Edit, so I was curious what Vice President, things are way better now, Pence has to say about the rise in cases and drop in ICU beds. The first hit happened to be about Florida:
“I want the people of Florida to know we’re in a much better place thanks to the leadership of President [Donald] Trump, the innovation of American industry and to the partnership that we’ve forged, not just in testing, but in personal protective equipment,”
Pence and DeSantis, along with several federal health officials, noted a handful of differences between the current outbreak in Florida and the earlier ones in New York and Seattle this spring. Treatment options have improved, testing capabilities have expanded and hospitals are ready for a surge.
Now is not the time to close down the economy again to prevent further spread, Pence said, citing all of those factors. Particularly not when the nation’s workforce is rebounding. The economy added 4.8 million jobs in June.
“We don’t have to choose between opening up America and the health of our people,” Pence said at the event.
How does he sleep at night? With visions of AIDS epidemics dancing in his head?
So thank Trump for treatment, when states should fend for themselves and seizes equipment for "federal use" and reports as hoaxes.
Last edited by LordMortis on Thu Jul 02, 2020 6:56 pm, edited 1 time in total.
On Thursday, Texas Gov. Greg Abbott issued a mandatory face mask ordinance for all counties in the state of Texas that currently have more than 20 cases of COVID-19.
...
If you are found in violation of the face-mask ordinance, a warning would be issued the first time. Any times you are found in violation after that, you can be fined by police, up to $250.
Abbott did explain that no one will be jailed for not wearing a face mask.
Edit, so I was curious what Vice President, things are way better now, Pence has to say about the rise in cases and drop in ICU beds. The first hit happened to be about Florida:
“I want the people of Florida to know we’re in a much better place thanks to the leadership of President [Donald] Trump, the innovation of American industry and to the partnership that we’ve forged, not just in testing, but in personal protective equipment,”
Pence and DeSantis, along with several federal health officials, noted a handful of differences between the current outbreak in Florida and the earlier ones in New York and Seattle this spring. Treatment options have improved, testing capabilities have expanded and hospitals are ready for a surge.
Now is not the time to close down the economy again to prevent further spread, Pence said, citing all of those factors. Particularly not when the nation’s workforce is rebounding. The economy added 4.8 million jobs in June.
“We don’t have to choose between opening up America and the health of our people,” Pence said at the event.
How does he sleep at night? With visions of AIDS epidemics dancing in his head?
So thank Trump for treatment, when states should fend for themselves and seizes equipment for "federal use" and reports as hoaxes.
A group of Oregon State Police troopers appeared to defy Gov. Kate Brown’s statewide mask order while in uniform Wednesday, entering a Corvallis coffee shop without wearing required face coverings, video obtained by The Oregonian/OregonLive shows.
The store’s assistant manager, Travis Boss, said he told the first trooper who arrived that the trooper needed to wear a mask.
“Governor Brown has no authority to take our civil liberties. We aren’t going to wear masks,” the trooper allegedly said, according to a written statement from Boss provided to the newsroom.
The trooper proceeded to place his order, Boss said in an interview, offering a foul-mouthed retort to the governor’s mandate that masks be worn within indoor public spaces.
LordMortis wrote: Thu Jul 02, 2020 6:38 pm
How does he sleep at night? With visions of AIDS epidemics dancing in his head?
I'm convinced that this administration ignoring public-health science is a specific, targeted gift to right-wing Christians, who are still capable of seeing diseases, weather, and natural disasters as part of God's specific action in the world.
When Trump says the virus will just "disappear" (as he did months ago and absurdly again *this week*), he's invoking that faith. And the modern version doesn't even posit that illness or death is a punishment, as it might have been in the Middle Ages; it's just that God's plan is larger than us and we simply have to accept it.
All of this is ultimately in the service of rejection of science, elites, and government, and it trends towards ever-more-explicit theocracy.
Went to the gym today. No showers, no lockers. Assigned time slots, there were about 10 people in there, it has a capacity of over 100 I'm guessing. 3 people in there sterilizing equipment after you hop off.
It was nice to get back in but full on cardio with the mask is big shitty. Not going to do that again. My mask was soaked with condensation and sweat by the time I was done. One of those surgical masks.
Will limit to weights and light cardio as long a masks are required.
" Hey OP, listen to my advice alright." -Tha General "“I like taking the guns early...to go to court would have taken a long time. So you could do exactly what you’re saying, but take the guns first, go through due process second.” -President Donald Trump. "...To guard, protect, and maintain his liberty, the freedman should have the ballot; that the liberties of the American people were dependent upon the Ballot-box, the Jury-box, and the Cartridge-box, that without these no class of people could live and flourish in this country." - Frederick Douglass MYT
LawBeefaroni wrote: Thu Jul 02, 2020 8:43 pm
Went to the gym today. No showers, no lockers. Assigned time slots, there were about 10 people in there, it has a capacity of over 100 I'm guessing. 3 people in there sterilizing equipment after you hop off.
It was nice to get back in but full on cardio with the mask is big shitty. Not going to do that again. My mask was soaked with condensation and sweat by the time I was done. One of those surgical masks.
Will limit to weights and light cardio as long a masks are required.
I've been surprised that bicycling somewhat long-distance at significant speed is still possible with a mask on.
It's weird: miles of steady cycling in the sun doesn't produce anything like the mask-sweat of just climbing three flights of stairs.
LawBeefaroni wrote: Thu Jul 02, 2020 8:43 pm
Went to the gym today. No showers, no lockers. Assigned time slots, there were about 10 people in there, it has a capacity of over 100 I'm guessing. 3 people in there sterilizing equipment after you hop off.
It was nice to get back in but full on cardio with the mask is big shitty. Not going to do that again. My mask was soaked with condensation and sweat by the time I was done. One of those surgical masks.
Will limit to weights and light cardio as long a masks are required.
I've been surprised that bicycling somewhat long-distance at significant speed is still possible with a mask on.
It's weird: miles of steady cycling in the sun doesn't produce anything like the mask-sweat of just climbing three flights of stairs.
Radiator + evaporation I'm guessing.
" Hey OP, listen to my advice alright." -Tha General "“I like taking the guns early...to go to court would have taken a long time. So you could do exactly what you’re saying, but take the guns first, go through due process second.” -President Donald Trump. "...To guard, protect, and maintain his liberty, the freedman should have the ballot; that the liberties of the American people were dependent upon the Ballot-box, the Jury-box, and the Cartridge-box, that without these no class of people could live and flourish in this country." - Frederick Douglass MYT
MA is going ahead with stage 3. Despite the national disaster, our numbers are still trending good. I was not consulted.
Museums are the only thing opening that tempt me. I would love to spend a weekend in the Berkshires, and theater and museums are what we do there. Theater's still off the table, but museums can easily fill 2-3 days. Unfortunately, life's getting in the way in other ways that make this seem impossible.
Kraken wrote: Thu Jul 02, 2020 10:09 pm
MA is going ahead with stage 3. Despite the national disaster, our numbers are still trending good. I was not consulted.
Museums are the only thing opening that tempt me. I would love to spend a weekend in the Berkshires, and theater and museums are what we do there. Theater's still off the table, but museums can easily fill 2-3 days. Unfortunately, life's getting in the way in other ways that make this seem impossible.
We got take out from a Chinese restaraunt in Worcester this evening. While going in to pick it up I noticed that they had people dining outdoors, which wasn't surprising. I was surprised that they also had a few people dining indoors - apparently with limited capacity. Still a big no thank you for me.
Max Peck wrote: Thu Jul 02, 2020 3:52 pm
Meanwhile, you're far from the only skeptic.
Thanks for posting that thread.
Yeah, this has all the hallmarks of a moral panic. It's like D&D Satanism or the Knockout Game: parents are sure it's happening and it's terrible but no one actually doing it can be located.
Kids are savvy enough to know that Covid can ruin their lungs even if they don't die from it. There's a reason they don't play Russian Roulette, either. (Nor, as it happens, do actual Russians.)
You mean the same ones not practicing mask wearing or social distancing while having parties at bars at other venues?
Max Peck wrote: Thu Jul 02, 2020 3:52 pm
Meanwhile, you're far from the only skeptic.
Thanks for posting that thread.
Yeah, this has all the hallmarks of a moral panic. It's like D&D Satanism or the Knockout Game: parents are sure it's happening and it's terrible but no one actually doing it can be located.
Kids are savvy enough to know that Covid can ruin their lungs even if they don't die from it. There's a reason they don't play Russian Roulette, either. (Nor, as it happens, do actual Russians.)
You mean the same ones not practicing mask wearing or social distancing while having parties at bars at other venues?
These are in completely different leagues. One is people not understanding the risks they are taking. The other is an unverified account of people intentionally taking risks for kicks. It might be true but it sounds like bullshit.
For those trying to understand, how did CA go from success to hotspot in 5 weeks?
In about five weeks, the nation’s most populous state went from success story to cautionary tale. Health experts say no single thing went wrong, but contributing factors included a populace made complacent by a long stretch of positive trends, the rapid reopening of businesses, a confusing patchwork of local rules and enforcement, and Newsom’s late adoption of a mandatory mask rule, on June 18.
“On Memorial Day, why did we just unleash the floodgates without a statewide mask order in place? I wish I had an answer to that, and it’s alarming to us,” said Stephanie Roberson, government relations director for the California Nurses Association.
Of note:
“We’re in a very precarious situation,” said Anne Rimoin, a professor of epidemiology at the University of California-Los Angeles’s Fielding School of Public Health.
She noted that May produced a rapid reopening leading into Memorial Day weekend and then Father’s Day. Many people gathered as they have in the past.
“All of these things together gave ample opportunity for this virus to spread, and I think that this just really demonstrates how quickly we can lose all of the gains that we made,” Rimoin said.
This coming weekend has potential to really kick this off to a whole new level.
Max Peck wrote: Thu Jul 02, 2020 3:52 pm
Meanwhile, you're far from the only skeptic.
Thanks for posting that thread.
Yeah, this has all the hallmarks of a moral panic. It's like D&D Satanism or the Knockout Game: parents are sure it's happening and it's terrible but no one actually doing it can be located.
Kids are savvy enough to know that Covid can ruin their lungs even if they don't die from it. There's a reason they don't play Russian Roulette, either. (Nor, as it happens, do actual Russians.)
You mean the same ones not practicing mask wearing or social distancing while having parties at bars at other venues?
These are in completely different leagues. One is people not understanding the risks they are taking. The other is an unverified account of people intentionally taking risks for kicks. It might be true but it sounds like bullshit.
For me, I’d say the difference is slight. I’m perceiving it as almost identical with the only difference being that the bar ones are not announcing that they are doing this intentionally.
Both are groups of people taking risks for kicks. One for money the other for partying in general.
Smoove_B wrote: Thu Jul 02, 2020 6:03 pm
If only we could have been working on increasing capacity. It's a shame this pandemic came out of nowhere and then just instantly exploded.
Max Peck wrote: Thu Jul 02, 2020 3:52 pm
Meanwhile, you're far from the only skeptic.
Thanks for posting that thread.
Yeah, this has all the hallmarks of a moral panic. It's like D&D Satanism or the Knockout Game: parents are sure it's happening and it's terrible but no one actually doing it can be located.
Kids are savvy enough to know that Covid can ruin their lungs even if they don't die from it. There's a reason they don't play Russian Roulette, either. (Nor, as it happens, do actual Russians.)
You mean the same ones not practicing mask wearing or social distancing while having parties at bars at other venues?
These are in completely different leagues. One is people not understanding the risks they are taking. The other is an unverified account of people intentionally taking risks for kicks. It might be true but it sounds like bullshit.
For me, I’d say the difference is slight. I’m perceiving it as almost identical with the only difference being that the bar ones are not announcing that they are doing this intentionally.
Both are groups of people taking risks for kicks. One for money the other for partying in general.
They are intentionally going to the bar - yes. They don't necessarily understand the risk. They maybe don't think they'll get it. And lots of young people think that if they do get it then the disease won't kill them. That is not slightly different then let's *intentionally* infect each other.
Last edited by malchior on Thu Jul 02, 2020 11:35 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Punisher wrote: Thu Jul 02, 2020 11:24 pmWhy does testing stop being of value after 7 days?
If it takes 7 days to get a result, there's no way to realistically break the chain of infection and try to start running down their contacts and ideally get to those people before they are potentially spreading it to others.
In short, when the test results take that long, all you're doing is confirming a doctor's diagnosis. You're not able to proactively go out into a community and stop spread.
So there's value (in the bigger picture) but in terms of helping us slow down a localized outbreak? No so much.
Inslee has put the kibosh on all further reopening in WA state and instituted mandatory mask wearing indoors as well. a few counties are looking like they might regress a phase - i'd like to see the likes of Yakima go to Phase 0 'shelter in place'.
Kraken wrote: Thu Jul 02, 2020 10:09 pm
MA is going ahead with stage 3. Despite the national disaster, our numbers are still trending good. I was not consulted.
Museums are the only thing opening that tempt me. I would love to spend a weekend in the Berkshires, and theater and museums are what we do there. Theater's still off the table, but museums can easily fill 2-3 days. Unfortunately, life's getting in the way in other ways that make this seem impossible.
We got take out from a Chinese restaraunt in Worcester this evening. While going in to pick it up I noticed that they had people dining outdoors, which wasn't surprising. I was surprised that they also had a few people dining indoors - apparently with limited capacity. Still a big no thank you for me.
I picked up takeout at an Italian place tonight. They had half a dozen tables filled outside and none inside, but a good number to to-go orders queued up. Massholes are not reverting to normal.
I'm still not going to do inside dining but want to go outdoors another time or two before the weather tanks. A few places are doing it well. Others just have picnic tables in their parking lots.
Kraken wrote: Thu Jul 02, 2020 10:09 pm
MA is going ahead with stage 3. Despite the national disaster, our numbers are still trending good. I was not consulted.
Museums are the only thing opening that tempt me. I would love to spend a weekend in the Berkshires, and theater and museums are what we do there. Theater's still off the table, but museums can easily fill 2-3 days. Unfortunately, life's getting in the way in other ways that make this seem impossible.
We got take out from a Chinese restaraunt in Worcester this evening. While going in to pick it up I noticed that they had people dining outdoors, which wasn't surprising. I was surprised that they also had a few people dining indoors - apparently with limited capacity. Still a big no thank you for me.
I picked up takeout at an Italian place tonight. They had half a dozen tables filled outside and none inside, but a good number to to-go orders queued up. Massholes are not reverting to normal.
I'm still not going to do inside dining but want to go outdoors another time or two before the weather tanks. A few places are doing it well. Others just have picnic tables in their parking lots.
FWIW the place's outdoor dining was well set up - good tables, lots of distance in between. So I'd have been comfortable eating outside there.
Ralph-Wiggum wrote: Thu Jul 02, 2020 9:45 pm
The governor of SC announced that we're moving to Phase 2 on Monday, so I guess that means everything is good here!
Um, unless I missed something, we moved to Phase 2 on May 11. It was a Monday....maybe you saw an old press release?
LordMortis wrote: Thu Jul 02, 2020 6:38 pm
How does he sleep at night? With visions of AIDS epidemics dancing in his head?
I'm convinced that this administration ignoring public-health science is a specific, targeted gift to right-wing Christians, who are still capable of seeing diseases, weather, and natural disasters as part of God's specific action in the world.
When Trump says the virus will just "disappear" (as he did months ago and absurdly again *this week*), he's invoking that faith. And the modern version doesn't even posit that illness or death is a punishment, as it might have been in the Middle Ages; it's just that God's plan is larger than us and we simply have to accept it.
All of this is ultimately in the service of rejection of science, elites, and government, and it trends towards ever-more-explicit theocracy.
Have you read Sarah Kendzior's Hiding in Plain Sight? I think they all know exactly what they're doing, and this is all part of the 1% power/money grab.
Ralph-Wiggum wrote: Thu Jul 02, 2020 9:45 pm
The governor of SC announced that we're moving to Phase 2 on Monday, so I guess that means everything is good here!
Um, unless I missed something, we moved to Phase 2 on May 11. It was a Monday....maybe you saw an old press release?
Whoops - this is what I get for reading emails too quickly. The Department of Natural Resources (where I work) is moving to phase 2, which means the office buildings/labs can be occupied at 75% capacity. The maximum occupancy had previously been set at 25%. I have no idea what their justification for doing this now is, since everything is trending in the wrong direction; I assume there must be pressure from higher up.
We have a reservation to eat at a restaurant in town on the 18th (since it's my birthday).
We actually haven't done anything just the two of us since our son was born in November so it'll be a breath of fresh air to be able to go out and enjoy something different even if it's going to be a bit weird with the social distancing and the masks.
People are complaining that we're reopening a bit fast in Quebec but we're down to single digits to sometimes 15-20 deaths per day so as long as people keep being careful I think we'll be fine, at least until September when the big surge of kids going back to school happens.
Isgrimnur wrote:
His name makes me think of a small, burrowing rodent anyway.
Smoove_B wrote: Thu Jul 02, 2020 11:20 pm
This coming weekend has potential to really kick this off to a whole new level.
When I came home from work yesterday my street was filled with parked cars with California plates - my next door neighbor has a bunch of family in town visiting for the weekend. I have a feeling the the Fourth of July is going to result in a lot of social gatherings and, in two weeks, a whole lot of new cases.
Not intentional spread, but an outbreak at University of Washington fraternity houses has been identified:
More than 100 students living in fraternity houses near the University of Washington campus have reported testing positive for COVID-19, with hundreds of results pending. The Interfraternity Council, a student-led governing board for UW fraternities, said that at least 105 residents living in 15 fraternity houses have self-reported that they tested positive, CBS affiliate KIRO-TV reports.
The university learned Saturday that some fraternity residents had symptoms of COVID-19, and public health officials noticed a spike in cases among people ages 18 to 20, according to university spokeswoman Michelle Ma.
Of note:
Dr. Charles Lockwood, the senior vice president of University of South Florida Health, has administered more than 300 coronavirus tests and is alarmed by the spike among young people.
"It really is consistent with what we've been observing, which is incredible noncompliance with wearing face masks, social distancing, particularly among young adults and teenagers," he said.
Lockwood recognized that young people have "a different way of looking at life."
"The problem is that while you may not die and you may not even know you're sick, you may be killing other people," he said.
Sweden's prime minister has ordered an inquiry into the country's decision not to impose a coronavirus lockdown after the country suffered thousands more deaths than its closest neighbours.
"We have thousands of dead," Swedish prime minister Stefan Lofven said at a press conference on Wednesday, while admitting that the country's handling had exposed Sweden's "shortcomings," The Times of London reported.
"Now the question is how Sweden should change, not if."
Unlike most other European countries, including its closest neighbours, Sweden did not implement strict, wholesale lockdown measures in response to the pandemic. Instead, the country has largely allowed businesses and hospitality to remain open and students to attend school.
Sweden's prime minister has ordered an inquiry into the country's decision not to impose a coronavirus lockdown after the country suffered thousands more deaths than its closest neighbours.
"We have thousands of dead," Swedish prime minister Stefan Lofven said at a press conference on Wednesday, while admitting that the country's handling had exposed Sweden's "shortcomings," The Times of London reported.
"Now the question is how Sweden should change, not if."
Unlike most other European countries, including its closest neighbours, Sweden did not implement strict, wholesale lockdown measures in response to the pandemic. Instead, the country has largely allowed businesses and hospitality to remain open and students to attend school.
Yeah. When looking at the death tolls of Finland, Norway and Denmark it's pretty clear that we failed to protect our risk groups (elders in particular). I think the biggest changes will come to elder care and security routines/testing of hospital personell and patients.
Elder care has not worked well here for decades. Much of it has to do with how it is organized (very decentralized in an already small country) and this pandemic made it embarrasingly clear just how vulnerable our nursing homes are to contagion.
I don't know what the verdict will be in regards to society at large though (less restricted lockdowns, keeping schools and pre-schools open). But it's pretty clear that there are severe logistics and competency issues with the elder care sector.
EDIT: The reason why cases has gone up recently has to do with mass testing kicking off, though. Death rates and ICU rates have declined for weeks. Not sure why international media fails to report this in regards to Sweden. The discussion over here has more the character of evaluating what went wrong in the early stages of the pandemic and how death rates can be further lowered. But it's not as if the crisis is getting worse currently.
But you've seen who's in heaven
Is there anyone in hell?
"Lagom you are a smooth tongued devil, and an opportunistic monster" - OOWW Game Club
Lagom Lite wrote: Fri Jul 03, 2020 5:20 pmYeah. When looking at the death tolls of Finland, Norway and Denmark it's pretty clear that we failed to protect our risk groups (elders in particular). I think the biggest changes will come to elder care and security routines/testing of hospital personell and patients.
Elder care has not worked well here for decades. Much of it has to do with how it is organized (very decentralized in an already small country) and this pandemic made it embarrasingly clear just how vulnerable our nursing homes are to contagion.
This was the major problem in my home state of New Jersey. Our government has basically have turned a blind eye to horrible, incompetent nursing home conditions for years. When this kicked off, we didn't even have a check-in with nursing homes until they found large numbers of bodies stashed in one. On top, we adopted policies to protect hospital capacity that put sick people back into these terrible conditions and might have been responsible for killing a lot of elder's here.
I don't know what the verdict will be in regards to society at large though (less restricted lockdowns, keeping schools and pre-schools open). But it's pretty clear that there are severe logistics and competency issues with the elder care sector.
EDIT: The reason why cases has gone up recently has to do with mass testing kicking off, though. Death rates and ICU rates have declined for weeks. Not sure why international media fails to report this in regards to Sweden. The discussion over here has more the character of evaluating what went wrong in the early stages of the pandemic and how death rates can be further lowered. But it's not as if the crisis is getting worse currently.
I think it is because at least here in the States, Sweden is often touted as a reason that lock downs were unnecessary or an alternate approach that worked. So when the 'example' for less prescriptive measures weighs in at 5th worst per capita death rate it is in some ways a cautionary tale.
malchior wrote: Fri Jul 03, 2020 7:20 pmI think it is because at least here in the States, Sweden is often touted as a reason that lock downs were unnecessary or an alternate approach that worked. So when the 'example' for less prescriptive measures weighs in at 5th worst per capita death rate it is in some ways a cautionary tale.
You could still make that argument without being untruthful. Lying about things only hurts your credibility, no?
But you've seen who's in heaven
Is there anyone in hell?
"Lagom you are a smooth tongued devil, and an opportunistic monster" - OOWW Game Club
malchior wrote: Fri Jul 03, 2020 7:20 pmI think it is because at least here in the States, Sweden is often touted as a reason that lock downs were unnecessary or an alternate approach that worked. So when the 'example' for less prescriptive measures weighs in at 5th worst per capita death rate it is in some ways a cautionary tale.
You could still make that argument without being untruthful. Lying about things only hurts your credibility, no?
Your outlook is so refreshing. You're embarrassed and concerned about truth and credibility. Hey America, remember when we felt that?
malchior wrote: Fri Jul 03, 2020 7:20 pmI think it is because at least here in the States, Sweden is often touted as a reason that lock downs were unnecessary or an alternate approach that worked. So when the 'example' for less prescriptive measures weighs in at 5th worst per capita death rate it is in some ways a cautionary tale.
You could still make that argument without being untruthful. Lying about things only hurts your credibility, no?
Right and as Formix alludes to our politics are so broken that we have different factions tossing around Sweden as some example that proves out their position by distorting some aspect. No one here cares about the truth. Credibility doesn't matter anymore. If they are of your tribe, they are to be believed. Everyone else is an enemy.
In the abstract though, early on when Sweden charted its course it was at the time pointed out by some experts to be riskier. That turned out to be true. Not in the caricature way that the various 'talking heads' here talk about it as inevitable. It more so it exposed issues you didn't have a handle on. Otherwise, it probably would have worked. So it is good that your PM recognized this as something to drive learning. In comparison, we aren't interested in any of that here because our President is a walking, talking trash can of a human soul who says we are just going to have to 'live with it'. YOLO!
Was just fishing at a spot opposite an island beach that can only be reached by swimming or boating across a small estuary. Got there earlyish (9:30) in the hope that it would be pretty empty, but it was not to be. The beach already had boats of three or four families and one group of about five 20 year olds. But over the course of the two hours I was there, one member of the 20 year old group kept ferrying more people across the estuary to join them. By the time I left the group had expanded to at least 50 people, all interacting with no mask and no social distancing. Considering this was on a relatively hard to reach island beach, I can’t imagine what it looks like on beaches that people can drive to. We’re fucked.
Zaxxon wrote: Tue Jun 30, 2020 5:00 pm
The Atlantic continues to rock it with their coverage. This one is a detailed look at the US government reaction to COVID-19 from the perspective of an NTSB air crash investigation.
Spoiler: Trump fucked it all up, as anyone paying attention already knew. Seeing it all laid out at once is still sobering, though.
I just got around to reading this in detail today. This piece alone should be the end of his Presidency. That our system doesn't have a workable circuit breaker for someone as unsuitable as Trump should give us a lot to think about after he is gone.
malchior wrote: Sat Jul 04, 2020 12:53 pm That our system doesn't have a workable circuit breaker for someone as unsuitable as Trump should give us a lot to think about after he is gone.
We really need to have some serious discussions after January and I can only hope whatever elected officials remain aren't going to cock-block real change because their cult tells them to do so.
All of the info I've been reading (national, international) from 3rd party public health organizations is saying they cannot believe how severely they collectively didn't consider just how much politics were going to influence emergency response to a pandemic. I said it early on from my own experience - nothing at all like this was part of any tabletop exercise I've ever been in; it was unthinkable.
