[WW - nonvariant] Back to Basics - Game Over

[Grundbegriff]

If pr0ner had told me that you were the Scanned, or if you had told me and pr0ner had confirmed, I would have had no choice but to withdraw my vote and advocate that others do so.

Why? If he had told you privately who he scanned, you could have just played it exactly like you did.

But then he could've told everyone that I had requested this info and that he had provided it. My choices then would've been (a) to deny this and try to make the case that he was lying-- something a Wolf in his situation wouldn't have done-- or (b) to roll with the punch.

The only real choice was (b). If pr0ner had said "I told Grundbegriff I'm the Seer and even revealed to him my scanned" and I had said "No you didn't" he could've brought you forward, thereby publicly outing me as a Wolf.

Considering we thought it was very likely that you were a wolf, why give up both of us?

Because you were both going to die anyhow. Since nobody knew you were Scanned rather than Seer, nobody knew how seriously to take your words. That left your remarks open to my spin after your death.

If you had both come forward (whether to me or to everyone) once pr0ner was outed, the whole bandwagon would've fallen apart.

That's where, logically, your argument didn't hold up. Even if you weren't sure that you believed pr0ner, a true innocent would have given him the benefit of the doubt for at least one more night

I disagree. I've seen that "give him another night" tactic play out more than once; it's nearly always a disaster.

My argument to pr0ner was exactly the argument I would've made in all sincerity if I had been innocent: he had it within his power to prove his identity to me at no cost, and chose not to.

(a) If I was a Wolf, he was already outed to the Wolves and was going to die. Thereafter, his Scanned would have no special worth trust-wise (anyone could've claimed to be the Scanned).

(b) If I wasn't a Wolf, he'd have (i) expanded the web of trust he was aiming to build, (ii) gained an ally, and (iii) stopped the bandwagon. He'd still possibly have died by the hand of the Wolves, but not necessarily, since a mouthpiece scheme with a Normal as "Real Seer" could've bought a turn/scan.

Which is the better deal: (a) or (b)?

(as the seer is the most important player in the game for the village). I tried to point that out publically but apparently no one agreed with me (or worse, read just your version of what I wrote).

I didn't distort what you wrote. I quoted in relevant part, without commentary, and provided direct links to the original individual messages. Later, my spin consisted of offering multiple interpretations and settling nowhere, all to create FUD.

Y'all just made a miscalculation by staying secret.

[Archinerd]

Yes, pr0ner may have made the mistake of confusing the heck out of me, but I was too hasty in casting the killing vote. Things may have gone differently if I had been more patient.

Also, Grund's arguments were more convincing for two reasons.
1) he's better with words and analysis than I am.
2) he had Austin's help

[LordMortis]

One thing I don't get is why Pr0ner didn't out you as his contact.

Because we were still hoping to convince people to change their vote.

If pr0ner had told me that you were the Scanned, or if you had told me and pr0ner had confirmed, I would have had no choice but to withdraw my vote and advocate that others do so.

Why? If he had told you privately who he scanned, you could have just played it exactly like you did. Considering we thought it was very likely that you were a wolf, why give up both of us? And don't forget that pr0ner also contacted Archinerd. So we hoped that at least one of you would change your vote, even if you didn't fully believe pr0ner.

That's where, logically, your argument didn't hold up. Even if you weren't sure that you believed pr0ner, a true innocent would have given him the benefit of the doubt for at least one more night (as the seer is the most important player in the game for the village). I tried to point that out publically but apparently no one agreed with me (or worse, read just your version of what I wrote).

I'm surpirsed RW. I find you literally to be the most rational and yet still quick on your feet player out there. When Pr0ner's head was on the chopping block, you had the perfect opportunity to come out as the seer and clear him without screwing up the entire game of trust in favor of the wolves. The only person to contradict you would have been him. The wolves would then kill you that night and leaver pr0ner an additional night to scan. Your death and pr0ner's coming clean the next day would at least leave him another scan of Archinerd or Grund and an incontravertablity of his testimony that day. Handing either a force of the next two nights wolf kills or a dead wolf that day. Given Grund's refusal to work with him, likely that would be a dead Grund.

[Bakhtosh]

A village without a seer is little more than a snack for wolves. It's a crap shoot, and unless you play with the same group every time (and thereby form a good idea of how they play when good or bad), then it's hard to tell when someone is trying to act different, or trying to not act different...for most people anyway.

[Austin]

Yes, pr0ner may have made the mistake of confusing the heck out of me, but I was too hasty in casting the killing vote. Things may have gone differently if I had been more patient.

Also, Grund's arguments were more convincing for two reasons.
1) he's better with words and analysis than I am.
2) he had Austin's help

I did probe a bit there. I tried to be subtle though. Actually one of my favorite lines from the game is right in here.

If Pr0ner is the real seer, and I do believe he was, I think Archenerd must be a wolf. I'm willing to listen if he wants to relate his conversations as did Grund. Of course I'm not convinced on Grund's conversations either. This game is a cluster-something so far, but hopefully Pr0ner gave us someone. I just wish he gave us the person that he scanned. (although it could have been Ralph I guess )

I'm not voting Arch yet though. Assuming Grund's story is true, Pr0ner came across like a desperate wolf. I'd like to think, I wouldn't have believed him either. Arch, what's your story before you get lynched? Feel free to Kelrique.

Notice the comma placement. Awkward yes? This was going to allow an evidence for if we had to take Grund down. I was going to point back at that and say it was a clue that I didn't believe Grund. Kind of lame but in the right circumstances it would have been effective. Amazing what context can do in these games.

[Ralph-Wiggum]

I'm surpirsed RW. I find you literally to be the most rational and yet still quick on your feet player out there. When Pr0ner's head was on the chopping block, you had the perfect opportunity to come out as the seer and clear him without screwing up the entire game of trust in favor of the wolves.

I don't think that would've worked. It would have just made pr0ner seem like he was lying even more. And I'm not sure I would be believed. If you read most of the posts, you know that Austin at least believed that I was the seer anyway.

Plus, as I said, pr0ner was PMing people behind the scenes telling them more or less that he was the seer. We thought that at least one of the people he scanned would not vote for him; that would give us the time to change the vote.

[Ralph-Wiggum]

My argument to pr0ner was exactly the argument I would've made in all sincerity if I had been innocent: he had it within his power to prove his identity to me at no cost, and chose not to.

He didn't have it in his power to prove anything. Unless a seer gets a wolf, he can't prove that he's the seer. Sure, he could have said that I was in contact with him: but remember this - I myself wasn't sure about if I should believe him to be the seer. He could have very easily been a wolf trying to get information from me. As others pointed out (and as I said to him in a PM) he was acting suspiciously.

[Remus West]

To me the village made the same mistake they made during the Vampire game. I should have been lynched for my role in killing Genghis in that one, Grund should have been lynched for his role in killing pr0ner in this one. I think people focus so much on finding the hidden bad guy they tend to look right past the obvious one. The same thing happened when Grenard played his "Seer" role. The same thing happened during the game that Nameless pretended to be the Seer. Take the obvious bad guy down is the lesson I get from all of those.

[Grundbegriff]

Actually one of my favorite lines from the game is right in here.

I'd like to think, I wouldn't have believed him either.

Notice the comma placement. Awkward yes? This was going to allow an evidence

Now you're just living in your own little private self-indulgent world.

Nobody would've noticed or cared about such a subtlety.

[LordMortis]

I'm surpirsed RW. I find you literally to be the most rational and yet still quick on your feet player out there. When Pr0ner's head was on the chopping block, you had the perfect opportunity to come out as the seer and clear him without screwing up the entire game of trust in favor of the wolves.

I don't think that would've worked. It would have just made pr0ner seem like he was lying even more. And I'm not sure I would be believed. If you read most of the posts, you know that Austin at least believed that I was the seer anyway.

Plus, as I said, pr0ner was PMing people behind the scenes telling them more or less that he was the seer. We thought that at least one of the people he scanned would not vote for him; that would give us the time to change the vote.

Great. Now either you are both innocent or both guilty. You are proclaimed the seer. You coming out as seer is huge. If no one contradicts you then you know pr0ner is not lieing and his identity is still protected. If Grund or Archinerd come and proclaim that pr0ner said he is the seer it only helps your cause. If they come out too hasty and accuse the two of you of wolfish collusion then they look guilty. Two wolves are not going to out both of themselves on turn one. The absolute worst of players would never do this. With pr0ner's life on the line, you have nothing to lose.

For the wolves to allow you both to live is to let you live for a good three days while PMs go rampant only letting the initiated in on your secret. The wolves would have to choose between you and pr0ner that night while you are trying to figure out whom to lynch. The odds favor the village by searching somewhere else and forcing the wolves to make crap shooting bets.

[Grundbegriff]

My argument to pr0ner was exactly the argument I would've made in all sincerity if I had been innocent: he had it within his power to prove his identity to me at no cost, and chose not to.

He didn't have it in his power to prove anything.

Ah, but he did.

Think it through:

1. pr0ner reveals you to me, and you confirm
2. pr0ner announces that he has revealed the Scanned to me and that he is prepared to out that person if I don't retract my vote and fall into line.
3. I refuse, and call him a liar
4. proner does bring you forth.

Look at the board. If pr0ner's a Wolf, who's going to be his second in step 4? The only candidate is the other Wolf. What are the odds that both Wolves would put themselves on the line, unforced, on Day#1. I calc that as approximately 0%.

My only choice would've been to comply or die. And 'die' probably would've come even if I had complied.

The mouthpiece gambit also would've worked. Having a proxy Seer to protect the real Seer is such a common, reasonable tactic that even Amidala used it in Phantom Menace.

Unless a seer gets a wolf, he can't prove that he's the seer.

Wrong-O!

Sure, he could have said that I was in contact with him: but remember this - I myself wasn't sure about if I should believe him to be the seer. He could have very easily been a wolf trying to get information from me. As others pointed out (and as I said to him in a PM) he was acting suspiciously.

You had a way to test his sincerity: ask him to pretend to be a Seer-mouthpiece while you pretended to be the Seer.

[Austin]

Actually one of my favorite lines from the game is right in here.

I'd like to think, I wouldn't have believed him either.

Notice the comma placement. Awkward yes? This was going to allow an evidence

Now you're just living in your own little private self-indulgent world.

Nobody would've noticed or cared about such a subtlety.

Actually I started out talking about the line being my favorite as a support of you, forgetting about the comma. I was called into a quick meeting and hit submit before clarifying. Anyway, what I mean with the comma is that I would point it out later if need be.

In the vampire game I went back and listed all sorts of evidence of my priestlyness. Some of it actually wasn't intentional, I just stumbled across it going through my old posts and used them later. I'm saying I would have gone back and used it as a small nudge if need be, that is to say I thought someone might pick up on it... it made sense at the time anyway. At least as much sense as saying something about dodging a right cross points to me being a priest.

[Grundbegriff]

Two wolves are not going to out both of themselves on turn one. The absolute worst of players would never do this. With pr0ner's life on the line, you have nothing to lose.

Exactly right.

[Grundbegriff]

I'm saying I would have gone back and used it as a small nudge if need be, that is to say I thought someone might pick up on it... it made sense at the time anyway. At least as much sense as saying something about dodging a right cross points to me being a priest.

All I'm saying is that to be effective, these nuggets of illuminating evidence have to look big and obvious in retrospect. (like this).

Remus is good at planting clues that work. And Kraegor-- he plants effective ones accidentally!

You're strong at scheming. You should develop your breadcrumbing. In most of the cases (in the past few games) where you catalogued your prior clues, I had no idea what the connection was supposed to be between the evidence to which you were linking and the role you were claiming.

[Austin]

I'm saying I would have gone back and used it as a small nudge if need be, that is to say I thought someone might pick up on it... it made sense at the time anyway. At least as much sense as saying something about dodging a right cross points to me being a priest.

All I'm saying is that to be effective, these nuggets of illuminating evidence have to look big and obvious in retrospect. (like this).

Remus is good at planting clues that work. And Kraegor-- he plants effective ones accidentally!

You're strong at scheming. You should develop your breadcrumbing. In most of the cases (in the past few games) where you catalogued your prior clues, I had no idea what the connection was supposed to be between the evidence to which you were linking and the role you were claiming.

Gotcha but you're missing the point. These are clues that I didn't want people to see. They're things I can point back to later and say, Look you dummies! I was trying to get through to you! Even though I really wasn't.

[Archinerd]

Is there a chance the wolves will eat each other?

[Austin]

Is there a chance the wolves will eat each other?

Gross

[Remus West]

Is there a chance the wolves will eat each other?

I guess that depends on how long it takes them to get to the next village.

[Austin]

Is there a chance the wolves will eat each other?

I guess that depends on how long it takes them to get to the next village.

So do we like roll a 20 sided die or something?

[Ralph-Wiggum]

But again, we were hoping to get people to retract their votes without having to out a seer. pr0ner was PMing Grund and Archinerd right up until he died (which wasn't too long after he first starting PMing). We didn't have any reason to believe that either was a wolf until after pr0ner was dead. If could have had the vote turned without outing himself, his chances of living for a while were pretty good.

Grund, you're arguing your point based on the knowledge that you were a wolf and what you would or would not have to do. We didn't know that you were probably a wolf until pr0ner was dead. Because of the rule set (where the vote doesn't count until Remus announces it), we hoped to have time to change some votes. It's not like we just gave up - pr0ner first had a PM with Archinerd at 10:30 Monday morning and voting was official at 2:30 Monday afternoon. It all just happened too fast.

[Grundbegriff]

Gotcha but you're missing the point. These are clues that I didn't want people to see. They're things I can point back to later and say, Look you dummies! I was trying to get through to you! Even though I really wasn't.

No, I'm not missing the point. We're talking about the same thing-- stuff that's ignored on the first pass, but to which you can appeal in retrospect to support some (usually outlandish) pretense or vital truth later in the game.

I'm saying your breadcrumbs aren't doing what you think they're doing, when you eventually refer back to them. I usually can't see what you think they're supposed to show; I'm guessing others also have no idea what you think you're proving when you harken back to some phrase that seems to demonstrate nothing!

On p. 5 you said, "then we went to the carwash"-- therefore, you're the Hunter?!

Just a tip for your further improvement.

[Remus West]

But again, we were hoping to get people to retract their votes without having to out a seer. pr0ner was PMing Grund and Archinerd right up until he died (which wasn't too long after he first starting PMing). We didn't have any reason to believe that either was a wolf until after pr0ner was dead. If could have had the vote turned without outing himself, his chances of living for a while were pretty good.

Grund, you're arguing your point based on the knowledge that you were a wolf and what you would or would not have to do. We didn't know that you were probably a wolf until pr0ner was dead. Because of the rule set (where the vote doesn't count until Remus announces it), we hoped to have time to change some votes. It's not like we just gave up - pr0ner first had a PM with Archinerd at 10:30 Monday morning and voting was official at 2:30 Monday afternoon. It all just happened too fast.

You should have assumed the worst while hoping for the best. You guys seemed to assume the best while hoping to avoid the worst.

[Austin]

Gotcha but you're missing the point. These are clues that I didn't want people to see. They're things I can point back to later and say, Look you dummies! I was trying to get through to you! Even though I really wasn't.

No, I'm not missing the point. We're talking about the same thing-- stuff that's ignored on the first pass, but to which you can appeal in retrospect to support some (usually outlandish) pretense or vital truth later in the game.

Agreed. You seem to prefer 1 or 2 well placed, really nice looking ones. I so far have been trying to use lame, really hidden, teeny tiny ones but going for shock and awe with links to them. More yellow = more street cred yo.

When you can post something like, "HELLO! I was tyring to get through to you people! Look Here, andhere and here and here and hereand here. You know as well as I do that some people won't even look at the links. The ones that do might see what you want them to. Wizard's First Rule and all that.



Edit:

On p. 5 you said, "then we went to the carwash"-- therefore, you're the Hunter?!

Point taken.


Anyway, back to the comma thing. My love for that quote was not in the comma, rather in the message of, were I grund I hope I would have reacted the same way. Pulling people into your shoes to really examine it from your point of view and then stick themselves in your shoes and say, "You know what, I wouldn't have believed Pr0ner either".

Then with added, "Arch, I'm not buying it, I don't understand what you're saying" it served to really strengthen your position. The comma was an after thought but it's brough up some valid points about my crumbs.

[Grundbegriff]

But again, we were hoping to get people to retract their votes without having to out a seer. pr0ner was PMing Grund and Archinerd right up until he died (which wasn't too long after he first starting PMing).

Yeah. I guesss that's a plan, too. How'd it go?

Remind me to add "stubborn" to your profile.

Grund, you're arguing your point based on the knowledge that you were a wolf and what you would or would not have to do.

In a PM game where I'm innocent, I always assume I'm talking to a Wolf unless I have some reason not to do so.

Meanwhile, you can't both claim you and pr0ner highly suspected me of Wolfiness and claim that my argument is wrong because neither of you yet suspected me of Wolfiness.

We didn't know that you were probably a wolf until pr0ner was dead.

Don't strain too hard to make the rebuttal work; you might pull something.

we hoped to have time to change some votes.

It was within your power to change my vote, and thereby to change some or all of the other votes. You just didn't see it. We all miss opportunities!

It all just happened too fast.

No-PM games are like turn-based. PM games are like real-time.

[Remus West]

Austin and Grundbegriff, you both miss the point of hints IMO. There is no need to leave hints in a PM game. If you want someone to think something you PM it to them. In a non-PM game you leave hints to communicate to those you can not otherwise. The link Grund provided was of me telling him I knew that he was telling the truth AND that I was the one contacted by Genghis by mentioning the Siblings since he and Chaosraven were the Siblings. I could not do that any other way. Thus I had justified my trust of him and allowed him to trust in me as well. Anyone else should only have read that I trusted his play as logical only for a villager.

[Austin]

Austin and Grundbegriff, you both miss the point of hints IMO. There is no need to leave hints in a PM game. If you want someone to think something you PM it to them. In a non-PM game you leave hints to communicate to those you can not otherwise. The link Grund provided was of me telling him I knew that he was telling the truth AND that I was the one contacted by Genghis by mentioning the Siblings since he and Chaosraven were the Siblings. I could not do that any other way. Thus I had justified my trust of him and allowed him to trust in me as well. Anyone else should only have read that I trusted his play as logical only for a villager.

Again. My hints helped bury Genghis in the vampire game. He had nothing to go back to, I did. Plus he had a couple errors like not having read his role all the way through.

[LordMortis]

But again, we were hoping to get people to retract their votes without having to out a seer. pr0ner was PMing Grund and Archinerd right up until he died (which wasn't too long after he first starting PMing). We didn't have any reason to believe that either was a wolf until after pr0ner was dead. If could have had the vote turned without outing himself, his chances of living for a while were pretty good.

Grund, you're arguing your point based on the knowledge that you were a wolf and what you would or would not have to do. We didn't know that you were probably a wolf until pr0ner was dead. Because of the rule set (where the vote doesn't count until Remus announces it), we hoped to have time to change some votes. It's not like we just gave up - pr0ner first had a PM with Archinerd at 10:30 Monday morning and voting was official at 2:30 Monday afternoon. It all just happened too fast.

Wow. Normally I don't find criticism in your style of play at all. But here you had no reason to believe that pr0ner was the seer until he was dead. By coming out as the seer, you are given the chance to see him proven as the seer while still at least trying to protect him for one day.

Pr0ner did what he had to do on his own, but the two of you should have also combined forces. There was no downside to it. The worst thing that could have happened was that pr0ner was a wolf, forcing the real seer to come out. You change your story and both you and pr0ner get lynched while the real seer gets eaten by the wolves anyway. You still get a wolf from what starts off as the worst case scenario in your book.

The most likely scenario is that neither of you gets lynched because no other seer comes forward to challenge you, the wolves have to make a decision on who to kill, possibly gaining another night's scan, the two of you are forced to be the wolves next two kills, and you have a better chance at lynching wolves with your names cleared. It's not ideal, but it's better than just letting the seer get lynched and taking nothing from the wolves in the process.

[Grundbegriff]

Austin and Grundbegriff, you both miss the point of hints IMO. There is no need to leave hints in a PM game. If you want someone to think something you PM it to them. In a non-PM game you leave hints to communicate to those you can not otherwise. The link Grund provided was of me telling him I knew that he was telling the truth AND that I was the one contacted by Genghis by mentioning the Siblings since he and Chaosraven were the Siblings. I could not do that any other way. Thus I had justified my trust of him and allowed him to trust in me as well. Anyone else should only have read that I trusted his play as logical only for a villager.

You're detached, Remus. My link wasn't about what you were doing; it was about my shouting from the rooftop that I was a Sibling, and Chaos replying, when we both knew perfectly well that nobody would take it as true even though it was.

This is similar to my saying at the beginning of this game, that Austin and Newcastle were Wolves, when Newcastle isn't even in the game. Austin is a Wolf, but the remark was (rightly) taken as meaningless chatter at the time.

You're right that PM games allow communication behind the scenes, so that communication via glyphs isn't needed.

However, that's not the use of clues we were discussing. Austin and I were talking about planting clues not to signal someone else, but to back up one's own later claims about his role. (I said you were good at that.)

Communication with others NOW != Confirmation of self LATER
glyphs != breadcrumbs

[Grundbegriff]

Again. My hints helped bury Genghis in the vampire game. He had nothing to go back to, I did. Plus he had a couple errors like not having read his role all the way through.

Heh

I'm not saying all your hints are inadequate. I'm saying some are too obscure or remote to be convincing. Free advice for ratcheting up your game. Take it or leave it!

[Austin]

Again. My hints helped bury Genghis in the vampire game. He had nothing to go back to, I did. Plus he had a couple errors like not having read his role all the way through.

Heh

I'm not saying all your hints are inadequate. I'm saying some are too obscure or remote to be convincing. Free advice for ratcheting up your game. Take it or leave it!

Note my edit above. Point taken for sure. Ratcheting may or may not take place.

Edit: But you still have to admit there are those who don't read through all the evidence links. As noted in your response to me regarding your use of Ralph's apparent scan of tru1cy from before the game really started. Sometimes more is more.

[Ralph-Wiggum]

In a PM game where I'm innocent, I always assume I'm talking to a Wolf unless I have some reason not to do so.

And that's why I didn't fully trust pr0ner, even up until his death. Even in his PMs to me he acted strangely. His first PM to me only said "Can you keep a secret?". Why would the seer who knows I'm innocent start a conversation like that with me? Just tell me you're the seer and that you scanned me. It just seemed strange.

Meanwhile, you can't both claim you and pr0ner highly suspected me of Wolfiness and claim that my argument is wrong because neither of you yet suspected me of Wolfiness.

Where did I ever say that we suspected you before (or, if before, just before) pr0ner's death? If I hadn't been contacted by pr0ner, I probably would've been voting with you guys. I didn't know that either you or Arch was a wolf until pr0ner's death, because I still thought there was a chance pr0ner was a wolf.

But after his death, I thought my post would make it fairly clear that either Grund or Archinerd was a wolf. If in the next two days the village had killed both of you, I think there would be a good chance we would have won. 1 wolf to go with 7 players left? Those are pretty good odds. Unfortunately, I didn't make it clear enough (or people didn't go back to reread it).

I fully admit that I didn't play my best game, but I don't think the choices I made at the time were obviously the incorrect decisions. Hindsight is 20/20 and all that jazz.

[Grundbegriff]

Edit: But you still have to admit there are those who don't read through all the evidence links.

Certainly. Some folks make note of the fact that I've provided links, but don't follow them. They do this either because they remember the message I'm pointing to, or they don't need persuasion because they're already in agreement with me, or they can't be bothered, or they doubt me so intensely that they don't want to be persuaded.

The fact remains that anyone who does follow such a link lands on clear evidence that has something relevant to say about the claim I made when I linked to it. Unless I'm deliberately using silly evidence, in which case I'm counting on collective laziness to see me through.

What's this Wizard's Rule you keep mentioning?

[Grundbegriff]

In a PM game where I'm innocent, I always assume I'm talking to a Wolf unless I have some reason not to do so.

And that's why I didn't fully trust pr0ner, even up until his death. Even in his PMs to me he acted strangely. His first PM to me only said "Can you keep a secret?". Why would the seer who knows I'm innocent start a conversation like that with me? Just tell me you're the seer and that you scanned me. It just seemed strange.

Yeah, that's weird. I think pr0ner was just off his game this time. Maybe Real Life got in the way or something.

[Austin]

What's this Wizard's Rule you keep mentioning?

People Are Stupid.

Explanation by Zeddicus Zu'l Zorander: "People can be made to believe any lie, either because they want to believe it's true, or because they are afraid it's true.


Edit: Why isn't my code working here? Hmmm...

Edit 2: stupid wiki links and their ''s

[pr0ner]

I still can't believe no one went after Grund after I stated my suspicion of him over and over again. Wow.

[Grundbegriff]

You have to encode the apostrophe:

Code: Select all

[url=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wizard%27s_Rule]You have to encode the apostrophe[/url]

[Kelric]

One more thing. It was fun to play with Grund. He's much more calculated than I am and seeing the future planning/predicting was fun. I tend toward reacting and trying to think on my feet. Twas a fun balance as he pushed me to plan more.

The one game he and I were paired together (as Siblings or something similar IIRC), he got killed the first night. And I can never recruit him as a bad guy since the perception is he's always a decent lynch target.

Kelric: Dangerously moderate, not especially analytical

Yeah, I don't bother with the follow the logic train of thought too much in these games. I prefer to just kind of wing it. More fun for me.

[Grundbegriff]

I still can't believe no one went after Grund after I stated my suspicion of him over and over again. Wow.

Why can't you believe it? Because you had made yourself so credible in the eyes of so many?

[pr0ner]

I still can't believe no one went after Grund after I stated my suspicion of him over and over again. Wow.

Why can't you believe it? Because you had made yourself so credible in the eyes of so many?

Sometimes your tag can be so appropriate.

[Grundbegriff]

I still can't believe no one went after Grund after I stated my suspicion of him over and over again. Wow.

Why can't you believe it? Because you had made yourself so credible in the eyes of so many?

Sometimes your tag can be so appropriate.

Well, surely you have to admit that I was only able to exploit your weird behavior because your behavior was weird....

Archinerd doubted you. Even your Scanned+Contacted doubted you.

I don't think there's anything wrong with your acknowledging that you misconstrued your role or developed a wrongheaded strategy. In games where I've screwed up or misinterpreted, I've owned and explained my mistakes in detail in the postmortem.

It's a game. It's all good. We can all have a chuckle, raise a toast, and learn from one another, we few, we band of Minions....