The Politics of Covid 19, mask wearing and the vaccination process

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Smoove_B
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Re: The Politics of Covid 19, mask wearing and the vaccination process

Post by Smoove_B »

Really interesting article today from Australia, detailing the viewpoints of three different researchers/scientists as it relates to COVID-19:
Some commentators have described this situation — the crashing of wave after wave of COVID-19, a steady drip, drip, drip of death and mounting chronic illness — as the "new normal". But other experts insist it doesn't have to be, and that continuing on the current trajectory is unsustainable — especially in light of data showing that COVID has decreased life expectancy, will cost the global economy an estimated $US13.8 trillion by 2024, and is decimating the lives of millions of people who have developed long COVID.

Meanwhile, studies continue to pile up showing COVID-19 can cause serious illness affecting every organ system in the body, even in vaccinated people with seemingly mild infections. It can cause cognitive decline and dysfunction consistent with brain injury; trigger immune damage and dysfunction; impair liver, kidney and lung function; and significantly increases the risk of cardiovascular disease and diabetes. Then there's long COVID, a debilitating disease that robs fit and high-functioning people of their ability to think, work and exercise.

...

With HIV, experts and health ministers collectively built a strong public health strategy that they strove to protect from politics. "When we look at COVID, it was political from the start and continues to be," he says. We also now lack a "mid to long-term plan to navigate us through" this next phase of COVID-19: "Some argue that we are no longer in the emergency phase and need to gear down or simply stop," he says. "But should we stop, and if not, what do we gear down to as a longer-term plan?"
From an aerosol scientist:
What she still finds thrilling is that indoor air quality can be assessed with a battery-powered CO2 monitor; popular devices like the Aranet cost about $300 but some companies are developing tech to allow smartphones to do the same. And the investment is worth it, many argue, because it can help you avoid catching COVID-19. It's also good for productivity, with studies showing higher CO2 levels decrease cognitive performance. If CO2 is 800 parts per million, Dr Schofield says, 1 per cent of the air being inhaled has been breathed out by someone else — and is therefore a good proxy for infection risk.

One of the findings from the past few years she finds "most exciting", however, is the role of relative humidity in indoor spaces. When relative humidity is below 40 per cent, Dr Schofield says, the risk of catching COVID-19 increases. (A good sign of that, for those who wear contact lenses, is dry eyes, which she says is "a really good indication that you should get out!") "Because you are becoming the moisture source. Your mucous membranes — which are protecting you from getting COVID or the doses you acquire — are giving up that moisture, and so it's easier to be infected."
I also thought this was interesting (where she'll eat indoors, and why):
When eating out, she chooses restaurants that have outdoor dining areas: a newly revamped boathouse in the Melbourne suburb of Kew is a favourite of hers, and Korean barbecue is "always excellent", she says, because there are generally extractor fans at each table. It's all about good ventilation — clean air. "I always take my Aranet [CO2 monitor] along, and if you sit close enough to the kitchen, the kitchen fans are very effective."
However, note the stumbling block:
All of these issues point to an urgent need for governments to develop indoor air standards, Dr Schofield says — for air quality to be regulated and monitored, just like food and water are. Before the pandemic, in 1998, the economic cost to the Australian economy of poor indoor air was $12 billion per year — $21.7 billion in 2021 money. "So why aren't we learning from that, and moving forward?" she says. "This is not about going back to 2019, it's about having the future we deserve in 2030."
The last scientist is my favorite:
The lack of action against COVID-19, Professor Crabb says, is fundamentally a problem of a lack of leadership. "The most common thing said to me is, 'Brendan, I really do trust what you and others are saying. But if there was a real problem the prime minister, the government, would be telling us that,'" he says. "I don't think people are all of a sudden profoundly individualistic and don't care about COVID anymore — that they're suddenly willing to take massive risks and hate the idea of vaccines and masks. I just don't think they're being well led on this issue."
Not too often I get to see the United States being used as an example:
He also points a finger at two unhelpful ideas. "There is a strong belief, I think, by the chief medical officer and many others that once we got vaccinated, infection was our friend," he says. Australia's vaccine program was highly successful, Professor Crabb says. Most people were inoculated against COVID-19 before large numbers were infected. "If we were the US, we'd have had 80,000 deaths … [instead] we had 1,744 deaths in the first two years," he says. But while vaccination broadly protects against severe illness and death, it does not protect against (re)infection or the risk of acute and chronic health problems.
There's some more; it's a great article.
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Max Peck
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Re: The Politics of Covid 19, mask wearing and the vaccination process

Post by Max Peck »

Cool. I've been meaning to get some sort of CO2 monitor for a while (for non-COVID reasons related to air quality in my apartment). The Aranet4 mentioned in the article is available on Amazon, so I just ordered one.
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Re: The Politics of Covid 19, mask wearing and the vaccination process

Post by Smoove_B »

I've had mine for a few years now; definitely worth it imho. Wish they were cheaper and more accessible but I am a fan. And yes, they're good for just general air quality monitoring.
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Re: The Politics of Covid 19, mask wearing and the vaccination process

Post by Dogstar »

This is just a cautionary tale from central PA -- take care of yourself (and probably mask) because there is a ton of stuff floating around out there. Our receptionist - unknown deep wet cough. Our one notary - Covid. Me - Unknown virus that pivoted into pneumonia. My friend - RSV. My friend's daughter - Flu A. My dad - bad cold. Three friends -- stomach flu. I'm sure a Facebook survey would reveal even more...

The initial doc who was going to see me actually had to cancel because he got sick. I can't remember the last time I knew this many people that were under the weather at once. Feels crazy.
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Re: The Politics of Covid 19, mask wearing and the vaccination process

Post by Pyperkub »

Smoove_B wrote: Sun Jan 21, 2024 11:56 am I've had mine for a few years now; definitely worth it imho. Wish they were cheaper and more accessible but I am a fan. And yes, they're good for just general air quality monitoring.
How so? Do they just monitor CO2, or include other quality issues? I do have a bunch of humidity sensors already.

I haven't looked at it, but we have had moisture issues leading to mildew, etc. in the past (needed to call in ServPro for testing before a remodel to fix a leak behind a wall, as well as some venting issues) and wouldn't mind something at that price.
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Re: The Politics of Covid 19, mask wearing and the vaccination process

Post by Smoove_B »

You can look at the various options, but you can link them together and monitor remotely if you're crafty enough.

I use mine to monitor CO2, the temp and humidity, yes.

The CO2 levels are an indirect way to gauge how "fresh" the air is at any given location. In other words, if there are frequent enough air exchanges (HVAC) or if there's an open window, the CO2 levels should ideally remain below 800 ppm, suggesting enough "clean' air is being introduced into a room or space where you're monitoring.

If you use the app, you can also monitor trends (like time of day) to see if there are patterns.

Going back to the CO2 monitoring, it's not a direct way to measure risk - you could have low CO2 levels but if you're sitting near someone that is coughing non-stop into your airways, the fresh air circulating isn't going to help. However, it is a good way to at least see if the ambient room conditions are reasonable (too dry, too stale).
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Re: The Politics of Covid 19, mask wearing and the vaccination process

Post by Pyperkub »

Thanks!
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Re: The Politics of Covid 19, mask wearing and the vaccination process

Post by Pyperkub »

3rd Circuit Appeals Court - not wearing a mask is NOT free speech.
A federal appeals court shot down claims Monday that New Jersey residents' refusal to wear face masks at school board meetings during the COVID-19 outbreak constituted protected speech under the First Amendment.

The 3rd Circuit Court of Appeals issued a ruling in two related cases stemming from lawsuits against officials in Freehold and Cranford, New Jersey.

The suits revolved around claims that the plaintiffs were retaliated against by school boards because they refused to wear masks during public meetings. In one of the suits, the court sent the case back to a lower court for consideration. In the other, it said the plaintiff failed to show she was retaliated against.

Still, the court found that refusing to wear a mask during a public health emergency didn't amount to free speech protected by the Constitution.
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Re: The Politics of Covid 19, mask wearing and the vaccination process

Post by Smoove_B »

Amazingly I hadn't seen that yet - thanks for linking it.
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Re: The Politics of Covid 19, mask wearing and the vaccination process

Post by Isgrimnur »

Good thing we'll never have another public health emergency.
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Re: The Politics of Covid 19, mask wearing and the vaccination process

Post by Smoove_B »

I'll personally be amazed if we make it to 2030 without another one, yes.
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Re: The Politics of Covid 19, mask wearing and the vaccination process

Post by Isgrimnur »

Epidemiologically? Sure.

Politically? No.
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Re: The Politics of Covid 19, mask wearing and the vaccination process

Post by Smoove_B »

Yeah, just referring to the WHO declaration. I realize Public Health in the United States is largely dying and/or already dead. Which is weird to say, but I've accepted it.
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Re: The Politics of Covid 19, mask wearing and the vaccination process

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I'd be more optimistic and say "in hiding."

If politics come back to reason, they'll reemerge. If one side takes over, the advantage in making it controversial will be gone, and they'll reemerge, but in a different form.
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Re: The Politics of Covid 19, mask wearing and the vaccination process

Post by Smoove_B »

So I guess Joe Rogan had Dr. Bret Weinstein on his show a few days ago, and after presumably spending time talking about how great anti-vaccination and ivermectin are, he apparently went on a rant about HIV/AIDS that ended with him blaming the "gay lifestyle" for the proliferation of the disease.

For those keeping track, we're now fully back into the 1990s where people are not only blaming "the gays" for AIDS but also denying that HIV is actually responsible for causing it.

Anyway, if you see weird circles of news regarding COVID-19 and HIV/AIDS circulating, apparently that's why. It's like all this anti-science nonsense is building to a genuine fever-pitch.

EDIT: Though all this helps propel people like RFK, Jr. so maybe that's the play here, especially after his SuperBowl ad.
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Re: The Politics of Covid 19, mask wearing and the vaccination process

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Smoove_B wrote: Tue Feb 06, 2024 9:02 pm I'll personally be amazed if we make it to 2030 without another one, yes.
Granted I'm picking on a Hollywood scenario, but it does make you wonder how well, given where we are now, we'd handle a Contagion-type bug.
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Re: The Politics of Covid 19, mask wearing and the vaccination process

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Smoove_B wrote: Thu Feb 15, 2024 11:51 am especially after his SuperBowl ad.
Yeah, WTF was that!? I forgot about that - that left our room speechless (briefly)
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Re: The Politics of Covid 19, mask wearing and the vaccination process

Post by Isgrimnur »

Trying to ride his uncle's coat tails. Nothing says leader of the future like 60+yo campaign ads.
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Re: The Politics of Covid 19, mask wearing and the vaccination process

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"That's about as blatant of a coattails campaign as can be."
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Re: The Politics of Covid 19, mask wearing and the vaccination process

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Can't we just give the anti-vaxxers, 2nd absolutists, disinformation junkies, and the hard right Florida and Texas to themselves? Then we just wait a couple of years until they're all dead and collect all the loot.
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Re: The Politics of Covid 19, mask wearing and the vaccination process

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This Covid mis-information grift machine...
Four major nonprofits that rose to prominence during the coronavirus pandemic by capitalizing on the spread of medical misinformation collectively gained more than $118 million between 2020 and 2022, enabling the organizations to deepen their influence in statehouses, courtrooms and communities across the country, a Washington Post analysis of tax records shows.

Children’s Health Defense, an anti-vaccine group founded by Robert F. Kennedy Jr., received $23.5 million in contributions, grants and other revenue in 2022 alone — eight times what it collected the year before the pandemic began — allowing it to expand its state-based lobbying operations to cover half the country. Another influential anti-vaccine group, Informed Consent Action Network, nearly quadrupled its revenue during that time to about $13.4 million in 2022, giving it the resources to finance lawsuits seeking to roll back vaccine requirements as Americans’ faith in vaccines drops.

Two other groups, Front Line Covid-19 Critical Care Alliance and America’s Frontline Doctors, went from receiving $1 million combined when they formed in 2020 to collecting more than $21 million combined in 2022, according to the latest tax filings available for the groups...

...Arthur Caplan, head of the division of medical ethics at the New York University Grossman School of Medicine, said that in his view, the four groups endanger lives with their spread of misinformation.

These groups gave jet fuel to misinformation at a crucial time in the pandemic,” Caplan said. “The richer they get, the worse off the public is because, indisputably, they’re spouting dangerous nonsense that kills people.”
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Re: The Politics of Covid 19, mask wearing and the vaccination process

Post by Pyperkub »

Seriously, eff Florida...
Florida surgeon general Joseph A. Ladapo failed to urge parents to vaccinate their children or keep unvaccinated students home from school as a precaution in a letter to parents at the Fort Lauderdale-area school this week following six confirmed measles cases.

Instead of following what he acknowledged was the “normal” recommendation that parents keep unvaccinated children home for up to 21 days — the incubation period for measles — Ladapo said the state health department “is deferring to parents or guardians to make decisions about school attendance.”
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Re: The Politics of Covid 19, mask wearing and the vaccination process

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That makes perfect sense. Why shouldn't non-medical parents and guardians decide to make uninformed medical judgement?

The more I see, the more I think my neighbor is certifiably crazy to want to move there.
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Re: The Politics of Covid 19, mask wearing and the vaccination process

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Let's not forget that Ladapo signed the Barrington declaration. He intends on doing NOTHING as FL's surgeon general, which is why DeSantis picked him.
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Re: The Politics of Covid 19, mask wearing and the vaccination process

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Our school is going to e-learning next week because of an increase of COVID. In the same email, they said this.
In terms of COVID, you may have recently seen the information about the change to guidelines. Based on this information, we are updating our procedures as well:
  • Compete the COVID form available on the website
  • Students are no longer REQUIRED to be out for 5 days following testing positive for COVID. They are able to return to school 24 hours after testing positive IF they have been fever free for 24 hours without the use of fever-reducing medication.
  • Parents/guardians must email when your child has been fever free for 24 hours without fever-reducing medication. Your child can not return to school without this note/email from the parents.


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Re: The Politics of Covid 19, mask wearing and the vaccination process

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Isn’t that basically the protocol for any fever?
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Re: The Politics of Covid 19, mask wearing and the vaccination process

Post by Grifman »

The one thing he did right:

Tolerance is the virtue of the man without convictions. – G.K. Chesterton
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Re: The Politics of Covid 19, mask wearing and the vaccination process

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Every single pic I see of him is that same shit face on him. I wish i could punch his shit face through the back of his shit head.
Last edited by Daehawk on Fri Mar 08, 2024 9:11 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: The Politics of Covid 19, mask wearing and the vaccination process

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This is the first I'm hearing of these turbo cancers.
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Re: The Politics of Covid 19, mask wearing and the vaccination process

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stessier wrote: Thu Mar 07, 2024 6:02 pm Our school is going to e-learning next week because of an increase of COVID. In the same email, they said this.
In terms of COVID, you may have recently seen the information about the change to guidelines. Based on this information, we are updating our procedures as well:
  • Compete the COVID form available on the website
  • Students are no longer REQUIRED to be out for 5 days following testing positive for COVID. They are able to return to school 24 hours after testing positive IF they have been fever free for 24 hours without the use of fever-reducing medication.
  • Parents/guardians must email when your child has been fever free for 24 hours without fever-reducing medication. Your child can not return to school without this note/email from the parents.


This will end well....
Ya cause ya know they are not sick without a fever and 24 has passed.

Also from that school note...
Compete the COVID form available on the website
School itself cant even write properly :)
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Re: The Politics of Covid 19, mask wearing and the vaccination process

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Does anyone have a Smoove signal? His silence concerns me.
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Re: The Politics of Covid 19, mask wearing and the vaccination process

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You’re right. I hope everything is okay. :?
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Re: The Politics of Covid 19, mask wearing and the vaccination process

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hepcat wrote: Fri Mar 08, 2024 10:24 pm You’re right. I hope everything is okay. :?
Can't remember the title, but he keeps popping up on my Steam notifications as playing a particular game, as recently as yesterday I believe.
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Re: The Politics of Covid 19, mask wearing and the vaccination process

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Is it called Turbo Cancer?
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Re: The Politics of Covid 19, mask wearing and the vaccination process

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Plague Inc: Evolved?

Actually, it's RoboCop: Rogue City
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Re: The Politics of Covid 19, mask wearing and the vaccination process

Post by Punisher »

Kraken wrote: Fri Mar 08, 2024 10:23 pm Does anyone have a Smoove signal? His silence concerns me.
I'm assuming that since Covid isn't a thing anymore he has nothing to post...
But seriously does anyone have his contact info to check,
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Re: The Politics of Covid 19, mask wearing and the vaccination process

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Kraken wrote: Fri Mar 08, 2024 10:23 pm Does anyone have a Smoove signal? His silence concerns me.
Likewise. I've been worried as well.

I know that the last few years have to have been hard on him. I can't imagine devoting my life to a discipline, only to find that when the time actually comes, society decides that dying is more fun. I have to imagine that he's pretty fed up right now.
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Re: The Politics of Covid 19, mask wearing and the vaccination process

Post by Unagi »

Kraken wrote: Fri Mar 08, 2024 10:23 pm Does anyone have a Smoove signal? His silence concerns me.
Freaked me out as well, but I noticed his Steam account plays and then not play RoboCop - so at least someone is on that account. But the silence has been way too long here - so I'm still worried.
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Re: The Politics of Covid 19, mask wearing and the vaccination process

Post by LordMortis »

Unagi wrote: Sat Mar 09, 2024 1:53 am
Kraken wrote: Fri Mar 08, 2024 10:23 pm Does anyone have a Smoove signal? His silence concerns me.
Freaked me out as well, but I noticed his Steam account plays and then not play RoboCop - so at least someone is on that account. But the silence has been way too long here - so I'm still worried.
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Re: The Politics of Covid 19, mask wearing and the vaccination process

Post by Grifman »

But of course they are:

Tolerance is the virtue of the man without convictions. – G.K. Chesterton
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