Octopus Overlords

malchior wrote:

El Guapo wrote: Tue May 02, 2023 1:58 pm

malchior wrote: Tue May 02, 2023 1:51 pm

Kraken wrote: Tue May 02, 2023 1:59 amYup. The more trump is front and center, the more everyone but his base hates him.

Respectfully how is anyone going to learn anything new about Trump now? All I see is people making excuses for the media falling to further lows for clicks. Just like in 2016. I get why because people don't want to face how bad the situation is but that doesn't mean it is not happening. I fear in a year after the media has normalized some of his aberrant behaviors we'll be wondering how he is a contender.

I'm not really commenting on the ethics of CNN hosting a town hall, nor defending their decision to do it. I'm more just saying that I think in general more direct exposure of Trump to the public tends to hurt Trump rather than help him.

There isn't really any evidence of this. It is frankly a hope. His unfavorable ratings are probably at the ceiling and we're well into diminishing returns here on moving broad support.

However, what we do have evidence for is that support amongst the Republican base is growing. We are seeing more and more support amongst even recalcitrant Republicans abandoning DeSantis and others. Some of it is probably the deplorables rallying around the cult leader but the press is helping shore up Trump's support with the base. I don't know if that matters all that much since it seems super unlikely he won't get the nomination right now. They'll be tuning in and if/when the ratings are good he'll be back in business with the fickle press.

Edit: The sin is that they are already starting to treat him like a normal candidate. We're hearing talk that - he's the frontrunner so people need to hear his views. No they don't. He is a goddamn criminal who tried to commit a coup. We shouldn't even hint that we need to give him coverage. If he wants to speak he can figure out a venue. The networks don't need to provide him free airtime again. They have no obligation to do so and again I don't believe it is in the public interest.

If I was running Trump's campaign I wouldn't let him talk to any outlet that wasn't known to be friendly & cooperative.

I mean that's generally the advice you give a candidate anyway. They only engage with non-friendly press if there is a clear reason. What is happening here is that CNN has made a series of missteps and their ratings have crashed. This is a cynical ratings based business decision that doesn't do anything for the public. If it's true they struck some bargain with Trump then it is all the more wrong.

El Guapo wrote: Tue May 02, 2023 3:31 pmNo evidence? His poll numbers reliably dropped after debates (which is why I would be shocked if he debates in 2024). A lot depends on how it's done, of course.

But at the end of the day I'm for whatever approach is worse for Trump.

Tucker Carlson January 7, 2021 — 04:18:04 PM UTC
A couple of weeks ago, I was watching video of people fighting on the street in Washington. A group of Trump guys surrounded an Antifa kid and started pounding the living shit out of him. It was three against one, at least. Jumping a guy like that is dishonorable obviously. It’s not how white men fight. Yet suddenly I found myself rooting for the mob against the man, hoping they’d hit him harder, kill him. I really wanted them to hurt the kid. I could taste it. Then somewhere deep in my brain, an alarm went off: this isn’t good for me. I’m becoming something I don’t want to be. The Antifa creep is a human being. Much as I despise what he says and does, much as I’m sure I’d hate him personally if I knew him, I shouldn’t gloat over his suffering. I should be bothered by it. I should remember that somewhere somebody probably loves this kid, and would be crushed if he was killed. If I don’t care about those things, if I reduce people to their politics, how am I better than he is?

Grifman wrote: Tue May 02, 2023 9:47 pm This is why Tucker Carlson was fired:

https://www.nytimes.com/2023/05/02/busi ... ticleShare

Tucker Carlson January 7, 2021 — 04:18:04 PM UTC
A couple of weeks ago, I was watching video of people fighting on the street in Washington. A group of Trump guys surrounded an Antifa kid and started pounding the living shit out of him. It was three against one, at least. Jumping a guy like that is dishonorable obviously. It’s not how white men fight. Yet suddenly I found myself rooting for the mob against the man, hoping they’d hit him harder, kill him. I really wanted them to hurt the kid. I could taste it. Then somewhere deep in my brain, an alarm went off: this isn’t good for me. I’m becoming something I don’t want to be. The Antifa creep is a human being. Much as I despise what he says and does, much as I’m sure I’d hate him personally if I knew him, I shouldn’t gloat over his suffering. I should be bothered by it. I should remember that somewhere somebody probably loves this kid, and would be crushed if he was killed. If I don’t care about those things, if I reduce people to their politics, how am I better than he is?

malchior wrote: Tue May 02, 2023 10:38 pm

Grifman wrote: Tue May 02, 2023 9:47 pm This is why Tucker Carlson was fired:

https://www.nytimes.com/2023/05/02/busi ... ticleShare

Tucker Carlson January 7, 2021 — 04:18:04 PM UTC
A couple of weeks ago, I was watching video of people fighting on the street in Washington. A group of Trump guys surrounded an Antifa kid and started pounding the living shit out of him. It was three against one, at least. Jumping a guy like that is dishonorable obviously. It’s not how white men fight. Yet suddenly I found myself rooting for the mob against the man, hoping they’d hit him harder, kill him. I really wanted them to hurt the kid. I could taste it. Then somewhere deep in my brain, an alarm went off: this isn’t good for me. I’m becoming something I don’t want to be. The Antifa creep is a human being. Much as I despise what he says and does, much as I’m sure I’d hate him personally if I knew him, I shouldn’t gloat over his suffering. I should be bothered by it. I should remember that somewhere somebody probably loves this kid, and would be crushed if he was killed. If I don’t care about those things, if I reduce people to their politics, how am I better than he is?

No one should believe this heaping serving of bullshit. He said much worse than this on the air day after day for years. The credulous rubes at the NY Times bit on Rupert Murdoch's paper trail.

Kurth wrote: Tue May 02, 2023 11:48 pmCan you explain what you mean by "Murdoch's paper trail."? Why is this in Murdoch's best interest? Because of the shareholder suit? Not sure how this plays.

Beside that, this message from Carlson is just . . . weird. It's both terribly and casually racist, while at the same time actually painting Carlson as being at least a little bit introspective and even showing some compassion. It doesn't make me hate him any less, but it isn't something I would have expected he would have written in a private exchange with his producer. Strange.

To be fair, the NYT story couches the text not as a smoking gun per se, but reports that it “contributed to a chain of events that ultimately led to Mr. Carlson’s firing.” That leaves a fair bit for interpretation of how much the text contributed and what other things also contributed to the firing.

We’re not in a position to know, with so many of the Carlson internal communications either still private or redacted in court documents, what combination of revelations or notifications to the board prompted it to act finally. But it’s simply way too credulous to pretend this text somehow represents a greater display of racism from Carlson than he displayed on air in front of million of viewers night after night for years, in plain view of the Fox board.

Kurth wrote: Tue May 02, 2023 11:48 pm Beside that, this message from Carlson is just . . . weird. It's both terribly and casually racist, while at the same time actually painting Carlson as being at least a little bit introspective and even showing some compassion. It doesn't make me hate him any less, but it isn't something I would have expected he would have written in a private exchange with his producer. Strange.

malchior wrote: Wed May 03, 2023 9:06 am David Kurtz at TPM expresses similar...disbelief in the reductive storyline that is being peddled and has some good points.

To be fair, the NYT story couches the text not as a smoking gun per se, but reports that it “contributed to a chain of events that ultimately led to Mr. Carlson’s firing.” That leaves a fair bit for interpretation of how much the text contributed and what other things also contributed to the firing.

We’re not in a position to know, with so many of the Carlson internal communications either still private or redacted in court documents, what combination of revelations or notifications to the board prompted it to act finally. But it’s simply way too credulous to pretend this text somehow represents a greater display of racism from Carlson than he displayed on air in front of million of viewers night after night for years, in plain view of the Fox board.

Though I keep wondering why everyone keeps talking about the Fox board in this abstract way that seems to minimize that Rupert Murdoch has something like ~40% of the votes on the board.

Also this - glad I'm seeing some folks displaying a hint of critical thinking out there because it still smells to high heaven like bullshit to me.

malchior wrote:

Grifman wrote: Tue May 02, 2023 9:47 pm This is why Tucker Carlson was fired:

https://www.nytimes.com/2023/05/02/busi ... ticleShare

Tucker Carlson January 7, 2021 — 04:18:04 PM UTC
A couple of weeks ago, I was watching video of people fighting on the street in Washington. A group of Trump guys surrounded an Antifa kid and started pounding the living shit out of him. It was three against one, at least. Jumping a guy like that is dishonorable obviously. It’s not how white men fight. Yet suddenly I found myself rooting for the mob against the man, hoping they’d hit him harder, kill him. I really wanted them to hurt the kid. I could taste it. Then somewhere deep in my brain, an alarm went off: this isn’t good for me. I’m becoming something I don’t want to be. The Antifa creep is a human being. Much as I despise what he says and does, much as I’m sure I’d hate him personally if I knew him, I shouldn’t gloat over his suffering. I should be bothered by it. I should remember that somewhere somebody probably loves this kid, and would be crushed if he was killed. If I don’t care about those things, if I reduce people to their politics, how am I better than he is?

No one should believe this heaping serving of bullshit. He said much worse than this on the air day after day for years. The credulous rubes at the NY Times bit on Rupert Murdoch's paper trail.

hepcat wrote: Wed May 03, 2023 7:43 am Fox is going to keep leaking damaging stuff on Carlson as time goes by. I hope Tucker does the same against Fox. I like watching two assholes beat on each other.

GreenGoo wrote: Wed May 03, 2023 1:39 pm

hepcat wrote: Wed May 03, 2023 7:43 am Fox is going to keep leaking damaging stuff on Carlson as time goes by. I hope Tucker does the same against Fox. I like watching two assholes beat on each other.

The unhinged masses are attacking Fox and swearing undying loyalty to Tucker. On the one hand, great. On the other, what a fucking world.

Unagi wrote: Wed May 03, 2023 6:55 pm But Tucker kept pushing for Tump, and it seems as though FOX has tried to push for DeSantis over Trump. I feel like somewhere in all of that lies the break.

Holman wrote: Wed May 03, 2023 7:11 pm Surely DeSantis would be too risky a bet for Fox to eliminate its star anchor over.

Unagi wrote: Wed May 03, 2023 6:55 pm But Tucker kept pushing for Tump, and it seems as though FOX has tried to push for DeSantis over Trump. I feel like somewhere in all of that lies the break.

Alefroth wrote: Wed May 03, 2023 7:24 pm

Unagi wrote: Wed May 03, 2023 6:55 pm But Tucker kept pushing for Tump, and it seems as though FOX has tried to push for DeSantis over Trump. I feel like somewhere in all of that lies the break.

Which is odd, since he admitted hating Trump.

So nat'ralists observe, a flea
Hath smaller fleas that on him prey;
And these have smaller fleas to bite 'em.
And so proceeds ad infinitum.

The death of a New York City subway rider who was placed in a chokehold by another passenger on Monday was ruled a homicide, the city’s medical examiner confirmed on Wednesday evening.

The man who died, Jordan Neely, was homeless and had been screaming at passengers when the other rider wrapped his arms around Mr. Neely’s neck and head and held him for several minutes until he went limp. Mr. Neely died from compression to his neck as a result of the chokehold, according to Julie Bolcer, a spokeswoman for the medical examiner.

“This investigation is being handled by senior, experienced prosecutors and we will provide an update when there is additional public information to share,” he added.

On Monday, a man who was riding in the same subway car went up to Mr. Neely, a 30-year-old Michael Jackson impersonator who was yelling that he was hungry and ready to die. The 24-year-old man who choked Mr. Neely has not been identified.

Police were no where to be found and the guy was saying some threatening things in a closed subway car. Given the level of violence in the country, it is reasonable to take threats seriously. We need to find out more facts but the knee jerk reaction by the left and AOC to call this murder is really disappointing. It’s easy to second guess people from the comfort at home but the people in the situation had to deal with a threatening person with apparently no police around for 15 minutes.

Why must we all sit still in fear avert our eyes and hold our breath trapped in a subway car with ranting mentally ill riders? The fact that they are homeless has nothing to do with it. The fact that one of us may be injured or killed by that person is reason enough to try to protect ourselves until those doors open and we can escape. Who is advocating for our right to live free from the fear many of us feel when yet another ranting raving lunatic uses us as their captive audience? “Stand clear of the closing doors,” has taken on a whole new meaning. Offer the offender some water?! Offer the rest of us a Xanax.

If you scream at people in a confined space that you're "ready to die" someone better stop you from doing whatever comes next, or the headline will be that some crazy person slashed several people to death, or pulled out a gun and shot people. It's amazing anyone was brave enough to put a stop to the threatening behavior. This is far different than recent cases where someone innocently rang a doorbell, or turned around in a driveway, or chased a ball into a yard. Crazy people are inherently unpredictable and it isn't reasonable to expect people to just wait and see, and hope for the best.

The man apparently had 40 prior arrests for harassment and assault. Of course everyone else is to be blamed but him.

New York City and the legal system has to stop coddling violent, disruptive, drug addicts.

It is sad that the homeless man died, but his statement that he was prepared to do something and serve life in prison in jail would be interpreted by many as a threat to commit a very serious crime such as murder.

The people who was restrained this Troublemaker were heroes, not criminals.

malchior wrote: Thu May 04, 2023 5:12 am Follow up story came out late last night after the killing has been classified as a homicide by the coroner.

Isgrimnur wrote: Wed Sep 22, 2021 8:28 pm A reminder: there are only a few categories that a coroner's finding falls into:

• natural
• accident
• suicide
• homicide
• undetermined

LawBeefaroni wrote: Thu May 04, 2023 12:52 pm I used to take thr train everywhere. Now I avoid it whenever I can. I hate taking my kids on there. Smells like piss and pot and beer. Even the once pristine Purple line is a mess.

I can't remember the number of times in the past few years, even with my limited ridership, that I've had to go back to the wall and condition orange because someone is screaming and carrying on. I can't imagine the constant stress for someone who has to ride daily.

None of thst is intended to justify choking someone out or anything remotely similar. It's just that public transit fast is becoming a hostile environment.



Neely was failed over and over again by all the social safety nets. Unfortunately the final failing led to his death.

As for the guy who killed him, very bad decision making there. Even if he's not charged this is going to suck for him.

Carpet_pissr wrote: Thu May 04, 2023 2:07 pmNot a lot of great options for the riders TBH. If I was in that car with my kids and someone started making those specific threats? I guess ‘get off at next stop’ is obvious choice, but still. If you felt the guy was just about to do something dangerous and the next stop was several minutes away?

Tough call.

Isgrimnur wrote: Wed May 03, 2023 8:16 pm It's parasites all the way down.

Artificial intelligence tools are now being used to populate so-called content farms, referring to low-quality websites around the world that churn out vast amounts of clickbait articles to optimize advertising revenue, NewsGuard found.

In April 2023, NewsGuard identified 49 websites spanning seven languages — Chinese, Czech, English, French, Portuguese, Tagalog, and Thai — that appear to be entirely or mostly generated by artificial intelligence language models designed to mimic human communication — here in the form of what appear to be typical news websites.

The websites, which often fail to disclose ownership or control, produce a high volume of content related to a variety of topics, including politics, health, entertainment, finance, and technology. Some publish hundreds of articles a day. Some of the content advances false narratives. Nearly all of the content features bland language and repetitive phrases, hallmarks of artificial intelligence.

Many of the sites are saturated with advertisements, indicating that they were likely designed to generate revenue from programmatic ads

Me: I live in a world where people think we should kill other people who annoy us

Hobbes: On no. Sounds like you live in the State of Nature. The solution to that is authoritarianism.

Me: You say that, but in my world the authoritarians ALSO support vigilante justice

Hobbes: Wut?

Me: Yeah dude. They support a monopoly of force not from the state, but from any white individual who is afraid.

Hobbes: So the Leviathans of your time are not just petty and stupid, but also racist? Man, I didn't see that coming.

Me: Yeah. That's why you've always been wrong.

Hobbes: I'm not wrong.

Rawls: Really Thom? Riddle me this, from behind the veil of ignorance, would you choose to be black and poor?

Hobbes: Fuck you, John. I'm not playing your stupid game.

Plato: You just need a better ruling class.

Me: Eric Adams is our mayor

Plato: fuuuck

Jefferson: Consider a bourgeoise Republic where men of wealth and status can decide for themselves who is to be murdered on community transportation?

Me: It's not really working out.

Jefferson: Oh look, the slave can type. How novel! Can you also sing and make me a sanwich?

Marx: You know what the solution is.

Me: Leave me alone, Karl.

Marx: Search your feelings, you know it to be true.

Me: I don't think trading white supremacists for a ruling group think politburo is helpful

Marx: Hey, that wasn't me, it was the other guy.

Lenin: Hello fellow kids.

Nietzsche: I have thoughts...

Me: No.

Nietzsche: It's really simple.

Me: Dear God, please shut up.

Nietzsche: YOU COULD ACT, LIKE A MAN!!!

Me: Motherfucker, this is how people get syphilis.

LordMortis wrote: Fri May 05, 2023 6:55 am Good but scary. It suggests to me that 30% will follow Tucker or find another rat bastard and that Fox will want that viewership back and will do what it takes.