The Hillary Clinton thread

[gbasden]

Since Trump seems inclined to appease and capitulate to the Russians, there'll never be a need to worry about actual confrontation between Trumptopia and Russia. Given that the US military already "outperforms" and "outarms" (nice Trumpism) the Russian military, I think Rip's plan pretty much covers all the bases, and already provides more detail than any of Trump's policy positions.

We certainly won't need to worry about confrontation with Russia as Trump will simply abandon our obligations with NATO and stand strong with Syria. Trump: Friend to brutal strongmen everywhere.

[malchior]

Kinder words here we could choose.
We've kind of got a lot to lose.

[em2nought]

This message temporarily interrupted due to hurricane, now back on track. Another outage due to last minute tax wrangling upcoming.

http://www.investors.com/politics/comme ... y-elected/

[GreenGoo]

Lol, unless the "media" is guarding the polling stations, it's a free country and free press.

And according to Breitbart.com, itls Drumpf by a landslide, so I don't know what media your article is talking about anyway.

[Grifman]

What we have always done to overcome them. Outperform them, outarm them, and stand strong against them even when it calls for actual confrontation. The full answer would take a few pages and I'm not that interested in typing that much. It is lot easier to lay out exactly what not to do and I will defer on the premise that if Hillary wins she can show you instead of me needing to lay it out.

Non-responsive. I asked why you criticize Clinton for a failed reset, yet think Trump would be better when all he offers is another reset. Please response as to why Trump following the same policy would be better, not what YOU think we should do. Try again.

[LordMortis]

Blame fatigue from our misadventures in Iraq and Afghanistan -- started but not finished by Bush.

Not really sure how we got there but previously at a tipping point with Iran rather than Iraq with Carter
And then previously escalated but not started by Reagan
...
And then started and not finished by Clinton
And then started and not finished by Bush
And then continued and not finished by Obama

Fatigue is right.

If you want the US to be more likely to use force, vote for Clinton. Trump is scared of even acknowledging he supported those wars.

Concurred. I'm really surprised to see those words typed by you. And I still hear that smile and laughing "we landed under sniper fire."

[Max Peck]

The Washington Post presents a well-articulated endorsement for Clinton.

In the gloom and ugliness of this political season, one encouraging truth is often overlooked: There is a well-qualified, well-prepared candidate on the ballot. Hillary Clinton has the potential to be an excellent president of the United States, and we endorse her without hesitation.

In a moment, we will explain our confidence. But first, allow us to anticipate a likely question: No, we are not making this endorsement simply because Ms. Clinton’s chief opponent is dreadful.

Republican presidential nominee Donald Trump is dreadful, that is true — uniquely unqualified as a presidential candidate. If we believed that Ms. Clinton were the lesser of two evils, we might well urge you to vote for her anyway — that is how strongly we feel about Mr. Trump. But we would also tell you that was our judgment.

Fortunately, it is not.

[...]

That presages what Americans might reasonably expect of a Clinton presidency: seriousness of purpose and relentless commitment, even in the face of great obstacles, to achievements in the public interest. We believe that Ms. Clinton will prove a worthy example to girls who celebrate the election of America’s first female president. We believe, too, that anyone who votes for her will be able to look back, four years from now, with pride in that decision.

[Rip]

What we have always done to overcome them. Outperform them, outarm them, and stand strong against them even when it calls for actual confrontation. The full answer would take a few pages and I'm not that interested in typing that much. It is lot easier to lay out exactly what not to do and I will defer on the premise that if Hillary wins she can show you instead of me needing to lay it out.

Non-responsive. I asked why you criticize Clinton for a failed reset, yet think Trump would be better when all he offers is another reset. Please response as to why Trump following the same policy would be better, not what YOU think we should do. Try again.

I disagree that Trump would perform another reset. I criticize her because a reset was exactly the opposite of what we should have been doing. If Reagan offered a reset there would still be a wall in Germany.

In the end I have no idea what Trump would do but as long as it isn't what Clinton would do I am happy. I would prefer making decisions with a magic 8-ball to allowing her to make them.

[Unagi]

Well, get ready

[hepcat]

Hillary Goddamn Clinton.

[raydude]

What we have always done to overcome them. Outperform them, outarm them, and stand strong against them even when it calls for actual confrontation. The full answer would take a few pages and I'm not that interested in typing that much. It is lot easier to lay out exactly what not to do and I will defer on the premise that if Hillary wins she can show you instead of me needing to lay it out.

Non-responsive. I asked why you criticize Clinton for a failed reset, yet think Trump would be better when all he offers is another reset. Please response as to why Trump following the same policy would be better, not what YOU think we should do. Try again.

I disagree that Trump would perform another reset. I criticize her because a reset was exactly the opposite of what we should have been doing. If Reagan offered a reset there would still be a wall in Germany.

In the end I have no idea what Trump would do but as long as it isn't what Clinton would do I am happy. I would prefer making decisions with a magic 8-ball to allowing her to make them.

You realize that with Trump one of the options on the magic 8-ball is "nuke 'em", right? If so, and you're still happy with your decision I suggest you put down the crack pipe now.

[Rip]

A hacker posting on the 4chan message board claims that he is in possession of a tape that shows Hillary Clinton making racist remarks about an African-American woman.
The individual, who claims to be linked to the John Podesta email hack, also claims that the thousands of emails deleted from Hillary Clinton’s private server will be leaked before November 1st.
“All 33k deleted Emails are going to be released by November 1st. probably in 4 – 5 sets. these emails are going to be the complete undoing of the Democratic Party. We are purposely holding them back so they cannot have time to replace Hillary,” claims the alleged hacker, who asserts that he is not working for Russia.
He goes on to promise that no less than six embarrassing videos will be released, including one, “that documents Hillary slandering and being racist against a Female African American. The amount of hatred seen on her face for their community will be worse than 100 TrumpTapes.”
The individual also comments on the Podesta emails, noting that “we are saving the best for last”.
“I can confirm rotten Hillary’s 33,000 emails have been obtained. Word is it will be a “November surprise.” Wow, something new every day!” claimed author Mike Cernovich in response to the post.

Not that I place a lot of faith in some hacker on 4chan but still.

[hepcat]

Word is it will be a “November 28th surprise.”

[raydude]

Word is it will be a “November 28th surprise.”

If this was really true and the hacker had any brains at all he'd release them now. Kill the Hillary momentum before it becomes unstoppable. As it stands, releasing it on or after Nov 1 would almost guarantee that it arrives buried under other headlines. Particularly if news agencies take their time vetting the story before it breaks.

[Max Peck]

It's a good thing (Ha!) that hackers don't know about advance voting.

[TheMix]

Even if there is a tape of Hillary, I find myself doubting that it will be 100x worse than Trump. For one thing, it's a single example. We've seen countless examples of Trump exhibiting racism. Anyone that thinks 1 example trumps countless examples already had their mind made up anyway. I don't think of myself as racist, but I'm certain that if someone went back through everything that I've ever said, that there would be examples to "prove" otherwise.

[Jaymann]

Ah, but there were black soldiers among the hundreds she gunned down at Benghazi!

[Ralph-Wiggum]

Word is it will be a “November 28th surprise.”

If this was really true and the hacker had any brains at all he'd release them now. Kill the Hillary momentum before it becomes unstoppable.

Also, early and absentee voting has started or starts pretty soon in many states. I don't know what percentage of people vote either way, but I'm sure it's a sizable chunk. Waiting until a week before the election is going to have no effect on votes already cast.

[Defiant]

Also, early and absentee voting has started or starts pretty soon in many states. I don't know what percentage of people vote either way, but I'm sure it's a sizable chunk. Waiting until a week before the election is going to have no effect on votes already cast.

IIRC, about 35% of voting in 2012 was done by early voting, and this year, it's predicted to be 40%.

[Skinypupy]

Mailed my ballot today.

Standing in line at the polls can suck it.

[Grifman]

What we have always done to overcome them. Outperform them, outarm them, and stand strong against them even when it calls for actual confrontation. The full answer would take a few pages and I'm not that interested in typing that much. It is lot easier to lay out exactly what not to do and I will defer on the premise that if Hillary wins she can show you instead of me needing to lay it out.

Non-responsive. I asked why you criticize Clinton for a failed reset, yet think Trump would be better when all he offers is another reset. Please response as to why Trump following the same policy would be better, not what YOU think we should do. Try again.

I disagree that Trump would perform another reset.

But that's what he's said he would do - you can't deny that. Either you aren't following the campaign or you are willfully choosing to ignore what your candidate is saying. Do you want me to provide you quotes - there are plenty of them?

[Skinypupy]

When a Trump supporter friend's FW:FW:FW:FW:FW: made it into a FB discussion today, I posted a link to the Snopes article showing it as false (yes, I'm "that guy"). Her response: "Besides Snopes being unfortunately left leaning and funded..." ( ) and went on to say she's still sure it's true because "it seems like something Clinton would use".

If these people want to live in willful ignorance forever and ignore absolutely any facts that might compete with their narrow world-view, how do we ever make any progress? Goes for both sides, BTW.

[Grifman]

A hacker posting on the 4chan message board claims that he is in possession of a tape that shows Hillary Clinton making racist remarks about an African-American woman.
The individual, who claims to be linked to the John Podesta email hack, also claims that the thousands of emails deleted from Hillary Clinton’s private server will be leaked before November 1st.
“All 33k deleted Emails are going to be released by November 1st. probably in 4 – 5 sets. these emails are going to be the complete undoing of the Democratic Party. We are purposely holding them back so they cannot have time to replace Hillary,” claims the alleged hacker, who asserts that he is not working for Russia.
He goes on to promise that no less than six embarrassing videos will be released, including one, “that documents Hillary slandering and being racist against a Female African American. The amount of hatred seen on her face for their community will be worse than 100 TrumpTapes.”
The individual also comments on the Podesta emails, noting that “we are saving the best for last”.
“I can confirm rotten Hillary’s 33,000 emails have been obtained. Word is it will be a “November surprise.” Wow, something new every day!” claimed author Mike Cernovich in response to the post.

Not that I place a lot of faith in some hacker on 4chan but still.

The real problem is that this is a typical Russian disinformation campaign. You release a bunch of stuff that is true at first but then follow it up with false information. I'm not saying Clinton didn't say these things in emails but how would we know. Since we have known foreign govt hostile to the US involved, how can we trust anything that comes out? Frankly, I'm surprised that you aren't more worried about this aspect, Rip. But then again, if it gets Trump/Putin elected president, it really doesn't matter, does it?

[Grifman]

When a Trump supporter friend's FW:FW:FW:FW:FW: made it into a FB discussion today, I posted a link to the Snopes article showing it as false (yes, I'm "that guy"). Her response: "Besides Snopes being unfortunately left leaning and funded..." ( ) and went on to say she's still sure it's true because "it seems like something Clinton would use".

Do we know the same person? I get the same response from a friend who posts bogus stuff. Even when she admits it's false, she still says, "I still think she did/said it, just sounds like something Clinton would do". How can you discuss a topic when someone ignores the facts? It's alt right insanity. You condemn someone not for what they did/say, but for what you think they would have done/said. You just can't even argue with that kind of mindset.

[LordMortis]

While I still point to Snopes, it is becoming left leaning. The language is becoming soft of left leaning politics and their proving/debunking not so authoritative and True/False meters seem to be broken. They seem to be taking unsubstantiated claims and labeling them as false when they used to label them as unknown or some other neutral term I don't have examples and I'm not about to comb snopes so I can go A HA! but I will try to remember to post them when I see them in the future.

In short, for things political, I read snopes critically. I trust their sourcing and research but I don't their narrative anymore.

[LordMortis]

The real problem is that this is a typical Russian disinformation campaign. You release a bunch of stuff that is true at first but then follow it up with false information. I'm not saying Clinton didn't say these things in emails but how would we know. Since we have known foreign govt hostile to the US involved, how can we trust anything that comes out? Frankly, I'm surprised that you aren't more worried about this aspect, Rip. But then again, if it gets Trump/Putin elected president, it really doesn't matter, does it?

+1 Especially as it's already been alleged in the media that Russian hacker modifications that has ear marks of state sponsorship have been proven on some on the hacked emails. Do you trust our media or do you trust Assange and Russian hackers for their honesty? I don't know how to get a hold emails judge their authenticity. The Clinton conspiracy whistleblowers own lack of transparency and penchant for being an overhyping machine has doomed them to the self fulfilling prophesy of the general doubt.

[Rip]

That is silly. Every intel officer worth his salt knows Mossad is behind it.

[hitbyambulance]

When a Trump supporter friend's FW:FW:FW:FW:FW: made it into a FB discussion today, I posted a link to the Snopes article showing it as false (yes, I'm "that guy"). Her response: "Besides Snopes being unfortunately left leaning and funded..." ( ) and went on to say she's still sure it's true because "it seems like something Clinton would use".

Do we know the same person? I get the same response from a friend who posts bogus stuff. Even when she admits it's false, she still says, "I still think she did/said it, just sounds like something Clinton would do". How can you discuss a topic when someone ignores the facts? It's alt right insanity. You condemn someone not for what they did/say, but for what you think they would have done/said. You just can't even argue with that kind of mindset.

try writing up some garbage 'that sounds like something Clinton would do' that looks authoritative, then distribute to list. if anyone takes the bait and insists that it actually is true, point out that the first letter of each sentence spells out 'THIS IS A PRANK HA HA FOOLED YOU' (or something).

[hepcat]

That is silly. Every intel officer worth his salt knows Mossad is behind it.

If someone else wrote this, you'd accuse them of hating Israel, then call them anti-Semitic.

[Rip]

What we have always done to overcome them. Outperform them, outarm them, and stand strong against them even when it calls for actual confrontation. The full answer would take a few pages and I'm not that interested in typing that much. It is lot easier to lay out exactly what not to do and I will defer on the premise that if Hillary wins she can show you instead of me needing to lay it out.

Non-responsive. I asked why you criticize Clinton for a failed reset, yet think Trump would be better when all he offers is another reset. Please response as to why Trump following the same policy would be better, not what YOU think we should do. Try again.

I disagree that Trump would perform another reset.

But that's what he's said he would do - you can't deny that. Either you aren't following the campaign or you are willfully choosing to ignore what your candidate is saying. Do you want me to provide you quotes - there are plenty of them?

No he hasn't said reset. He has said he is going to work with them, that goes well beyond a reset. Much more like embrace them.

So what is Clinton's plan now that the reset blew up in her face? Let's ask Jill Stein.

JILL STEIN: It's important to look at where we are going. It's not just a moment in time, but where has the strategy of voting for the lesser evil you will taken us?

All these times you have been told to but for the lesser evil because you didn't want the wars, or the meltdown of the climate, or the offshoring of our jobs, or the attack on immigrants or the massive bailout for Wall Street, that is actually what we have gotten. By the droves.

Because we with public interest allow ourselves to be silent and voted for the lesser evil. But the lesser evil doesn't solve the problem.

The Obama administration, even with both houses of Congress, actually did all of these fossil fuel emissions. "All of the above" gave us some renewable energy but it completely amplified and intensified our film production, which has been incredibly destructive to the climate.

The wars have gotten bigger, we are not bombing seven countries.

It is important to not just look at the rhetoric but also look at the track record and the reality is the lesser people and greater people is a race to the bottom, and even Donald Trump in the right wing extremism grows out of the policies of the Clintons, in particular Nafta, which sent our jobs overseas and Wall Street deregulation, which blew 9 million jobs up into smoke.

That is what is creating this right wing extremism. A vote for Hillary Clinton isn't going to fix it...

It is now Hillary Clinton that wants to start an air war with Russia over Syria by calling for a no fly zone.

We have 2000 nuclear missiles on hairtrigger alert. They are saying we are closer to a nuclear war than we have ever been.

Under Hillary Clinton, we could slide into nuclear war very quickly from her declared policy in Syria.

I sure won't sleep well at night if Donald Trump is elected, but I sure won't sleep well at night if Hillary Clinton elected. We have another choice other than these two candidates who are both promoting lethal policies.

On the issue of war and nuclear weapons, it is actually Hillary's policies which are much scarier than Donald Trump who does not want to go to war with Russia.

He wants to seek modes of working together, which is the route that we need to follow not to go into confrontation and nuclear war with Russia.

[Alefroth]

So what is Clinton's plan now that the reset blew up in her face? Let's ask Jill Stein.

Why?

[Defiant]

So what is Clinton's plan now that the reset blew up in her face? Let's ask Jill Stein.

Why?

For entertainment value, I would guess. Let's also bring several wifi devices and place them next to her while asking her the question and see how she reacts.

[geezer]

So what is Clinton's plan now that the reset blew up in her face? Let's ask Jill Stein.

Why?

For entertainment value, I would guess. Let's also bring several wifi devices and place them next to her while asking her the question and see how she reacts.

What am I missing here?

The Obama administration, even with both houses of Congress, actually did all of these fossil fuel emissions. "All of the above" gave us some renewable energy but it completely amplified and intensified our film production, which has been incredibly destructive to the climate.

[Defiant]

What am I missing here?

She's ranted about wifi being hazardous to peoples health.

[geezer]

What am I missing here?

She's ranted about wifi being hazardous to peoples health.

Right, but I mean with the quote I, er, quoted from the quote Rip quoted Film causes climate change, and somehow Obama accomplishing something increased film production? Huh???

[Defiant]

What am I missing here?

She's ranted about wifi being hazardous to peoples health.

Right, but I mean with the quote I, er, quoted from the quote Rip quoted Film causes climate change, and somehow Obama accomplishing something increased film production? Huh???

Cause he's so photogenic?

[GreenGoo]

Holy crap, the pic with his foot on the scale is hi-lar-i-ous.

Serious sense of humour alert and nice to see. Can anyone imagine, say, Nixon doing that?

[gbasden]

While I still point to Snopes, it is becoming left leaning. The language is becoming soft of left leaning politics and their proving/debunking not so authoritative and True/False meters seem to be broken. They seem to be taking unsubstantiated claims and labeling them as false when they used to label them as unknown or some other neutral term I don't have examples and I'm not about to comb snopes so I can go A HA! but I will try to remember to post them when I see them in the future.

In short, for things political, I read snopes critically. I trust their sourcing and research but I don't their narrative anymore.

It's sad that reality has a known liberal bias.

[tgb]

Mailed my ballot today.

Standing in line at the polls can suck it.

Ours just arrived. Mailing it out tomorrow.

[tgb]

Here's how to handle a heckler.