[WW] TRON - Game Over - End of Line

stessier · Post by **stessier** » Fri Jan 28, 2011 10:13 am

And another one - what if Flynn is dead? Can the Users still win by collecting the necessary permission bits?

Remus West · Post by **Remus West** » Fri Jan 28, 2011 10:24 am

stessier wrote:So wait - what do we learn if we scan Thorne? What ability do we have to positively identify him?

From what I read we don't get to know "Thorne" but rather we just learn corrupted or not. Then, assuming you have the ability to clean and recheck, you could become reasonably sure it was him. Myself, I plan to try and terminate anyone I manage to find as Corrupted since that is just to much work comparatively.

Sectoid · Post by **Sectoid** » Fri Jan 28, 2011 10:28 am

I scanned sector 23 last night and I ain't found nothing.

Lassr · Post by **Lassr** » Fri Jan 28, 2011 10:35 am

sector 45 contained a ping. Should I broadcast some Cylon Porn with it?

Lassr · Post by **Lassr** » Fri Jan 28, 2011 10:41 am

Gah! So many rules, I keep having to go back and read. So my ping is limited to 125 characters. Not much Cylon porn I can broadcast with that limit.

coopasonic · Post by **coopasonic** » Fri Jan 28, 2011 10:47 am

I thought I hit the jackpot on 46, but now that a system scan doesn't reveal role, it's value is questionable.

On the other hand, I think a virus scan executed at the next downtime is the best option to identify Thorne. There should be a very limited pool of infected right now and two people executing a virus scan can root him out quickly. Eliminating Thorne makes winning easier for both other teams, though it may give MCP a bit more advantage. At the very least identifying him or at least shrinking the pool of potential Thorne's is still very good info to have.

stessier · Post by **stessier** » Fri Jan 28, 2011 10:56 am

coopasonic wrote:On the other hand, I think a virus scan executed at the next downtime is the best option to identify Thorne. There should be a very limited pool of infected right now and two people executing a virus scan can root him out quickly.

Hmm, my impression is that the Codes are one time use - not a permanent ability.

Scoop, is this true?

coopasonic · Post by **coopasonic** » Fri Jan 28, 2011 11:08 am

stessier wrote:
coopasonic wrote:On the other hand, I think a virus scan executed at the next downtime is the best option to identify Thorne. There should be a very limited pool of infected right now and two people executing a virus scan can root him out quickly.
Hmm, my impression is that the Codes are one time use - not a permanent ability.

Scoop, is this true?

Yes, use and done, that doesn't change my thought. Maybe I didn't say it right? Right now there should only be Thorne and one other corrupted right? A virus scan will scan half the programs. Two coordinated virus scans will scan them all (well maybe all but given the half rounded down rule and one program terminated today) Virus scan runs after Thorne's corrupt order (and Daft Punk's if Thorne got lucky last night). At most there would be 4 infected. That's significantly better than having 15 possible Thorne's.

The downside to the plan being that Thorne or Daft Punk, being completely anonymous at this point, can screw with the outcome. I know I can trust one half of the results and it's highly unlikely the other half could be trusted.

coopasonic · Post by **coopasonic** » Fri Jan 28, 2011 11:10 am

coopasonic wrote:(well maybe all but given the half rounded down rule and one program terminated today)

(well maybe all but one given the half rounded down rule and one program terminated today)

stessier · Post by **stessier** » Fri Jan 28, 2011 11:10 am

I'm sorry, I missed that part of the description. Didn't realize it covered half the field.

Ok - I got a Virus Scan too. How do you want to divy up the field?

Lassr · Post by **Lassr** » Fri Jan 28, 2011 11:14 am

stessier wrote:
coopasonic wrote:On the other hand, I think a virus scan executed at the next downtime is the best option to identify Thorne. There should be a very limited pool of infected right now and two people executing a virus scan can root him out quickly.
Hmm, my impression is that the Codes are one time use - not a permanent ability.

Scoop, is this true?

back to the rules:

looks like a virus scan allows you to choose half of the programs you want scanned. So coop could pick the programs and scan and there is no more than 2 max corrupted right now. Does the scan happen before or after the next infection during downtime? Hold please.......next infection happens before the scan so you could have 3 infections. But that really limits Thorne's hiding places.

Can Thorne run a virus scan himself? I assume everyone gets to search a sector since it says ALL programs.

Lassr · Post by **Lassr** » Fri Jan 28, 2011 11:15 am

and stessier reads the rules while I'm reading and typing...

Unagi · Post by **Unagi** » Fri Jan 28, 2011 11:24 am

Bull's Eye !

I, like Sectoid, (shakes fist)

- got nothing out of Sector 23. You god damned son of a biatch!

Wait.

Did we actually compete for the same empty Sector? Or did someone else also hit #23.

Regarding the Corrupted and Infected. These are two different states, right?

Thorne is on team Corrputed and he infects players. They become corrupted (unknowingly), but they aren't ON team Corruption unless they actually Log into that team. Right?

So, something I am a little curious about: - is Thorne himself "infected" . I can't imagine he can be Cleaned.

Scoop, does Thorne show as "infected" in a Virus Scan?

Be interesting if Thorne didn't show as "infected" (since - hey, he IS the infection, right?). Likewise, the Daft Punks are on the Team Corruption - but they aren't "infected" and showing up on any virus scan until they are hit.

coopasonic · Post by **coopasonic** » Fri Jan 28, 2011 11:25 am

Lassr wrote:So coop could pick the programs and scan and there is no more than 2 max corrupted right now. Does the scan happen before or after the next infection during downtime? Hold please.......next infection happens before the scan so you could have 3 infections. But that really limits Thorne's hiding places.

Technically it could be 4 if Thorne hit either Daft Punk program last night there would be another infection tonight.

stessier wrote:I'm sorry, I missed that part of the description. Didn't realize it covered half the field.

Ok - I got a Virus Scan too. How do you want to divy up the field?

You take the top half and I'll take the bottom half, that way we aren't each scanning ourselves. I see about six ways the corrupted could screw with this plan, but I think it's a start.

Lassr · Post by **Lassr** » Fri Jan 28, 2011 11:30 am

coopasonic wrote:
Lassr wrote:So coop could pick the programs and scan and there is no more than 2 max corrupted right now. Does the scan happen before or after the next infection during downtime? Hold please.......next infection happens before the scan so you could have 3 infections. But that really limits Thorne's hiding places.
Technically it could be 4 if Thorne hit either Daft Punk program last night there would be another infection tonight.

oh yeah, true.

coopasonic · Post by **coopasonic** » Fri Jan 28, 2011 11:32 am

Unagi wrote:Regarding the Corrupted and Infected. These are two different states, right?

Thorne is on team Corrputed and he infects players. They become corrupted (unknowingly), but they aren't ON team Corruption unless they actually Log into that team. Right?

So, something I am a little curious about: - is Thorne himself "infected" . I can't imagine he can be Cleaned.

Scoop, does Thorne show as "infected" in a Virus Scan?

Be interesting if Thorne didn't show as "infected" (since - hey, he IS the infection, right?). Likewise, the Daft Punks are on the Team Corruption - but they aren't "infected" and showing up on any virus scan until they are hit.

Sorry I am trying to use infected, but the rules themselves are worded a little funny:

Corrupt : Each Downtime, Thorne can Corrupt a Program by infecting it with a virus.

Corrupt a program by infecting it with a virus. So if it's infected it is corrupted, but not necessarily on "team corrupted".

If Thorne doesn't scan as infected, it seems like it would be nearly impossible to root him out.

Lassr · Post by **Lassr** » Fri Jan 28, 2011 11:32 am

Unagi wrote: Thorne is on team Corrputed and he infects players. They become corrupted (unknowingly), but they aren't ON team Corruption unless they actually Log into that team. Right?

So, something I am a little curious about: - is Thorne himself "infected" . I can't imagine he can be Cleaned.

Scoop, does Thorne show as "infected" in a Virus Scan?

Be interesting if Thorne didn't show as "infected" (since - hey, he IS the infection, right?). Likewise, the Daft Punks are on the Team Corruption - but they aren't "infected" and showing up on any virus scan until they are hit.

good point. If Thorne does show infected then that's a game breaker for him! Not that I'm complaining.

Unagi · Post by **Unagi** » Fri Jan 28, 2011 11:37 am

Lassr wrote:
Unagi wrote: Thorne is on team Corrputed and he infects players. They become corrupted (unknowingly), but they aren't ON team Corruption unless they actually Log into that team. Right?

So, something I am a little curious about: - is Thorne himself "infected" . I can't imagine he can be Cleaned.

Scoop, does Thorne show as "infected" in a Virus Scan?

Be interesting if Thorne didn't show as "infected" (since - hey, he IS the infection, right?). Likewise, the Daft Punks are on the Team Corruption - but they aren't "infected" and showing up on any virus scan until they are hit.
good point. If Thorne does show infected then that's a game breaker for him! Not that I'm complaining.

I don't think the point of the Virus Scan was to expose 'Team Corrupted', but rather to show where the work was needed to be done in order to Clean Up the infected.

tru1cy · Post by **tru1cy** » Fri Jan 28, 2011 11:42 am

Austin

Haven't done that in awhile. Just wanted to get it out of the way

This vote is just my way of saying HI. It is non-binding and will be changed

coopasonic · Post by **coopasonic** » Fri Jan 28, 2011 11:43 am

Unagi wrote:I don't think the point of the Virus Scan was to expose 'Team Corrupted', but rather to show where the work was needed to be done in order to Clean Up the infected.

If Thorne doesn't show as infected, then it would be better to save the virus scans for a little later to be able to give Quorra a worklist. At this point, if that's true, it feel like the corrupted have a pretty big advantage here. They just need to corrupt everyone. That seems much easier to accomplish than gathering up most/all of the permission bits on the user team or killing off Flynn and all infected.

I guess we wait for the answer to that question.

Scoop20906 · Post by **Scoop20906** » Fri Jan 28, 2011 12:04 pm

stessier wrote:And another one - what if Flynn is dead? Can the Users still win by collecting the necessary permission bits?

If Flynn dies then the User team can NOT win.

theohall · Post by **theohall** » Fri Jan 28, 2011 12:06 pm

Terminate MOON_RMC

The M in RMC along with that MOON thing = MPC = Mycroft Holmes. Besides, these new programs need to be debugged.

And Lassr stole my sector scan.

Scoop20906 · Post by **Scoop20906** » Fri Jan 28, 2011 12:09 pm

stessier wrote:
coopasonic wrote:On the other hand, I think a virus scan executed at the next downtime is the best option to identify Thorne. There should be a very limited pool of infected right now and two people executing a virus scan can root him out quickly.
Hmm, my impression is that the Codes are one time use - not a permanent ability.

Scoop, is this true?

All code is one time use with the exception of:

admin_rights ()

Code: Select all

Admin Rights (3) :=  {execute and stay resident};
                      {USE = immediate};
                      {give a Program the security permissions to derezz a User-Program};
                      {Admin Rights do not grant the ability to derezz};

sector_map ()

Code: Select all

Sector Map   (1) :=  {execute and stay resident};
                      {USE = immediate};
                      {gives a Program the complete map of the 64 sectors};

improved_processing()

Code: Select all

Improved Processing (1) :=  {execute and stay resident};
                             {USE = immediate};
                             {Program can now search 3 sectors each Downtime};

These codes automatically execute and stay resident (you gain that ability).

Lassr · Post by **Lassr** » Fri Jan 28, 2011 12:17 pm

theohall wrote: Terminate MOON_RMC

The M in RMC along with that MOON thing = MPC = Mycroft Holmes. Besides, these new programs need to be debugged.

And Lassr stole my sector scan.

sorry...I chose based on turning 45 next week.

Scoop20906 · Post by **Scoop20906** » Fri Jan 28, 2011 12:19 pm

Unagi wrote:Bull's Eye !

I, like Sectoid, (shakes fist) - got nothing out of Sector 23. You god damned son of a biatch!

Wait.

Did we actually compete for the same empty Sector? Or did someone else also hit #23.

Regarding the Corrupted and Infected. These are two different states, right?

Thorne is on team Corrputed and he infects players. They become corrupted (unknowingly), but they aren't ON team Corruption unless they actually Log into that team. Right?

So, something I am a little curious about: - is Thorne himself "infected" . I can't imagine he can be Cleaned.

Scoop, does Thorne show as "infected" in a Virus Scan?

Be interesting if Thorne didn't show as "infected" (since - hey, he IS the infection, right?). Likewise, the Daft Punks are on the Team Corruption - but they aren't "infected" and showing up on any virus scan until they are hit.

Thorne will show as infected when scanned by a Virus Scan. Thorne can not be cleaned by a anti-virus.

Lassr · Post by **Lassr** » Fri Jan 28, 2011 12:20 pm

Scoop20906 wrote:
Unagi wrote:Bull's Eye !

I, like Sectoid, (shakes fist) - got nothing out of Sector 23. You god damned son of a biatch!

Wait.

Did we actually compete for the same empty Sector? Or did someone else also hit #23.

Regarding the Corrupted and Infected. These are two different states, right?

Thorne is on team Corrputed and he infects players. They become corrupted (unknowingly), but they aren't ON team Corruption unless they actually Log into that team. Right?

So, something I am a little curious about: - is Thorne himself "infected" . I can't imagine he can be Cleaned.

Scoop, does Thorne show as "infected" in a Virus Scan?

Be interesting if Thorne didn't show as "infected" (since - hey, he IS the infection, right?). Likewise, the Daft Punks are on the Team Corruption - but they aren't "infected" and showing up on any virus scan until they are hit.
Thorne will show as infected when scanned by a Virus Scan. Thorne can not be cleaned by a anti-virus.

Game over! For Thorne that is.

stessier · Post by **stessier** » Fri Jan 28, 2011 12:24 pm

Scoop20906 wrote:
stessier wrote:And another one - what if Flynn is dead? Can the Users still win by collecting the necessary permission bits?
If Flynn dies then the User team can NOT win.

Okay, so explain Backups again. Can they be passed? Are they protections we can spend to protect anyone, or is it only for the person holding it?

I'm not sure this game is going to be winnable for anyone.

Lassr · Post by **Lassr** » Fri Jan 28, 2011 12:26 pm

stessier wrote:
Scoop20906 wrote:
stessier wrote:And another one - what if Flynn is dead? Can the Users still win by collecting the necessary permission bits?
If Flynn dies then the User team can NOT win.
Okay, so explain Backups again. Can they be passed? Are they protections we can spend to protect anyone, or is it only for the person holding it?

I'm not sure this game is going to be winnable for anyone.

well then, there's your neutral victory...or neutral loss.

stessier · Post by **stessier** » Fri Jan 28, 2011 12:28 pm

Sector Scan Downtime 0

1 THIF_NEWCASTLE
2 RBRD_THEOHALL - 45
3 SEAL_ISGRIMNUR
4 MOON_RMC
5 DNGR_LASSR - 45 (ping)
6 YCAR_COOPASONIC- 46 (virus scan)
7 BABY_REMUS_WEST
8 EMPY_QANTAGA
9 ALIN_SECTOID - 23
10 STCH_STESSIER - 53 (virus scan)
11 POPP_MR_BUBBLES
12 DAVB_LAGOM_LITE
13 AFRI_AUSTIN
14 SUSI_UNAGI -23
15 BNDK_TRU1CY
16 SMPN_CHAOSRAVEN

Scoop20906 · Post by **Scoop20906** » Fri Jan 28, 2011 12:28 pm

Votes:
Austin (1) - tru1cy
RMC (1) - theohall

Players with no vote:
Newcastle, RMC, Lassr, coopasonic, Remus West, Qantaga, Sectoid, Stessier, Mr Bubbles, Lagom Lite, Austin, Unagi, chaosraven

Majority is 9 votes.

The hard deadline to terminate is Wednesday, February 2, 2011 by 10:00 pm (Eastern Time Zone). If no majority is met by the hard deadline we will move to Downtime 1 and there will be no termination.

coopasonic · Post by **coopasonic** » Fri Jan 28, 2011 12:29 pm

stessier wrote:
Scoop20906 wrote:
stessier wrote:And another one - what if Flynn is dead? Can the Users still win by collecting the necessary permission bits?
If Flynn dies then the User team can NOT win.
Okay, so explain Backups again. Can they be passed? Are they protections we can spend to protect anyone, or is it only for the person holding it?

I'm not sure this game is going to be winnable for anyone.

Can't you guys read API specs? When you execute a backup you pass the program name you are backing up. Then as long as the program isn't on team ENCOM they will survive the next derezz against them.

Scoop20906 · Post by **Scoop20906** » Fri Jan 28, 2011 12:30 pm

stessier wrote:
Scoop20906 wrote:
stessier wrote:And another one - what if Flynn is dead? Can the Users still win by collecting the necessary permission bits?
If Flynn dies then the User team can NOT win.
Okay, so explain Backups again. Can they be passed? Are they protections we can spend to protect anyone, or is it only for the person holding it?

I'm not sure this game is going to be winnable for anyone.

Permission Bits may be passed (the passing is announced by the moderator and send and received are revealed) but all other code can not be passed. Back ups can be played on another program.

coopasonic · Post by **coopasonic** » Fri Jan 28, 2011 12:31 pm

theohall wrote: Terminate MOON_RMC

The M in RMC along with that MOON thing = MPC = Mycroft Holmes. Besides, these new programs need to be debugged.

And Lassr stole my sector scan.

That makes no sense to me whatsover, but someone has to die to move this thing forward.

MOON_RMC

stessier · Post by **stessier** » Fri Jan 28, 2011 12:32 pm

coopasonic wrote:Can't you guys read API specs?

stessier wrote:I'm a Chemical Engineer, not a Computer Program!

Remus West · Post by **Remus West** » Fri Jan 28, 2011 12:33 pm

Well, with two folks having found virus scans Thorne does seem to be relatively screwed as we can narrow down to a starting group of corrupted that we can derez/clean to remove the corruption. Then it becomes a fight between the MCP and Flynn for the win. The corruption needs to be removed first though or Thorne is going to be the winner by default eventually. With 16 living players you can each scan 8. However, with 15 living players (post lynch) you will each be scanning 7 and leaving a single unscanned player.

Scoop, can code be stolen? That is, if someone scans a sector where the players found the virus scan can they take the virus scan for themselves and deny it to the previous program?

stessier · Post by **stessier** » Fri Jan 28, 2011 12:33 pm

So - is there any reason we should actually lynch someone today and not just punt?

Lagom Lite · Post by **Lagom Lite** » Fri Jan 28, 2011 12:35 pm

stessier wrote:So - is there any reason we should actually lynch someone today and not just punt?

Permission bits, I guess.

Unagi · Post by **Unagi** » Fri Jan 28, 2011 12:35 pm

Lassr wrote:Game over! For Thorne that is.

agreed, (in fact, I am pretty surprised by the ruling)

stessier, I think Back-ups are basically 'protection' and can be applied to a buddy, should you wish.

And, just to start things off here :

> kill -9 Isgrimnur

What's the point of that program anyway?

stessier · Post by **stessier** » Fri Jan 28, 2011 12:37 pm

Lagom Lite wrote:
stessier wrote:So - is there any reason we should actually lynch someone today and not just punt?
Permission bits, I guess.

There is no guarantee anyone has any bits yet.

coopasonic · Post by **coopasonic** » Fri Jan 28, 2011 12:37 pm

stessier wrote:So - is there any reason we should actually lynch someone today and not just punt?

The only reason in my mind would be so we don't have to wait until Wed night to see what happens next. Flynn is immune to lynch/termination, so not much risk there.