[MCU] Thunderbolts*

[Isgrimnur]

[Blackhawk]

You beat me by about 90 seconds. I went ahead and deleted my version of the thread. I'll just copy-paste my original post here first.

[Vid snipped]

Lots of characters from previous films and shows. I have been looking forward to seeing what they'd do with Thunderbolts, but I'm not sure whether I like what I'm seeing here. It seems to be lacking a sense of humor, which Thunderbolts really needs.

[Isgrimnur]

You beat me by about 90 seconds.

[Blackhawk]

Fine. Steal my thunderbolts.

[McNutt]

Every time I see a trailer for a new movie I immediately wonder, "what old song are they going to make moody for this one?" Why does every damn trailer still do that?

[Blackhawk]

Because the Epic Trailer Voice and Inception sound both got old much faster. Don't worry - minor key popular songs will soon be replaced by something that gets just as tired.

[Smoove_B]

It seems to be lacking a sense of humor, which Thunderbolts really needs.

You don't think the interactions between Alexi and Yelena are likely the humor element? I thought they were a highlight in Black Widow and she was great in the D+ Hawkeye show too.

But yeah, overall I like all the actors that will be in the film so I'm hopeful it's good.

[Grifman]

This looks pretty good, a Marvel Suicide Squad, hopefully, it will be much better. The only character I don't really like is USAgent Walker. He just comes off as a cheap jerky Captain American wannabe. Not a fan of this character. But other than that, this looks fun.

[Isgrimnur]

The only character I don't really like is USAgent Walker. He just comes off as a cheap jerky Captain American wannabe.

Then that's an excellent acting job by Wyatt Russell.

[Blackhawk]

It seems to be lacking a sense of humor, which Thunderbolts really needs.

You don't think the interactions between Alexi and Yelena are likely the humor element?

Potentially, although it didn't come through in the trailer. I'm also not a huge fan of Yelena (the character - the actress is fine.)

[msteelers]

The only character I don't really like is USAgent Walker. He just comes off as a cheap jerky Captain American wannabe.

Then that's an excellent acting job by Wyatt Russell.

Yeah, that’s exactly how you’re supposed to see him.

[EvilHomer3k]

It seems to be lacking a sense of humor, which Thunderbolts really needs.

You don't think the interactions between Alexi and Yelena are likely the humor element?

Potentially, although it didn't come through in the trailer. I'm also not a huge fan of Yelena (the character - the actress is fine.)

I can't understand this. I love the character and the actress. David Harbor and Florence Pugh is all I needed to see to be in. I absolutely love the dry humor and the way Florence delivers it.

[Max Peck]

I'm not convinced that the film will be lacking in humor (with the understanding that humor is subjective, of course).

[Grifman]

It seems to be lacking a sense of humor, which Thunderbolts really needs.

You don't think the interactions between Alexi and Yelena are likely the humor element?

Potentially, although it didn't come through in the trailer. I'm also not a huge fan of Yelena (the character - the actress is fine.)

I can't understand this. I love the character and the actress. David Harbor and Florence Pugh is all I needed to see to be in. I absolutely love the dry humor and the way Florence delivers it.

Yeah, I think they are great together.

[Blackhawk]

It seems to be lacking a sense of humor, which Thunderbolts really needs.

You don't think the interactions between Alexi and Yelena are likely the humor element?

Potentially, although it didn't come through in the trailer. I'm also not a huge fan of Yelena (the character - the actress is fine.)

I can't understand this. [snip]

What's to understand? Different people have different tastes and experiences. Personally, I disliked the character. I found her unlikable.

That's all. Other people are free to like or dislike whichever character they choose.

[Zaxxon]

What's to understand? Different people have different tastes and experiences. Personally, I disliked the character. I found her unlikable.

That's all. Other people are free to like or dislike whichever character they choose.

Yes, but your taste is wrong, can't you see!??

J/K.

...

I don't know whether this will be good or not, but I'm in for Yelena Belova & Co.

Anyone know the story behind the asterisk?

[Smoove_B]

Anyone know the story behind the asterisk?

It's a mystery!

[El Guapo]

I'm excited for this. The cast is just so great that there's a high chance that I enjoy this even if the movie is otherwise not that great.

[AWS260]

Yeah, that's kind of what I'm expecting. Partially because, unlike most of the MCU stuff, I've never read the comic book that this is riffing on.

[Smoove_B]

[hepcat]

Two things stand out for me in that trailer:

1) Whoever is in charge of the music needs to be fired.

2) The omission of one character they’ve been including in previous trailers tells me who the villain is.

[AWS260]

"So... none of us can fly? So what, we all just punch and shoot?"

I know people think that superhero films are too quippy, but honestly I could watch Florence Pugh quip all day. I really enjoyed that trailer.

[JCC]

Looks like fun to me.

There is obviously plenty of superhero movie fatigue out there, but I have generally enjoyed practically all of the MCU movies, and love plenty of them. So, if they want to keep the tired golden goose going, I'll keep watching if I keep enjoying it.

[Madmarcus]

It looks fun even though I dislike the villain. I doubt I'll see it right away but I might have to see if my brother wants to meet up and see it since neither of our wives have any interest.

[GreenGoo]

Why the asterisk? Is obelix in this one?

[hepcat]

If it's the villain I believe it will be, I think it's going to be the stronger for it. They have an interesting history, to say the least.

[Smoove_B]

Why the asterisk?

Still a mystery.

[Smoove_B]

I know people think that superhero films are too quippy, but honestly I could watch Florence Pugh quip all day. I really enjoyed that trailer.

Agreed. She's so enjoyable to watch in this role. I know people are burned out and hating on the MCU is cool now, but this looks like a winner to me.

[hepcat]

I don't think it's cool, I think it's essential. If a franchise you love starts taking the easy way out and churns out poorly written action films when they have a history of producing mature, thoughtful and fun entries in the past, they need to be called out. That's the only way we're going to get back to the good stuff. Criticism may not be fun, but it is a vital component in quality control for a reason.

[Smoove_B]

Oh, I'm not against calling out Marvel schlock when it's not great, but it feels like there's a default assumption now that all MCU stuff is bad and questioning why it exists.

[hepcat]

The solution?

Prove people wrong.

Problem solved.

But on a more serious note, I can completely understand comic book movie burnout. We were getting hit with 3 or 4 entries a year there for a while, it seemed. Eventually the limitations of that genre had to rear its head. At least the limitations of the more popular entries in the genre.

It also seems like the genre has a cycle. It goes like this: standard superhero fare, good guys/gals that do the right thing. Then we move incrementally to morally grey characters with more adult themes. Then we hit full blow deconstruction of the genre with gore, sex and violence galore in which the villains are often the main draw (see The Boys and Invincible....maybe even Deadpool).

But that's just me throwing out a theory I've held for a while. I'm usually wrong about most things, so take it as you will.

p.s. the one constant that I do love is that Spiderman and Superman remain morally centered. I hate the belief that Zak Snyder held that you could move Supes a little more towards the grey zone. He NEEDS to be who he is. Same with Spidey. His innocence and belief in humanity is essential to his character.

[Pyperkub]

It seems to be lacking a sense of humor, which Thunderbolts really needs.

You don't think the interactions between Alexi and Yelena are likely the humor element?

Potentially, although it didn't come through in the trailer. I'm also not a huge fan of Yelena (the character - the actress is fine.)

I can't understand this. I love the character and the actress. David Harbor and Florence Pugh is all I needed to see to be in. I absolutely love the dry humor and the way Florence delivers it.

I'm guessing you haven't seen Hawkeye. It's one of the best Marvel shows, and a huge reason is Pugh's Yelena.

[Blackhawk]

Why the asterisk?

Still a mystery.

Your info is out of date (by a couple of hours.)

Spoiler:

Thunderbolts*

*The Avengers are not available

[Smoove_B]

[Sudy]

p.s. the one constant that I do love is that Spiderman and Superman remain morally centered. I hate the belief that Zak Snyder held that you could move Supes a little more towards the grey zone. He NEEDS to be who he is. Same with Spidey. His innocence and belief in humanity is essential to his character.

That's just making me want a Spider-Man who completely falls from grace and goes full Daenerys.

[Blackhawk]

It also seems like the genre has a cycle. It goes like this: standard superhero fare, good guys/gals that do the right thing. Then we move incrementally to morally grey characters with more adult themes. Then we hit full blow deconstruction of the genre with gore, sex and violence galore in which the villains are often the main draw (see The Boys and Invincible....maybe even Deadpool).

And within a single series there is the problem of power creep. It breaks all superhero stories eventually, which is why comics keep being rebooted as well. You start with Iron Man fighting against another guy in armor. You move up to the Avengers fighting an alien army. That leads up to the Avengers facing Thanos who *spoiler* destroys half of the universe. That leads up to... what? What presents an interesting threat after Thanos? Another small army invading New York? A guy in armor?

When that power creep sets in, most comics have to do just what the MCU tried to do - they go cosmic. They fight bigger and badder enemies (Galactus incoming!), or they create a multiverse to shake things up, or they get 'out there' enemies that are so abstract that they're hard to identify with the way the audience was able to identify with Thanos - both his cause and his threat.

Some have their best stories at that point when they challenge the heroes with problems that don't have anything to do with powers. Like you said, Superman and Spidey are the moral centers of their universes, so when power creep sets in, you hit them with moral and ethical problems that they can't solve with punching, as the 'superhero' solutions are often the unethical solution, or where doing the 'right' thing is going to have major consequences. Or you take a character like The Flash (one of the more powerful DC characters) and you put them in a situation where the entire problem is their own fault, where they make a mistake and creates chaos. With The Flash, you get the main character doing something incredibly human with his powers, and as a result, breaking the entire world (see Flashpoint Paradox.) This was a central theme with MCU Wanda when she accidentally blew up a building saving the day, which was the entire basis for Civil War and the stories and tensions that grew from that, affecting everything from then until Thanos got thwomped.

[hepcat]

p.s. the one constant that I do love is that Spiderman and Superman remain morally centered. I hate the belief that Zak Snyder held that you could move Supes a little more towards the grey zone. He NEEDS to be who he is. Same with Spidey. His innocence and belief in humanity is essential to his character.

That's just making me want a Spider-Man who completely falls from grace and goes full Daenerys.

Would you settle for a former villain turned hero who specializes in adhesives? If so, I'll send you a link to my fan blog.

[hentzau]

p.s. the one constant that I do love is that Spiderman and Superman remain morally centered. I hate the belief that Zak Snyder held that you could move Supes a little more towards the grey zone. He NEEDS to be who he is. Same with Spidey. His innocence and belief in humanity is essential to his character.

[Blackhawk]

That's just making me want a Spider-Man who completely falls from grace and goes full Daenerys.