The Politics of Covid 19, mask wearing and the vaccination process

[RunningMn9]

It's not like there are definitions for words like "pandemic" and "endemic" that should guide health departments or anything.

[Smoove_B]

We (my profession) has lost these words; they're meaningless now. Nothing matters anymore.

[Zaxxon]

We (my profession) has lost these words; they're meaningless now. Nothing matters anymore.

Another we've lost is 'health board,' at least around here.

[Jaymon]

We (my profession) has lost these words; they're meaningless now. Nothing matters anymore.

Another we've lost is 'health board,' at least around here.

Shall be referred to from now as 'health splinter"

[LordMortis]

Health Nonplussed?
Health Unenthused unto Reckless Ignorance?

(See what I did there, I inferred board was actually bored and equated the boredom with the idea that we're over it)

[YellowKing]

I remember thinking back in early 2020 that the idea of 250,000 dead Americans was inconceivable, and that the government (and society) would do everything in their power to prevent that scenario. Ha! What a sweet summer child I was.

[LordMortis]

I remember thinking back in early 2020 that the idea of 250,000 dead Americans was inconceivable, and that the government (and society) would do everything in their power to prevent that scenario. Ha! What a sweet summer child I was.

600,000 was the target from uncontrolled spread IIRC and that was inconceivable to me. And now we know.

[hitbyambulance]

wait til people get infected with C19 multiple times over the years, increasing the possibility of Long Covid symptoms, creating a sizeable population of disableds no longer able to work short-term/long-term. there's your 'new economy'.

[LordMortis]

wait til people get infected with C19 multiple times over the years, increasing the possibility of Long Covid symptoms, creating a sizeable population of disableds no longer able to work short-term/long-term. there's your 'new economy'.

As long hauler equivalent of Epstein-Barr, aka CFS, (Mono knocked me out for nearly 6 months and I've known it ever since) I do not endorse this message. What people are describing, I've been living for long time and it gets worse as I get older.

[Smoove_B]

A snapshot of workplaces across America:

Justice Sonia Sotomayor was back on the bench for oral arguments at the Supreme Court on Tuesday after participating remotely during the court's January sitting that came during a surge in Covid-19 cases due to the Omicron variant.

Sotomayor was the only justice wearing a mask on Tuesday. She suffers from diabetes that puts her in a high-risk category for Covid.
All of the justices are fully vaccinated, have received booster shots and are tested regularly, according to a court spokesperson.

Except for all workers being vaccinated and tested.

[Defiant]

Aren't almost all of the justices ancient, putting them in "a high-risk category for Covid"?

[stessier]

Aren't almost all of the justices ancient, putting them in "a high-risk category for Covid"?

Code: Select all

Clarence Thomas		23 Jun 1948	Age: 73 yr 7 mo
Stephen Breyer		15 Aug 1938	Age: 83 yr 6 mo
John G. Roberts		27 Jan 1955	Age: 67 yr 0 mo	
Samuel A. Alito, Jr.	1 Apr 1950	Age: 71 yr 10 mo
Sonia Sotomayor		25 Jun 1954	Age: 67 yr 7 mo
Elena Kagan		28 Apr 1960	Age: 61 yr 9 mo
Neil McGill Gorsuch	29 Aug 1967	Age: 54 yr 5 mo
Brett Michael Kavanaugh	12 Feb 1965	Age: 57 yr 0 mo
Amy Coney Barrett	28 Jan 1972	Age: 50 yr 0 mo

[Defiant]

Huh, that's younger than I thought (I guess I hadn't factored in the recent turnover). Still, that's 6 of them over 60.

[LawBeefaroni]

Huh, that's younger than I thought (I guess I hadn't factored in the recent turnover). Still, that's 6 of them over 60.

And they can suck it.

Freedom! Endemic!

[LawBeefaroni]

CHICAGO (WLS) -- Chicago Mayor Lori Lightfoot and Chicago Department of Public Health Commissioner Dr. Allison Arwady announced Tuesday the city will remove the mask and vaccine requirements for certain public spaces Monday. This is in alignment with the state of Illinois' plan.

Lightfoot said the key metrics of cases and hospitalization numbers are putting Chicago in a position to no longer require masks in most indoor spaces.

I take this as further evidence that we beat COVID into endemic-ness.

[Smoove_B]

Yeah, the CDC agrees totally with this.

[LawBeefaroni]

The governor already announced the end to the mask mandate on the 28th which would have included Cook outside of Chicago. I honestly expected Chicago to keep it in place but hey, politics comes first.

[Zaxxon]

What does the CDC know? Our guts tell us that it feels endemic now.

[Max Peck]

Now that COVID is endemic, people will simply die with COVID rather than from COVID. This is the way.

[Defiant]

Yeah, the CDC agrees totally with this.

To be fair, that's still better than the 85% of the country that still has high community transmission and which, given the way things are going, are likely also withdrawing most of the mandates.

[Smoove_B]

If all of your neighbors are still shitting in the street but you have been making sure to use the toilet, now is not the time to decide your well water is safe to drink. Also, I completely believe I am now surrounded by a large segment of people that are genuinely angry they cannot shit in the street.

[LawBeefaroni]

If all of your neighbors are still shitting in the street but you have been making sure to use the toilet, now is not the time to decide your well water is safe to drink. Also, I completely believe I am now surrounded by a large segment of people that are genuinely angry they cannot shit in the street.

Relax. Street shitting is endemic now.

[Max Peck]

More studies confirm what we already knew: science has a liberal bias.

Ivermectin fails another COVID trial as study links use to GOP politics

The antiparasitic drug ivermectin failed to treat COVID-19 in yet another randomized clinical trial, but the drug remains popular amid the pandemic thanks to Republican politics. That's the takeaway from two separate studies published Friday in JAMA Internal Medicine.

Together, the studies raise yet more concerns for the use of ivermectin against the pandemic virus—as well as the reasons behind its use, which appear politically motivated.

"Political affiliation should not be a factor in clinical treatment decisions," the Harvard researchers behind one of the studies concluded. "Our findings raise concerns for public trust in a non-partisan health care system."

[Defiant]

Good video on the polarization of the vaccine, although the surprising thing from it? There were signs of the divide as far back as May 2020 (before the vaccines and the election), and it suggests that part of this was the belief that the pandemic was exaggerated, which could make it harder for people to access their risk from the disease.

[Smoove_B]

As predicted

https://twitter.com/Phil_Lewis_/status/ ... 0545342465

WASHINGTON (AP) — AP sources: CDC to ease COVID guidelines Friday, new criteria drop mask recommendation for most of US as cases ebb.

[Defiant]

For better or worse, likely worse...


https://twitter.com/JakeSherman/status/ ... 0570757153

[Kurth]

Mask mandates to be lifted in OR on March 19. I think we’re the last state to do so.

[Alefroth]

Mask mandates to be lifted in OR on March 19. I think we’re the last state to do so.

WA has you beat by two days.

edit: I mean for being last.

[Smoove_B]

I believe WA state has the lowest levels of community circulation, currently. At least until the CDC updates the equation this afternoon. Everywhere else in the US is still in high levels of transmissions.

But magically that will all change.

[Zaxxon]

I believe WA state has the lowest levels of community circulation, currently. At least until the CDC updates the equation this afternoon. Everywhere else in the US is still in high levels of transmissions.

But magically that will all change.

I know we're going to get new metrics and the new math and all that later today, so I'm curious on the Smoove Take™ on what metrics should be used, and at what levels, for a 'safe' point at which to drop indoor masking on an individual level. I know that what the CDC is going to put out is not going to meet your standard for what we should be doing for the common good, but that ship has certainly sailed at this point.

I've heard 5% positivity in the past as a solid marker, and many counties around here are back to or around that level. Colorado is under 4% now.

What I'm trying to discern is how to make decisions for my fully-vaxxed and boosted family going forward, now that the CDC appears to want to double down on last year's no masks, no problem brouhaha and the Biden admin pivots to a 'we're done here' mentality.

[Smoove_B]

It's complicated.

The bigger issue to take into account includes your local vaccination rates (all people). Knowing that kids under 5 still can't be vaccinated + the number of "booster" eligible people that still haven't received are setting us up for the next wave. Community spread average levels over 14 days (say < 10 / 100,000) are a piece of the puzzle, but my understanding is the CDC will be using hospitalizations to justify the new masking policy. Are hospitals full? You better mask. Do they have capacity? FREEDOM.

It's not public health at all and it's beyond confusing to me. Disease control? Meh.

So in terms of what you can do locally? I'm continuing to mask in public. I'm continuing to avoid indoor unmasked contact with strangers. I'm doing this because of the first part of the equation above (kids, immunocompromised people, unboostered folks). I think this will effectively put me in a difficult to maintain position as society collectively leaps forward. I cannot (and would not) blame people for saying fuck it at this point; I'm aware my position and mentality is untenable. Just from where I live, vaccination rates are still embarrassingly low. The pandemic here in the U.S. is about to change drastically (I think) - how it looks and how it affects the average American.

[Zaxxon]

I guess what I'm asking is what specific metrics and numbers would make you feel comfortable dropping masking and other non-vaccine precautions? Understanding that your bar is likely about the highest on the forum, that info would still be useful.

Clearly we're not there yet, but presumably we will be at some point. I hope.

[LordMortis]

I guess what I'm asking is what specific metrics and numbers would make you feel comfortable dropping masking and other non-vaccine precautions? Understanding that your bar is likely about the highest on the forum, that info would still be useful.

Clearly we're not there yet, but presumably we will be at some point. I hope.

IANASB, but I will drop my masking and hygiene efforts when I look at the hospitalization and death rates and don't feel like I have an elevated rate of killing my unvaccinated mother due to my relaxed attitude. She is my stand in for everyone who can't or won't protect themselves. I don't know the metrics but what we have right now is not there.

[Smoove_B]

I guess what I'm asking is what specific metrics and numbers would make you feel comfortable dropping masking and other non-vaccine precautions? Understanding that your bar is likely about the highest on the forum, that info would still be useful.

Clearly we're not there yet, but presumably we will be at some point. I hope.

Sorry, I didn't finish my thought there. Rambling at this point is a thing for me.

I think community spread under 10/100,000 over a 14 day period + community vaccination levels over 80% (fully vaccinated) is a good start. This uses the set of numbers the State of Maryland DOE is using to justify masking/no masking in schools and I think it's a reasonable balance. I like it because it also applies vaccination pressures - reach [X] level and we can have nice things.

[Defiant]

I know we're going to get new metrics and the new math and all that later today, so I'm curious on the Smoove Take™ on what metrics should be used, and at what levels, for a 'safe' point at which to drop indoor masking on an individual level. I know that what the CDC is going to put out is not going to meet your standard for what we should be doing for the common good, but that ship has certainly sailed at this point.

The CDC's recommendation on their website until now, for those who are vaccinated and not immunocompromised, has been to mask up if the area has substantial or high transmission. So if positive testing rates are below 8% *and* there are fewer than 50 new cases over the past week per 100,000 people.

Personally, I'd need to have the numbers at the low transmission rate to consider it - less than 5% positive and fewer than 10 new cases per 100,000 in the past week to consider it (especially since it's harder for tests to detect Omicron vs past variants). Also, I'd want to take other things into account, too (eg, where I'm going, how long I'm going for, how many people will be there, what kind of ventilation, etc)

[Kraken]

I've heard 5% positivity in the past as a solid marker, and many counties around here are back to or around that level. Colorado is under 4% now.

My personal trigger number is 3%. MA is comfortably below that for the moment. We went out to eat last night for the first time since early November! Gotta take advantage of these windows while they're open.

[Zaxxon]

Thanks, that's helpful.

Less helpful: Jared Polis says we're done here.

[Smoove_B]

Thanks, that's helpful.

Less helpful: Jared Polis says we're done here.

Yeah. Live your normal life*


*as parents of children under 5, the immunocompromised and the elderly still worry about the spread of COVID-19

[Zaxxon]

Thanks, that's helpful.

Less helpful: Jared Polis says we're done here.

Yeah. Live your normal life*


*as parents of children under 5, the immunocompromised and the elderly still worry about the spread of COVID-19

** - Also parents of children over 5, folks with comorbidities, etc, to varying degrees.

[Smoove_B]

All true. What I think really kills me (above and beyond this) is that when the next surge comes (and don't doubt it will), the idea that anyone is going to resume masking or endorse masking is now laughable. We've collectively agreed that we're done. Masking is punishment and we're not going to punish anyone, anymore!