Blood Sucking Freaks Redux. Fin.

[Chaosraven]

Using Remus West vote notes, it glosses over the following portions (from Genghis tracking) in favor of current votes:

Lassr -
Remus West - Genghis
Newcastle - Genghis
Austin - Genghis
Chaosraven - Genghis
Bakhtosh - Remus West
Kraegor - Genghis

(withdrawal and current votes removed)
Austin - Proner(1)
Lassr - Genghis(1)
Baktosh - Kraegor(1)
Remus West - ChaosRaven(1)
ChaosRaven - Kraegor(2)
Austin - Kraegor (3)
Newcastle - newcastle(1)
Baktosh - withdraw Kraegor(1) Vote Chaosraven(1)
Kraegor - Chaosraven(3)
Baktosh - Vote Genghis (6)
Remus - Withdraw Genghis (5) Vote Baktosh (2)
Newcastle - Vote Remus West(4)
Austin - Withdraw Genghis (4) Vote ChaosRaven (2)

Perhaps he's 'lazy' or just trying to keep track of where we are... or is there something hidden in what was omitted?

[Chaosraven]

(a) No vampires have voted for him as they are trying to stay out of the limelight, this assumes he is innocent as at least one of them should have been in early if he is vampire.

This theory leaves us with:

1). PR_GMR
2). Tru1cy
7). Triggercut
13). pr0ner

--------------------------------------
(b) One vampire has voted for him (most likely within the 3-5 range) to be aboard if he is a vampire, or within the first 3 votes if he is innocent, and either way the other(s) need to keep their names off a common list.

Vote Position 1-3
Lassr - Genghis(1)
Remus West - Withdraw ChaosRaven(0) Vote Genghis (2)
FTWalker - Genghis (3)
Remus West - Revote - Genghis(2)

Vote Position 3-5
FTWalker - Genghis (3)
Austin - Genghis(4)
Chaosraven - withdraw Kraegor(1) Vote Genghis(5)
Austin - Withdraw Choasrave(2) Vote Genghis (5)

----------------------------------------------------------------
(c) Two vampires have voted for him (most likely not consecutive) if he is innocent and the third is staying out of it. If he is a Vampire, the other 2 Vampires would most likely NOT join in unless he's going to go BOOM.

Lassr - Genghis(1)
Remus West - Withdraw ChaosRaven(0) Vote Genghis (2)
FTWalker - Genghis (3)
Remus West - Revote - Genghis(2)
Austin - Genghis(4)
Chaosraven - withdraw Kraegor(1) Vote Genghis(5)
Baktosh - Vote Genghis (6)
Kraegor - Withdraw Chaosraven (2) - Vote Genghis 6
Remus West- withdraw Baktosh(1) Vote Genghis (6)
Austin - Withdraw Choasrave(2) Vote Genghis (5)
Newcastle - Withdraw Remus west (3) Vote Genghis (6)

Consecutive pairings:

Lassr - Remus West
Remus West - FTWalker
Remus West - Austin
Austin - Chaosraven
Chaosraven - Bakhtosh
Bakhtosh - Kraegor
Kraegor - Remus West
Austin - Newcastle

So if Remus West is a Vampire, then Lassr, FTWalker, Austin. and Kraegor would not be under the theory they won't vote back to back.

following that logic;

Lassr vampire means Remus West is not
FTWalker vampire means Remus West is not
Austin vampire means Remus West, Chaosraven and Newcastle are not
Chaosraven vampire means Austin and Bakhtosh are not
Bakhtosh vampire means Chaosraven and Kraegor are not
Kraegor vampire means Bakhtosh and Remus West are not
Newcastle vampire means Austin is not

None of this is actual accusation, just exploring the three theories I put forth.

If I missed anything, please point it out.

[Austin]

Finally. Thank you. I love the lists, especially for day 1. I'm just not so good at making them. The lists assume reasonably experienced vampires, but I think everyone here has some experience under their belts so that's fair.
Chaos, why the delay? A hard night of blood- feasting?

[Kraegor]

Genghis - 6
Remus West - 4
Chaosraven - 2
tru1cy - 1
Bakhtosh - 1

to the fence sitters: YOU HAVE A POLE UP YOUR ASS.

4 votes dicking around in left field. Pick a side please.
Thank you, drive thru.

Do I think a vampire is in the "i must abstain crowd"? Hell yes! You dont stand in that much abject fear unless you have something to hide by not choosing. Which means it's very possible Remus and Genghis are innocent. But who gives a rat's ass? It's day 1. For a week. Hang someone. Should I start a lynch me campaign again?

[Austin]

[meta]Be sure to join my game where I have some triggered events planned to take care of these things. [/meta]

[Bakhtosh]

Had to go back and get a new vote count

Austin - No Vote
Lassr - Austin
PR_GMR - Bakhtosh
Bakhtosh - Remus West
Triggercut - Tru1cy
Remus West - Genghis
Chaosraven - Genghis
FTWalker - Genghis
Newcastle - No Vote
pr0ner - Chaosraven
Genghis - Remus West
Kraegor - Genghis
tru1cy - Remus West

Talley:
Austin (1) - Lassr
Bakhtosh (1) - PR_GMR
Remus West (3) - Tru1cy, Genghis, Bakhtosh
Tru1cy (1) - Triggercut
Genghis (4) - Remus West, Chaosraven, FTWalker, Kraegor
Chaosraven (1) - Pr0ner

Not Voting: Austin, Newcastle

[Austin]

Meh. If it's between Remus and Genghis, I'll vote Genghis. We've got nothing until we find out details about one of these two. They have the most votes on them so perhaps the most can be found out by lynching one of them. My gut is going back and forth on each of them, but Genghis seems way more vampy to me than does Remus. (allowing for the fact that Remus is a compelling bad guy)

[Bakhtosh]

Please link to any corrections you know about.

Now, that said, we need to do something here.

Genghis, you keep hinting that you're a special, and I believe you are. That's why I'm no longer voting for you. But we're to a breaking point on this first day, and votes are liable to move very quickly. I think you need to come clean. This game you're playing is making you look more suspicious, not less.

[Kraegor]

hinting at being a special on day 1 is bullshit.

pssst: I could be a special /wink/wink

which one???? errr ummmm.....

it's easy to claim specialhood when none are dead. NONE ARE DEAD.
if a special is about to be lynched RIGHT NOW.....guess how easy it is to get positive identification????? when every single special is still alive....gee anyone wanna FAKE IT????

but no...lets play blind tap dance with hints...cuz that proves...nothing....

Don't wanna die and have special powers this round? Speak up. Otherwise, it's a ploy and I'm not buyin.

[Lassr]

Please link to any corrections you know about.

Now, that said, we need to do something here.

Genghis, you keep hinting that you're a special, and I believe you are. That's why I'm no longer voting for you. But we're to a breaking point on this first day, and votes are liable to move very quickly. I think you need to come clean. This game you're playing is making you look more suspicious, not less.

I agree, I've held off my vote long enough trying to catch any hint Genghis may drop if he is a special. I will change my vote back to Genghis today unless otherwise convinced.

I'm not sure he is a vampire anymore but we need to get the game moving and if we don't lynch him now he'll continue to be a suspect until it's somehow proven he is not a vampire.

[Newcastle]

oh another thing, CR, i think it look slike you missed my genghis retraction (#2). fyi. Nice list also by the way. And also, I am not going to vote till either late tonight or tomorrow. Any which way you split it, it doesnt matter since Ralphie aint gonna be back till tomorrow.

[Austin]

oh another thing, CR, i think it look slike you missed my genghis retraction (#2). fyi. Nice list also by the way. And also, I am not going to vote till either late tonight or tomorrow. Any which way you split it, it doesnt matter since Ralphie aint gonna be back till tomorrow.

Yeah, thanks for killing to forum. I clicked this post and suddenly Rip had to do "maintenance". Analyzing...

[Genghis]

Hrm, it seems the concensus is that I should reveal what I know since my neck is on the chopping block. I am the medium, though at the time of my post about the PMs I didn't know it. Unfortunately, there is no way to verify who I am other than by the seer, and he should remain hidden.
I do not even know if it is worthwhile to have the garlic protected guard me tonight, the medium doesn't have much power.

[Austin]

withdraw Genghis

[pr0ner]

[Kraegor]

Unfortunately, there is no way to verify who I am other than by the seer, and he should remain hidden.

no specials are dead.

Only the medium needs to come forward to prove you lie.
If none come forward, obviously you win the contest.

In other words this would be a round where your role can absolutely be proven.

[Austin]

Hrm, it seems the concensus is that I should reveal what I know since my neck is on the chopping block. I am the medium, though at the time of my post about the PMs I didn't know it. Unfortunately, there is no way to verify who I am other than by the seer, and he should remain hidden.
I do not even know if it is worthwhile to have the garlic protected guard me tonight, the medium doesn't have much power.

Interesting. I'm inclined to believe you because a vampire coming out as the medium would be dumb. I mean drawing out the medium wouldn't be all that enticing to the vampires. The only scenario I can think of would be that you are the spawning vampire and just need to make it one more night to use your power. Still... I'll give you the benefit of the doubt for Day 1. (If Genghis is not the real medium, the real one must step forward IMO)

[Newcastle]

Ok, PMs have been sent out to players with a role. If you don't have a PM, that means you're a normal villager.

It is now Night.

For the first night, I need to receive PMs from the vampires (both whom they want to kill/convert and whom they want to scan), the seer, and the garlic dispenser. Once I have received those it will turn into day.

One note, if the head vampire converts the same target that the seer scans on a given night, the seer will see that player as a normal villager (as the conversion process takes the whole night).

712 AM

[Newcastle]

Time to get started. Remus West, because he is always evil and stuff.

744AM

It might be a good idea to send a PM to those that did not get roles as well, just to make sure everyone knows the game started. Some people may not be checking the thread since it took awhile to get going.

755Am



Only one question, one question only...if the PM's had been sent, prior to your post, then you just posted about not knowing that you were the Medium when you posted your first pm gaffe...then why bring up the mention of sending PM's. There is a huge 10 min gap between responses here.

I reintstall my vote for
Genghis

[triggercut]

For now I'm inclined to believe Genghis. I sort of thought that maybe he had another role, or was a vampire...but none of the other villagers have come out to refute him.

Austin also makes sense--for a Vamp to come out posing as the Medium...well that's an awful lot of risk for not a lot of reward. I would only temper this by pointing out that there's a small chance that Genghis could be both The Medium, and the turned, Berserker vampire.

I think we can wait on discovery of that latter, remote, possibility. What strikes me as interesting is how quickly Newcastle is jumping on the idea of still lynching Genghis. That seems to me to be more significant than tru1cy's uncharacteristic lack of "stake me" posts.

Thus, withdraw tru1cy.

Stake Newcastle.

[Genghis]

I do not always login whenn I am reading the boards. I was reading the boards when I saw Ralphs post saying he had only sent a PM to those who had a ability. I had confused this game with newcastles that had been trying to get players for a few weeks. I thought it would be a good idea to send a PM to everyone to remind them that the game had started.

Basicly it was a minor thing that was blown way out of proportion.

[Bakhtosh]

Well crap...there goes that idea, and tru1cy is back on my suspect list.

Here's my thinking...the Genghis vote gets close to putting him over when he posts this:

Austin - Proner(1)
Lassr - Genghis(1)
Pr-GMR - Baktosh(1)
Baktosh - Kraegor(1)
Triggercut - Tru1cy(1)
Remus West - ChaosRaven(1)
Austin - Withdraw Pr0ner(0)
Remus West - Withdraw ChaosRaven(0)
ChaosRaven - Kraegor(2)
Austin - Kraegor (3)
Austin - Withdraw Kraegor (2)
FTWalker - Genghis (2)
Newcastle - newcastle(1)
Baktosh - withdraw Kraegor(1) Vote Chaosraven(1)
Pr0ner - Chaosraven(2)
Genghis - Remus West(1)
Kraegor - Chaosraven(3)
tru1cy - Remus west (2)
Remus West - Genghis(3)
Austin - Genghis(4)
Chaosraven - withdraw Kraegor(1) Vote Genghis(5)
Baktosh - Withdraw ChaosRaven(1)
Baktosh - Vote Genghis (6)

Which is immediately followed by tru1cy:

Yep, seem like some late jump on and that's what botheres me. A few of those players are savvy enough not make such a obvious mistake like that.

Maybe the lay off from constant games have dulled the senses, but it DOES look ominous

Without ANY explanation from Genghis, tru1cy finishes his thought and posts an explanation of the list for us to all see. This set off big warning bells for me. I figured we had to have found 2 people who could PM. So I withdrew my Genghis vote while I read through it again.

He & tru1cy were either a vamp,
a twin, or
seer & scanned

#3 is out since we've only had 1 turn...no way a seer would PM someone he can't trust.

Vamps do not typically defend each other when one is close to being lynched.

That put the two of them firmly in the "Twins" camp to me. The fact that tru1cy and genghis were both voting for the same person cemented it. That's why I placed my trust in tru1cy.

Tru1cy, I think I see what you're trying two say, and until I see some reason to mistrust you, I'll trust you.

Remus West

Note the word I just bolded. It was intentional, to let tru know that I had figured out their roles.

Except I was obviously wrong.

Withdraw Remus West

To be continued...

[Newcastle]

triggercut..feel free to vote for me, however i will explain as to why i came out so quick and back on the bandwagon.

Look at the quotes i posted. Now, follow my lead here in discerning behanviors within the games.

1. If you are playing these games, you usually do check for PM's because this is a notification that a. the game is on, however b. in this point the role you are assigned.

2. I doubt the innnocence of his statement based on the fact that not only would i think someone check their pm's prior to posting, that "ooh..game is on" but also by the fact that if he had not realized this in his first post...there was a 10 minute lag between the posts, and he ought to have checked it by then.

Giving these...I sincerely doubt his claim that "I didn't know my role as medium when i posted about the pm's, i hadn't checked my pm's". In all honesty it's a limp defense.

The pm's had been sent. That is the basis of my rationale for voting for genghis. Just me.

[Lassr]

triggercut..feel free to vote for me, however i will explain as to why i came out so quick and back on the bandwagon.

Look at the quotes i posted. Now, follow my lead here in discerning behanviors within the games.

1. If you are playing these games, you usually do check for PM's because this is a notification that a. the game is on, however b. in this point the role you are assigned.

2. I doubt the innnocence of his statement based on the fact that not only would i think someone check their pm's prior to posting, that "ooh..game is on" but also by the fact that if he had not realized this in his first post...there was a 10 minute lag between the posts, and he ought to have checked it by then.

Giving these...I sincerely doubt his claim that "I didn't know my role as medium when i posted about the pm's, i hadn't checked my pm's". In all honesty it's a limp defense.

The pm's had been sent. That is the basis of my rationale for voting for genghis. Just me.

plus you have to be logged in to post. So he logged in and posted about the game starting without checking his PM. That is weak but possible. I know when I'm waiting on a game to start I always look at the top of the page to see if I have a PM.

[grund]analyzing[/grund]

I think we are sitting at 6 votes so let's make sure before we stake Genghis.

[Newcastle]

ok how bout this...
withdraw genghis

reason is..perhaps the medium will want to come out and verify this..

wille xplain further though

[Newcastle]

first of all, i hate ping-ponging back and forth between votes. But will hold back, but know that i am in all likelihood going to go back to genghis. I withdrew because i know he is close. Nothing else. This also gives time for another medium to dispute his claim, if that were in case the fact. In addition this gives us more time to discuss this matter (not that we have truly taking that much time).

I usually dont advocate bringing out specials, but in all hoensty the medium is not that huge of a loss to the village. I am sorry medium to say that. The choice is yours though if you choose to come out. That is if Genghis is in fact lying.

I think that genghis has engaged in some quite sloppy play to be honest, and to be honest its the basics of what we have to go on.

[Remus West]

withdraw Genghis whether or not he made some odd play regarding PMs in immaterial. For the Medium not to be willing to come forward and call him on a lie would be stupid. There are only three possibilities as I see it and two of them have very low potential.

• high potential Genghis is the Medium
• Genghis was the Medium and is now the Beserker
• Genghis was a Vampire and they converted the Medium

Those are the only ways I see him not getting called out, oddness with PMs or not. I will give time for someone to come out and call him on it before I even consider voting for him as I think the first by far the most likely.

[triggercut]

I think Genghis stands at 5 now. Austin withdrew his vote.

I keep trying to rationalize why a vampire would "out" himself as a medium. I think there might be reasons, but reasons that would eventually get you torched if you were faking.

About the only thing I can come up with is that *if* Genghis were the Zerker Vamp, it'd be a great way to try to draw out another special before going to the stake and taking another villager with them. In other words, if it looks like you're about to eat some stake anyway, and you're the Zerker, you can at least try to draw out the special whose role you've claimed for your teammates, *and* take a villager (who may also be a special) with you.

Hmm.

[Bakhtosh]

If we DO decide to lynch Genghis, I think we need to head shot him.

His actions were suspicious enough that he certainly could be the berzerker. The fact that he didn't come out when he was 1 vote away (for a long time) adds to it.

Personally, I think I'm going with tru1cy for right now.

The way he jumped on Genghis' list (that I quoted above) makes me wonder if he is a vamp who saw a chance to implicate some innocents by jumping on G's observations.

He never questioned my trust in him despite me being wrong about my reasoning.

[Remus West]

triggercut - the problem I have with his trying to out a special as the beserker is this, how much is the Medium worth? If he were to fake it would be as the Seer or as the Garlic Dispenser. Either of them are much more valuable.

[tru1cy]

If we DO decide to lynch Genghis, I think we need to head shot him.

His actions were suspicious enough that he certainly could be the berzerker. The fact that he didn't come out when he was 1 vote away (for a long time) adds to it.

Personally, I think I'm going with tru1cy for right now.

The way he jumped on Genghis' list (that I quoted above) makes me wonder if he is a vamp who saw a chance to implicate some innocents by jumping on G's observations.

He never questioned my trust in him despite me being wrong about my reasoning.

Why should I question you? You are free to make your own judgments about me. Honestly, I could die and the village would lose nothing. Still think Remus , Austin and CR are in cahoots, but that's just gut feeling.

Vote me down if the village pleases, but I won't be lodging a vote against myself this time

[triggercut]

triggercut - the problem I have with his trying to out a special as the beserker is this, how much is the Medium worth? If he were to fake it would be as the Seer or as the Garlic Dispenser. Either of them are much more valuable.

Heh. I didn't say it wasn't a questionable play... I'm just exploring it from all angles, and imagining how being at 6 votes to lynch would cause this.

Here's the thing. Genghis dangled at 6 votes for an awfully long time. I think we hit that mark on 2-3 separate occasions over the course of a week, and NOW he comes out? I dunno. It smells a little bit fishy, as if this was a play just thought of by others and reluctantly agreed to by the principal.

The other thing that occurs to me: it'd be awfully tough for a Vamp to sell the village on the notion that you were a Twin. No way, you'd be getting bombarded by PM's from your brother. It'd even be hard to sell us on the notion you were a Seer or GD or Hunter. I mean, we're playing the game and into it and you're suddenly going to notice that you're one of those? Notice how quickly the first night actions with specials resolved itself; it'd sure be tough to sell the "I didn't notice I got a PM" meme if you were claiming Seerhood.

As it is, I still find Newcastle to be fishy, but I have suspicions on tru1cy.

[Austin]

The Medium would be such a ridiculously poor choice to fake. Not only are you outing a fairly weak power, it is extremely likely that the medium would come out. In fact I'd be annoyed if there was a real medium who didn't come out now. For a medium to deliver us a vampire would be golden.

The vampire coming out as the mage would either out the mage or the mage would stay quiet for a night or two and at least get that vampire a night's rest, and a chance to use the spawn power if needed. Same with garlic-guy, although he's more likely to come forward than the mage.

However, dissecting what could have happened if he came forward as something else isn't really useful right now. He came forward as the medium and unless a real medium steps forward, we need to trust him. If he's being truthful there are some definite silver linings to these developments.

[Chaosraven]

Finally.
Chaos, why the delay? A hard night of blood- feasting?

Shall I list my fabulous work schedule this week?

Suffice it to say that I have worked on all three shifts within the week.

oh another thing, CR, i think it look slike you missed my genghis retraction (#2). fyi.

(withdrawal and current votes removed)

If we wish to accept Genghis claim (as I cannot refute him, I am not the Medium) we need to make sure everyone gets an opportunity to chime in.

I am also of the opinion that if there is a Medium who is remaining silent, they need to understand the damage that will be done by keeping quiet.

[Chaosraven]

The vampire coming out as the mage would either out the mage or the mage would stay quiet for a night or two and at least get that vampire a night's rest, and a chance to use the spawn power if needed.

wondering if Maybe the Advantage to GEnghis claiming to be a "lesser" role factors in the events of the first night...

did we even ask what happens when a powered role is the converted?

[Remus West]

did we even ask what happens when a powered role is the converted?

Not that I know of. Hey Ralph, what happens when a powered role is converted?

[triggercut]

Yeah, I've played in games with a Medium before, but never one where an actual seance happened. Does it happen in public in the forum? Or is it a PM behind-the-scenes thing? Obviously the former could be faked, the latter not so much...and if the Medium becomes the Berserker Vamp, is he dual-powered like an Intel chip?

[Remus West]

Yeah, I've played in games with a Medium before, but never one where an actual seance happened. Does it happen in public in the forum? Or is it a PM behind-the-scenes thing? Obviously the former could be faked, the latter not so much...and if the Medium becomes the Berserker Vamp, is he dual-powered like an Intel chip?

Different Medium ability. This one is a Seer of the dead. That is this Medium gets to find the role of one dead player each night. If this were the serance type of Medium then faking it would be impossible as the seances happen by vote in thread, or that is the way they have worked in the past. This Medium is much weaker IMO as the strength of the Medium w/seance is the ability to prove yourself publically. The seance can prove useful for gaining information otherwise lost but the proof of ID was always the strongest part in my eyes.

[Ralph-Wiggum]

I'm gone for three days and still nobody's been killed. Losers.

did we even ask what happens when a powered role is the converted?

Not that I know of. Hey Ralph, what happens when a powered role is converted?

As for this question, if a powered player gets converted, then the villagers lose that powered player (just like if he died). The converted player does not keep his pre-conversion powers, however.

[Lassr]

I haven't been able to read the forum since yesterday, keep getting the sql errors. But I see I haven't missed much. I'm still keeping my vote on Austin.