Octopus Overlords

LordMortis wrote: Fri Feb 14, 2020 10:26 am

Seems like what they really need is better internal controls to ensure that any changes are processed all the way down to the vehicle itself and all associated paperwork before it's listed for sale by Tesla.

From before it was declared as a miscommunication, this didn't sound like a lack of control. It sounded like a bullshit control. (Again, as reported or allegedly or whatever tag we put on when sourcing can be called in to question)


Also how do I get the $767 offering price so I can sell it at 800?

A huge account. A friend it two at Goldman doesn't hurt. Don't call them, they'll call you.

LawBeefaroni wrote: Fri Feb 14, 2020 10:37 am

LordMortis wrote: Fri Feb 14, 2020 10:26 am

Seems like what they really need is better internal controls to ensure that any changes are processed all the way down to the vehicle itself and all associated paperwork before it's listed for sale by Tesla.

From before it was declared as a miscommunication, this didn't sound like a lack of control. It sounded like a bullshit control. (Again, as reported or allegedly or whatever tag we put on when sourcing can be called in to question)


Also how do I get the $767 offering price so I can sell it at 800?

A huge account. A friend it two at Goldman doesn't hurt. Don't call them, they'll call you.

Yep. First, be a bigger fish. Then feast on the small fish.

Please sign me up for bigger fishnessitude please.

LordMortis wrote: Fri Feb 14, 2020 10:42 am Please sign me up for bigger fishnessitude please.

If you find the form, send me a copy, as well.

LordMortis wrote: Fri Feb 14, 2020 10:26 am

Seems like what they really need is better internal controls to ensure that any changes are processed all the way down to the vehicle itself and all associated paperwork before it's listed for sale by Tesla.

From before it was declared as a miscommunication, this didn't sound like a lack of control. It sounded like a bullshit control. (Again, as reported or allegedly or whatever tag we put on when sourcing can be called in to question)


Also how do I get the $767 offering price so I can sell it at 800?

Why would you sell a stock after only a 5% increase in price? Do you truly not believe in the company that much? If so, why are you buying it in the first place?

raydude wrote: Fri Feb 14, 2020 11:08 am Why would you sell a stock after only a 5% increase in price? Do you truly not believe in the company that much? If so, why are you buying it in the first place?

Indeed. Unless you see a 30% upside, what's the point?

raydude wrote: Fri Feb 14, 2020 11:08 am

LordMortis wrote: Fri Feb 14, 2020 10:26 am

Seems like what they really need is better internal controls to ensure that any changes are processed all the way down to the vehicle itself and all associated paperwork before it's listed for sale by Tesla.

From before it was declared as a miscommunication, this didn't sound like a lack of control. It sounded like a bullshit control. (Again, as reported or allegedly or whatever tag we put on when sourcing can be called in to question)


Also how do I get the $767 offering price so I can sell it at 800?

Why would you sell a stock after only a 5% increase in price? Do you truly not believe in the company that much? If so, why are you buying it in the first place?

5% in one day annualizes out quite well.

I have a few accounts. In my speculative ones, if I can do a one day arbitrage or a quick trade of 8% I'll do it. In my retirement accounts I don't even bother to look on a daily basis.

Although this is getting out of Tesla territory. For that TSLA offering there is probably a lock up period so you can't just flip on day one.

LawBeefaroni wrote: Fri Feb 14, 2020 11:47 am

raydude wrote: Fri Feb 14, 2020 11:08 am

LordMortis wrote: Fri Feb 14, 2020 10:26 am

Seems like what they really need is better internal controls to ensure that any changes are processed all the way down to the vehicle itself and all associated paperwork before it's listed for sale by Tesla.

From before it was declared as a miscommunication, this didn't sound like a lack of control. It sounded like a bullshit control. (Again, as reported or allegedly or whatever tag we put on when sourcing can be called in to question)


Also how do I get the $767 offering price so I can sell it at 800?

Why would you sell a stock after only a 5% increase in price? Do you truly not believe in the company that much? If so, why are you buying it in the first place?

5% in one day annualizes out quite well.

I have a few accounts. In my speculative ones, if I can do a one day arbitrage or a quick trade of 8% I'll do it. In my retirement accounts I don't even bother to look on a daily basis.

Although this is getting out of Tesla territory. For that TSLA offering there is probably a lock up period so you can't just flip on day one.

Arbitrage is a completely different beast. That's not speculation, that's taking advantage of a real existing price mismatch.

You can't know about your theoretical 8% ahead of time. All you know is that you feel it should be valued higher. I would argue that if you don't expect a 30% return, then 8% is too much risk for too little reward; and hence you should still feel there is a lot of upside and not sell.

And yes, this belongs in our other thread, so I'll leave it at that.

BBC

Tesla has been ordered to temporarily halt preparations for a car factory in Germany after environmentalists won a court injunction on Sunday.

The electric carmaker had been clearing forest land near the capital, Berlin, ahead of building its first European car and battery plant.

The court emphasised the injunction was temporary and subject to further hearings, probably this week.

Protesters say the factory is a threat to local wildlife and water supplies.
...
According to local media reports, Tesla has promised to relocate colonies of forest ants, reptiles and bats, and is working with conservationists. Last month, authorities defused seven Second World War bombs discovered at the site.

Yahoo

Researchers were able to trick a Tesla Inc. vehicle into speeding by putting a strip of electrical tape over a speed limit sign, spotlighting the kinds of potential vulnerabilities facing automated driving systems.

Technicians at McAfee Inc. placed the piece of tape horizontally across the middle of the “3” on a 35 mile-per-hour speed limit sign. The change caused the vehicle to read the limit as 85 miles per hour, and its cruise control system automatically accelerated, according to research released by McAfee on Wednesday.

What I wonder about is will a self-driving car mow down some pedestrians in order to save the occupant of the car.

Jaymann wrote: Thu Feb 20, 2020 12:40 pm What I wonder about is will a self-driving car mow down some pedestrians in order to save the occupant of the car.

Or vice-versa. There may be some philosophical decisions to be made when FSD becomes a reality. For example, what if you're alone in your car, 80 years old, and the car can either ram into a couple of pedestrians or get hit by a semi? That's a choice extremely unlikely to be noticed and acted upon by a human, but a computer with a bunch of cameras and radar along with split-second decision-making will see that sort of thing a lot more often.

Tesla short sellers going bankrupt? I apologize for the terrible voice over.

Haven't watched it, but I see Mark Spiegel in the thumbnail. There is no pit in hell deep enough for that asshole. What a vile human being.

Zaxxon wrote: Thu Feb 20, 2020 12:53 pm

Jaymann wrote: Thu Feb 20, 2020 12:40 pm What I wonder about is will a self-driving car mow down some pedestrians in order to save the occupant of the car.

Or vice-versa. There may be some philosophical decisions to be made when FSD becomes a reality. For example, what if you're alone in your car, 80 years old, and the car can either ram into a couple of pedestrians or get hit by a semi? That's a choice extremely unlikely to be noticed and acted upon by a human, but a computer with a bunch of cameras and radar along with split-second decision-making will see that sort of thing a lot more often.

Or what if you must swerve left or right, and on the left is a pregnant black woman with a toddler, and on the right are 3 old white men. It's a classic trolley problem, the difference being that someone will have to make these decisions and program them into an algorithm. Do you trust some nerd to make these decisions for you?

Yes. I'd rather argue about a few ethics deaths than 30,000 auto fatalities a year.

noxiousdog wrote: Thu Feb 20, 2020 3:01 pm Yes. I'd rather argue about a few ethics deaths than 30,000 auto fatalities a year.

What ND said. Humans on the whole are absolutely terrible drivers. The issue we will collectively need to get over is 'computer cars messed up this week and killed four humans that otherwise might have lived, yet computer cars on the whole this week saved 50 humans that otherwise would have died.' At present, and in line with humans' collective terribleness with statistics, we lose our collective shit over the former case while not properly counting the latter.

Zaxxon wrote: Thu Feb 20, 2020 3:08 pm

noxiousdog wrote: Thu Feb 20, 2020 3:01 pm Yes. I'd rather argue about a few ethics deaths than 30,000 auto fatalities a year.

What ND said. Humans on the whole are absolutely terrible drivers. The issue we will collectively need to get over is 'computer cars messed up this week and killed four humans that otherwise might have lived, yet computer cars on the whole this week saved 50 humans that otherwise would have died.' At present, and in line with humans' collective terribleness with statistics, we lose our collective shit over the former case while not properly counting the latter.

It's human nature to view unexpected/"undeserved" deaths as more significant. A fatal car accident comes with the territory if you're driving. The "50 humans that otherwise would have died" are already baked in to our expectations. A mom and kid minding their own business on the sidewalk are not. If a car with 6 passengers runsover the mom and kid to avoid another car with 6 passengers, the story isn't that up to 12 lives were saved. It's that two innocent bystanders were killed. Or murdered by the AI if you're looking for clicks.

No, it's not logical. It's not efficient. But it's human nature.


There was recently a memorial for the 5 people killed and 6 wounded in the Aurora, IL factory shooting last year. It was an unexpected, "undeserved" event. But we had nothing for the dozens or so shot in gang violence the same week last year. Because those are already baked in. Same thing.

Agreed. That's what I was trying to get at with my 'human terribleness with statistics' comment. Baked in or not, the reality is that if the entire class of deaths drops significantly, that's a net benefit. Full stop. It's humans and their nature that view it as anything else.

Zaxxon wrote: Thu Feb 20, 2020 3:30 pm Agreed. That's what I was trying to get at with my 'human terribleness with statistics' comment. Baked in or not, the reality is that if the entire class of deaths drops significantly, that's a net benefit. Full stop. It's humans and their nature that view it as anything else.

Well, and juries too. And that's the rub.

LawBeefaroni wrote: Thu Feb 20, 2020 3:49 pm

Zaxxon wrote: Thu Feb 20, 2020 3:30 pm Agreed. That's what I was trying to get at with my 'human terribleness with statistics' comment. Baked in or not, the reality is that if the entire class of deaths drops significantly, that's a net benefit. Full stop. It's humans and their nature that view it as anything else.

Well, and juries too. And that's the rub.

Yes, humans, as I said. Maybe the root problem is that our juries are human, too.

Zaxxon wrote: Thu Feb 20, 2020 3:53 pm

LawBeefaroni wrote: Thu Feb 20, 2020 3:49 pm

Zaxxon wrote: Thu Feb 20, 2020 3:30 pm Agreed. That's what I was trying to get at with my 'human terribleness with statistics' comment. Baked in or not, the reality is that if the entire class of deaths drops significantly, that's a net benefit. Full stop. It's humans and their nature that view it as anything else.

Well, and juries too. And that's the rub.

Yes, humans, as I said. Maybe the root problem is that our juries are human, too.

As a human working in technology utilizing machine learning. Let's just stop that conversation right there. Computers are smart, but computers are still dumb!

coopasonic wrote: Thu Feb 20, 2020 4:05 pm

Zaxxon wrote: Thu Feb 20, 2020 3:53 pm

LawBeefaroni wrote: Thu Feb 20, 2020 3:49 pm

Zaxxon wrote: Thu Feb 20, 2020 3:30 pm Agreed. That's what I was trying to get at with my 'human terribleness with statistics' comment. Baked in or not, the reality is that if the entire class of deaths drops significantly, that's a net benefit. Full stop. It's humans and their nature that view it as anything else.

Well, and juries too. And that's the rub.

Yes, humans, as I said. Maybe the root problem is that our juries are human, too.

As a human working in technology utilizing machine learning. Let's just stop that conversation right there. Computers are smart, but computers are still dumb!

I'm kidding, of course. I do drive a Tesla with FSD, after all. We're... not that close to this conversation being a real thing.

But an AI clerk with instant access to all case law would be awesome.

I paid for FSD. I never use FSD. Sometimes humans are dumb also.

coopasonic wrote: Thu Feb 20, 2020 4:08 pm I paid for FSD. I never use FSD. Sometimes humans are dumb also.

Also, FWIW, I'm getting the HW3 computer upgrade in 2 weeks. Looks like they're finally rolling the retrofit out in larger #s.

Zaxxon wrote: Thu Feb 20, 2020 4:10 pm

coopasonic wrote: Thu Feb 20, 2020 4:08 pm I paid for FSD. I never use FSD. Sometimes humans are dumb also.

Also, FWIW, I'm getting the HW3 computer upgrade in 2 weeks. Looks like they're finally rolling the retrofit out in larger #s.

Did you reach out, were getting other service done or did they reach out to you?

Since I don't actually use Autopilot I don't really care too much and I have seen the horror stories on reddit of losing the car for 4-5 days and just getting uber credits.

coopasonic wrote: Thu Feb 20, 2020 4:11 pm

Zaxxon wrote: Thu Feb 20, 2020 4:10 pm

coopasonic wrote: Thu Feb 20, 2020 4:08 pm I paid for FSD. I never use FSD. Sometimes humans are dumb also.

Also, FWIW, I'm getting the HW3 computer upgrade in 2 weeks. Looks like they're finally rolling the retrofit out in larger #s.

Did you reach out, were getting other service done or did they reach out to you?

Someone else in my local group with a VIN similar to mine got theirs, so I submitted a service request (category: upgrades) via the app. They reached out a day or two later to schedule me. This upgrade has to be done at a service center for now, though. They scooted me to the center off of mobile for it.

I looked at the Tesla service app on my phone and I see no listing for routine maintenance. Must I wait until something breaks?

Jaymann wrote: Thu Feb 20, 2020 4:22 pm I looked at the Tesla service app on my phone and I see no listing for routine maintenance. Must I wait until something breaks?

Schedule Service --> Accessories --> Upgrades & Installations. Explain in the notes that you have FSD but are on the old 2.5 computer and would like your upgrade to the new FSD computer. Choose an appointment slot (it'll probably default you to mobile service; that's fine--they'll review the request and move you if needed).

I should caveat that I'm a pretty early VIN (22XXX), so YMMV. They may be rolling this out by VIN, in which case VINs later than mine may not yet get the green light. Or geographically, etc.

I don't want FSD, I'm talking about maintenance of the mechanical components.

Jaymann wrote: Thu Feb 20, 2020 4:28 pm I don't want FSD, I'm talking about maintenance of the mechanical components.

Ah, sorry, I confused you for coop. I would use the 'Other --> Something Else' category, and put in the notes that you're looking for the 2-year service. That is the first maintenance interval--if you're there already, congrats. I've still got 3 months to go. I believe all that's needed is a brake fluid inspection and cabin air filter replacement.

Thanks I will check it out.

Zaxxon wrote: Wed Mar 28, 2018 5:20 pm There was a terrible Model X crash earlier this week where it's unclear whether Autopilot was in use (the car was so badly destroyed that they will need to black box the logs rather than receiving OTA as usual).

MarketWatch

The National Transportation Safety Board says the driver of a Tesla SUV who died in a Silicon Valley crash two years ago was playing a videogame on his smartphone at the time.
...
Just before the crash, the Tesla steered to the left into a paved area between the freeway travel lanes and an exit ramp, the NTSB said. It crashed into the end of the concrete barrier. The car’s forward collision didn’t alert Huang, and its automatic emergency braking did not activate, the NTSB said.

Huang did not brake, and there was no steering movement detected to avoid the crash, the board’s staff said.

NTSB investigators previously found that Tesla’s system became confused at a freeway exit and was a factor in the crash. Documents released earlier this month quoted Huang’s relatives as saying Huang had previously complained about Autopilot malfunctioning and swerving in the area near where crash occurred.

Documents released earlier this month quoted Huang’s relatives as saying Huang had previously complained about Autopilot malfunctioning and swerving in the area near where crash occurred.

Whatever happened, if I had a car that swerved dangerously when I did something at a certain location, I would stop doing that thing at that location. At the very least.

If I had a car that swerved dangerously at a certain location, I would stop driving that car AND stop driving past that location.

Isgrimnur wrote:If I had a car that swerved dangerously at a certain location, I would stop driving that car AND stop driving past that location.

Well, you'd pay friggin attention when on autopilot, at least. Or just not use it.

Isgrimnur wrote: Tue Feb 25, 2020 5:52 pm

Zaxxon wrote: Wed Mar 28, 2018 5:20 pm There was a terrible Model X crash earlier this week where it's unclear whether Autopilot was in use (the car was so badly destroyed that they will need to black box the logs rather than receiving OTA as usual).

MarketWatch

The National Transportation Safety Board says the driver of a Tesla SUV who died in a Silicon Valley crash two years ago was playing a videogame on his smartphone at the time.

I guess maybe he got Candy Crushed.

Z-Corn wrote: Tue Feb 25, 2020 9:56 pm

Isgrimnur wrote: Tue Feb 25, 2020 5:52 pm

Zaxxon wrote: Wed Mar 28, 2018 5:20 pm There was a terrible Model X crash earlier this week where it's unclear whether Autopilot was in use (the car was so badly destroyed that they will need to black box the logs rather than receiving OTA as usual).

MarketWatch

The National Transportation Safety Board says the driver of a Tesla SUV who died in a Silicon Valley crash two years ago was playing a videogame on his smartphone at the time.

I guess maybe he got Candy Crushed.

I chuckled. Probably going to hell.