Lynching Liaisons - The End

[tru1cy]

Into shadow, into gloom,
Children rush to face their doom,
Armed with amber, ash, and lye,
Marching forth to live or die.

Into darkness, into night,
Children march away to fight.
Who will spare them wrath and hell?
Who will warn them, ring the bell?

Tapestry's a silent art.
Watch what weavers heard.
Bards tell tales to break your heart.
Hang on every word.
Time for children to depart.
Fang and beak and bird.

 withdraw Grund 
 

[Lagom Lite]

Into shadow, into gloom,
Children rush to face their doom,
Armed with amber, ash, and lye,
Marching forth to live or die.

Into darkness, into night,
Children march away to fight.
Who will spare them wrath and hell?
Who will warn them, ring the bell?

Tapestry's a silent art.
Watch what weavers heard.
Bards tell tales to break your heart.
Hang on every word.
Time for children to depart.
Fang and beak and bird.

HA!

So ok, Grund favors us with some original verse.

In that case, I've been missing the chance to do this:

 Scoop 
 

Yah, let's go there. I kind of think Scoop may be a wolf.

 withdraw Grundbegriff 
 


 Scoop 
 


Like bb2112 said, we don't lynch Grund on Day 1. Yes, my vote was opportunistic, but more to see who else would want to vote for him/argue to vote for him.


Leaning good: triggercut, pr0ner, bb2112, tru1cy, theohall, redrun, Unagi*.

Leaning evil: Scoop, Lassr (again), Remus West, Chaosraven, Qantaga.

DISCLAIMER: The above is mostly hunches.


* Although Unagi is tricky and I don't think I'm very good at reading him when he's evil. But he's participating.

[Lagom Lite]

Hmm, we should probably look into Vorret too.

[theohall]

Into shadow, into gloom,
Children rush to face their doom,
Armed with amber, ash, and lye,
Marching forth to live or die.

Into darkness, into night,
Children march away to fight.
Who will spare them wrath and hell?
Who will warn them, ring the bell?

Tapestry's a silent art.
Watch what weavers heard.
Bards tell tales to break your heart.
Hang on every word.
Time for children to depart.
Fang and beak and bird.

HA!

So ok, Grund favors us with some original verse.

In that case, I've been missing the chance to do this:

 Scoop 
 

Yah, let's go there. I kind of think Scoop may be a wolf.

 withdraw Grundbegriff 
 


 Scoop 
 


Like bb2112 said, we don't lynch Grund on Day 1. Yes, my vote was opportunistic, but more to see who else would want to vote for him/argue to vote for him.


Leaning good: triggercut, pr0ner, bb2112, tru1cy, theohall, redrun, Unagi*.

Leaning evil: Scoop, Lassr (again), Remus West, Chaosraven, Qantaga.

DISCLAIMER: The above is mostly hunches.


* Although Unagi is tricky and I don't think I'm very good at reading him when he's evil. But he's participating.

Unagi wants to lynch someone he doesn't believe is a wolf.  Unagi 
 

[Vorret]

Hmm, we should probably look into Vorret too.

Now now, let's not go crazy with this idea

[Bakhtosh]

Quick business trip to Idaho made for long days and short nights, but should be back to normal tomorrow.

[Bakhtosh]

Verse from Grund? Is he linking himself to Newcastle?

[redrun]

Into shadow, into gloom,
Children rush to face their doom,
Armed with amber, ash, and lye,
Marching forth to live or die.

Into darkness, into night,
Children march away to fight.
Who will spare them wrath and hell?
Who will warn them, ring the bell?

Tapestry's a silent art.
Watch what weavers heard.
Bards tell tales to break your heart.
Hang on every word.
Time for children to depart.
Fang and beak and bird.

Grundbegriff
Saw the forum in a tiff
Gave us a sonnet as to say
I'll give my throughts another day.

[redrun]

No edits. Spelling corrected for those who twitched.

Grundbegriff
Saw the forum in a tiff
Gave us a sonnet as to say
I'll give my thoughts another day.

[stessier]

Day 1 Vote Count

Spoiler:

• Scoop acc Qantaga (1)
  Bakhtosh acc Newcastle (1)
  bb2112 acc LordMortis (1)
  tru1cy acc Grundbegriff (1)
• Lassr acc redrun (1)
  theohall acc Chaosraven (1)
  LordMortis acc bb2112 (1)
  Lagom Lite acc Chaosraven (2)
• Remus West acc Newcastle (2)
  Bakhtosh wd Newcastle (1)
• Bakhtosh acc RMC (1)
  Vorret acc Grundbegriff (2)
• redrun acc Lassr (1)
• El Guapo acc Newcastle (2)
• RMC acc El Guapo (1)
  Lagom Lite wd Chaosraven (1)
  Lagom LIte acc Scoop (1)
  Unagi acc pr0ner (1)
• pr0ner acc Newcastle (3)
  bb2112 wd LordMortis (0)
  bb2112 acc Qantaga (2)
  Scoop wd Qantaga (1)
  Scoop acc Newcastle (4)
  theohall wd Chaosraven (0)
  theohall acc Grundbegriff (3)
  bb2112 wd Qantaga (0)
  bb2112 acc Newcastle (5)
• Newcastle acc Grundbegriff (4)
  Lagom LIte wd Scoop (0)
  Lagom Lite acc Grundbegriff (5)
  LordMortis wd bb2112 (0)
  LordMortis acc Qantaga (1)
  Unagi wd pr0ner (0)
• Unagi acc theohall (1)
  LordMortis wd Qantaga (0)
• LordMortis acc theohall (2)
  Vorret wd Grund (4)
  bb2112 wd Newcastle (4)
• bb2112 acc Lagom LIte (1)
  Scoop wd Newcastle (3)
• Scoop acc El Guapo (2)
• trig acc Scoop (1)
  theohall wd Grund (3)
  tru1cy wd Grund (2)
  Lagom wd Grund (1)
• Lagom acc Scoop (2)
• theohall acc Unagi (1)

Votes required for lynch - 11

Against Newcastle (3) - Remus, El Guapo, pr0ner
Against theohall (2) - Unagi, LordMortis
Against El Guapo (2) - RMC, Scoop
Against Scoop (2) - triggercut, Lagom LIte
Against Grundbegriff (1) - Newcastle
Against redrun (1) - Lassr
Against RMC (1) - Bakhtosh
Against Lassr (1) - redrun
Against Lagom LIte (1) - bb2112
Against Unagi (1) - theohall

No votes - Qantaga, Purge, Grundbegriff, Chaosraven, tru1cy, Vorret

There are 17 villagers alive. The deadline for the lynch vote is June 6th at 9pm Eastern time.

[LordMortis]

Into shadow, into gloom,
Children rush to face their doom,
Armed with amber, ash, and lye,
Marching forth to live or die.

Into darkness, into night,
Children march away to fight.
Who will spare them wrath and hell?
Who will warn them, ring the bell?

Tapestry's a silent art.
Watch what weavers heard.
Bards tell tales to break your heart.
Hang on every word.
Time for children to depart.
Fang and beak and bird.

 withdraw Grundbegriff 
 

 withdraw Grund 
 

 withdraw Grundbegriff 
 

Seriously? That's what it takes? That's as good as

No edits. Spelling corrected for those who twitched.

 withdraw theo 
 

[Scoop20906]

I don't think anyone wants to off Grund on Day One. He could have posted the nutritional information on a bag of Doritos.

[Lassr]

I don't think anyone wants to off Grund on Day One. He could have posted the nutritional information on a bag of Doritos.

but what if he had posted the nutritional value of Holman...

[Lassr]

I still see no reason to move my vote off redrun yet. I started the day by making half joke accusations and used one to vote redrun. It was obviously not a serious vote but he comes in a little defensive and says it looks like I am trying to set up several folks for possible votes that day and then votes for me.

Of all the reactions to my jests his was the most defensive.

May be nothing but it's all I got right now.

[Qantaga]

Seriously? That's what it takes?

I don't think anyone wants to off Grund on Day One. He could have posted the nutritional information on a bag of Doritos.

Which makes it even stranger that those votes were there in the first place. Lagom, tru1cy, and theo are all players experienced with Grund. To withdraw their so quickly, based on a single post of verse is odder still.

Like bb2112 said, we don't lynch Grund on Day 1. Yes, my vote was opportunistic, but more to see who else would want to vote for him/argue to vote for him.

So, what did you learn from this exercise?

[Qantaga]

Unagi wants to lynch someone he doesn't believe is a wolf.

I'm not hellbent on Theohall being a wolf at this point, but I have little reason not to test him over someone else.

It looks like Unagi is doing the exact same thing you were doing with Grund, except:

- Unagi did list reasons he thought you might be a wolf.
- You immediately withdrew your vote on the merits of one post by Grund, confirming definitively that you were accusing someone you didn't believe to be a wolf.

[redrun]

Unagi wants to lynch someone he doesn't believe is a wolf.

I'm not hellbent on Theohall being a wolf at this point, but I have little reason not to test him over someone else.

It looks like Unagi is doing the exact same thing you were doing with Grund, except:

- Unagi did list reasons he thought you might be a wolf.
- You immediately withdrew your vote on the merits of one post by Grund, confirming definitively that you were accusing someone you didn't believe to be a wolf.

Really? I'd have thought that Theohall was poking the silent to get them to participate, and accepted Grund writing a sonnet as participation. You could disagree that a non-specific sonnot was participation, but to call "poking the silent" the "exact same thing" as calling for a player to be lynched is pretty far-fetched. (I won't quote Unagi, but he made it clear he was trying to get Theohall lynched today.)

[Qantaga]

to call "poking the silent" the "exact same thing" as calling for a player to be lynched is pretty far-fetched.

An accuse tag is the exact same thing as another accuse tag.

Regardless of the justifications behind it, a vote to lynch is a vote to lynch. Grund had 5 votes on him at the time, so theohall's vote had Grund much closer to the noose than Unagi's vote for theo had him.

[Unagi]

Vorret was on the Grund train eary, because he felt Grund maybe killed Holman to clear hard-reads, but then when I made my post about theohall, Vorret said it was a good post and removed his vote for Grund - - Vorret, I'd like to hear why my post lead to you removing your vote on Grund (would have made a small degree of sense, had you then put your vote on Theohall, but you didn't)

and... LM, what is it about the dropping of the Grund votes that made you drop your vote on Theohall?

[LordMortis]

and... LM, what is it about the dropping of the Grund votes that made you drop your vote on Theohall?

An expression of the ridiculousness of the event. Like the implicit intent is to do a dance of nothing on the first day until time presses us. So fuck it, I'm joining those that would prefer to be part of the precipitate rather than part of the solution.

[Unagi]

to be part of the precipitate rather than part of the solution.

I love that t-shirt.

And, yeah - OK, I had a simular response, but frankly it made me feel even better about the Theohall vote.

[Remus West]

Ha. There were games I would have loved to have someone offer to join my vote. Just saying I have no real vibe for anyone other than Newcastle (just cause he looks like he is trying too hard).

What? Does everyone prefer when I am constantly posting useless drivel?

Oh follow my lead Scoop! Let's start are own train on.... umm.. who have I voted for..Oh Yeah, El Guapo! Come on it will be fun over here. We have all kinds of cool stuff. And my Mom says that I am the coolest ever!

Your mom is always wrong to.

Too.

[Unagi]

Here is where you can read right up front about how Theohall's vote was interfacing with Grund. He forecasted that the vote was meaningless and would be removed the second Grund showed that he was willing to post at all. This is a fantastic way for a wolf to spend Day 1... a bunch of meaningless 'poke' votes that come with the Pre-agreed-upon "I will be removing this vote later". Theohall wasn't putting anyone 'to the fire', and a 'poke the silent' has no "poke" if it comes with a pre-approved out-clause. What that is, is hiding on Day 1 - making a bunch of meaningless votes.

Theohall was just trying to get silents to participate. I suppose he feels now that Grund has participated?

I am just trying to get silents to participate. Check my first vote and when it was withdrawn. Many agreed being silent in a large game is bad and the silent should be lynched, as happened to Chaosraven. I don't subscribe to this theory, but it is interesting seeing those who pushed it last game ignoring it now. Yes, there is info to be gleaned from this. When Grundbegriff actually posts I will withdraw my vote.

[Qantaga]

I'm torn between theohall and  Lagom Lite 
 

[Unagi]

Ha. There were games I would have loved to have someone offer to join my vote. Just saying I have no real vibe for anyone other than Newcastle (just cause he looks like he is trying too hard).

What? Does everyone prefer when I am constantly posting useless drivel?

Oh follow my lead Scoop! Let's start are own train on.... umm.. who have I voted for..Oh Yeah, El Guapo! Come on it will be fun over here. We have all kinds of cool stuff. And my Mom says that I am the coolest ever!

Your mom is always wrong to.

Too.

[tru1cy]

I'll admit my vote was a poke vote, but I always poke and see no reason to deviate from what I normally do. Now I have no idea of where I am going next. Will place a vote before I sign off for the weekend

[bb2112]

I don't think anyone wants to off Grund on Day One. He could have posted the nutritional information on a bag of Doritos.

[Vorret]

Vorret was on the Grund train eary, because he felt Grund maybe killed Holman to clear hard-reads, but then when I made my post about theohall, Vorret said it was a good post and removed his vote for Grund - - Vorret, I'd like to hear why my post lead to you removing your vote on Grund (would have made a small degree of sense, had you then put your vote on Theohall, but you didn't)

and... LM, what is it about the dropping of the Grund votes that made you drop your vote on Theohall?

I don't know Grund and you have a keen eye (as proven last game) so I removed my vote. Also, it's day one, we barely have any information and there was too many people defending Grund (ie: my vote was going nowhere).

I didn't vote for anyone else , yet, while Theo is a good pick (who isn't at this point?) I feel we might want to lynch some of the less vocal players first and keep the one who have an opinion for later.

You never know, like I did last game, one of them could make a blunder while I silent player will obviously not.

[El Guapo]

Second, we're back to that same erroneous theory that's been cropping up with increasing frequency. Namely, that only one person controls the Team Evil night kill.

Technically that's true though, right? I believe the rules say that the Alpha Wolf is responsible for submitting the night kill, which sounds to me like he / she controls it and that they can submit what they want (though presumably they're unlikely to overrule the other wolves absent a very unusual situation).

[Vorret]

"You never know, like I did last game, one of them could make a blunder while I silent player will obviously not."

should have a read

While a silent player won't

[bb2112]

Ha. There were games I would have loved to have someone offer to join my vote. Just saying I have no real vibe for anyone other than Newcastle (just cause he looks like he is trying too hard).

What? Does everyone prefer when I am constantly posting useless drivel?

Oh follow my lead Scoop! Let's start are own train on.... umm.. who have I voted for..Oh Yeah, El Guapo! Come on it will be fun over here. We have all kinds of cool stuff. And my Mom says that I am the coolest ever!

Your mom is always wrong to.

Too.

Wow! Did your wolf buddies clue you in?

[theohall]

Into shadow, into gloom,
Children rush to face their doom,
Armed with amber, ash, and lye,
Marching forth to live or die.

Into darkness, into night,
Children march away to fight.
Who will spare them wrath and hell?
Who will warn them, ring the bell?

Tapestry's a silent art.
Watch what weavers heard.
Bards tell tales to break your heart.
Hang on every word.
Time for children to depart.
Fang and beak and bird.

 withdraw Grundbegriff 
 

 withdraw Grund 
 

 withdraw Grundbegriff 
 

Seriously? That's what it takes? That's as good as

No edits. Spelling corrected for those who twitched.

 withdraw theo 
 

I did exactly what I said I would do. Did you expect something different?

[Qantaga]

Second, we're back to that same erroneous theory that's been cropping up with increasing frequency. Namely, that only one person controls the Team Evil night kill.

Technically that's true though, right? I believe the rules say that the Alpha Wolf is responsible for submitting the night kill, which sounds to me like he / she controls it and that they can submit what they want (though presumably they're unlikely to overrule the other wolves absent a very unusual situation).

Technically, yes.

However, I can't imagine an Alpha Wolf player ignoring the opinions of his team. So much so, that I believe the only practical interpretation is that one person does not control the night kill, especially on Night 0.

[tru1cy]

Second, we're back to that same erroneous theory that's been cropping up with increasing frequency. Namely, that only one person controls the Team Evil night kill.

Technically that's true though, right? I believe the rules say that the Alpha Wolf is responsible for submitting the night kill, which sounds to me like he / she controls it and that they can submit what they want (though presumably they're unlikely to overrule the other wolves absent a very unusual situation).

Technically, yes.

However, I can't imagine an Alpha Wolf player ignoring the opinions of his team. So much so, that I believe the only practical interpretation is that one person does not control the night kill, especially on Night 0.

Umm, really? You've participated in these conversation and normally on Night 0 most wolves are ambivalent to the first choice. If one person controls the vote it's typically go with your gut. Night 1 is where the strategy normally begins cause the wolves has data

Holman is a ambivalent choice. Much more higher valued targets for Night 0

Grund
Remus
ChaosRaven
Unagi
Qantaga

All of the above would have been a better choice if I controlled the vote. Holman, imo, was a target of least importance.

[El Guapo]

Regarding Grundbegriff--and here my memory's hazy--but the last time he laid low like this it was because he was a goodguy special and was flying under the radar.

Pretty sure (per earlier discussions) that Grund is almost always completely silent on day 1. Kind of annoying, but as a result not particularly probative on wolfitude.

[El Guapo]

We voting for  El Guapo 
 
?

I'm convinced! Scoop's logic is unassailable - you have cracked me, sir.

[Qantaga]

tru1cy, both trig and Vorret speculated that Grund killed Holman. In previous games, it has been theorized that newbie players were the controller of the killing vote.

My point is that trying to lay a Night 0 kill at the feet of one particular player sounds to me as more of a manufactured reason than a true one.

[El Guapo]

tru1cy, both trig and Vorret speculated that Grund killed Holman. In previous games, it has been theorized that newbie players were the controller of the killing vote.

My point is that trying to lay a Night 0 kill at the feet of one particular player sounds to me as more of a manufactured reason than a true one.

Yeah I agree that it seems a pretty unlikely vote rationale (especially as it, assuming I understand it correctly), depends upon Grund not only being a wolf but specifically being the Alpha Wolf. But then, any diagnosis of why a night kill was made, especially on night 0, seems fraught with error.

[Lassr]

tru1cy, both trig and Vorret speculated that Grund killed Holman. In previous games, it has been theorized that newbie players were the controller of the killing vote.

My point is that trying to lay a Night 0 kill at the feet of one particular player sounds to me as more of a manufactured reason than a true one.

Yeah I agree that it seems a pretty unlikely vote rationale (especially as it, assuming I understand it correctly), depends upon Grund not only being a wolf but specifically being the Alpha Wolf. But then, any diagnosis of why a night kill was made, especially on night 0, seems fraught with error.

exactly which is why I do not spend much time analyzing a night 0 kill. Sure, there is a reason for it but guessing that reason is a waste of time due to there being so many possibilities.

[Unagi]

exactly which is why I do not spend much time analyzing a night 0 kill. Sure, there is a reason for it but guessing that reason is a waste of time due to there being so many possibilities.

agreed