm inclined to believe him.

It always amuses me that county sheriffs festoon themselves like a Field Marshal while most of them have like 55 employees.

Octavious · Post by **Octavious** » Fri Dec 03, 2021 11:54 pm

So they withdrew 4K and turned off their phones. Their attorney? They are not running they are going to turn themselves in. Suuurrreeeee

Daehawk · Post by **Daehawk** » Sat Dec 04, 2021 12:06 am

Octavious wrote: Fri Dec 03, 2021 11:54 pm So they withdrew 4K and turned off their phones. Their attorney? They are not running they are going to turn themselves in. Suuurrreeeee

We can only hope they flee police and suffer a single car accident that kills them. Save some money.

gbasden · Post by **gbasden** » Sat Dec 04, 2021 2:26 am

I know I have some anger issues with idiots, but you seem to be going a bit overboard with wishing violent death on a wide swath of humanity.

malchior · Post by **malchior** » Sat Dec 04, 2021 6:57 am

WaPo

The fugitive parents of a 15-year-old boy accused of fatally shooting four classmates at a Michigan high school were taken into custody overnight, after they were found hiding in a commercial building in Detroit, police said in a news conference early Saturday.

Jennifer and James Crumbley were located after a tip off from the local community, and were taken into custody unarmed and “without incident,” Detroit police chief James White said. It came after an extensive search for the pair involving K-9 units, local law enforcement and the U.S. Marshals Service.

The parents each face four counts of involuntary manslaughter, after being criminally charged in an extraordinarily rare move to hold parents accountable when a minor uses their weapon in a school shooting.

The pair “did not break in” to the building, but “were aided,” White said, adding that police were actively investigating one other person that may have assisted the couple.

Maybe this could get more absurd and the authorities could announce that the person aiding them was their attorney.

hepcat · Post by **hepcat** » Sat Dec 04, 2021 9:24 am

I have to wonder if the NRA will take up their cause, or if they’re too hot for even them.

Unagi · Post by **Unagi** » Sat Dec 04, 2021 9:30 am

Making use of commercial property in Detroit has to catch the eye of even the most casual observer. Not a great way to hide.

Grifman · Post by **Grifman** » Sat Dec 04, 2021 9:42 am

A lot of crazy stuff going on with this case, but for the life of me, I can’t figure out why the school didn’t search the shooter’s backpack the morning of the shooting when they discussed his drawings with him and his parents. If I had a student and was worried about a potential shooting and he’s sitting in front of me with a backpack, I’d sure be looking inside before letting him go. That doesn’t absolve anyone else of their responsibility but this seems like a terrible oversight on the school’s part.

FYI, my school district recently announced they will be going to transparent book bags/backpacks due to recent incidents with guns in schools here.

RunningMn9 · Post by **RunningMn9** » Sat Dec 04, 2021 9:51 am

Grifman wrote: Sat Dec 04, 2021 9:42 amA lot of crazy stuff going on with this case, but for the life of me, I can’t figure out why the school didn’t search the shooter’s backpack the morning of the shooting when they discussed his drawings with him and his parents. If I had a student and was worried about a potential shooting and he’s sitting in front of me with a backpack, I’d sure be looking inside before letting him go. That doesn’t absolve anyone else of their responsibility but this seems like a terrible oversight on the school’s part.

Was his social media something already on the radar the morning of (were school officials aware that his parents just bought him a gun)? If so, yeah, I feel like a pretty important question to ask when the parents and kid are sitting there is "where is the gun? and are any other guns accounted for? Also, open the backpack and your locker or get out of the school and don't come back."

I assume lawyers have prevented most of that though.

Unagi · Post by **Unagi** » Sat Dec 04, 2021 10:05 am

Grifman wrote: Sat Dec 04, 2021 9:42 am
FYI, my school district recently announced they will be going to transparent book bags/backpacks due to recent incidents with guns in schools here.

I don't think that will make a difference - just in that, a kid can hide a gun inside a fake book or empty binder very easily. Metal detectors are where they are all headed...

Isgrimnur · Post by **Isgrimnur** » Sat Dec 04, 2021 12:18 pm

Unagi wrote:Making use of commercial property in Detroit has to catch the eye of even the most casual observer. Not a great way to hide.

They should have gone exurb industrial. Higher chance of giant salamanders, but less chance of being observed.

Smoove_B · Post by **Smoove_B** » Sat Dec 04, 2021 12:32 pm

Isgrimnur wrote: Fri Dec 03, 2021 6:26 pm In November 2016, Jennifer Crumbley posted her open letter to Trump on her blog, the Daily Beast reported. Her husband, James Crumbley, wrote above a link to his wife's open letter on Facebook, "My wife can be spot on. Sometimes."

I can't stop thinking about this letter. It's always projection.

At that point, Jennifer started complaining about 'illegal immigrant parents' and their children at a school where her mom teaches.

'Most of their parents are locked up,' Jennifer wrote.

Little Raven · Post by **Little Raven** » Sat Dec 04, 2021 12:33 pm

This whole scenario is just baffling.

Charging the parents of school shooters is extremely rare, even when firearms have been left unsecured. But then, these parent's aren't being charged with making a weapon accessible to a minor, they're being charged with manslaughter, which would indicate that the prosecutor thinks they are outright co-conspirators.

And to top it all off, they tried to run, which is just madness in this day and age. I mean, when was the last time a high-profile criminal actually succeeded in running? Where were they thinking they were going to go?

This whole family appears to be damaged beyond belief. Good grief.

malchior · Post by **malchior** » Sat Dec 04, 2021 12:38 pm

Little Raven wrote: Sat Dec 04, 2021 12:33 pm which would indicate that the prosecutor thinks they are outright co-conspirators

I think what's happened from the prosecutor sharing communications between the parents and the son is that she will argue that their negligence led to the deaths. Not some active conspiracy especially since there is no conspiracy charge.

This whole family appears to be damaged beyond belief. Good grief.

Yup they all seem like super winners. Too bad our society's insane policies allowed them to kill 4 children.

Kurth · Post by **Kurth** » Sat Dec 04, 2021 12:59 pm

Grifman wrote: Sat Dec 04, 2021 9:42 am FYI, my school district recently announced they will be going to transparent book bags/backpacks due to recent incidents with guns in schools here.

That seems insane to me. I know kids’ privacy rights in school are not exactly robust, but this seems over the top. I know I’m going to sound like a broken record, but every time one of these horrible school shootings happens, I feel like people lose their minds. In the same way that COVID highlights how bad most people are at analyzing risk, so do mass shooting events.

malchior · Post by **malchior** » Sat Dec 04, 2021 1:08 pm

Kurth wrote: Sat Dec 04, 2021 12:59 pm
Grifman wrote: Sat Dec 04, 2021 9:42 am FYI, my school district recently announced they will be going to transparent book bags/backpacks due to recent incidents with guns in schools here.
That seems insane to me. I know kids’ privacy rights in school are not exactly robust, but this seems over the top.

It's bad in all sorts of ways. But to me this is the constant rachet of trying to chase point fixes instead of solutions to the cause in the first place.

Smoove_B · Post by **Smoove_B** » Sat Dec 04, 2021 1:08 pm

Yeah, the clear backpacks thing is theater. The teacher in this case identified all kinds of red flags and took action, but nothing happened. If the only way to stop school shootings it to expect someone to see a gun inside a backpack? Everyone has lost their mind. There must be some other way to deal with this. Some larger measure that we could consider as a nation. Oh well, I guess we'll do nothing and see what happens....again.

malchior · Post by **malchior** » Sat Dec 04, 2021 1:11 pm

But we did something. Parents are now on notice not to be completely negligent instead of just accidentally negligent. An important step forward.

LawBeefaroni · Post by **LawBeefaroni** » Sat Dec 04, 2021 1:17 pm

malchior wrote: Sat Dec 04, 2021 1:11 pm But we did something. Parents are now on notice not to be completely negligent instead of just accidentally negligent. An important step forward.

Hopefully schools learned some lessons here too.

The clear backpacks are ridiculous. NFL has done that theater. It's only good for companies that sell backpacks that cost $1.26 and are priced at $30. I had a bag that they wouldn't let in so I bought a clear bag and put my bag inside it. Magically safe.

You can hide a modern 9mm handgun in something the size of a wallet.

Jaymann · Post by **Jaymann** » Sat Dec 04, 2021 1:41 pm

LawBeefaroni wrote: Sat Dec 04, 2021 1:17 pm
malchior wrote: Sat Dec 04, 2021 1:11 pm But we did something. Parents are now on notice not to be completely negligent instead of just accidentally negligent. An important step forward.
Hopefully schools learned some lessons here too.

The clear backpacks are ridiculous. NFL has done that theater. It's only good for companies that sell backpacks that cost $1.26 and are priced at $30. I had a bag that they wouldn't let in so I bought a clear bag and put my bag inside it. Magically safe.

Comedy gold, Jerry.

Daehawk · Post by **Daehawk** » Sat Dec 04, 2021 2:12 pm

LawBeefaroni wrote: Sat Dec 04, 2021 1:17 pm The clear backpacks are ridiculous. NFL has done that theater. It's only good for companies that sell backpacks that cost $1.26 and are priced at $30. I had a bag that they wouldn't let in so I bought a clear bag and put my bag inside it. Magically safe.

You can hide a modern 9mm handgun in something the size of a wallet.