Octopus Overlords

Sidney Lumet should be filming this.

Henry Fonda plays Varity.

If we lynched a beta vamp, would we be told?

triggercut wrote:Sidney Lumet should be filming this.

Henry Fonda plays Varity.

I think the real question would be.. Who would Danny Devito play.

noxiousdog wrote:If we lynched a beta vamp, would we be told?

I've given this issue a lot of thought, actually.

The answer, and I think it the best answer, is "no."

The beta vamps don't fully come into their undeadedness until the moon rises high on the night following this eternal day. So...staking a beta vamp prior to that saves his mortal soul from the evil Vampire and allows him to ford the river Styx or whatever.

One other rule "twist" I'll throw in, because I've been thinking about what would result if it happened. What follows is an official rule:

Should the person protected by the FVH be attacked by Vampires, the village at large will simply be told that everyone is alive in the morning. The Vampires, obviously, will know they've been thwarted. The FVH and protectee will also know they've been saved, and will know the identity of one another...but that information will not be shared with the village, and it'll be up to the saved villager and/or the FVH to announce the event and/or convince their dubious neighbors as to its veracity.

noxiousdog wrote:If we lynched a beta vamp, would we be told?

Villagers lynched will have their true identity revealed should they be undead.

I assume that means yes.

Edit - Apparently it means no.

Apparently, it means "yes, because their true identity is still non-undead".

Kelric wrote:

noxiousdog wrote:If we lynched a beta vamp, would we be told?

Villagers lynched will have their true identity revealed should they be undead.

I assume that means yes.

Edit - Apparently it means no.

I should clarify: If you guys lynch a beta vamp today, you'll be in the dark.

After tonight, though, he/she will be fully undead, and staking a beta will reveal that vampirish status.

triggercut wrote:After tonight, though, he/she will be fully undead

Are you sure we're not playing 28 Days Later?

Grundbegriff wrote:

triggercut wrote:After tonight, though, he/she will be fully undead

Are you sure we're not playing 28 Days Later?

If a 3rd or 4th seer contacts noxiousdog, we will be.

setaside wrote:

7 out of 9 people will disagree with you, I think.

But which 7?

That's the whole problem. You could wake up in the morning as a vamp and BAM! all of a sudden, the entire game has changed for you. The information you've been feeding the Mason will now be used against you, handing the other team the likely victory.

From a realism standpoint, it makes sense but from a victory standpoint, it's potential suicide.

As much as I hate to see it that way since likely I will wake up in the morning and STILL be a villager, thus kicking myself for not going forward with it. If I did wake up in the morning as a vamp, I'd be kicking myself if I DID go along with it.

If you're not a plain villager, it's an easy choice. Otherwise ... serious potential for a conflict of interests.

Thats all true, but the odds for both cases are not 50:50!

I place my bets on the horse with the better odds, if I have to choose. Trying to resist the web of trust will most likely fail anyhow, regardless of your choice (to support the masons or not) right now.

What other choice do you have? Your chances of individial survival are best in a short game. If you support the masons you decrease your risk of getting killed by keeping the game from dragging out.

Varity wrote: Thats...
I...
What...

So, like, what's your vote?

Grundbegriff wrote:

Varity wrote: Thats...
I...
What...

So, like, what's your vote?

Dude, I'm tellin ya: Henry Fonda doesn't vote!!

(Just be aware that Ed Begley Sr., had Lumet allowed, most certainly would've lynched Fonda; I mean he gave him some looks!)

triggercut wrote:Dude, I'm tellin ya: Henry Fonda doesn't vote!!

"You a Yankee fan?"
"No, Baltimore."
"Baltimore? That's like being hit in the head with a crow bar once a day."

Varity wrote: What other choice do you have? Your chances of individial survival are best in a short game. If you support the masons you decrease your risk of getting killed by keeping the game from dragging out.

Unless I wake up a vamp in which case I've increased my risk of getting staked. What purpose, as a plain villager, does supporting the Masons serve except to hand the game to the villagers? This is great except for the 2 who wake tonight and realize that "wow, now how the hell am I going to do?"

I'd agree that the seers and the FVH should be in contact with noxious by now, letting noxious and the other mason figure out any discrepencies that might arise. But the villagers ... with an approximately 22% chance that they will wake up a vampire, revealing too much now would be sealing their own fate. NOT a smart move for potential vampires.

triggercut wrote:

Grundbegriff wrote:

Varity wrote: Thats...
I...
What...

So, like, what's your vote?

Dude, I'm tellin ya: Henry Fonda doesn't vote!!

(Just be aware that Ed Begley Sr., had Lumet allowed, most certainly would've lynched Fonda; I mean he gave him some looks!)

I nominate Mira Sorvino for Leigh. But give her more lines.

setaside wrote:

Varity wrote: What other choice do you have? Your chances of individial survival are best in a short game. If you support the masons you decrease your risk of getting killed by keeping the game from dragging out.

Unless I wake up a vamp in which case I've increased my risk of getting staked. What purpose, as a plain villager, does supporting the Masons serve except to hand the game to the villagers? This is great except for the 2 who wake tonight and realize that "wow, now how the hell am I going to do?"

I'd agree that the seers and the FVH should be in contact with noxious by now, letting noxious and the other mason figure out any discrepencies that might arise. But the villagers ... with an approximately 22% chance that they will wake up a vampire, revealing too much now would be sealing their own fate. NOT a smart move for potential vampires.

I fear if you draw that lot, you're screwed anyways, regardless of what you do. You may have the satisfaction to see 1 or 2 more people die before you, but the end result will be the same.

Your only hope is, that the alpha didn't consider you worthy enough.

At this point, if Nox really is a mason (and I believe he is) and he has been contacted by the two seers, the vampires are screwed anyways. Most of these games don't have early coordination.

Grund may have broken the model for all future games on this forum for anyone who reads this thread. I knew there was a reason for him to die early.

Varity wrote: I fear if you draw that lot, you're screwed anyways, regardless of what you do. You may have the satisfaction to see 1 or 2 more people die before you, but the end result will be the same.

Your only hope is, that the alpha didn't consider you worthy enough.

Possibly. But why should they give up before the first night is even over? What fun is that?

Kelric wrote:At this point, if Nox really is a mason (and I believe he is) and he has been contacted by the two seers, the vampires are screwed anyways. Most of these games don't have early coordination.

Grund may have broken the model for all future games on this forum for anyone who reads this thread. I knew there was a reason for him to die early.

Speaking of which, it looks like ya'll are waiting for me to lead this bandwagon. I got no problem with it, but be aware, it's probably going to be a random name.

I'm going to sleep in the hopes that I get a 3rd or 4th seer. Otherwise, expect to see the bandwagon crank up around 9am Central time.

noxiousdog wrote:but be aware, it's probably going to be a random name.

How rational.

Grundbegriff wrote:

noxiousdog wrote:but be aware, it's probably going to be a random name.

How rational.

Heh. When Grund throws down the rolley-eyes, it's EXTRA biting.

Oh and screw you guys for making tonights exchange particularly interesting. I had other things I wanted to do tonight.

Grundbegriff wrote:

noxiousdog wrote:but be aware, it's probably going to be a random name.

How rational.

He seems to be confused between your whisperings and mine, so he opts for the middle ground, I think.

Kelric wrote:At this point, if Nox really is a mason (and I believe he is) and he has been contacted by the two seers, the vampires are screwed anyways. Most of these games don't have early coordination.

You're assuming too much, dear sir, and thinking under rules that apply to a different game. Perhaps the vampires are hosed in this game...but the means to defeat this strategy (and in fact turn it to the advantage of the vampires) are already written into the rules of this game.

And that said, when this game concludes I will most definitely run a sequel, perhaps with two more innocent villagers added, perhaps with a rule tweak or two based upon this game.

I say we lynch Chris Grenard (not bolded)!

Funny enough I'm pretty well content to keep discussing and debating strategies and logic and deduction well into 2007...

(that was a joke, Mr Bubbles... crap, someone get a net!)

Have we developed enough information or suspicion on all fronts to call for an actual vote?

Have the lies caused enough confusion?

Why didn't I get a lap dance at the strip club tonight?

Personally, I think this entire fiasco will be greatly humorous when we find out that Leigh is the alpha, sent PMs to her minions pr0ner and msteelers to let them know they would turn the first night and they have all sat back smirking as the rest of us babble on to no avail.

Hmmm... actually that's an interesting thought.

Triggercut: is the alpha allowed to inform her minions before you do?

Chaosraven wrote: Triggercut: is the alpha allowed to inform her minions before you do?

Nope. Both beta-vamps are flying blind right now.

Which puts them/us in the same boat as the rest of us/them

triggercut wrote:

Chaosraven wrote: Triggercut: is the alpha allowed to inform her minions before you do?

Nope. Both beta-vamps are flying blind right now.

Well, unless someone decided to cheat.

Grundbegriff wrote:

noxiousdog wrote:but be aware, it's probably going to be a random name.

How rational.

Then start your own bandwagon.

Kelric wrote:I say we lynch Chris Grenard (not bolded)!

I am at a quandry. Our two most likely candidates are Mark and Grund. But neither are likely enough to outweight their usefulness as honest villagefolk.

No one has come forward to challenge Mark's claim, and Grundbegriff has done more to help this village than anyone.

Does this mean they are free from doubt? Of course not! But Grund's status can be easily tested, and Mark's already has, though the test isn't complete.

We are at an impasse really. Signs point to Grund and Mark, but those signs are not strong enough to reach a conclusion. The lasting harm done by being wrong is greater than the immediate help by being right. But we have to do something.

So, my recommendation is to lynch someone would has the skills to be very useful to the vampires, but also would also would fly beneath the radar. Lynch Chris Grenard.

Varity wrote: ...I am fairly sure that Grundbegriff is the alpha vampire.
...I would like to see noxiousdog make a comment on this.

Well, here's what noxiousdog has now said:

noxiousdog wrote:Grundbegriff has done more to help this village than anyone. Does this mean they are free from doubt? Of course not! But Grund's status can be easily tested

So then, will you vote now? Or will you allow this to devolve into the same random mob justice we started with?

noxiousdog wrote:

Kelric wrote:I say we lynch Chris Grenard (not bolded)!

I am at a quandry. Our two most likely candidates are Mark and Grund. But neither are likely enough to outweight their usefulness as honest villagefolk.

No one has come forward to challenge Mark's claim, and Grundbegriff has done more to help this village than anyone.

Does this mean they are free from doubt? Of course not! But Grund's status can be easily tested, and Mark's already has, though the test isn't complete.

We are at an impasse really. Signs point to Grund and Mark, but those signs are not strong enough to reach a conclusion. The lasting harm done by being wrong is greater than the immediate help by being right. But we have to do something.

So, my recommendation is to lynch someone would has the skills to be very useful to the vampires, but also would also would fly beneath the radar. Lynch Chris Grenard.

So this is what a bandwagon looks like, huh?

Very well: vote for Leigh rescinded.

Lynch Chris Grenard

Grundbegriff wrote:

Varity wrote: ...I am fairly sure that Grundbegriff is the alpha vampire.
...I would like to see noxiousdog make a comment on this.

Well, here's what noxiousdog has now said:

noxiousdog wrote:Grundbegriff has done more to help this village than anyone. Does this mean they are free from doubt? Of course not! But Grund's status can be easily tested

So then, will you vote now? Or will you allow this to devolve into the same random mob justice we started with?

I will follow noxiousdogs recommendation, but if I do so right now, I remove the impasse at a time when we have a different front runner than noxiousdog wanted.

I'd like to have an official updated voting record, so that I don't make a mistake.

my vote for msteelers stand for the same reason noxious has picked Chris. At least I know that Chris is active in the other threads. msteelers is just laying low period.

Varity wrote:I'd like to have an official updated voting record, so that I don't make a mistake.

It's unofficial, but I believe this is where we stand:

against Chaosraven: 1 votes (pr0ner)
against ChrisGrenard 2 votes (noxiousdog, Mark)
against Grundbegriff: 2 votes (Orinoco, msteelers)
against Mark: 3 votes (Kelric, Chaosraven, JD)
against Mr Bubbles: 1 vote (Crux)
against msteelers: 2 votes (Leigh, Mr Bubbles)
against Varity: 1 vote (ChrisGrenard)


votes not given: Grundbegriff, setaside, Varity

Crux wrote: First rounds suck. Someone has to go. Sorry Mark.
I will change my vote to Grundbegriff.
I withdraw my vote for Grund, and instead vote for Chaosraven.
Grundbegriff. It's all a posture. Surely.
I am going to vote for Mark.
I'm going to trust ND for now, and am switching my vote to Mr. Bubbles

BTW, somebody ping the Crux-bot. There's suspiciously subservient followin' to be done!

Hey! *WE* haven't programmed him with the days orders yet! (please note the big ol' smiley hereby applied to the use of the word WE)

I still get runner-up for wishy-washy fishin' votes, right?

Speaking of shit or get off the pot, Grund...

Chaosraven wrote:Hey! *WE* haven't programmed him with the days orders yet! (please not the big ol' smiley hereby applied to the use of the word WE)

I still get runner-up for wishy-washy fishin' votes, right?

Speaking of shit or get off the pot, Grund...

Grund

Because I have nothing better to do with myself, and because the game needs to move forward:

Stake: ChrisGrenard

No, that's not a vote for him... that's a nudge to remind him he is one of the few non-votes holding us up

Grundbegriff wrote: So then, will you vote now? Or will you allow this to devolve into the same random mob justice we started with?

Funny how you're bitching at someone else to vote, when you're still without a vote yourself.