Octopus Overlords

noxiousdog wrote: Fri May 25, 2018 9:52 amWhen Kaepernick started his demonstration, it wasn't clear to me what he wanted or why he was drawing attention to himself.

"I'm going to continue to stand with the people that are being oppressed. To me, this is something that has to change. When there's significant change and I feel that flag represents what it's supposed to represent, and this country is representing people the way that it's supposed to, I'll stand."

"This stand wasn’t for me. This is because I’m seeing things happen to people that don’t have a voice, people that don’t have a platform to talk and have their voices heard, and effect change. So I’m in the position where I can do that and I’m going to do that for people that can’t."

"It's something that can unify this team. It's something that can unify this country. If we have these real conversations that are uncomfortable for a lot of people. If we have these conversations, there's a better understanding of where both sides are coming from."

"I have great respect for the men and women that have fought for this country. I have family, I have friends that have gone and fought for this country. And they fight for freedom, they fight for the people, they fight for liberty and justice, for everyone. That’s not happening. People are dying in vain because this country isn’t holding their end of the bargain up, as far as giving freedom and justice, liberty to everybody. That’s something that’s not happening. I’ve seen videos, I’ve seen circumstances where men and women that have been in the military have come back and been treated unjustly by the country they fought have for, and have been murdered by the country they fought for, on our land. That’s not right."

msteelers wrote: Fri May 25, 2018 10:36 am

noxiousdog wrote: Fri May 25, 2018 9:52 amWhen Kaepernick started his demonstration, it wasn't clear to me what he wanted or why he was drawing attention to himself.

I'm not sure how that is Kaepernick's fault, considering he said why he was doing it the moment someone shoved a microphone into his face.

"I'm going to continue to stand with the people that are being oppressed. To me, this is something that has to change. When there's significant change and I feel that flag represents what it's supposed to represent, and this country is representing people the way that it's supposed to, I'll stand."

"This stand wasn’t for me. This is because I’m seeing things happen to people that don’t have a voice, people that don’t have a platform to talk and have their voices heard, and effect change. So I’m in the position where I can do that and I’m going to do that for people that can’t."

"It's something that can unify this team. It's something that can unify this country. If we have these real conversations that are uncomfortable for a lot of people. If we have these conversations, there's a better understanding of where both sides are coming from."

"I have great respect for the men and women that have fought for this country. I have family, I have friends that have gone and fought for this country. And they fight for freedom, they fight for the people, they fight for liberty and justice, for everyone. That’s not happening. People are dying in vain because this country isn’t holding their end of the bargain up, as far as giving freedom and justice, liberty to everybody. That’s something that’s not happening. I’ve seen videos, I’ve seen circumstances where men and women that have been in the military have come back and been treated unjustly by the country they fought have for, and have been murdered by the country they fought for, on our land. That’s not right."

I have a hard time finding something offensive there. The people that took offense more than likely never heard those words.

noxiousdog wrote: Fri May 25, 2018 12:12 pm So, then the cameras were pushed in his face and what? There's nothing about police. There's nothing about people being murdered.

"I'm going to continue to stand with the people that are being oppressed. To me, this is something that has to change. When there's significant change and I feel that flag represents what it's supposed to represent, and this country is representing people the way that it's supposed to, I'll stand."

"This stand wasn’t for me. This is because I’m seeing things happen to people that don’t have a voice, people that don’t have a platform to talk and have their voices heard, and effect change. So I’m in the position where I can do that and I’m going to do that for people that can’t."

noxiousdog wrote: There's nothing about what he would like done about it.

"It's something that can unify this team. It's something that can unify this country. If we have these real conversations that are uncomfortable for a lot of people. If we have these conversations, there's a better understanding of where both sides are coming from."

stessier wrote: Fri May 25, 2018 12:20 pm

noxiousdog wrote: Fri May 25, 2018 12:12 pm So, then the cameras were pushed in his face and what? There's nothing about police. There's nothing about people being murdered.

That's exactly what this says. You have to read it in the context of the times.

"I'm going to continue to stand with the people that are being oppressed. To me, this is something that has to change. When there's significant change and I feel that flag represents what it's supposed to represent, and this country is representing people the way that it's supposed to, I'll stand."

"This stand wasn’t for me. This is because I’m seeing things happen to people that don’t have a voice, people that don’t have a platform to talk and have their voices heard, and effect change. So I’m in the position where I can do that and I’m going to do that for people that can’t."

noxiousdog wrote: There's nothing about what he would like done about it.

And he addresses this as well.

"It's something that can unify this team. It's something that can unify this country. If we have these real conversations that are uncomfortable for a lot of people. If we have these conversations, there's a better understanding of where both sides are coming from."

He wants people to talk about the problem. Expecting him to have more of a solution to a problem of this magnitude is ludicrous.

"I didn't have scandals, which seems like it shouldn't be something you brag about," Obama joked.

noxiousdog wrote:You're not listening to what I wrote.

The offense is kneeling during the anthem. The common ritual we have is to stand for national anthems. Even ones that are not our own. Not standing is the point of the demonstration. It's supposed to draw attention to him and his cause. If we weren't offended by it, it would be pretty ineffective.

So, then the cameras were pushed in his face and what? There's nothing about police. There's nothing about people being murdered. There's nothing about what he would like done about it.

msteelers wrote: Fri May 25, 2018 2:01 pm This is where you lose me. I don’t know how you can read his comments and still say this. He literally says the things you say he didn’t say.

noxiousdog wrote: Fri May 25, 2018 3:11 pm

msteelers wrote: Fri May 25, 2018 2:01 pm This is where you lose me. I don’t know how you can read his comments and still say this. He literally says the things you say he didn’t say.

Page no worky.

"I'm going to continue to stand with the people that are being oppressed. To me, this is something that has to change. When there's significant change and I feel that flag represents what it's supposed to represent, and this country is representing people the way that it's supposed to, I'll stand."

noxiousdog wrote: Fri May 25, 2018 3:18 pm

noxiousdog wrote: Fri May 25, 2018 3:11 pm

msteelers wrote: Fri May 25, 2018 2:01 pm This is where you lose me. I don’t know how you can read his comments and still say this. He literally says the things you say he didn’t say.

Page no worky.

I think what you want is this.

He did not say anything concrete. He said

"I'm going to continue to stand with the people that are being oppressed. To me, this is something that has to change. When there's significant change and I feel that flag represents what it's supposed to represent, and this country is representing people the way that it's supposed to, I'll stand."

So what? Bullies? Equal Pay for Equal Work? Native Americans get their land back? The 1% pays more taxes? Union power? This country has a lot of places it can use some work.

"I am not going to stand up to show pride in a flag for a country that oppresses black people and people of color," Kaepernick told NFL Media in an exclusive interview after the game. "To me, this is bigger than football and it would be selfish on my part to look the other way. There are bodies in the street and people getting paid leave and getting away with murder."

noxiousdog wrote: Fri May 25, 2018 3:33 pm That was not widely reported at the time. I even missed it in that article and I was looking for it.

I never heard that explanation and of it doesn't surprise me. Anything to fuel controversy I suppose.

noxiousdog wrote: Fri May 25, 2018 3:33 pm That was not widely reported at the time. I even missed it in that article and I was looking for it.

I never heard that explanation and of it doesn't surprise me. Anything to fuel controversy I suppose.

msteelers wrote: Fri May 25, 2018 10:36 am I'm not sure how that is Kaepernick's fault, considering he said why he was doing it the moment someone shoved a microphone into his face.

"I think the two presidential candidates that we currently have also represent the issues that we have in this country right now," Kaepernick said. "You have Hillary who's called black teens or black kids super predators. You have Donald Trump who is openly racist. We have a presidential candidate who deleted emails and done things illegally and is a presidential candidate. That doesn't make sense to me. Because if that was any other person, you'd be in prison. So what is this country really standing for?"

LordMortis wrote: Fri May 25, 2018 3:52 pm We were quoting his words on the 29th

http://octopusoverlords.com/forum/viewt ... k#p2394119

Or maybe I'm missing what you are saying was not being reported.

noxiousdog wrote: Fri May 25, 2018 4:29 pm

LordMortis wrote: Fri May 25, 2018 3:52 pm We were quoting his words on the 29th

http://octopusoverlords.com/forum/viewt ... k#p2394119

Or maybe I'm missing what you are saying was not being reported.

No we weren't (other than the generic oppression). I was saying then I didn't know what it was about and McNutt said you had to infer it.

noxiousdog wrote: Mon Aug 29, 2016 4:51 pm

tjg_marantz wrote:

Isgrimnur wrote:

tjg_marantz wrote:

I never thought of that.

It was a copy paste from my mobile so I guess something got lost, hehe. This is what it was supposed to say:

"I am not going to stand up to show pride in a flag for a country that oppresses black people and people of color. To me, this is bigger than football and it would be selfish on my part to look the other way. There are bodies in the street and people getting paid leave and getting away with murder."

That last sentence couldn't be more spot on. It's not that everyone is rotten. But those that are have been and continue to "get away with it". Until that changes, and I think we are headed in the right direction with all the videotaping, I completely understand his frustration and stance and I won't assume he's being anything but honest at this point.

And even if he isn't, the point itself is valid.

Saying "I don't want to be an American" is about the worst possible way to get other Americans to want to support your cause.

msteelers wrote: Fri May 25, 2018 5:12 pm You quoted a post that included the quote from Kaepernick where he specifically said this was in response to black people getting killed by police, and you didn't know what it was about? Even crazier, you somehow interpreted it as him saying "I don't want to be an American."

I don't know what it is about this issue that makes reasonable people suddenly suffer from short term amnesia. It's in one ear and out the other. I don't know what to call it, other than willful ignorance. You even admitted yourself earlier today that you missed the quote, even after specifically looking for it in an article that you posted.

msteelers wrote: Fri May 25, 2018 5:12 pm I don't know what it is about this issue that makes reasonable people suddenly suffer from short term amnesia. It's in one ear and out the other. I don't know what to call it, other than willful ignorance. You even admitted yourself earlier today that you missed the quote, even after specifically looking for it in an article that you posted.

noxiousdog wrote: Fri May 25, 2018 12:12 pm The offense is kneeling during the anthem. The common ritual we have is to stand for national anthems. Even ones that are not our own. Not standing is the point of the demonstration. It's supposed to draw attention to him and his cause. If we weren't offended by it, it would be pretty ineffective.

So, then the cameras were pushed in his face and what? There's nothing about police. There's nothing about people being murdered. There's nothing about what he would like done about it.

Pyperkub wrote: Fri May 25, 2018 7:52 pm

noxiousdog wrote: Fri May 25, 2018 12:12 pm The offense is kneeling during the anthem. The common ritual we have is to stand for national anthems. Even ones that are not our own. Not standing is the point of the demonstration. It's supposed to draw attention to him and his cause. If we weren't offended by it, it would be pretty ineffective.

So, then the cameras were pushed in his face and what? There's nothing about police. There's nothing about people being murdered. There's nothing about what he would like done about it.

Actually, it wasn't a cause. He was just kneeling out of personal feelings at first, not out of some desire to start a movement/cause. It wasn't until Eric Reid asked him what was up that things developed that way. He had actually done it for a game or two before Reid spoke with him, and it was another game or two after that that the media got wind of it. Mostly it was just him doing what he felt was right for himself at the start.

We sorta came to a middle ground where he would take a knee alongside his teammate. Soldiers take a knee in front of a fallen brother’s grave, you know, to show respect. When we’re on a patrol, you know, and we go into a security halt, we take a knee, and we pull security.

Defiant wrote: Wed May 23, 2018 2:15 pm Of course, Sisko is the best. He won a god damned war. He was a literal god. And when he found himself on the other side of the galaxy, it only took him a few minutes to get back to the Alpha quadrant.

Trump wrote:The Failing @nytimes quotes “a senior White House official,” who doesn’t exist, as saying “even if the meeting were reinstated, holding it on June 12 would be impossible, given the lack of time and the amount of planning needed.” WRONG AGAIN! Use real people, not phony sources.

The White House organized an off-the-record call with reporters. This is a lie.

Holman wrote: Sat May 26, 2018 1:04 pm This kind of thing comes almost every day now. Is Trump's lying actually pathological, or is he just fully embracing the strategy that every official lie weakens the idea of truth itself?

Put pressure on the Democrats to end the horrible law that separates children from there parents once they cross the Border into the U.S. Catch and Release, Lottery and Chain must also go with it and we MUST continue building the WALL! DEMOCRATS ARE PROTECTING MS-13 THUGS.

Unagi wrote: Sat May 26, 2018 4:58 pm Aren't his in-laws here as a result of 'chain migration' ?

Unagi wrote: Sat May 26, 2018 4:58 pm Aren't his in-laws here as a result of 'chain migration' ?

How many times has Trump played golf as President of the United States? Since taking office on Jan. 20, 2017, Mr. Trump has reportedly been on the grounds of his golf courses or played golf elsewhere 115 times since becoming President, and that's as of May 13, 2018.

The cost of Trump's golf rounds to the American taxpayer varies by round and course, but it has totaled so far in the tens of millions of dollars.

Trump has spent nearly 22 percent of his days in office at one of his golf properties for some portion of the day.

We don't know if Trump has played golf every time he shows up to one of his clubs. That's because the Trump Administration has gone out of its way to bar the White House press pool from shadowing President Trump when he goes to his golf clubs. That means Trump could be playing golf, or he could be hitting golf balls on the range, or he could be twiddling his thumbs. We don't know, and the Trump Administration won't say.

However, Trump was particularly critical of how many rounds President Barack Obama played in office, and so now he looks somewhat hypocritical in retrospect.

In total, according to CBS News reporter and presidential historian Mark Knoller, President Barack Obama played a total of 333 rounds of golf while President. That means Obama played golf for 1,665 hours of his presidency, which was, officially, 55,008 hours. In other words, Obama played golf for 3 percent of the time Obama was President.

Holman wrote: Sat May 26, 2018 1:04 pm https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/sta ... 0371106817

https://twitter.com/ArmsControlWonk/sta ... 5725876224

Trump wrote:The Failing @nytimes quotes “a senior White House official,” who doesn’t exist, as saying “even if the meeting were reinstated, holding it on June 12 would be impossible, given the lack of time and the amount of planning needed.” WRONG AGAIN! Use real people, not phony sources.

The White House organized an off-the-record call with reporters. This is a lie.

Journo Twitter is lit up about this. There were apparently quite a few reporters on the call, all of them witnesses.

This kind of thing comes almost every day now. Is Trump's lying actually pathological, or is he just fully embracing the strategy that every official lie weakens the idea of truth itself?

Unagi wrote: Sat May 26, 2018 4:58 pm Aren't his in-laws here as a result of 'chain migration' ?

Happy Memorial Day! Those who died for our great country would be very happy and proud at how well our country is doing today. Best economy in decades, lowest unemployment numbers for Blacks and Hispanics EVER (& women in 18years), rebuilding our Military and so much more. Nice!

Smoove_B wrote:A special reverent and respectful holiday message for everyone, courtesy of the President of the United States of America:

Happy Memorial Day! Those who died for our great country would be very happy and proud at how well our country is doing today. Best economy in decades, lowest unemployment numbers for Blacks and Hispanics EVER (& women in 18years), rebuilding our Military and so much more. Nice!

Smoove_B wrote: Mon May 28, 2018 9:54 am A special reverent and respectful holiday message for everyone, courtesy of the President of the United States of America:

Happy Memorial Day! Those who died for our great country would be very happy and proud at how well our country is doing today. Best economy in decades, lowest unemployment numbers for Blacks and Hispanics EVER (& women in 18years), rebuilding our Military and so much more. Nice!