Octopus Overlords

Host: “What would you tell a teenage woman who gets pregnant that, by state law, she has to carry through and become a Mother?”

Gov. McMaster: “Don’t get pregnant. And if you do, there are consequences for actions.”

stessier wrote: Sat Jul 02, 2022 4:01 am

LawBeefaroni wrote: Fri Jul 01, 2022 8:44 pm

malchior wrote: Fri Jul 01, 2022 4:23 pm

Smoove_B wrote: Fri Jul 01, 2022 4:02 pm Yeah, that's true. I've honestly never been a position to argue "legally pregnant", only trying to educate on how to figure out when/how far along. It's a fair distinction.

That was what I was getting at. I knew the rough estimation method but 6 weeks, 3 days? That sort of precision? And for a 10-year old? Come on. There is no way anything there is accurate. They were straddling a line and didn't want to take the risk. I get it but it just stood out as very artificial.

Presumably they calculate from the date she was raped to get that type of accuracy.

It doesn't say she was raped.

stessier wrote: Sat Jul 02, 2022 4:01 am

LawBeefaroni wrote: Fri Jul 01, 2022 8:44 pm

malchior wrote: Fri Jul 01, 2022 4:23 pm

Smoove_B wrote: Fri Jul 01, 2022 4:02 pm Yeah, that's true. I've honestly never been a position to argue "legally pregnant", only trying to educate on how to figure out when/how far along. It's a fair distinction.

That was what I was getting at. I knew the rough estimation method but 6 weeks, 3 days? That sort of precision? And for a 10-year old? Come on. There is no way anything there is accurate. They were straddling a line and didn't want to take the risk. I get it but it just stood out as very artificial.

Presumably they calculate from the date she was raped to get that type of accuracy.

It doesn't say she was raped.

Grifman wrote: Sat Jul 02, 2022 8:08 am

El Guapo wrote: Thu Jun 30, 2022 10:23 am Well, Biden called for restricting the filibuster to allow for a Roe codification. Feels a day late and a dollar short, but it's progress at least.

All you people wanting to break the filibuster do realize that with a Republican Senate and President, you get a nationwide ban on abortion, right? Do you really want to go there?

Alefroth wrote: Sat Jul 02, 2022 1:19 pm

Grifman wrote: Sat Jul 02, 2022 8:08 am

El Guapo wrote: Thu Jun 30, 2022 10:23 am Well, Biden called for restricting the filibuster to allow for a Roe codification. Feels a day late and a dollar short, but it's progress at least.

All you people wanting to break the filibuster do realize that with a Republican Senate and President, you get a nationwide ban on abortion, right? Do you really want to go there?

With a Republican Senate and President, we get a nationwide ban on abortion.

Everybody in blue states that was like "phew, at least I'll be okay here on Abortion Island" after Roe was overturned: tomorrow a federal district court is hearing arguments re: an Arizona law that if upheld would establish all fertilized embryos as "persons."

Urgent! Last night, while you were sleeping, the Senate of Pennsylvania advanced language to ban abortions in Pennsylvania. Contact your legislators to demand that they protect the rights of women and pregnant people in Pennsylvania and vote NO on SB 106.

Biden: "We need 2 additional pro-choice senators & a pro-choice House to codify Roe as federal law. Your vote can make that a reality. I know it's frustrating & it made a lot of people very angry. But the truth is this... women of American can determine the outcome of this issue"

malchior wrote: Fri Jul 08, 2022 12:15 pm This is a smart calculated risk by the GOP in PA. They are trying to drive turnout for Mastriano and Oz. If they lose, it's just the status quo. If they win, they get another huge victory for their christofascism dreams and will inject talk amongst MSM stenographers that PA isn't purple and evidence that they are the real America.

LawBeefaroni wrote: Sat Jul 02, 2022 1:21 pm

Alefroth wrote: Sat Jul 02, 2022 1:19 pm

Grifman wrote: Sat Jul 02, 2022 8:08 am

El Guapo wrote: Thu Jun 30, 2022 10:23 am Well, Biden called for restricting the filibuster to allow for a Roe codification. Feels a day late and a dollar short, but it's progress at least.

All you people wanting to break the filibuster do realize that with a Republican Senate and President, you get a nationwide ban on abortion, right? Do you really want to go there?

With a Republican Senate and President, we get a nationwide ban on abortion.

It's unbelievable. Even 85%+ Catholic nations like Ireland and Mexico don't have federal bans. .

Octavious wrote: Fri Jul 08, 2022 1:22 pm

malchior wrote: Fri Jul 08, 2022 12:15 pm This is a smart calculated risk by the GOP in PA. They are trying to drive turnout for Mastriano and Oz. If they lose, it's just the status quo. If they win, they get another huge victory for their christofascism dreams and will inject talk amongst MSM stenographers that PA isn't purple and evidence that they are the real America.

Oz looks pretty dead in the water if the polls are accurate. Mastriano on the other hand isn't really that far behind.

We're 100% fucked if he wins. He already said he would just toss out the results of an election. And god knows we don't have a court system that would stop that nonsense. So ya... Things are great.

pr0ner wrote: Fri Jul 08, 2022 1:27 pm

LawBeefaroni wrote: Sat Jul 02, 2022 1:21 pm

Alefroth wrote: Sat Jul 02, 2022 1:19 pm

Grifman wrote: Sat Jul 02, 2022 8:08 am

El Guapo wrote: Thu Jun 30, 2022 10:23 am Well, Biden called for restricting the filibuster to allow for a Roe codification. Feels a day late and a dollar short, but it's progress at least.

All you people wanting to break the filibuster do realize that with a Republican Senate and President, you get a nationwide ban on abortion, right? Do you really want to go there?

With a Republican Senate and President, we get a nationwide ban on abortion.

It's unbelievable. Even 85%+ Catholic nations like Ireland and Mexico don't have federal bans. .

Poland does.

Today I signed an Executive Order to protect the reproductive rights of women in the aftermath of the Supreme Court's extreme decision to overturn Roe v. Wade.

It formalizes the actions I announced right after the decision and will add new measures to protect women's health.

-Access to abortion, including medication abortion
-Access to contraception
-The right to emergency medical care under law
-Providers and the clinics you rely on
-Privacy and sensitive health information
-Access to accurate information

Smoove_B wrote: Fri Jul 08, 2022 2:08 pm Going the old Executive Order route. Why this wasn't done 37 seconds after the Supreme Court decision, I have no idea.

Unagi wrote: Fri Jul 08, 2022 3:04 pm I don’t understand. Will this allow a clinic in Texas to perform an abortion or no?

Ohio Representative Click (HB 704) has introduced a bill that would effectively ban IVF, as well as various forms of birth control, on top of being extremely broad and vague.

Ohio House Republicans introduced a new bill Monday that physicians worry would ban in vitro fertilization (IVF).

H.B. 704, sponsored by state Rep. Gary Click, a Republican from Vickery, would recognize "personhood" from the moment of conception.

"Nothing in this section shall be interpreted in any manner that would endanger the life of a mother," the three-sentence bill stated.

...

In H.B. 598, the total abortion ban that many Republicans are expecting to go into place in the winter, specifies that an "unborn child" refers to an "individual organism of the species homo sapiens from fertilization until live birth."

"House Bill 598 may erase the dreams of many patients of becoming parents through IVF or other reproductive technologies," Dr. Thomas Burwinkel, an OB/GYN specializing in IVF, said during opponent testimony on May 26.

Most embryo created for IVF specifically will not survive to be implanted, Burwinkel said.

"The definition of “unborn child” contained in the bill leaves us to question if discarding unused embryos would be considered a criminal act," he said.

Some of the embryos are non-viable, and thus discarded. Under this bill, that could be considered an abortion, the doctor continued.

The three-sentence bill, dubbed “The Personhood Act,” does not specify what “conception” means—whether it happens at fertilization or implantation—leaving in doubt the status of certain contraceptives such as Plan B.

Smoove_B wrote: Mon Jul 11, 2022 10:08 pm

They're cranking out stuff like this covering various issues to see what sticks, intentionally being vague and potentially confusing. And in the meantime, it's going to cause strife for businesses or organizations involved in doing anything related to abortion that are afraid of lawsuits. It's all part of their strategy now.

And in the meantime, it's going to cause strife for businesses or organizations involved in doing anything related to abortion women's health that are afraid of lawsuits.

Kraken wrote: Tue Jul 12, 2022 11:20 pm The fetus gains a soul only when it starts paying Social Security taxes.

waitingtoconnect wrote: Tue Jul 12, 2022 10:23 pm Quickening is when a pregnant person starts to feel their baby's movement in their uterus (womb). It feels like flutters, bubbles or tiny pulses. Quickening happens around 16 to 20 weeks in pregnancy, but some people may feel it sooner or later.

This is when people leading into the 19th and early 20th century believed the baby became alive and human.

In Judaism, the fetus is not considered to have a human soul until it is safely outside of the woman, is viable, and has taken its first breath.(Genesis 2:7) The fetus is considered valuable property of the woman and not a human life while in the womb (Exodus 21:22–23).

This belief stems from the fact that pregnancy in pre modern times was incredibly dangerous with a high probability of death for the woman.

Even the Catholic Church did not begin vigorously opposing abortion until the 19th century.

Pope Pius IX (in his 1869 bull, Apostolicae Sedis) instituted a Church policy labeling all abortion as homicide and condemning abortion regardless of the stage of pregnancy.

So the new anti abortionists are neither projecting the founders wishes nor protecting tradition. No abortion from conception is modern in Judeo-christian thinking.

LawBeefaroni wrote: Tue Jul 12, 2022 11:55 pm

Kraken wrote: Tue Jul 12, 2022 11:20 pm The fetus gains a soul only when it starts paying Social Security taxes.

It was originally called Soulcial Security for that exact reason. Over time it was shortened.

"If we're talking about a fetus being a person, there's a lot of other rights that attach to being a person that will be litigated in the courts, such as, does my fetus qualify for a tax deduction? Does my fetus qualify for citizenship? Does my fetus qualify for child support?" she said. "These are all issues that are going to be raised and probably litigated in the courts."

Unfortunately for Bottone, her reasoning didn't convince the officers on scene, she said.

"He kind of just brushed me off and asked me to go to the other officer to get my citation," she said. The other officer said similar things and told her, "Honestly if you go and fight this I'm sure it'll get dropped."

Re the rape case of the 10-year-old Ohio girl:

Left: WSJ Edit Page yesterday calls it a 'fanciful tale'

Right: Columbus Dispatch today reports arrest of suspect

Indiana AG now says they are looking into the doctor