Should an agnostic take communion?

rob · Post by **rob** » Fri May 19, 2006 8:33 am

A little background: a good friend of mine is getting married tomorrow and I'm one of his groomsmen. Yesterday we had the wedding rehearsal at the Lutheran church he's getting married in. During the rehearsal, the pastor indicated that at a certain point in the ceremony, he'd be offering communion to those who wanted it, starting with the wedding party. He said that the only requirement for taking the communion was baptism. He also indicated that it wouldn't be a problem if anyone didn't want to take the communion - he would just give a blessing to the individual and move on.

Here's the issue: I consider myself agnostic, i.e., I really don't know if there's a higher power or not. Honestly, though, I lean pretty heavily towards not believing in a god. I don't say this with any hatred or coldness in my heart; it's just where my reason and my logic lead me. I respect others' religious beliefs, I just don't share them. When the pastor mentioned the communion, I felt a little odd about it because of my beliefs, but figured I'd do it anyway out of politeness and respect for the ceremony and the church.

Now my wife is also in the wedding. As we were leaving the church after the rehearsal, I mentioned my feelings about the communion, and that I'd likely participate for the reasons I indicated above. She was quite offended by this and said that it would be sacrilegious for me to participate and that I would be making a mockery of the ceremony (her exact words). She comes from a very strict evangelical tradition (her father is a pastor) that manifests itself in ways that I personally find excessive (the show Bewitched was forbidden in her home because it dealt with witchcraft, for example). She isn't a Bible-thumper by any means - indeed, it's very unlikely that our relationship would have ever progressed beyond friendship had that been the case - but she has carried a lot of that tradition with her.

Right now, I'm leaning towards politely declining the communion. It's not a big deal to me either way, and I figure if it won't offend the pastor or disrespect the ceremony, I'll take the more conservative route. But we'll see. I might talk to him before the wedding starts and see what he thinks, though I'm reluctant to do so as I feel it would be selfish to impose my own personal drama when the day really should belong to my friend and his soon to be wife.

What do you guys think? I know there's a broad sampling of personal beliefs among the members of this community and I'm very curious to hear some other opinions on the matter.

r

(Edited to fix typos)

Post by **godhugh** » Fri May 19, 2006 8:38 am

I would pass on it. I've been in that situation before (not in a wedding, but I attended church with my wife once) and I chose to not participate. Just be polite and everything will go okay, most folks probably won't even know you passed on it.

Edit: I'm agnostic myself btw.

LordMortis · Post by **LordMortis** » Fri May 19, 2006 8:43 am

I want to. But then I also want to wear a Yamaka. And hang out at a Masque and face Mecca. And rub Budda's belly for luck before throwing him over my right shoulder into into a fountain in Vegas.

Smoove_B · Post by **Smoove_B** » Fri May 19, 2006 8:43 am

As a recovering Catholic (16 years), I know exactly where you are. I haven't taken communion since shortly after I was confirmed.

Once I realized I was feeling pressure to particpate (at funerals, weddings, baptisims, etc...) rather than actually wanting to do it, I stopped.

If I don't actively practice the other beliefs, why would I take communion?

I think it's excellent that the pastor is open enough to not make a big deal out of people skipping communion. I don't know that I would lean as far as your wife and call it sacrilegious, but her message is the same as mine - why would you do something if you have no belief?

As far as making it about you versus your friends on their day - I can't imagine a single person is going to notice whether or not you take communion or not. I'd say skip it.

noxiousdog · Post by **noxiousdog** » Fri May 19, 2006 8:54 am

I wouldn't.

From someone that was raised Catholic, communion is a sacred thing. It would be sacriligous to participate without believing (you're not even supposed to take communion if you haven't been to confession recently). However, as I understand it, Lutherens aren't as hard core about it as Catholics, so YMMV.

I assume your concern is with offending the wedding party? If so, I'd discuss it with them.

ATB · Post by **ATB** » Fri May 19, 2006 8:54 am

From a scriptural standpoint, you should not take communion unless you believe that Christ is God in the flesh, died for your salvation and rose from the dead for your atonement.

Take a pass. It shouldn't be a big deal.

Poleaxe · Post by **Poleaxe** » Fri May 19, 2006 9:00 am

All things considered, I would do the thing that keeps the wife happy.

rob · Post by **rob** » Fri May 19, 2006 9:11 am

noxiousdog wrote:I assume your concern is with offending the wedding party? If so, I'd discuss it with them.

No, I'm pretty certain that I wouldn't offend anybody if I declined. Actually, I think another member of the wedding party is going to decline. He's a strict Catholic, but I'm not sure on what grounds he's declining.

If I were to do it, it would be out of politeness and respect for the tradition and the "rules of the house" as it were.

rob · Post by **rob** » Fri May 19, 2006 9:15 am

LordMortis wrote:I want to. But then I also want to wear a Yamaka. And hang out at a Masque and face Mecca. And rub Budda's belly for luck before throwing him over my right shoulder into into a fountain in Vegas.

Your right shoulder? Heathen!

noxiousdog · Post by **noxiousdog** » Fri May 19, 2006 9:15 am

rob wrote:
If I were to do it, it would be out of politeness and respect for the tradition and the "rules of the house" as it were.

Then be aware that taking communion is likely to be more impolite and disrespectful if they are aware of your beliefs.

Smoove_B · Post by **Smoove_B** » Fri May 19, 2006 9:22 am

rob wrote:
If I were to do it, it would be out of politeness and respect for the tradition and the "rules of the house" as it were.

It could be my own ignorance, but I never thought that taking communion = wearing a yarlmuke = taking off your shoes before entering a temple.

The act of taking communion is a highly specilized ritual, while the other two are more acts of respect that don't imply belief.

Blackadar · Post by **Blackadar** » Fri May 19, 2006 9:22 am

While they're taking communion, crack open a box of Triscuits and do some sort of pagan goat-leggings dance.

Don't forget to film it and post it here.

rob · Post by **rob** » Fri May 19, 2006 9:27 am

Smoove_B wrote:
rob wrote:
If I were to do it, it would be out of politeness and respect for the tradition and the "rules of the house" as it were.
It could be my own ignorance, but I never thought that taking communion = wearing a yarlmuke = taking off your shoes before entering a temple.

The act of taking communion is a highly specilized ritual, while the other two are more acts of respect that don't imply belief.

That's an excellent point, Smoove - I hadn't thought of it that way.

rob · Post by **rob** » Fri May 19, 2006 9:32 am

Blackadar wrote:While they're taking communion, crack open a box of Triscuits and do some sort of pagan goat-leggings dance.

Don't forget to film it and post it here.

You read the part about my wife, right? By the time I woke up from the coma, nobody would remember this thread.

Kraken · Post by **Kraken** » Fri May 19, 2006 9:46 am

Poleaxe wrote:All things considered, I would do the thing that keeps the wife happy.

Agreed. It is meaningless to you, one way or the other, so just go along with whatever causes believers the least grief. If you're secretly in it for the snack, bring yourself a triscuit and a nip.

LawBeefaroni · Post by **LawBeefaroni** » Fri May 19, 2006 9:49 am

Ironrod wrote:
Poleaxe wrote:All things considered, I would do the thing that keeps the wife happy.
Agreed. It is meaningless to you, one way or the other, so just go along with whatever causes believers the least grief. If you're secretly in it for the snack, bring yourself a triscuit and a nip.

Yep. For you it's just a wafer cracker. For the wife and everyone else partaking it's some kind of big deal (Jesus' flesh). It all comes down to how much you want to respect their beliefs, however different from your own.

Mr. Fed · Post by **Mr. Fed** » Fri May 19, 2006 9:55 am

LordMortis wrote:I want to. But then I also want to wear a Yamaka. And hang out at a Masque and face Mecca. And rub Budda's belly for luck before throwing him over my right shoulder into into a fountain in Vegas.

You're supposed to read it, not wear it.

Rob, it is perfectly acceptable with everyone but a select few for someone not to take communion if they don't share the faith. In fact, many think it's the only appropriate thing to do. I never take communion when in Catholic church for weddings, funerals, etc., though I do in my own church.

There's always the chance that someone will single you out for not taking communinion. But there's no avoiding such an asshole --- they'll single you out for one reason or another.

Edit: now that I reread it it sounds like I'm insulting your wife (because I didn't read your post carefully and misunderstood her viewpoint). I don't mean to. Her view, even if more strongly asserted than it would be by most, is the majority one, I think.

Blackadar · Post by **Blackadar** » Fri May 19, 2006 9:59 am

rob wrote:
Blackadar wrote:While they're taking communion, crack open a box of Triscuits and do some sort of pagan goat-leggings dance.

Don't forget to film it and post it here.
You read the part about my wife, right? By the time I woke up from the coma, nobody would remember this thread.

Just leave the instructions in your Final Will and Testament for the video to be posted here.

Peacedog · Post by **Peacedog** » Fri May 19, 2006 10:06 am

Mr Fed. wrote:I never take communion when in Catholic church for weddings, funerals, etc., though I do in my own church.

You act like that's your choice. That's the Catholic chuch's choice, brutha.

I had a buddy get shot down in such a situation once (he was raised episcopalian). Pretty funny.

LordMortis · Post by **LordMortis** » Fri May 19, 2006 10:25 am

Mr. Fed wrote:You're supposed to read it, not wear it.

The Beanie, man. You think I can spell in Jewish, when I can't even spell in American?

For that matter, if they let me wear a Jewish beanie, could I wear one with propeller on top?

YellowKing · Post by **YellowKing** » Fri May 19, 2006 10:31 am

I do it when I go to my wife's church just to get some free wine. Damn that's some good stuff.

If I knew where to get it, I'd be buying a case of Jesus Blood.

$iljanus · Post by **$iljanus** » Fri May 19, 2006 10:52 am

YellowKing wrote:I do it when I go to my wife's church just to get some free wine. Damn that's some good stuff.

Yes it is. It was shed for all people and His gift to you.

On another note, when I started going to a Presbyterian church, the wine was replaced by grape juice and wafers with matzah which was certainly different from the Catholic communion. It was a little jarring at first but I did like the practice of offering communion to all who follow Christ.

Debris · Post by **Debris** » Fri May 19, 2006 10:53 am

Rob,

I didn't see in your first message that you had actually passed the first requirement; you being baptized.

I belong to a pretty relaxed Christian church where we don't have any undue requirements for taking communion other than actually believing in Jesus as your Lord and Savior. While I wouldn't be upset at anyone willing to eat and drink at the Lord's table, I think they should, at the very least, believe in God.

Otherwise, the polite and proper thing to do would be to take a pass and just accept the blessing.

McBa1n · Post by **McBa1n** » Fri May 19, 2006 11:00 am

Blackadar wrote:While they're taking communion, crack open a box of Triscuits and do some sort of pagan goat-leggings dance.

Don't forget to film it and post it here.

Yeah - I heard that is what you are SUPPOSED to do.
If you want you can do the "I'm the black sheep" bit by Dave Chappelle along with that.

dbt1949 · Post by **dbt1949** » Fri May 19, 2006 11:06 am

Nuke em from orbit.It's the only way.

rob · Post by **rob** » Fri May 19, 2006 11:07 am

Debris wrote:Rob,

I didn't see in your first message that you had actually passed the first requirement; you being baptized.

Forgot to mention that, didn't I? Yes, I have been baptized.

Smoove_B · Post by **Smoove_B** » Fri May 19, 2006 11:11 am

McBa1n wrote:If you want you can do the "I'm the black sheep" bit by Dave Chappelle along with that.

Every time I see that on Comedy Central, I laugh like a mental patient. And I have no idea why.

Freezer-TPF- · Post by **Freezer-TPF-** » Fri May 19, 2006 11:22 am

There is no need to feel obligated to take communion "out of politeness and respect for the ceremony and the church." If your beliefs are such that you do not feel comfortable taking communion, then you are showing the appropriate respect by choosing to receive the blessing instead. There is nothing wrong with that at all. Enjoy the wedding!

I'm Episcopalian, btw.

Freezer

ChrisGwinn · Post by **ChrisGwinn** » Fri May 19, 2006 11:39 am

Which synod? My wife's ELCA, so your mileage may vary. Missouri or Wisonsin synod can be very different.

I ran into a similar problem. The only requirement to receive communion in the ELCA is to be baptized, which I am.

My reluctance to take communion came from my concern over demeaning the ritual, not out of pressure from the wife. Nobody's ever batted an eye, and I'm rarely the only person not taking communion. Occasionally I've gone up and taken communion when the church is really crowded, since I'd otherwise be obstructing the flow of traffic. This doesn't offend anyone either.

rob · Post by **rob** » Fri May 19, 2006 11:47 am

ChrisGwinn wrote:Which synod? My wife's ELCA, so your mileage may vary. Missouri or Wisonsin synod can be very different.

No idea. Had to look up 'synod' and 'ECLA' just now, in fact.

Cylus Maxii · Post by **Cylus Maxii** » Fri May 19, 2006 12:39 pm

Just skip it - people shouldn't care; and those that are sanctimonious enough to give you crap should have been more offended had you participated unwillingly. I think the only ones who might care would be if you also refused the blessing -> after all, the best man and groomsman are supposed to be the second and guards for the groom (traditionally) and in the religious connotation are his supporters in his faith and vows.

BTW - its not at all unusual for people to take the blessing instead of communion, especially if they have a cold and don't want to drink from a shared vessel. Others will decline due to AA. If anybody gives you crap - you can always claim that you had a scracthy throat and then claim ignorance that they could have made arrangements to accomodate you.

Thanks for the opportunity to use "sanctimonious" - For some reason, I got a cheap thrill out of that.

D'Arcy · Post by **D'Arcy** » Fri May 19, 2006 12:51 pm

Cylus Maxii wrote:If anybody gives you crap - you can always claim that you had a scracthy throat and then claim ignorance that they could have made arrangements to accomodate you.

On the other hand, telling a lie in a church might not be a much better idea than taking communion without faith.

ChrisGwinn · Post by **ChrisGwinn** » Fri May 19, 2006 1:28 pm

rob wrote:
ChrisGwinn wrote:Which synod? My wife's ELCA, so your mileage may vary. Missouri or Wisonsin synod can be very different.
No idea. Had to look up 'synod' and 'ECLA' just now, in fact.

Both my father-in-law and an ex-girlfriend are Lutheran pastors, so I was forced to learn all this stuff.

Cylus Maxii · Post by **Cylus Maxii** » Fri May 19, 2006 1:40 pm

D'Arcy wrote:
Cylus Maxii wrote:If anybody gives you crap - you can always claim that you had a scracthy throat and then claim ignorance that they could have made arrangements to accomodate you.
On the other hand, telling a lie in a church might not be a much better idea than taking communion without faith.

LOL - true enough. Still, it would avoid the uncomfortable situation.

To be honest, I really don't expect him to get any grief for passing on communion. If anything, I suspect a lot more people will take it as a sign of respect than will be offended. He WOULD be better of being up front about it... assuming its an issue at all.

Mr. Fed · Post by **Mr. Fed** » Fri May 19, 2006 1:45 pm

Cylus Maxii wrote:
D'Arcy wrote:
Cylus Maxii wrote:If anybody gives you crap - you can always claim that you had a scracthy throat and then claim ignorance that they could have made arrangements to accomodate you.
On the other hand, telling a lie in a church might not be a much better idea than taking communion without faith.
LOL - true enough. Still, it would avoid the uncomfortable situation.

To be honest, I really don't expect him to get any grief for passing on communion. If anything, I suspect a lot more people will take it as a sign of respect than will be offended. He WOULD be better of being up front about it... assuming its an issue at all.

It's only uncomfortable if you allow another person's rudeness to make it so. If someone questions you on why you are not taking communion at an event like a wedding, an acceptable response in any civilized culture would be to smile and say "I'm sorry, that's a personal matter." Only an uncouth person whose esteem is worth nothing would ask in the first place.

Darkie · Post by **Darkie** » Fri May 19, 2006 2:15 pm

Poleaxe wrote:All things considered, I would do the thing that keeps the wife happy.

+1

Blackhawk · Post by **Blackhawk** » Fri May 19, 2006 2:59 pm

Find out what Communion means. If you agree with that, then take it. If you do not (and if you're agnostic, you probably do not,) then don't. Taking a Communion if you don't believe what is behind it is comparable making a solemn vow you have no intention of keeping just to be polite to the person you're lying to. The lie is more impolite than the refusal. I'm not saying that Communion is an oath - it isn't. It is considered a sacrament (along with things like marriage and ordination.) It is more accurately an act of sharing with the Christian divine.

Dramatist · Post by **Dramatist** » Fri May 19, 2006 3:11 pm

I agree with the others that want you to politely refuse. That's the most honest thing, and it shouldn't upset anyone.

hitbyambulance · Post by **hitbyambulance** » Fri May 19, 2006 3:14 pm

i fail to see what the drama is. just pass with a 'thanks, but no thanks'.

Dirt · Post by **Dirt** » Fri May 19, 2006 3:18 pm

Religion is also a culture. Respect other people's culture.