How is your career going?

[Jeff V]

when I got started in IT, everyone wore onions on their belts.

Well, it was the style at the time.

One of the jobs I was extremely qualified for; among the 6 interviews I had, one was with a peer who just got promoted to the same level I was interviewing for. He was promoted from production support -- and he thought that the combination of his production smarts along with my ability to navigate the realm of upper management would have been a great combo. All of the interviews I had with that company were good (and I had production experience too, and with a packaging company...this company made predominately can packaging, tuna cans, beer cans, etc.) But I was older than my would-be boss, as well as the CIO, and, I think, his direct boss.

[Carpet_pissr]

when I got started in IT, everyone wore onions on their belts.

One of the jobs I was extremely qualified for; among the 6 interviews I had, one was with a peer who just got promoted to the same level I was interviewing for. He was promoted from production support -- and he thought that the combination of his production smarts along with my ability to navigate the realm of upper management would have been a great combo. All of the interviews I had with that company were good (and I had production experience too, and with a packaging company...this company made predominately can packaging, tuna cans, beer cans, etc.) But I was older than my would-be boss, as well as the CIO, and, I think, his direct boss.

Do you have a recruiter working for you currently? If you don't I would at least try it. Done all the LinkedIn things like showing TO RECRUITERS ONLY, that you are "Open to Work"? I signed up for the LinkedIn "jobs" module just for a couple of months to get the additional "Insights" that it gives you - data about who has applied for a certain job, what their skills are, previous titles, education, etc. Pretty nifty (and a bit creepy).

There are so many tweaks you can do that I didn't even get to...like taking the short "skills" tests and adding those to your profile (solely for the reason that the algos look for those things).

Also, how old are you exactly? If you're 68 and trying to get a job doing what you did before...well.....it may be time to pivot!

[Zenn7]

My counterpart at the mothership is leaving and I was just assigned most of their responsibilities. In line for a decent temp bonus and possibly a level up. But shit is getting real.

Today I "celebrate" 20 years with my current employer. A rather uncommon thing in tech. Before coming here I'd never worked anywhere else full time for more than two years.

I am still trying to make a selection from the "awards" they offer for the anniversary. jewelry, watches, luggage, exercise equipment, small appliances all in the $5-600 range.... meh all the way. I've considered selecting based on resale value and ease of resale (damn wish they offered a PS5!) but that feels wrong. Apple AirPods Max are the current top contender but maybe the exercise bike, but not sure where I'd put it or if I would be more likely to use it than the treadmill. I am guessing it doesn't come with a gift receipt.

I got sick of min/maxing those things and just pick one as a gift for someone else. Got my BIL a watch this last time but it's still sitting in my closet because we haven't seen each other for a year due to COVID. I got reset from 20yrs when I moved 6 years ago but the gifts here are a tad better.

Yeah once I decided I didn't want any of it, I reviewed it with my wife in mind and then my kids, and then I showed her all the options. Going beyond my immediate family I think most folks would be pissed if I gave them a $500+ gift. I appreciate the thought, but a less restrictive catalog would be nice.

When I first started at my current job, they did gift books (got 2/5/10 year - nothing I ever wanted, let my wife pick something out, made her happy).

Then they sold our division (which was very good for me as they were eliminating my team at the first company) - 15 year gift, they gave me points in our reward system where I could get VISA gift cards - roughly every 10 points= dollar, so I got a $250 visa card.

The company that bought us after that I think just gives gift cards or cash bonuses (I forget which) because I don't think I had to choose, just got $350 either bonus check or VISA card. Only downside with the Visa card/bonus is they tax it. No so bad for the bonus, you just get less, but the VISA card, they take the tax outta your paycheck. Mildly annoying (not a really big deal as I just use the cards for gas/groceries/out to eat - mostly stuff I'd have bought anyway).

Can't remember what we get for 25 years (think $500 maybe and then same every 5 after that). In 3 years, I'll find out what they are doing currently (assuming we don't get sold between now and then, doesn't seem likely but who knows).

[Jeff V]

when I got started in IT, everyone wore onions on their belts.

One of the jobs I was extremely qualified for; among the 6 interviews I had, one was with a peer who just got promoted to the same level I was interviewing for. He was promoted from production support -- and he thought that the combination of his production smarts along with my ability to navigate the realm of upper management would have been a great combo. All of the interviews I had with that company were good (and I had production experience too, and with a packaging company...this company made predominately can packaging, tuna cans, beer cans, etc.) But I was older than my would-be boss, as well as the CIO, and, I think, his direct boss.

Do you have a recruiter working for you currently? If you don't I would at least try it. Done all the LinkedIn things like showing TO RECRUITERS ONLY, that you are "Open to Work"? I signed up for the LinkedIn "jobs" module just for a couple of months to get the additional "Insights" that it gives you - data about who has applied for a certain job, what their skills are, previous titles, education, etc. Pretty nifty (and a bit creepy).

There are so many tweaks you can do that I didn't even get to...like taking the short "skills" tests and adding those to your profile (solely for the reason that the algos look for those things).

Also, how old are you exactly? If you're 68 and trying to get a job doing what you did before...well.....it may be time to pivot!

I have many recruiters ostensibly working for me, about 95% of the interest I get is from recruiters...sometimes a handful recruiting for the same job!

I am 59 the next 45 days or so. Too old to pivot to anything.

[Kraken]

Labor shortages across economy creating opportunities for older workers.

Employment data show the number of older workers has been slowly edging up after a sharp dropoff at the outset of the pandemic, when millions lost their jobs or left the workforce voluntarily.

Last week, the Labor Department reported the US jobless rate dropped to 3.6 percent, a postpandemic low, as employers added an average of 600,000 jobs a month since last fall. The number of workers over 55 in the labor force grew by nearly 1 million in the past year.

Not all older applicants are finding the doors open, and many still aren’t ready to return to full-time jobs without more flexible schedules and the option to work from home. But plenty of employers have become more adaptable, in part to accommodate working families who had kids learning from home earlier in the pandemic.
...
While some businesses remain resistant to embracing older employees, others are adapting in ways that would have been hard to imagine in the past. When the Publicis Groupe hosted an online panel titled “Advice to My Younger Self” last year, the intergenerational event was sponsored by a relatively new employee group called Sages, made up of US staffers over 50 years old and their younger allies at the firm.

Sages’ aim is “to make [older] people feel included,” said Geraldine White, chief diversity officer at Publicis, a global marketing and communications firm that owns dozens of agencies, including Digitas and Sapient in Boston. “If you think about it, we will all hopefully get to be over 50 some time.”

In-house affinity groups for older workers may be a sign that pockets of corporate America are warming to gray-haired employees — and in some cases, folding them into businesses’ diversity and inclusion efforts.

“It’s a cultural shift,” said Tim Driver, founder of the Age-Friendly Institute in Waltham, which vets and certifies employers open to hiring older workers and publishes a national list of those that earned his organization’s stamp of approval.

Some recruiters cite the strong work ethic of older workers, saying they’re more likely than younger colleagues to show up on time and less apt to quit or call in sick — all assets in a heating economy dogged by severe labor shortages.
...
Some labor market watchers question whether the environment has really improved for all older employees, though, especially those in the tech sector and in blue-collar jobs.

In a report last week, the New School’s Schwartz Center for Economic Policy Analysis in New York said the size of the nation’s retired population swelled by an additional 1.1 million older adults beyond the normal trend since March 2020. Many were pushed out of jobs during the COVID-19 lockdowns rather than leaving on their own, and have given up looking for work.

Ageism, a toxic mix of bias and stereotypes, persists in some industries, notably technology and other innovation sectors, where a startup culture and youthful vibe hold sway.

“Employers used the pandemic as a once-in-a-lifetime chance to get rid of older workers,” said Teresa Ghilarducci, a New School economics professor. She said the labor market remains “inhospitable” to many hourly workers in service businesses.

[Jeff V]

I wonder how many of those jobs are Walmart greeters?

[dbt1949]

Or cashiers at 7-11?

[Carpet_pissr]

“ Some recruiters cite the strong work ethic of older workers, saying they’re more likely than younger colleagues to show up on time and less apt to quit or call in sick — all assets in a heating economy dogged by severe labor shortages.”

At the end of my brief (5-6 months?) stint as a mail carrier with USPS, I remember literally asking someone what ‘calling out’ meant. Definitely got the ‘can’t tell if serious’ look.

Apparently it was crazy rare for someone to go months (especially in the epically and constantly shat upon position I had as a ‘city carrier assistant’) without calling out sick (unpaid of course at that level).

Considering they would have us work 10-13 days straight (usually 10-12 hour days), I get it. And if I had continued there, I’m sure I would have started doing that too.

But for whatever reason (age, way I was raised, where and how I worked before), I didn’t even CONSIDER ‘calling out’ unless I was very seriously ill.

[LordMortis]

“ Some recruiters cite the strong work ethic of older workers, saying they’re more likely than younger colleagues to show up on time and less apt to quit or call in sick — all assets in a heating economy dogged by severe labor shortages.”

Truth but they'll also be done quicker and lose sharpness if I am any indicator. There is also a much larger expectation from the younger crowd that they will start with leverage for concessions on the company. Guy who is replacing me, even with a broad latitude to WFH, has already taken three days off that I am aware of for reasons, so his wife won't miss school, "forgets" his phone all of the time, runs late, doesn't communicate, etc... and he was the best of the lot.

I put it on the company though for waiting so long to find to my replacement when I gave them notice in September. They should have started and been very serious about searching for applicants that same day. Rather they waited until December to not seriously start looking.

They do need someone young but they needed the luxury of time to be picky. Now they're at Find Out stage of Fucking Around.

CNBC is reporting the older workforce are starting to re-enter but not saying much about what's up other than unemployment basically being at an all time low. You wouldn't know it from all the help wanted postings retail sector being void of employees around here. But they are all for $14 an hour low skill jobs.

[dbt1949]

No matter what wonderful reasons there are to hire older people the end result is they just don't do it.

[gilraen]

Depends on your skillset. My dad is a developer - his knowledge isn't super unique but it's somewhat specialized. He's almost 72, he retired in 2020 in the middle of COVID-related layoffs. He's getting bombarded by recruiters now asking him to interview for open positions, even though his status on LinkedIn is set to not looking for job.

[LawBeefaroni]

Depends on your skillset. My dad is a developer - his knowledge isn't super unique but it's somewhat specialized. He's almost 72, he retired in 2020 in the middle of COVID-related layoffs. He's getting bombarded by recruiters now asking him to interview for open positions, even though his status on LinkedIn is set to not looking for job.

My dad is in his 80s and has been retired for a decade at least. He still has a small client base from his RBase days. He's been trying to move them to someone else for years but they keep coming back and he doesn't say "no." He also volunteers to do taxes for "old people" this time of year, which involves feeding their info into turbo tax at the local charity. He's crazy.

[LawBeefaroni]

No matter what wonderful reasons there are to hire older people the end result is they just don't do it.

I'm beginning to see why upper middle management is so political. It's not the young hard chargers you have to worry about, it's the olds that fear having to go look for another job. Which I'm starting to understand. If I see AVP or VP in an email I know whatever I want is going to be a battle, for no good reason.

[malchior]

No matter what wonderful reasons there are to hire older people the end result is they just don't do it.

I'm beginning to see why upper middle management is so political. It's not the young hard chargers you have to worry about, it's the olds that fear having to go look for another job. Which I'm starting to understand. If I see AVP or VP in an email I know whatever I want is going to be a battle, for no good reason.

Yup. It's always a battle. Worse in my experience they could be so much more valuable if they partnered up instead but that doesn't seem to be rewarded.

[RMC]

No matter what wonderful reasons there are to hire older people the end result is they just don't do it.

I'm beginning to see why upper middle management is so political. It's not the young hard chargers you have to worry about, it's the olds that fear having to go look for another job. Which I'm starting to understand. If I see AVP or VP in an email I know whatever I want is going to be a battle, for no good reason.

What do you define as upper middle management? I am a director, and on the older side. I see it from both sides, the younger managers eager to prove I am an idiot, and the VP's looking to make CIO, COO, etc, and looking to make me look bad. <shrug>

I have been here for almost 15 years this go around, and plan to retire from here, so neither of the above bother me for the most part.

[Jeff V]

I have been here for almost 15 years this go around, and plan to retire from here, so neither of the above bother me for the most part.

I don't have the cred to be upper management. I was a grunt in the trenches for a long time...but I was able to parlay a management job in a different industry into low-middle level management (supervisor, operations manager, helpdesk manager, purchasing manager). My last job, I held a title (supervisor) that was way out of whack from other jobs, mostly because that was how it was structured. I came to that company as a regional IT manager (firmly middle-management), my direct reports increased three fold, the number of locations I supervised, 10 fold, but the job title itself was a definite 2 steps backward. The money was ok, and while I'm employed, I'm not so hung up on things such as titles. It seems to matter more when not employed.

Over the weekend, I got a "how ya doin'?" inquiry from a company who's pretty much jacked me around my entire career (many times submitted for jobs, never actually getting anything). She replies to me about a job with ATI - the physical therapy company. I had applied to this job 6 months to a year ago (I can't be bothered to look it up), and even have a friend there who I was able to name as reference. When I told this recruiter I had already applied, she didn't contact me again until this weekend. And now she's still looking for the same job. I can only guess it was filled by someone not me (and this is something I'm highly qualified for) and paid the price for their lack of vision. But she also came to me with another job -- Federal Signal. 100% WFH, although the want someone within range of one of their facilities -- two are Oakbrook and Elgin, both where I had facilities for my last job (and the ATI job is 2 blocks from a logistics facility I managed IT for). The thing is, I don't necessarily have a bunch of experience in all of their technology initiatives, but I do with most. We'll see if this recruiter manages to get anything in motion.

[LawBeefaroni]

No matter what wonderful reasons there are to hire older people the end result is they just don't do it.

I'm beginning to see why upper middle management is so political. It's not the young hard chargers you have to worry about, it's the olds that fear having to go look for another job. Which I'm starting to understand. If I see AVP or VP in an email I know whatever I want is going to be a battle, for no good reason.

What do you define as upper middle management? I am a director, and on the older side. I see it from both sides, the younger managers eager to prove I am an idiot, and the VP's looking to make CIO, COO, etc, and looking to make me look bad. <shrug>

I have been here for almost 15 years this go around, and plan to retire from here, so neither of the above bother me for the most part.

AVPs and VPs. I'm happy at the director level but dealing with the army of AVPs is exhausting. Officers and Ps are pretty self-assured and easier to work with. .Most of everyone I work with is great and most conflicts are driven by imagined insecurity or territorial protection. I'm a bridge-builder but my patience is stretched.

[RMC]

No matter what wonderful reasons there are to hire older people the end result is they just don't do it.

I'm beginning to see why upper middle management is so political. It's not the young hard chargers you have to worry about, it's the olds that fear having to go look for another job. Which I'm starting to understand. If I see AVP or VP in an email I know whatever I want is going to be a battle, for no good reason.

What do you define as upper middle management? I am a director, and on the older side. I see it from both sides, the younger managers eager to prove I am an idiot, and the VP's looking to make CIO, COO, etc, and looking to make me look bad. <shrug>

I have been here for almost 15 years this go around, and plan to retire from here, so neither of the above bother me for the most part.

AVPs and VPs. I'm happy at the director level but dealing with the army of AVPs is exhausting. Officers and Ps are pretty self-assured and easier to work with. .Most of everyone I work with is great and most conflicts are driven by imagined insecurity or territorial protection. I'm a bridge-builder but my patience is stretched.

Yeah, thank god we don't have the AVP's, and all the VP's are easy going. Now I am IT and working in healthcare, so for the most part we are just ancillary folks, the real polotics is in the clinical areas, and I just am nice to everyone there.

[Kasey Chang]

One initial screening interview, one rejection, it's not that bad so far. I have side gigs lined up, but it's not exacting bringing in a full-time income.

[Carpet_pissr]

All you guys that are directors or at similar levels and have thousands of posts here.....WTF?!?

Maybe I have this all wrong...I have been ACTIVELY seeking a position with less stress than I had before....but if Director levels have enough free time to post all day on an internet forum, I want some of that!

[Max Peck]

All you guys that are directors or at similar levels and have thousands of posts here.....WTF?!?

Maybe I have this all wrong...I have been ACTIVELY seeking a position with less stress than I had before....but if Director levels have enough free time to post all day on an internet forum, I want some of that!

Careful. I made a joke like that once, and it ended in me having a forum nemesis.

[coopasonic]

All you guys that are directors or at similar levels and have thousands of posts here.....WTF?!?

Maybe I have this all wrong...I have been ACTIVELY seeking a position with less stress than I had before....but if Director levels have enough free time to post all day on an internet forum, I want some of that!

First, free time and reduced stress are not the same thing in any way shape or form. There may some level of correlation but they aren't 100% aligned.

There is no second.

[RMC]

All you guys that are directors or at similar levels and have thousands of posts here.....WTF?!?

Maybe I have this all wrong...I have been ACTIVELY seeking a position with less stress than I had before....but if Director levels have enough free time to post all day on an internet forum, I want some of that!

I have been part of these forums for a long time, and don't post nearly as much as I used too. The old Werewolf games helped pad my post counts as well. But if you looked at my post count over the last few years, I think you would see a huge decline.

I work about 60 hours a week, and take breaks and read this forum. So <shrug> the answer is I make time to do it.

[malchior]

For me I work all hours of the day depending on client needs, selling, etc. I have a ton of flexibility.

[Isgrimnur]

I'm lazy.

[Carpet_pissr]

Was mostly yanking your collective chains on that...when I was fully employed, and should have been working, I can assure you I was on here posting WAY too much, or at least reading.

Unrelated: the startup that I was supposed to START working for this coming Monday, called me yesterday to say something to the effect of: do you mind starting a week later? We had some clients come into the office unexpectedly this week, didn't have enough time to prepare for you, training, etc. Note that I accepted the position around April 4th?

Note also that I am 95% sure there are only 2 MAYBE three people working out of this office. The others are either remote (my soon to be boss), or on the West Coast, Colorado, or Brazil.

The first sign of hinkiness didn't really phase me because...startup (also, dudes and dudettes, we are not talking Silicon Valley startup with millions in VC funding, pinball machines in the lobby, and yoga time at lunch, in case that wasn't clear...this is one guy that owns a company that has done well since he started it in 2016). Anyway, that sign of...quirkiness was basically an almost overnight shift of "here's a job we created for you based on what you told us you wanted to do" to "oops, sorry, spoke with owner and he decided to move the entire Brazilian staff to a different company that he owns, and just do a fresh start in the USA (in some ways...there was a skeleton crew here, including the top dawgs). Also, that job position we sent you is no longer a position, we're killing that."

Spidey sense STARTING to tingle ever so slightly. They already completed the background check, sent me all the HR forms to sign, and I even noticed that they pinged my bank account to make sure the direct deposit was working. Still....this is starting to make me a bit wary.

Possibilities:
they could come back to me middle next week and say "we are so sorry, we have to rescind the offer...we are changing the company structure again and it doesn't include this position."
they found someone to do this job I took for $20K less (they did agree to pay me top of the range so it's certainly possible).
they found out how old I am after the background check ?!?!?
they were not happy at how hard I negotiated the salary, PTO, etc.

Who knows. They ARE currently in the final stages of building a new office and warehouse here, and if it weren't for that, I would be much more concerned.

Still, I think it's time to be a big boy and keep sending resumes. I'm already not crazy about the initial pay, the fact that when the new building is finisnhed, I will have a long commute (for me), and the weird office hours of 9-6 (which, to be fair, is pretty similar to when I didn't really have hours. I would go in at 9 or 10, leave at 6 or 7. But having those hours SET just feels...different.

[Kasey Chang]

One initial screening interview, one rejection, it's not that bad so far. I have side gigs lined up, but it's not exacting bringing in a full-time income.

Okay, got the rejection 24 hours after the initial screen interview. I don't recall making any overt mistakes, I did study what the company's about, so either I really am underqualified for the position (I don't think I am), or my starting salary offer of 25 an hour, which is NOT high in San Francisco and relatively low for tech support, is somehow a deal killer. F*** me.

[dbt1949]

You are not interested in moving to another part of the country?

[Kasey Chang]

I'm lazy too.

[dbt1949]

When I joined the service most everybody wanted to be stationed close to home. It's a natural phenomena.
I was looking to get as far from home as I could and look where that got me.

[Kraken]

I *almost* have a whole weekend off for the first time in ages. Q1 is always my busiest and it's finally behind me. Only need to put in about two hours over the next three days.

I finished this year's "Salute to Nurses" letters a few days ago. This year, in order to limit my hours (and fee), they devised a process of pre-selecting which 400 letters we would use, instead of having me edit all 650+ submissions and then culling from that. Letters submitted by PR/Marketing departments were flagged in red and rejected. That screening saved them (and cost me) about $1,500.

Yesterday one of the institutions complained that they'd submitted 30 letters and we only used 10, so they asked me to edit the 20 "red" submissions this weekend. This afternoon, they belayed that instruction. The company that complained isn't an advertiser so we don't have to use their spam. I do still owe them 1.5 hours of work so there could be another small task or two coming, but I'm probably done.

[Isgrimnur]

I fucking loathe the marketing industry. Everything is seen as an opportunity to further their own goals.

[Kraken]

I fucking loathe the marketing industry. Everything is seen as an opportunity to further their own goals.

Without moneychangers in media's temples, there would be no media. The key in journalism is a good firewall between marketing and editorial.

The Salute to Nurses is an advertising supplement. If Mass General Brigham is running a full page ad, all of MGB's submissions get used. If Hebrew SeniorLiving isn't buying ad space, we'll only use submissions by patients, families, and staff. None of this affects the Boston Globe's editorial side, who I'm sure is completely unaware of what their custom publishing arm is up to. They're going to cover everything MGB does because it's the largest healthcare company in MA.

In an ideal world we'd only use the honest submissions for everyone, but in that world advertising supplements aren't necessary.

[Kasey Chang]

Another week another couple rejections. The problem with applications is you never get any feedback so you have no idea what you can do to improve the process. Send in application on March 30th, just got rejection back. I think they scheduled the rejection letters to go out on Sunday mornings.

[LawBeefaroni]

All you guys that are directors or at similar levels and have thousands of posts here.....WTF?!?

Maybe I have this all wrong...I have been ACTIVELY seeking a position with less stress than I had before....but if Director levels have enough free time to post all day on an internet forum, I want some of that!

Conference/zoom calls. And with nearly no in-person working lunches these days I have actual lunch time.

You'll find my PPD count dramatically decreased over the past few years. Stress has gone up for sure, to the point where I take breaks to survive mentally, not to kill time.

[Archinerd]

I may need to find a new job. The stress form mine has contributed to giving me GERD, which I think is basically an ulcer heading toward the input instead of the output.

[Jeff V]

Several weeks ago, wife starts second job (again). Says I can remain Mr. Mom, mostly because she doesn't want to deal with trying to hire any fill-in parents should I find something that I can't work remote.

The other days she goes off on a rant because she's working too much (it was, apparently, an aberration, but she did 3 consecutive days of double-shifts, which gives her 4 hours sleep time on those days) and says I need to apply to something each day. As if I still wasn't...when something appropriate would come up. So today it was a job I'm highly qualified for near O'Hare, and I sent a recruiter my resume after he approached me regarding a job that preferred a masters degree (don't have), and pays 50% more than my last job (so...pipe dream). I already suggested I'm not what they are looking for but hey, if he has something more appropriate, we can talk.

[LordMortis]

Last Day: April 29th confirmed
Retirement dinner: April 28th confirmed (don't wanna go. Hoping it's warm and dry enough to be out doors but I doubt it)
...
Contracted work status: TBD but they're already committing to pay for my COBRA while it is figured out and they theoretically understand that I may just say 'no.'

Feeling guilty about the minimal effort they've received from me over that last month and a half but uncontrollably not guilty enough to give more. I need to do better and leave them in better shape in this last two weeks but there's just nothing in the tank.

[stessier]

Last Day: April 29th confirmed
Retirement dinner: April 28th confirmed (don't wanna go. Hoping it's warm and dry enough to be out doors but I doubt it)

You really need someone to give you a pep talk. You're retiring - if you don't want to go to the party, say you appreciate the thought, but you're done. No other explanation is needed. Just don't go. It's the day before you're done - find the strength to finally get your way.

[stimpy]

Last Day: April 29th confirmed
Retirement dinner: April 28th confirmed (don't wanna go. Hoping it's warm and dry enough to be out doors but I doubt it)

You really need someone to give you a pep talk. You're retiring - if you don't want to go to the party, say you appreciate the thought, but you're done. No other explanation is needed. Just don't go. It's the day before you're done - find the strength to finally get your way.

Or just go and enjoy it.
It's the least you deserve.