That is not dead which can eternal lie, and with strange aeons bring us some web forums whereupon we can gather
http://garbi.online/forum/
Maybe, just maybe, if we can keep masks and social distancing a "thing" we can whittle down the 30,000+ deaths the regular Flu claims each year, too.
There's billions of dollars invested in social closeness, sporting events, movie theatres, theme parks, cruise lines, work spaces, so the first thing that will happen if/when we reach herd immunity is that we'll get back to being able to be next to one another. Masks though could become (and are in some countries) routine. If I leave the house, I'm wearing a mask all the time, no matter what. I hate being sick.
Nope, here in LA aggravated assault and murders are way up.
Millions of US citizens think theres not much flu because the Gov doesn't have time to fake it with all the work in faking the COVID 19 scare taking their time.Absolutely astounding to see this.
It's complicated. Some crimes have changed. Some crimes are down (social crime - the stuff that happens in the streets.) Arrests are down. But other crimes are up - cyber crimes, domestic violence, child abuse. And new crimes have been born (there wasn't much of a counterfeit PPE racket prior to 2020.)
Record number of murders here for 2020.
Car jackings are up here, huge. January was up 300% over January last year. 2020 had the most in over 20 years. Gang wars are on.Blackhawk wrote: Mon Feb 08, 2021 1:56 pmIt's complicated. Some crimes have changed. Some crimes are down (social crime - the stuff that happens in the streets.) Arrests are down. But other crimes are up - cyber crimes, domestic violence, child abuse. And new crimes have been born (there wasn't much of a counterfeit PPE racket prior to 2020.)
2020 Totals (vs 2019)
Shot & Killed: 719 (+55%)
Shot & Wounded: 3455(+51%)
Total Shot: 4174 (+52%)
Total Homicides: 792 (+53%)
I mean ... like ... how the hell do people live there? I'm very isolated and insulated from the world at large, living in 95% white rural Maine. Things up here are almost static. The concept of gang wars is insane. The only gunshots I ever hear are from my neighbor's gun ranges. Car jacking only takes place when you get a flat.LawBeefaroni wrote: Mon Feb 08, 2021 9:24 pmCar jackings are up here, huge. January was up 300% over January last year. 2020 had the most in over 20 years. Gang wars are on.
I suspect they eke out a Road Warrior-esque existence in an enigmatic boardgaming compound led by Hepagello.Paingod wrote: Tue Feb 09, 2021 9:50 amI mean ... like ... how the hell do people live there? I'm very isolated and insulated from the world at large, living in 95% white rural Maine. Things up here are almost static. The concept of gang wars is insane. The only gunshots I ever hear are from my neighbor's gun ranges. Car jacking only takes place when you get a flat.LawBeefaroni wrote: Mon Feb 08, 2021 9:24 pmCar jackings are up here, huge. January was up 300% over January last year. 2020 had the most in over 20 years. Gang wars are on.
My mom is going for her COVID shot at a University of Chicago facility tomorrow, and she's leaving everything but her ID and $20 at home because of all the carjackings.
Yes, but I'm starting to suspect it mostly an excuse for hepcat to break out his bondage gear.Anonymous Bosch wrote: Tue Feb 09, 2021 1:19 pmI suspect they eke out a Road Warrior-esque existence in an enigmatic boardgaming compound led by Hepagello.Paingod wrote: Tue Feb 09, 2021 9:50 amI mean ... like ... how the hell do people live there? I'm very isolated and insulated from the world at large, living in 95% white rural Maine. Things up here are almost static. The concept of gang wars is insane. The only gunshots I ever hear are from my neighbor's gun ranges. Car jacking only takes place when you get a flat.LawBeefaroni wrote: Mon Feb 08, 2021 9:24 pmCar jackings are up here, huge. January was up 300% over January last year. 2020 had the most in over 20 years. Gang wars are on.
Maine's got a nice "city" in Portland. Lots of good food options there, some culture (music, museums, sports, etc), and a far more diverse array of humans than I see out in the woods (lots of immigrants end up here). I lived there for years before moving and never felt unsafe, even walking the "bad" parts of town at 1:00am on my way home from a friend's house. They had "gangs" but it was just sad wanna-be's who defaced property with tags and did little else.ImLawBoy wrote: Tue Feb 09, 2021 2:48 pmAnd there are benefits to big city living. I'm betting our tacos and pizzas are waaaay better (and much more plentiful) than what you get in rural Maine. We have lots of attractions - cultural, sports, etc. (Ignore the pandemic for a moment.) I've got 5-10 places brewing beer within a mile or so of my house. There are more jobs here. My kids are exposed to more than just 95% white people. I almost never see a Trump sign.
Keep in mind that Portland's population is ~66K, and its demographic breakdown is 85% white, 7.1% Black, 3.5% Asian, and 3% Hispanic/Latino (falls into other races). Chicago's population is ~2.6M, with demographics of 45% white, 33% Black, 5.5% Asian, and 29% Hispanic/Latino. (Numbers are 2010 Census taken off of Wikipedia.) It's not really fair to compare the food, culture, diversity, or safety of the cities, as they're playing in different leagues.Paingod wrote: Tue Feb 09, 2021 2:58 pmMaine's got a nice "city" in Portland. Lots of good food options there, some culture (music, museums, sports, etc), and a far more diverse array of humans than I see out in the woods (lots of immigrants end up here). I lived there for years before moving and never felt unsafe, even walking the "bad" parts of town at 1:00am on my way home from a friend's house. They had "gangs" but it was just sad wanna-be's who defaced property with tags and did little else.ImLawBoy wrote: Tue Feb 09, 2021 2:48 pmAnd there are benefits to big city living. I'm betting our tacos and pizzas are waaaay better (and much more plentiful) than what you get in rural Maine. We have lots of attractions - cultural, sports, etc. (Ignore the pandemic for a moment.) I've got 5-10 places brewing beer within a mile or so of my house. There are more jobs here. My kids are exposed to more than just 95% white people. I almost never see a Trump sign.
https://www.pewresearch.org/social-tren ... e-mothers/LawBeefaroni wrote: Fri Jan 22, 2021 1:11 pmStating the reality of the time isn't sexist. I grew up in liberated hippie land and it was still the norm for moms to be at home.Zarathud wrote: Fri Jan 22, 2021 11:58 am Your experience was not the norm for the 60s/70s/80s. My working neighborhood was full of moms and kids roaming the neighborhood under their supervision. Classic TV shows were more than just sexist mythology.
The stats bear me out, and not just in the US:
BBC Raising Children
I’m not saying it’s ideal or right. But the neighborhood gossip about kids did exist.
Having a parent at home, be it mom or dad, makes a difference. The reality is that back in the day it was moms.
Well... sure. Encasing your head in cement also does a better job of limiting transmission than wearing a single mask.
Every time I read something like that, I feel like people have simply decided to try and keep "just enough" COVID around so it persists in being a problem but "not enough" that it's completely overwhelming the hospitals.Sudy wrote: Thu Feb 11, 2021 2:56 amOntario's managed to drop our daily cases from a peak around 4,000 last month to only 1,000, so guess what, we're opening things back up!
The good news is that if you're looking for an N95, several of the companies in the article are providing direct sales from their websites.These businesses must overcome the ingrained purchasing habits of hospital systems, medical supply distributors and state governments. Many buyers are loath to try the new crop of American-made masks, which are often a bit more expensive than those produced in China. Another obstacle comes from companies like Facebook and Google, which banned the sale and advertising of N95 masks in an effort to thwart profiteers from diverting vital medical gear needed by frontline medical workers.
FWIW, I've been double masking for a few weeks now, and my only issue is that the extra loops around my ears leave less room for my glasses, so they fall off more. I've had no issues with breathing at all, and I was pleasantly surprised that it wasn't any less comfortable than wearing a single mask. My wife took my daughter (6 years old) to a doctor appointment yesterday, and they also both double-masked without issue. We use a paper mask underneath and a cloth mask on top.Sudy wrote: Thu Feb 11, 2021 2:56 am My masked, fat self was literally close to collapsing after carrying 40 pounds of groceries home the other day. I'm not complaining, but it seems like maybe we should be improving masks before recommending people throw two on. (Which no one is doing at this point, but that doesn't mean news like this won't push people to do so, and look down on those who don't.)
I double-mask when I expect to be indoors among strangers for any length of time -- which mostly means at the grocer. On the plus side, my glasses fog up less due to having a better seal. On the downside, I have to speak louder to be heard. That's a minor inconvenience since I only have to talk at the deli and fish counters, and sometimes at the checkout. For routine use when I'm not going shopping, I wear a cloth mask with a paper filter insert, so I've still got three layers.ImLawBoy wrote: Thu Feb 11, 2021 10:37 amFWIW, I've been double masking for a few weeks now, and my only issue is that the extra loops around my ears leave less room for my glasses, so they fall off more. I've had no issues with breathing at all, and I was pleasantly surprised that it wasn't any less comfortable than wearing a single mask. My wife took my daughter (6 years old) to a doctor appointment yesterday, and they also both double-masked without issue. We use a paper mask underneath and a cloth mask on top.Sudy wrote: Thu Feb 11, 2021 2:56 am My masked, fat self was literally close to collapsing after carrying 40 pounds of groceries home the other day. I'm not complaining, but it seems like maybe we should be improving masks before recommending people throw two on. (Which no one is doing at this point, but that doesn't mean news like this won't push people to do so, and look down on those who don't.)
Realistically though, and I'm quite certain Smoove would back me up on this, the main problem with the mask(s) most people are wearing -- in terms of providing much, if any, protection for the wearer -- boils down to how tightly they fit. If most of the air you breathe in comes from around the edges of the mask instead of being filtered through it, the protection it provides the wearer is negligible even while wearing more than one (though they would at least limit one's emission of respiratory droplets). That's the primary reason why N95 masks tend to provide superior protection for the wearer: because they usually fit a WHOLE lot tighter, making breathing more difficult but more likely to be properly filtered through the mask itself.ImLawBoy wrote: Thu Feb 11, 2021 10:37 amFWIW, I've been double masking for a few weeks now, and my only issue is that the extra loops around my ears leave less room for my glasses, so they fall off more. I've had no issues with breathing at all, and I was pleasantly surprised that it wasn't any less comfortable than wearing a single mask. My wife took my daughter (6 years old) to a doctor appointment yesterday, and they also both double-masked without issue. We use a paper mask underneath and a cloth mask on top.Sudy wrote: Thu Feb 11, 2021 2:56 am My masked, fat self was literally close to collapsing after carrying 40 pounds of groceries home the other day. I'm not complaining, but it seems like maybe we should be improving masks before recommending people throw two on. (Which no one is doing at this point, but that doesn't mean news like this won't push people to do so, and look down on those who don't.)
Sudy wrote: Thu Feb 11, 2021 2:56 amWell... sure. Encasing your head in cement also does a better job of limiting transmission than wearing a single mask.
My masked, fat self was literally close to collapsing after carrying 40 pounds of groceries home the other day. I'm not complaining, but it seems like maybe we should be improving masks before recommending people throw two on. (Which no one is doing at this point, but that doesn't mean news like this won't push people to do so, and look down on those who don't.)
Have you looked at any of the "ear saver" options? Typically, they are some sort of band that hooks onto the ear loops so that the mask doesn't need to rely on the ears to stay in place.Jeff V wrote: Thu Feb 11, 2021 10:52 am My daughter has problems with a single mask...her ears are too floppy and they just don't do a good job keeping the loops from slipping right off. FWIW, the double-mask advice is for those who have problems getting a single one to fit properly.
In related news…Anonymous Bosch wrote: Thu Feb 11, 2021 11:23 amRealistically though, and I'm quite certain Smoove would back me up on this, the main problem with the mask(s) most people are wearing -- in terms of providing much, if any, protection for the wearer -- boils down to how tightly they fit. If most of the air you breathe in comes from around the edges of the mask instead of being filtered through it, the protection it provides the wearer is negligible even while wearing more than one (though they would at least limit one's emission of respiratory droplets). That's the primary reason why N95 masks tend to provide superior protection for the wearer: because they usually fit a WHOLE lot tighter, making breathing more difficult but more likely to be properly filtered through the mask itself.ImLawBoy wrote: Thu Feb 11, 2021 10:37 amFWIW, I've been double masking for a few weeks now, and my only issue is that the extra loops around my ears leave less room for my glasses, so they fall off more. I've had no issues with breathing at all, and I was pleasantly surprised that it wasn't any less comfortable than wearing a single mask. My wife took my daughter (6 years old) to a doctor appointment yesterday, and they also both double-masked without issue. We use a paper mask underneath and a cloth mask on top.Sudy wrote: Thu Feb 11, 2021 2:56 am My masked, fat self was literally close to collapsing after carrying 40 pounds of groceries home the other day. I'm not complaining, but it seems like maybe we should be improving masks before recommending people throw two on. (Which no one is doing at this point, but that doesn't mean news like this won't push people to do so, and look down on those who don't.)
Metaphorically, it's not much different to the sliding scale between security and convenience in terms of password hygiene:
So wearing a comfortable mask or masks that do not significantly impair breathing is akin to using something like password123 for all of your digital security needs. More convenient, but a whole lot less secure.
medicalxpress.com wrote:It's known that face masks help protect against COVID-19 infection, but U.S. health officials said Wednesday that the tighter the mask, the better.
In lab experiments, wearing cloth or medical masks close to the face cut COVID transmission by 95%, according to a new report from the U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention.
"These laboratory-based experiments highlight the importance of good fit to maximize overall mask performance," wrote the researchers, led by Dr. John Brooks, of the CDC's COVID-19 Emergency Response Team.
"There are multiple simple ways to achieve better fit of masks to more effectively slow the spread of COVID-19," the researchers noted.
Using dummies, the CDC team tested two methods to prevent air leakage from the mask's edges: double masking (wearing a cloth mask over a medical mask) and knotting and tucking masks. For this, they knotted the ear loops of a medical mask at the mask edges and tucked in and flattened any extra material close to the face.
When people wear tight-fitting masks, infection could be slashed, experiments showed.
"I would rather people focus on finding one quality mask that meets the mark, versus trying to layer masks and create discomfort, difficulty breathing … or frustration that might lead to no mask at all," Saskia Popescu, an infectious disease epidemiologist at George Mason University in Virginia, told the Washington Post.
David Rothamer, an engineering professor at the University of Wisconsin-Madison, has experimented with masks on mannequins in classrooms while studying the best ways to prevent the spread of the virus in college classes. He told the Post that he is not a proponent of double masking because it consumes more masks and can lead to more air leakage.
"The only reason to [wear two masks] is if you can get better fit," he said.
Two other ways to improve fit, the CDC researchers said, include use of a mask fitter (a fitted plastic frame for a mask) or wearing a nylon covering over your mask.
Unlike N95 respirator masks, cloth masks and surgical or medical masks fit loosely, allowing respiratory droplets to escape, the researchers explained. They are not intended to block airborne particles.
By controlling the spread of aerosol drops, the mask experiments showed that an infected person is less likely to transmit COVID, while a non-infected person is less likely to become infected.
maybe this goes in the other thread, but why do they always mention "cloth over medical"? why not two cloth ones?Anonymous Bosch wrote: Thu Feb 11, 2021 12:21 pm
Tight-fitting masks can slash COVID transmission by 95%, CDC says
Using dummies, the CDC team tested two methods to prevent air leakage from the mask's edges: double masking (wearing a cloth mask over a medical mask) and knotting and tucking masks. For this, they knotted the ear loops of a medical mask at the mask edges and tucked in and flattened any extra material close to the face.
It's my understanding that the medical mask does a better job of filtering than multiple cloth masks, but fit too loosely for the type of filtering we want them to do. It's better to think of it as wearing a medical mask with a cloth mask tightener that just happens to add a bit more protection.hitbyambulance wrote: Thu Feb 11, 2021 3:46 pmmaybe this goes in the other thread, but why do they always mention "cloth over medical"? why not two cloth ones?Anonymous Bosch wrote: Thu Feb 11, 2021 12:21 pm
Tight-fitting masks can slash COVID transmission by 95%, CDC says
Using dummies, the CDC team tested two methods to prevent air leakage from the mask's edges: double masking (wearing a cloth mask over a medical mask) and knotting and tucking masks. For this, they knotted the ear loops of a medical mask at the mask edges and tucked in and flattened any extra material close to the face.
from the other thread:Blackhawk wrote: Thu Feb 11, 2021 4:10 pmIt's my understanding that the medical mask does a better job of filtering than multiple cloth masks, but fit too loosely for the type of filtering we want them to do. It's better to think of it as wearing a medical mask with a cloth mask tightener that just happens to add a bit more protection.hitbyambulance wrote: Thu Feb 11, 2021 3:46 pmmaybe this goes in the other thread, but why do they always mention "cloth over medical"? why not two cloth ones?Anonymous Bosch wrote: Thu Feb 11, 2021 12:21 pm
Tight-fitting masks can slash COVID transmission by 95%, CDC says
Using dummies, the CDC team tested two methods to prevent air leakage from the mask's edges: double masking (wearing a cloth mask over a medical mask) and knotting and tucking masks. For this, they knotted the ear loops of a medical mask at the mask edges and tucked in and flattened any extra material close to the face.
three-ply cloth = 44%CDC conducted experiments last month to test the effectiveness of mask combinations at reducing the amount of particles released during a cough. A three-ply surgical mask blocked 42% of particles from a simulated cough, and a three-ply cloth mask blocked 44%. But a cloth mask covering a medical mask blocked 92% of the particles, the report said.
You can also mimic a so-called "hybrid" mask by combining two layers of 600-thread-count cotton mask paired with another material like silk, chiffon, or flannel — an April study found such masks filtered at least 94% of small particles and at least 96% of larger particles, Business Insider's Aria Bendix and Yuqing Liu previously reported.