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Re: The Trump Presidency Thread
Posted: Tue Nov 27, 2018 5:50 pm
by GreenGoo
LawBeefaroni wrote: Tue Nov 27, 2018 5:21 pm
If you get a chance, listen to the speech. It's absolutely astounding.
I hope they do interviews or even a full documentary to hear what they have to say about that.
I like hearing what I want to hear too, but I'm usually critical enough not to believe any of it without good reason to do so. A politician's promise is not a good enough reason, about anything, no matter the politician.
Re: The Trump Presidency Thread
Posted: Tue Nov 27, 2018 5:54 pm
by GreenGoo
Enough wrote: Tue Nov 27, 2018 4:49 pm
Sherrod Brown is saying it's also because of the Republican tax cut that allows companies to pay a lower rate on overseas profits than they do on domestic ones.
And our politicians are blaming our current PM for the one plant closing in our country. How our PM would be responsible for American tax cuts is not important enough to discuss. I'd be very careful about believing politically motivated reasoning. I'm not saying it's wrong, I'm saying that these are common situations in which to make political hay, which may or may not be valid.
Re: The Trump Presidency Thread
Posted: Tue Nov 27, 2018 6:19 pm
by GreenGoo
Hey lawbeef and others, I see GM was up almost 5% yesterday on the announcements and closed down 2.55% today.
Is this anything other than typical volatility following a big announcement? Is today just profit taking from yesterday?
Where do you think GM will end up by Friday? Any opinions on a month from now?
Re: The Trump Presidency Thread
Posted: Tue Nov 27, 2018 6:29 pm
by Holman
Well, there are two announcements in play.
1) GM: "We're closing plants and shifting to suppliers abroad, which makes us leaner and helps shareholders!" (Stocks go up.)
2) Trump: "GM is BAD PEOPLE and we're going to punish them by taking away subsidies!!" (Stocks go down on the threat alone.)
It seems like the ultimate question is whether Trump follows through on the threat, but that won't be known for a while.
Of course the real winners here are the workers of GM, who voted for Trump because they hoped only to give the 1% a massive tax cut, which they've already achieved. MAGA!
Re: The Trump Presidency Thread
Posted: Tue Nov 27, 2018 6:41 pm
by GreenGoo
Of course. I'm wondering how much impact Drumpf comments have Vs what does normal profit taking look like in similar situations but without Drumpf comments.
Anyone who follows the market closely should already know the answer, or have an opinion at least.
I don't follow the market. I haven't a clue how these things typically shake out over the first 24/48/week/month, although a month is probably too long past the announcements to have a clear link back to them.
I do know that any significant jump in price is almost always met with a drop due to profit taking, after which things start to normalize again
Re: The Trump Presidency Thread
Posted: Tue Nov 27, 2018 7:26 pm
by Kraken
GM is closing plants that make sedans because Americans aren't buying their sedans anymore. Ford already announced comparable plans some months ago (the Mustang will be the last car in their stable). Short of Make America Buy Cars Again, I suppose the government could incentivize or force GM to retool those factories to make SUVs and trucks that are currently being imported...but that smacks of socialist planning, and GM has stated that it intends to plow that money into developing the EVs and self-driving vehicles that it considers to be the future of the industry.
But sure, #MABCA!
Re: The Trump Presidency Thread
Posted: Tue Nov 27, 2018 7:36 pm
by Holman
Kraken wrote: Tue Nov 27, 2018 7:26 pm
GM is closing plants that make sedans because Americans aren't buying their sedans anymore. Ford already announced comparable plans some months ago (the Mustang will be the last car in their stable). Short of Make America Buy Cars Again, I suppose the government could incentivize or force GM to retool those factories to make SUVs and trucks that are currently being imported...but that smacks of socialist planning, and GM has stated that it intends to plow that money into developing the EVs and self-driving vehicles that it considers to be the future of the industry.
But sure, #MABCA!
Nationalizing the industry to own the socialists...
Re: The Trump Presidency Thread
Posted: Tue Nov 27, 2018 8:06 pm
by Alefroth
The U.S. saved GM.
Hmm... wonder who was responsible for that.
Re: The Trump Presidency Thread
Posted: Tue Nov 27, 2018 8:54 pm
by Pyperkub
Kraken wrote: Tue Nov 27, 2018 7:26 pm
(the Mustang will be the last car in their stable).
I see what you did there
Re: The Trump Presidency Thread
Posted: Wed Nov 28, 2018 12:32 am
by Zarathud
Enough wrote: Sherrod Brown is saying it's also because of the Republican tax cut that allows companies to pay a lower rate on overseas profits than they do on domestic ones.
A new plant can be deducted against tax more effectively than refurbishing an old plant. Like 100% in the current tax year. GM is going to profit from the Trump Tax Cut by investing overseas. And there's nothing the Drumpster can do about it.
Re: The Trump Presidency Thread
Posted: Wed Nov 28, 2018 10:10 am
by LawBeefaroni
GreenGoo wrote: Tue Nov 27, 2018 6:19 pm
Hey lawbeef and others, I see GM was up almost 5% yesterday on the announcements and closed down 2.55% today.
Is this anything other than typical volatility following a big announcement? Is today just profit taking from yesterday?
Where do you think GM will end up by Friday? Any opinions on a month from now?
It was up in the plant announcement and an overall market up day and it was down on Trump's threats and a flat to down market.
I don't think profit taking played too much into yesterday's action.
Re: The Trump Presidency Thread
Posted: Wed Nov 28, 2018 10:10 am
by pr0ner
Re: The Trump Presidency Thread
Posted: Wed Nov 28, 2018 10:12 am
by LawBeefaroni
The Trump Train? That's not him, is it?
Re: The Trump Presidency Thread
Posted: Wed Nov 28, 2018 10:16 am
by stessier
LawBeefaroni wrote: Wed Nov 28, 2018 10:12 am
The Trump Train? That's not him, is it?
It isn't. Pr0ner is saying Trump retweeted that account.
Re: The Trump Presidency Thread
Posted: Wed Nov 28, 2018 10:18 am
by LawBeefaroni
stessier wrote: Wed Nov 28, 2018 10:16 am
LawBeefaroni wrote: Wed Nov 28, 2018 10:12 am
The Trump Train? That's not him, is it?
It isn't. Pr0ner is saying Trump retweeted that account.
Oh, ok. Got it. Why not post his RTs then?
In his Twitter now (then I'm taking a shower) and can verify. What a useless man.
Re: The Trump Presidency Thread
Posted: Wed Nov 28, 2018 10:20 am
by LawBeefaroni
Also:
"Followed by the tossers, Theo Fleury, and 5 others you follow"
Ugh.
Re: The Trump Presidency Thread
Posted: Wed Nov 28, 2018 10:31 am
by pr0ner
LawBeefaroni wrote: Wed Nov 28, 2018 10:18 am
stessier wrote: Wed Nov 28, 2018 10:16 am
LawBeefaroni wrote: Wed Nov 28, 2018 10:12 am
The Trump Train? That's not him, is it?
It isn't. Pr0ner is saying Trump retweeted that account.
Oh, ok. Got it. Why not post his RTs then?
In his Twitter now (then I'm taking a shower) and can verify. What a useless man.
I would have to take screenshots of the tweets to show that Trump retweeted them and that's a lot of effort!
Re: The Trump Presidency Thread
Posted: Wed Nov 28, 2018 10:36 am
by pr0ner
Re: The Trump Presidency Thread
Posted: Wed Nov 28, 2018 10:47 am
by Defiant
Trump is threatening to
get back at GM by taking away it's subsidies which would hurt anyone buying any electric car:
As Dan Primack points out, subsidies for G.M.-specific electric vehicles do not exist. Rather, there are industry-wide federal tax credits of up to $7,500 available for purchasers of U.S. electric cars, with “aggregate caps of 200,000 vehicles per manufacturer.” In other words, getting rid of the subsidy in its current form would hurt both American consumers and other auto manufacturers.
So now we know.
Trump. Trump holds back the electric car (Does he also make Steve Guttenberg a star?)
Re: The Trump Presidency Thread
Posted: Wed Nov 28, 2018 10:57 am
by Chaz
Well, the only ones buying electric cars are those lousy coastal elites anyway, so screw them. Real Americans are buying good old gas-powered cars, to keep those Real American oil drillers working!
Re: The Trump Presidency Thread
Posted: Wed Nov 28, 2018 11:06 am
by stessier
GM hit the 200k vehicle limit this quarter, so it's really just the credit phase out that could potentially be effected. I'm not sure how he would get something like that through the House though. Perhaps he forgot he lost his majority there?
Re: The Trump Presidency Thread
Posted: Wed Nov 28, 2018 11:07 am
by Isgrimnur
Defiant wrote: Wed Nov 28, 2018 10:47 am
Trump. Trump holds back the electric car (Does he also make Steve Guttenberg a star?)
Given that Guttenberg is playing Justice Powell in next year's Roe V. Wade film, I doubt that Trump will be a fan of his.
Re: The Trump Presidency Thread
Posted: Wed Nov 28, 2018 11:18 am
by Remus West
stessier wrote: Wed Nov 28, 2018 11:06 am
GM hit the 200k vehicle limit this quarter, so it's really just the credit phase out that could potentially be effected. I'm not sure how he would get something like that through the House though. Perhaps he forgot he lost his majority there?
Doesn't matter if they push it through during a lame duck session. Majority is not really gone until new seat holders take office.
Re: The Trump Presidency Thread
Posted: Wed Nov 28, 2018 11:34 am
by malchior
Remus West wrote: Wed Nov 28, 2018 11:18 am
stessier wrote: Wed Nov 28, 2018 11:06 am
GM hit the 200k vehicle limit this quarter, so it's really just the credit phase out that could potentially be effected. I'm not sure how he would get something like that through the House though. Perhaps he forgot he lost his majority there?
Doesn't matter if they push it through during a lame duck session. Majority is not really gone until new seat holders take office.
Pretty much impossible considering that they don't have the votes in the Senate to overcome a filibuster. It is as usual just bullshit bluster. He doesn't understand he isn't a king.
Re: The Trump Presidency Thread
Posted: Wed Nov 28, 2018 11:46 am
by malchior
Re: The Trump Presidency Thread
Posted: Wed Nov 28, 2018 11:51 am
by Remus West
malchior wrote: Wed Nov 28, 2018 11:34 am
Remus West wrote: Wed Nov 28, 2018 11:18 am
stessier wrote: Wed Nov 28, 2018 11:06 am
GM hit the 200k vehicle limit this quarter, so it's really just the credit phase out that could potentially be effected. I'm not sure how he would get something like that through the House though. Perhaps he forgot he lost his majority there?
Doesn't matter if they push it through during a lame duck session. Majority is not really gone until new seat holders take office.
Pretty much impossible considering that they don't have the votes in the Senate to overcome a filibuster. It is as usual just bullshit bluster. He doesn't understand he isn't a king.
stessier commented on pushing it through the House. Unless I'm mistaken (very possible) they could get that part done.
Re: The Trump Presidency Thread
Posted: Wed Nov 28, 2018 11:53 am
by malchior
Remus West wrote: Wed Nov 28, 2018 11:51 amstessier commented on pushing it through the House. Unless I'm mistaken (very possible) they could get that part done.
But why would they?
Re: The Trump Presidency Thread
Posted: Wed Nov 28, 2018 11:56 am
by Remus West
malchior wrote: Wed Nov 28, 2018 11:53 am
Remus West wrote: Wed Nov 28, 2018 11:51 amstessier commented on pushing it through the House. Unless I'm mistaken (very possible) they could get that part done.
But why would they?
Why do they do half the crap they do? At least in part to be able to later say "We tried to make GM treat Americans better but those nasty job hating Democrats in the Senate stopped us." Is it the truth? No. Would they care even a little about that? No.
Re: The Trump Presidency Thread
Posted: Wed Nov 28, 2018 12:02 pm
by malchior
Remus West wrote: Wed Nov 28, 2018 11:56 am
malchior wrote: Wed Nov 28, 2018 11:53 am
Remus West wrote: Wed Nov 28, 2018 11:51 amstessier commented on pushing it through the House. Unless I'm mistaken (very possible) they could get that part done.
But why would they?
Why do they do half the crap they do? At least in part to be able to later say "We tried to make GM treat Americans better but those nasty job hating Democrats in the Senate stopped us." Is it the truth? No. Would they care even a little about that? No.
Personally I'd be overjoyed if they spent their remaining time tilting at windmills. I just don't think they would.
Re: The Trump Presidency Thread
Posted: Wed Nov 28, 2018 12:04 pm
by Kraken
Remus West wrote: Wed Nov 28, 2018 11:56 am
malchior wrote: Wed Nov 28, 2018 11:53 am
Remus West wrote: Wed Nov 28, 2018 11:51 amstessier commented on pushing it through the House. Unless I'm mistaken (very possible) they could get that part done.
But why would they?
Why do they do half the crap they do? At least in part to be able to later say "We tried to make GM treat Americans better but those nasty job hating Democrats in the Senate stopped us." Is it the truth? No. Would they care even a little about that? No.
Go ahead and take a symbolic vote to punish GM. I'm sure the Rust Belt states will reward you.
Re: The Trump Presidency Thread
Posted: Wed Nov 28, 2018 1:20 pm
by Remus West
Kraken wrote: Wed Nov 28, 2018 12:04 pm
Remus West wrote: Wed Nov 28, 2018 11:56 am
malchior wrote: Wed Nov 28, 2018 11:53 am
Remus West wrote: Wed Nov 28, 2018 11:51 amstessier commented on pushing it through the House. Unless I'm mistaken (very possible) they could get that part done.
But why would they?
Why do they do half the crap they do? At least in part to be able to later say "We tried to make GM treat Americans better but those nasty job hating Democrats in the Senate stopped us." Is it the truth? No. Would they care even a little about that? No.
Go ahead and take a symbolic vote to punish GM. I'm sure the Rust Belt states will reward you.
You really doubt the GOP's ability to sell their base on the idea that punishing GM would help them? A large portio of the Rust Belt was against the auto bailout years ago and that actually did help them but the GOP sold the idea that it was bad for the American worker.
Re: The Trump Presidency Thread
Posted: Wed Nov 28, 2018 1:23 pm
by Carpet_pissr
Carpet_pissr wrote: Mon Nov 26, 2018 4:40 pm
If Giles fucking Snyder on NPR asks a guest expert "IS IT NORMAL FOR A PRESIDENT TO...?" ONE MORE FREAKING time, I am going to lose my shit.
The answer is NO you fuckwad! And you goddamn know it! We are so far past "is this normal?" that I want to shake people when they ask. Doesn't matter! Normal, not normal. Shit is happening that is patently bad for our country. Who gives a shit if it's happened before or not?! It's happening NOW, let's focus on that point, mkay?! FUUUUUUUCK.
"But there's no PRECEDENT for this kind of behavior out of the White House!!! WHAT WILL WE DOOOOOOO??" (wrings hands, clutches pearls, and faints on couch simultaneously)
I would pay someone on air to answer "No, of course not you ignorant twat. Let's move on to some real questions please." Or "Giles, you simpleton. Why are you asking a question to which you already know the answer?" Even go the other way "Yes, of course this is completely normal. Why do you ask?"
OMG I've made a yuge mistake. Steve Innskeep is the devil's tool, not Giles Snyder! Apologies to Giles, and an extra tweak of the ear for the dastardly Innskeep.
Re: The Trump Presidency Thread
Posted: Wed Nov 28, 2018 1:30 pm
by Carpet_pissr
I would be surprised to learn that Trump DIDN'T equate height with capability. This is very much in line with his overall garbage human mentality.
Re: The Trump Presidency Thread
Posted: Wed Nov 28, 2018 1:37 pm
by GreenGoo
We have decades of "good hair" jokes in all sorts of media. Vote for the candidate with the best hair etc. Drumpf doesn't realize it's satire?
Re: The Trump Presidency Thread
Posted: Wed Nov 28, 2018 1:53 pm
by Defiant
Chaz wrote: Wed Nov 28, 2018 10:57 am
Well, the only ones buying electric cars are those lousy coastal elites anyway, so screw them. Real Americans are buying good old gas-powered cars, to keep those Real American oil drillers working!
No, Real Americans use dirty old
coal-powered car
(Wait, what do you mean, it was made by GM? Doh!)
Re: The Trump Presidency Thread
Posted: Wed Nov 28, 2018 3:35 pm
by Carpet_pissr
OK, this has to be the topper of the week. The guy is apparently getting more stupid by the day:
Newsweek:
"His administration released a dense report compiled by 13 federal agencies last week that painted a bleak picture of the severity of the impact of climate change on the lives of Americans, and the U.S. economy.
But Trump dismissed it.
“One of the problems that a lot of people like myself, we have very high levels of intelligence but we’re not necessarily such believers,” Trump told The Washington Post in an interview in the Oval Office."
GOT to be trolling...otherwise surely he is THE case study for oblivious, Level 11 narcissism.
For such a high level of intelligence, he sure talks like a moron. I'm sure it's just a facade.
"we're not necessarily such believers"? Where the hell did this guy learn English?! I guess it's technically correct, but it's like...pidgin or something. Now I'm pissed at myself for even trying to break his sentence striucture down.
MORON.
Re: The Trump Presidency Thread
Posted: Wed Nov 28, 2018 3:40 pm
by GreenGoo
Dunning-Kruger Effect
Not something that you'd expect to see in a President of the United States, yet here we are.
Re: The Trump Presidency Thread
Posted: Wed Nov 28, 2018 3:42 pm
by Paingod
You spelled "Stable Genius" incorrectly.
Re: The Trump Presidency Thread
Posted: Wed Nov 28, 2018 3:53 pm
by Carpet_pissr
GreenGoo wrote: Wed Nov 28, 2018 3:40 pm
Dunning-Kruger Effect
Not something that you'd expect to see in a President of the United States, yet here we are.
Wow, that REALLY nails him, doesn't it? UNLESS it's all a charade.
Re: The Trump Presidency Thread
Posted: Wed Nov 28, 2018 3:57 pm
by GreenGoo
Carpet_pissr wrote: Wed Nov 28, 2018 3:53 pm
UNLESS it's all a charade.
Dude. This was the "logic" used to explain away all his nightmarish bullshit during his campaign. Just uttering the possibility pisses me off, because it throws doubt on the idea that he's a moron, when there can be no doubt.
It's like speculating "there must be a reason so many people believe the moon landing was faked" followed by "I wonder if they know something I (and every other reasonable person on the planet) don't...".
He looks and sounds like a moron because he's a moron. Nothing else. Don't give drumpf apologists any ammo to work with.