Ukraine

[Skinypupy]

To lighten the mood.

In what world does that lighten the mood.
Damn.

Yeah, I keep seeing this shared around social media as some sort of "inspirational moment" or "see, there is still beauty in the world". Um...no.

A child whose only option to sing is doing so in a bomb shelter during an active bombardment as her city is destroyed is one of the most depressing things I can think of.

[msduncan]

Right.



Because Pro-Russia == Pro-Democracy.
I think you’ll find the ‘dirt’ on our hands here was actually soap.

As I said....Russia's plan all along has been to try to re-institute the Soviet-bloc. However, the point stands that we keep meddling into other country's politics and is continually gets us engaged in situations like this.

[Scraper]

Right.



Because Pro-Russia == Pro-Democracy.
I think you’ll find the ‘dirt’ on our hands here was actually soap.

As I said....Russia's plan all along has been to try to re-institute the Soviet-bloc. However, the point stands that we keep meddling into other country's politics and is continually gets us engaged in situations like this.

Yes because if we give up our spot as the World's super power and withdraw from all international relations that will work out real great for us. I mean what could go wrong with letting Russia install puppet governments all over Eastern Europe?

[Smoove_B]

However, the point stands that we keep meddling into other country's politics and is continually gets us engaged in situations like this.

Where one sovereign nation invades another? That happens continually? Did I hit my head? Is it 1939 again?

[Max Peck]

That being said -- The US did shadow fund the Coop in 2014 to oust an elected pro-Russian, anti-NATO leader in Ukraine.

Citation?

[Zarathud]

Reagan would weep.

[LawBeefaroni]

To lighten the mood.

In what world does that lighten the mood.
Damn.

Yeah, I keep seeing this shared around social media as some sort of "inspirational moment" or "see, there is still beauty in the world". Um...no.

A child whose only option to sing is doing so in a bomb shelter during an active bombardment as her city is destroyed is one of the most depressing things I can think of.

Because the thread moves fast:

To lighten the mood.

That's being passed around as some kind of happy, inspiring video but it's incredibly sad to me. She's in a bomb shelter in the middle of a war zone and stands a relatively high chance of being killed in the coming days or weeks. But we'll send some aid and implement partial sanctions!

[msduncan]

To lighten the mood.

In what world does that lighten the mood.
Damn.

Yeah, I keep seeing this shared around social media as some sort of "inspirational moment" or "see, there is still beauty in the world". Um...no.

A child whose only option to sing is doing so in a bomb shelter during an active bombardment as her city is destroyed is one of the most depressing things I can think of.

Because the thread moves fast:

To lighten the mood.

That's being passed around as some kind of happy, inspiring video but it's incredibly sad to me. She's in a bomb shelter in the middle of a war zone and stands a relatively high chance of being killed in the coming days or weeks. But we'll send some aid and implement partial sanctions!

I thought it was meant to show the innocence of children, not some sort of inspirational moment.

[Scraper]

Reagan would weep.

So would Nixon, since he argued against the Rand Paul theory of foreign involvement when it comes to Russia.

[raydude]

However, the point stands that we keep meddling into other country's politics and is continually gets us engaged in situations like this.

Where one sovereign nation invades another? That happens continually? Did I hit my head? Is it 1939 again?

Assuming the Ukrainians were able to oust their president in 2014 with our help, why didn't Russia try the same playbook again? Do you think perhaps Russia knew the Ukrainian people were going to vote against another puppet president? I mean, you're Russia. You have two options with respect to Ukraine. 1 - try to get your man elected president. 2 - Invade. Why do you think they didn't try option 1 again?

[Jaymann]

That being said -- The US did shadow fund the Coop in 2014 to oust an elected pro-Russian, anti-NATO leader in Ukraine.

Citation?

And can you leave Coop out of this? Doesn't he have enough problems already?

[Kurth]

Right.



Because Pro-Russia == Pro-Democracy.
I think you’ll find the ‘dirt’ on our hands here was actually soap.

As I said....Russia's plan all along has been to try to re-institute the Soviet-bloc. However, the point stands that we keep meddling into other country's politics and is continually gets us engaged in situations like this.

Dr. Seuss would like a word with you, msd:

[xwraith]

This whole "Z" thing on the Russian side.

I keep thinking "Kneel before Zod!"

It just strikes me as rather ridiculous.

[LawBeefaroni]

This whole "Z" thing on the Russian side.

I keep thinking "Kneel before Zod!"

It just strikes me as rather ridiculous.

[Lagom Lite]

This whole "Z" thing on the Russian side.

I keep thinking "Kneel before Zod!"

It just strikes me as rather ridiculous.

Just keep walking, Charlie. Keep walking.

[El Guapo]

[msduncan]

There has never been very much separation between Soviet Communism and Fascism. I'm glad that the political left has finally figured this out. Also, it's impossible to know what the opinions of rank and file Russians are to their military actions. The media is so tightly controlled there, and the older Russians know better than to say anything that counters the official positions.... My guess is that the government is and has been much more unpopular than widely known.... they just can't express that discontent without fear of consequences.

[hepcat]

There has never been very much separation between Soviet Communism and Fascism. I'm glad that the political left has finally figured this out.

The political right has a history of expressing admiration for Putin in recent years, so I would say that's a more concerning disconnect. I wish they would figure that out.

[Max Peck]

Afghans are tweeting roadside device instructions and examples to Ukrainians....

I don't know how I feel about this.

To clarify: it's not the motivations of the afghans that is throwing me, it's logging on to Twitter and seeing mortars converted.

[Max Peck]

There has never been very much separation between Soviet Communism and Fascism. I'm glad that the political left has finally figured this out.

The political right has a history of expressing admiration for Putin in recent years, so I would say that's a more concerning disconnect. I wish they would figure that out.

Why is that a disconnect? Putin isn't a leftist, or a socialist, or a communist. He's an authoritarian ethnonationalist strongman. He's exactly what the right aspires to be.

[$iljanus]

This Clint Erlich chap seems to be very popular with right-wing Americans, so I can only presume that he knows what he's talking about when it comes to gaslighting. I'm sure his analysis is not influenced by his apparent pro-Russian, anti-Ukraine view of the conflict. After scanning his Twitter feed, it seems like he's working very hard to portray the Ukrainian government as the bad guys.

Yup. I scanned his Twitter feed today. He definitely has picked a side, and it ain't the country that's being invaded. The cherry on top is he's insinuating that US foreign policy has driven Russia to invade Ukraine.

You will never see me picking Russia's side since I've long been convinced that the old guard Soviets (ie Putin) never truly abandoned their original positions. The Soviet Union was merely rebranded so that they could suck in US aid and trade to get them through the economic crisis in the 1990s, and they have been waiting and trying to figure out a way to re-boot since then.

That being said -- The US did shadow fund the Coop in 2014 to oust an elected pro-Russian, anti-NATO leader in Ukraine. The elections that put him there had international observers that deemed them to be fair. Russia has been planning this war ever since. Therefore, the United States does not have clean hands on this matter.

If I can add some clarifications, this wasn’t a military backed coup but a revolution by people against a repressive regime who used brutal police state tactics to try and smother the people’s desire for better relations with Europe which was supported by their parliament and the desire for a functioning democracy vs a kleptocracy backed by Russia. He may have been fairly elected but his actions in office led the people to say “enough”. Also as with many revolts against strongmen it’s the government that has the bullets but the people had the courage to say no more. Do some reading about the Maidan Uprising also called the Revolution of Dignity. Even after the revolution there was still entrenched corruption which my brother in law complained about often but one got the sense that perhaps things were slowly moving towards a better direction with the newest president. Well until the Ukraine was invaded.

[Archinerd]

There has never been very much separation between Soviet Communism and Fascism. I'm glad that the political left has finally figured this out.

Incorrect. I believe whatever Hillary's Email newsletter tells me to believe.

[hepcat]

There has never been very much separation between Soviet Communism and Fascism. I'm glad that the political left has finally figured this out.

The political right has a history of expressing admiration for Putin in recent years, so I would say that's a more concerning disconnect. I wish they would figure that out.

Why is that a disconnect? Putin isn't a leftist, or a socialist, or a communist. He's an authoritarian ethnonationalist strongman. He's exactly what the right aspires to be.

Because they try to present themselves as the opposite. How you and I perceive them is not relevant.

[msduncan]

There has never been very much separation between Soviet Communism and Fascism. I'm glad that the political left has finally figured this out.

The political right has a history of expressing admiration for Putin in recent years, so I would say that's a more concerning disconnect. I wish they would figure that out.

Why is that a disconnect? Putin isn't a leftist, or a socialist, or a communist. He's an authoritarian ethnonationalist strongman. He's exactly what the right aspires to be.

He's an authoritarian ethnonationalist strongman exactly how the Soviet communist party trained him to be, in the very mint poured from the Soviet mold. Also, not coincidentally, the eventual path every communist experiment has gone in the last century.

[msduncan]

Also, it's time for me to check out again. I should have taken the warning sign when about 30% of this thread about a Ukrainian/Russian war was filled with Republican bashing that even this topic was unsafe to return to ( I mean we had one post wishing they could push a button and eliminate all of the GOP). Have a great day fellas. We aren't enemies like you seem to think we are. I hope for Ukraine to win this thing, and for the old Soviet guard to finally be disposed of once and for all. However, I also hope this whole thing stymies the march towards Marxism in this country, which has accelerated over the past decade among the youth, and the policies pushed by the left.

[pr0ner]

Also, it's time for me to check out again. I should have taken the warning sign when about 30% of this thread about a Ukrainian/Russian war was filled with Republican bashing that even this topic was unsafe to return to ( I mean we had one post wishing they could push a button and eliminate all of the GOP). Have a great day fellas. We aren't enemies like you seem to think we are. I hope for Ukraine to win this thing, and for the old Soviet guard to finally be disposed of once and for all. However, I also hope this whole thing stymies the march towards Marxism in this country, which has accelerated over the past decade among the youth, and the policies pushed by the left.

[Carpet_pissr]

I think our money is better spent on direct contributions to aid groups. Most AirBnB hosts are probably on the up and up, but there's a definite possibility of scammers, plus you're filtering your contribution through an individual's real-estate investment rather than taking advantage of the economies of scale that aid groups enjoy.

I'll nitpick a little there...but I definitely agree about the economies of scale part.

If anything, the airbnb deal is the most direct way to contribute, and the very nature of contributing to an NGO/aid group means your donation is getting 'filtered' through that org, and hopefully directly to the people.

You could argue that there are more urgent needs than money, though, and I think that's where giving to an aid group makes sense (money which in turn is used to buy....blankets, medical suipplies, food, etc). Do both!

As for the scamming, I think I addressed that pretty well above. Pretty easy ways to cut that risk wayyy down if not eliminate completely.

[Smoove_B]

"I'm checking out, but before I stop shitting in this thread, here's a final thought to let you know how I really feel."

[Freyland]

MSD, I just want all the people in this country taken care of, with compassion and fairness. What do you want?

[raydude]

Also, it's time for me to check out again. I should have taken the warning sign when about 30% of this thread about a Ukrainian/Russian war was filled with Republican bashing that even this topic was unsafe to return to ( I mean we had one post wishing they could push a button and eliminate all of the GOP). Have a great day fellas. We aren't enemies like you seem to think we are. I hope for Ukraine to win this thing, and for the old Soviet guard to finally be disposed of once and for all. However, I also hope this whole thing stymies the march towards Marxism in this country, which has accelerated over the past decade among the youth, and the policies pushed by the left.

You came into this thread right after I posted that a Twitter user was right-wing and favored the Russians. If your point was to say that "Not all right-wingers support Russia" then you could have made the point more strongly. As it was, you implied that the invasion was partly our fault for "not having clean hands". If that's not excusing Russia then I don't know what is.

[LawBeefaroni]

Macdonald's bows to pressure, closes all 850 locations in Russia.

As much as I hate to admit it, moves like this are huge because they cut through the censorship and media control. No Big Macs is no Big Macs, regardless of how it's spun.

[Jaymann]

Dang, there goes the "Over 850 Million Z Burgers Served" promotion.

[Archinerd]

I expect Starbucks to do the same very soon. They pretend to do the right thing all the time, and I'm surprised it took them this long.

Coca-Cola has a long history of supporting dictator's though. Somebody should make a COIN game with Coca-Cola as one of the factions.

[Alefroth]

( I mean we had one post wishing they could push a button and eliminate all of the GOP).

Look what you've done now, Daehawk.

[Zaxxon]

Macdonald's bows to pressure, closes all 850 locations in Russia.

As much as I hate to admit it, moves like this are huge because they cut through the censorship and media control. No Big Macs is no Big Macs, regardless of how it's spun.

More like this, please.

[LordMortis]

MSD, I just want all the people in this country taken care of, with compassion and fairness. What do you want?

Yes, please. I don't give to charity often. Not nearly as often as I should and this has moved me to do so and I feel like I should do much more. It sort of sheds light on all of the wars I've looked past as well.

[Lagom Lite]

Also, it's time for me to check out again. I should have taken the warning sign when about 30% of this thread about a Ukrainian/Russian war was filled with Republican bashing that even this topic was unsafe to return to ( I mean we had one post wishing they could push a button and eliminate all of the GOP). Have a great day fellas. We aren't enemies like you seem to think we are. I hope for Ukraine to win this thing, and for the old Soviet guard to finally be disposed of once and for all. However, I also hope this whole thing stymies the march towards Marxism in this country, which has accelerated over the past decade among the youth, and the policies pushed by the left.

I consider myself something of a marxist, and believe me when I say marxism isn't your problem. It isn't Russia's problem either, coincidentally. Russian oppression goes waaay back.

Look, the worker's movements in 19th century Europe, including the part that went by the Communist moniker, wanted to increase the power and influence of the working class. Regular Joes, if you will. In western and northern Europe, this went the way of labor union organizing and towards democracy (often in alliance with buorgeois liberals). The Bolsheviks in Russia were obviously not doing this.

The Bolsheviks instead did the Russian thing, which goes back hundreds of years to ol' Ivan. The KGB was essentially the Czarist secret police, repurposed and turned up to eleven. Scientific socialism (marxism), originally intended to provide a framework for understanding the historic struggles of the oppressed, was repurposed into a totalitarian state religion, complete with a pope (Stalin's cult of personality), dogma and zealous inquisition.

It's very sad that Russia can't ever seem to shake their penchant for authoritarian strongmen.

[Jaymann]

Also, it's time for me to check out again. I should have taken the warning sign when about 30% of this thread about a Ukrainian/Russian war was filled with Republican bashing that even this topic was unsafe to return to ( I mean we had one post wishing they could push a button and eliminate all of the GOP). Have a great day fellas. We aren't enemies like you seem to think we are. I hope for Ukraine to win this thing, and for the old Soviet guard to finally be disposed of once and for all. However, I also hope this whole thing stymies the march towards Marxism in this country, which has accelerated over the past decade among the youth, and the policies pushed by the left.

I consider myself something of a marxist, and believe me when I say marxism isn't your problem. It isn't Russia's problem either, coincidentally. Russian oppression goes waaay back.

Look, the worker's movements in 19th century Europe, including the part that went by the Communist moniker, wanted to increase the power and influence of the working class. Regular Joes, if you will. In western and northern Europe, this went the way of labor union organizing and towards democracy (often in alliance with buorgeois liberals). The Bolsheviks in Russia were obviously not doing this.

The Bolsheviks instead did the Russian thing, which goes back hundreds of years to ol' Ivan. The KGB was essentially the Czarist secret police, repurposed and turned up to eleven. Scientific socialism (marxism), originally intended to provide a framework for understanding the historic struggles of the oppressed, was repurposed into a totalitarian state religion, complete with a pope (Stalin's cult of personality), dogma and zealous inquisition.

It's very sad that Russia can't ever seem to shake their penchant for authoritarian strongmen.

Well fucking said.

[Jaymann]

And bizarrely in this country you have blue collar "no digitiles" fighting like hell to stay oppressed and calling it freedom.

[Daehawk]

McDonald's is shutting down its Russian restaurants

McDonald's has decided to temporarily close all our restaurants in Russia and pause all operations in the market," CEO Chris Kempczinski said in a statement Tuesday.

There were 847 locations of McDonald's in Russia at the close of last year, according to an investor document.