Department of Government Efficiency (DOGE)

[LawBeefaroni]

I don’t think anyone answered the question. What is the stated goal for pilfering all of our tax data? Like, what’s the lie that’s covering up why they actually want it?

DOGE isn't saying. White House is still claiming non-specific FWA.

Harrison Fields, a White House spokesman, said in an emailed statement that “waste, fraud, and abuse have been deeply entrenched in our broken system for far too long. It takes direct access to the system to identify and fix it.”

“DOGE will continue to shine a light on the fraud they uncover as the American people deserve to know what their government has been spending their hard earned tax dollars on,” he said.

https://apnews.com/article/doge-treasur ... 2e55a981b1

[Blackhawk]

Yep. They're justifying it with boogey-men, the same way as everything else. Thus far, the boogey-men have been an effective selling point, and people questioning that vaguely defined creature have been largely unsuccessful - mostly because of how vaguely defined it is.

[WYBaugh]

I don’t think anyone answered the question. What is the stated goal for pilfering all of our tax data? Like, what’s the lie that’s covering up why they actually want it?

DOGE isn't saying. White House is still claiming non-specific FWA.

Harrison Fields, a White House spokesman, said in an emailed statement that “waste, fraud, and abuse have been deeply entrenched in our broken system for far too long. It takes direct access to the system to identify and fix it.”

“DOGE will continue to shine a light on the fraud they uncover as the American people deserve to know what their government has been spending their hard earned tax dollars on,” he said.

https://apnews.com/article/doge-treasur ... 2e55a981b1

Fraud not really being fraud but a line item they don't like. Like money going towards DEI.

[Holman]

I'm stunned. How was it so easy for a small number of bad actors to seize control of so much at this level?

We're suffering an internal invasion and overthrow of the established government and it's just... happening? With no official resistance?

[Kraken]

They just want to control the data. ALL of the data.

[RunningMn9]

I'm stunned. How was it so easy for a small number of bad actors to seize control of so much at this level?

We're suffering an internal invasion and overthrow of the established government and it's just... happening? With no official resistance?

The people that tried to resist were terminated on the spot. This is why they went to OPM first - so they could instill terror amongst the rank and file - and then rolling mass firings - all completely illegal. But that only matters if someone is willing to do something. And no one is willing to do anything.

[Blackhawk]

I still hold out some (paper-thin) hope that some of them are simply avoiding giving Trump and Musk a clear target until they have a rock-solid plan. There's no point in making a symbolic stand if it just results in those who took the stand being removed, depowered, or replaced. And there's no point in using a legal strategy that can be neutralized after the first use if it's not being used in the most effective, impactful way.

Or at least that's what I tell myself so that I can sleep. The alternative is that we've fully surrendered to President Trusk's future.

[Smoove_B]

That's certainly possible. But I personally fear by the time they come up with a plan, the damage will have been done and it'll be far too late to fix. Hell, we might already be there!

Just seeing on social media how excited the usual crowd is that RFK Jr. was named as head of HHS, it's confirmed for me that people want exactly what's happening. As someone that has spent a lifetime in the public sector, it's sending me.

[Blackhawk]

it's confirmed for me that people want exactly what's happening.

You're right.

Just keep asking yourself: What people.

The answer isn't most people. It's not the people that you meet, when you're walking down the street each day. It's a small slice, a minority who are obsessed with revenge and hurting the any tribe that isn't their own, and it's a slightly larger slice that are so completely clueless that they don't actually understand what it means.

The majority of people think it's every bit as insane as we do. It's for them that we don't give up, and don't write off humanity as a lost cause.

Don't let the hateful idiots of the minority destroy the rest of the world in your eyes. People like you are too special and too important to fade away - slowly or abruptly. You've doubtlessly saved lives, and I can promise you that you've guided people, educated people, and improved lives around here. *raises hand*

[Kraken]

People like you are too special and too important to fade away - slowly or abruptly. You've doubtlessly saved lives, and I can promise you that you've guided people, educated people, and improved lives around here. *raises hand*

I like to tease Smoove, but I have long appreciated his information and the work he does, never more than during the pandemic and now again during the coup.

[waitingtoconnect]

I know of no one who truly wants this. And if they are cheering it on it’s because they are afraid or because they are brainwashed and don’t know what they are cheering for.

I think we could all argue about individual programs and this and that but this is insane. Turning out backs on our allies, gutting the public sector, putting up bills to seize Greenland and rename it red white and blue land… annexing Canada…. Leaving nato, dismantling the constitution ? While Republican house members don’t turn up and Democrat leadership basically waves it all through ignoring phone cans from constituents and sidelining any one like Bernie Saunders and the squad.

Take Usaid. It did good work. But it also bailed out our farmers such our adversaries and competitors hated that little loophole.

Take veterans affairs. It gives effective pensions to men and women who served that private industry rejects for being disabled. Now maga mocks them as losers because general bonespurs does.

[LordMortis]

I think you mean Napoleon Bonaspur

[RunningMn9]

That's certainly possible. But I personally fear by the time they come up with a plan, the damage will have been done and it'll be far too late to fix. Hell, we might already be there!

This is already unfixable. They’ve already done catastrophic damage. We are currently in the metaphorical 8 minute window where the sun was destroyed, but we just don’t know it yet.

[stimpy]

Do we even have a government anymore?
All I hear about is Musk and Trump seemingly able to do and say whatever they want
I mean, it seems they are exposing most, if not all, politicians as what they really are and have been all along, spineless sycophants that dont give a shit about what's happening to us.
Where is the pushback from them?
Where is the outrage? What are they doing to stop it?
It's pretty sickening to watch.

[Max Peck]

it's confirmed for me that people want exactly what's happening.

You're right.

Just keep asking yourself: What people.

A couple of follow up questions:

1. Which social media?
2. How many are actual people, how many are meat puppets, and how many are bots?

[WYBaugh]

Do we even have a government anymore?
All I hear about is Musk and Trump seemingly able to do and say whatever they want
I mean, it seems they are exposing most, if not all, politicians as what they really are and have been all along, spineless sycophants that dont give a shit about what's happening to us.
Where is the pushback from them?
Where is the outrage? What are they doing to stop it?
It's pretty sickening to watch.

It is. Rather than be the leaders that were voted in, they're too concerned about their positions. Being cowed by the threat of being primaried by a pos billionaire.

[LordMortis]

Or in the case of swing state senators being defeated in the general. Rodgers has no business being my senator. I fear the swing is now that of a door having shut.

[Grifman]

I think everyone here is fooling themselves:

https://www.axios.com/2025/02/14/arizon ... ive-orders

Sure this is just a small sample, but all eleven approve? And they specifically disavow many of the concerns expressed by people here. And I have also read that for the first time as president, Trump has a positive approval vs. disapproval rating.

A majority of people actually like what Trump is doing. They’ve been fed a steady stream of lies about government since Ronald Reagan by conservatives and now those lies are bearing fruit. It’s going to get worse before it even has a chance of getting better.

[LawBeefaroni]

it's confirmed for me that people want exactly what's happening.

You're right.

Just keep asking yourself: What people.

I'll give you two numbers.

$1 trillion - the amount of revenue loss in the next 10 years from extended tax cuts exclusively to the 1%. (That's out of the $4.5 or so total from tax cuts).

$1 trillion - anticipated cuts to Medicaid over the next 10 years as a result of increased deficits.

Should be clear what people.


Meanwhile Musk is absolutely destroying the workings of the federal for what, $55B in savings so far if you believe their best-case, ignore-the-consequences scenario.

$1.1 trillion.

[Smoove_B]

it's confirmed for me that people want exactly what's happening.

You're right.

Just keep asking yourself: What people.

A couple of follow up questions:

1. Which social media?
2. How many are actual people, how many are meat puppets, and how many are bots?

I guess I should clarify a bit. Yes, there are people expressing outrage and concern over what's happening - that really hasn't changed in 5+ years (I'm referring to public health related stuff here). And yes, there are lots of people (X, FB) expressing how excited they are over what's happening - also not really surprised there either, though it continues to be soul-crushing. It's the third group - and this extends beyond social media and into regular media and my general life - those that are now silently acquiescing to what's happening. And again I'm only speaking about the public health related stuff, which I know is but a small fraction of the awfulness that's unfolding.

I'm not sure what I expected exactly - the last 5 years should have prepared me a bit more for this - but I guess part of me wasn't fully ready to believe the dismantling of all things public health would be met with a shrug. Sure, I get the vaccine stuff but literally everything else? It's a lot to process and I'm flailing a bit.

There's a local non-profit that does community health outreach and education and I'm thinking of trying to transition into that in the Spring. Well, assuming they/we exist in ~2 more months.

[Kraken]

A majority of people actually like what Trump is doing. They’ve been fed a steady stream of lies about government since Ronald Reagan by conservatives and now those lies are bearing fruit. It’s going to get worse before it even has a chance of getting better.

You're right; there is still time for smashing and burning to applause. Consequences take time to propagate, and do so at different rates. Let's see where the approval ratings are a month from now, or 6 months, or a year, when the chickens come home to roost.

[Smoove_B]

Not surprised about this:

As its influence within the federal government grows daily, one question routinely emerges about the Department of Government Efficiency: Who is in charge?

That answer continues to evade the lawyers tasked with defending President Donald Trump's administration in court.

In an affidavit filed in federal court on Tuesday, a White House official clarified that Elon Musk is not the administrator of the newly formed entity -- seemingly contradicting public statements by Trump. Since announcing DOGE in December 2024, he has routinely referred to Musk as its leader.

However, according to Office of Administration Director Joshua Fischer, Musk is a "non career special government employee" who serves as a senior adviser to the president. The filing compared Musk's role to that of Anita Dunn, a longtime political advisor who served as a senior adviser to President Joe Biden.

Note:

The filing did not provide any information about who oversees DOGE, other than ruling out Musk.

But why does it matter?

Federal judges are similarly wresting with how to define DOGE within government. In an order issued late Friday, a federal judge in Washington, DC ruled that DOGE should be considered an "agency" though he noted how the Trump administration is "curiously" avoiding that label.

"This appears to come from a desire to escape the obligations that accompany agencyhood - such as being subject to the Freedom of Information Act, the Privacy Act and the Administrative Procedures Act -- while reaping only its benefits," U.S. District Judge John Bates wrote.

I am legitimately imaging Russia, North Korea, China, etc... on a conference Zoom meeting absolutely floored at how easy it could have been.

[Blackhawk]

That's certainly possible. But I personally fear by the time they come up with a plan, the damage will have been done and it'll be far too late to fix. Hell, we might already be there!

This is already unfixable. They’ve already done catastrophic damage. We are currently in the metaphorical 8 minute window where the sun was destroyed, but we just don’t know it yet.

It's absolutely unfixable. Bridges have been burned. Top talent that makes a difference will be avoiding returning to (or starting with) the government as government careers have been shown to be unreliable. Our reliability with the rest of the world is gone. Our allies are alienated, and are figuring out how to move forward without us. We're not going to return to 2024, even if several Justices, plus Trump, Vance, and Elon keel over, and the Democrats take over every branch. That ship has sailed. The America that was founded 250-ish years ago is gone.

What we can hope for now isn't to fix it. What we can hope for now is to salvage it. To stand in the rubble and build something out of the pieces - there are analogies here to the civil war and recovering as a somewhat different nation than the one that went down that path. It's a thin hope, but it's the best we have.

And if that's truly our best hope, then the 'good guys' in Washington might be better off recognizing that, and shouldn't be squandering their few resources - political and legal - on symbolic gestures or pointless patch-jobs that might save a department or prevent a confirmation. If it's unfixable but salvageable, then any grand action that doesn't stop Trump/Musk overall is wasted. It leaves them free to simply achieve the same thing with a different approach later. It might be better off saving all of those resources for a more strategic 'last stand' that could actually change what's happening and give us a chance to rebuild.

Imagine disrupting the RFK hearings and causing delays - or possibly avoiding him altogether, getting their tactic eliminated from Congress, and then getting Jenny McCarthy appointed later. Or symbolically getting 'on the record' with this vote or that, but getting those who went on the record recalled in their swing states and replaced.

What has that achieved?

And that's what we should be doing: Looking at what spending our resources on achieves toward the goal of recovering a non-Putinesque America. If it doesn't achieve anything long-term, or doesn't actually prevent the worst outcome, then they should absolutely be keeping their heads down and watching for a better opportunity, even if it means losing battles.

[Alefroth]

And I have also read that for the first time as president, Trump has a positive approval vs. disapproval rating.

One recent poll shows that, but the average is still upside down.

https://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/po ... ald-trump/

[Smoove_B]

One recent poll shows that, but the average is still upside down.

Once those imported eggs arrive from Turkey, everything will improve.

[Alefroth]

Time to turn Eggland into a giant egg farm

[Blackhawk]

Greenland

I have found the traitor.

[Alefroth]

Greenland

I have found the traitor.

Oops... fixed.

[Holman]

Time to turn Red White & Blueland into a giant egg farm

Fixed better.

[Max Peck]

Time to turn Whiteland into a giant egg farm

Fixed better.

I mean, why not skip past the transitional name (which MAGA will hate because it's transitional) and just get to the endgame.

[Blackhawk]

Trumpland?

[Smoove_B]

Absolute clowns running this:

The United States Department of Agriculture on Tuesday said that, over the weekend, it accidentally fired "several" agency employees who are working on the federal government's response to the H5N1 avian flu outbreak.

In a statement, the agency said it is trying to quickly reverse the firings.

Additionally:

The latest episode comes as the virus has decimated poultry flocks and has sent egg prices soaring. The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention confirmed 68 cases among humans in the U.S. so far. On her first day in office, Agriculture Secretary Brooke Rollins convened a panel on bird flu and "reviewed options for a comprehensive strategy to combat it," the department said in a release.

Several agencies within the Agriculture Department play a role in responding to the outbreak, including the Agricultural Research Service and the Animal and Plant Health Inspection Service. On Sunday, Politico reported that some of the Trump administration's layoffs hit the National Animal Health Laboratory Network, which is involved in avian flu research.

Also:

The layoffs concerned a number of Republican lawmakers, who privately warned the Trump administration that such cuts could hamper the government’s bird flu response and asked them to reconsider, according to two Republican sources with direct knowledge of the situation.

RELEASE THE COLLINS

[Max Peck]

Try as they might, they're never going top accidentally firing the people who look after their nuclear arsenal.

[raydude]

Try as they might, they're never going top accidentally firing the people who look after their nuclear arsenal.

As far as an immediate "oh shit" kind of impact, yes. I feel the firing of FAA employees, some of whom have got to be airplane safety insepectors, will lead to more aircraft failures over the next 4 years. A headline showing "More airline crashes under Trump than any of the past 10 presidents combined" would probably top that.

[LordMortis]

Try as they might, they're never going top accidentally firing the people who look after their nuclear arsenal.

As far as an immediate "oh shit" kind of impact, yes. I feel the firing of FAA employees, some of whom have got to be airplane safety insepectors, will lead to more aircraft failures over the next 4 years. A headline showing "More airline crashes under Trump than any of the past 10 presidents combined" would probably top that.

Doubt it. I'm guessing it would get the fake news moniker unless you had two undeniably really big ones back to back.

[LawBeefaroni]

Try as they might, they're never going top accidentally firing the people who look after their nuclear arsenal.

As far as an immediate "oh shit" kind of impact, yes. I feel the firing of FAA employees, some of whom have got to be airplane safety insepectors, will lead to more aircraft failures over the next 4 years. A headline showing "More airline crashes under Trump than any of the past 10 presidents combined" would probably top that.

Doubt it. I'm guessing it would get the fake news moniker unless you had two undeniably really big ones back to back.

We're still in the "blame it on Biden DEI hires" phase though, right?

Anything bad, vestiges of decades of liberal Democrat decay. Anything good, Trump or Musk did it.

[Kraken]

Try as they might, they're never going top accidentally firing the people who look after their nuclear arsenal.

As far as an immediate "oh shit" kind of impact, yes. I feel the firing of FAA employees, some of whom have got to be airplane safety insepectors, will lead to more aircraft failures over the next 4 years. A headline showing "More airline crashes under Trump than any of the past 10 presidents combined" would probably top that.

What worries me more is the SpaceX engineers who are currently remaking the air control system. Rocket scientists may be brilliant, but they aren't aviation specialists.

[LordMortis]

What worries me more is the SpaceX engineers who are currently remaking the air control system. Rocket scientists may be brilliant, but they aren't aviation specialists.

Or NFL head coaches.

[LawBeefaroni]

Try as they might, they're never going top accidentally firing the people who look after their nuclear arsenal.

As far as an immediate "oh shit" kind of impact, yes. I feel the firing of FAA employees, some of whom have got to be airplane safety insepectors, will lead to more aircraft failures over the next 4 years. A headline showing "More airline crashes under Trump than any of the past 10 presidents combined" would probably top that.

What worries me more is the SpaceX engineers who are currently remaking the air control system. Rocket scientists may be brilliant, but they aren't aviation specialists.

Wait until they get their hands on all the latest Skunk Works R&D.

[raydude]

Try as they might, they're never going top accidentally firing the people who look after their nuclear arsenal.

As far as an immediate "oh shit" kind of impact, yes. I feel the firing of FAA employees, some of whom have got to be airplane safety insepectors, will lead to more aircraft failures over the next 4 years. A headline showing "More airline crashes under Trump than any of the past 10 presidents combined" would probably top that.

What worries me more is the SpaceX engineers who are currently remaking the air control system. Rocket scientists may be brilliant, but they aren't aviation specialists.

Not to mention that usually rocket science just has to deal with Newton in the driver's seat. Almost all airplanes have a human pilot, and those humans are not as predictable.