Octopus Overlords

Posted: **Fri Mar 11, 2011 11:50 am**

Unagi wrote:No one has answered my question:
Did stessier lie about not reading the Theohall Kill Write-Up, or was he being honest.

Seriously, I think if you read this game there are things that show that stessier, Scoop, and I are NOT teamed with Lassr (and more to the point in Stessier, I think he simply isn't a Villain)

Sorry, I didn't comment about that but I did think it was a good point.

I honestly don't know where to throw my vote at the moment. But one thing does keep coming back to me and that is RMC putting that N-1 vote on Qantaga.

Posted: **Fri Mar 11, 2011 12:00 pm**

Scoop20906 wrote:
Unagi wrote:No one has answered my question:
Did stessier lie about not reading the Theohall Kill Write-Up, or was he being honest.

Seriously, I think if you read this game there are things that show that stessier, Scoop, and I are NOT teamed with Lassr (and more to the point in Stessier, I think he simply isn't a Villain)
Sorry, I didn't comment about that but I did think it was a good point.

I honestly don't know where to throw my vote at the moment. But one thing does keep coming back to me and that is RMC putting that N-1 vote on Qantaga.

Well I can tell you honestly I did not really think about what place I was putting the vote on someone. I waited and listened to the arguments, and placed the vote. After everyone had chimed in, I switched my vote to Tru1cy, as the arguments pointed away from Qantaga. And I have not really went back to him. <shrug> I really see now that I was too eager to put place votes and did not consider how it might be construed.

I still Say that Scoop is putting a lot of time and effort to ensure that no one looks to everyone but him, and the fact that I played into this actually makes me appreciate how good at being evil Scoop is.

I still vote for Scoop, but I can not really lay out anything to refute most of this as I played right into scoops hands throughout this time. <shrug> And while Scoop likes to point out that I have used the Newb excuse, I can't help but point out that it is true.

Posted: **Fri Mar 11, 2011 12:10 pm**

Scoop20906 wrote:

I certainly don't think I was attempting to setup RMC.

I meant that you and RMC had that exchange setup behind the scenes. Reading RMC's vote post certainly wouldn't have made me think the first thing I should do is run out and find a funny picture about betrayal. I mean - betrayal only happens between teammates, right?

Posted: **Fri Mar 11, 2011 12:19 pm**

stessier wrote:
Scoop20906 wrote:

I certainly don't think I was attempting to setup RMC.
I meant that you and RMC had that exchange setup behind the scenes. Reading RMC's vote post certainly wouldn't have made me think the first thing I should do is run out and find a funny picture about betrayal. I mean - betrayal only happens between teammates, right?

Hey, that would have been great if it were true.

I know when I have played evil in the past I usually just go into "scoop" mode and ignore my partners. I'm too fearful of showing some kind of preference to them.

No, the thing with RMC has been totally one of his own doing. He keeps using me as a reason for whatever he has done and following me around like a puppy dog and except now he is starting to look like an evil foul smelling chubacapra. I feel like he has been trying to set me up this entire game.

The odd thing is both Stessier (unknown) and Lassr (evil) made comments about it.

Posted: **Fri Mar 11, 2011 12:20 pm**

stessier wrote:
Scoop20906 wrote:

I certainly don't think I was attempting to setup RMC.
I meant that you and RMC had that exchange setup behind the scenes. Reading RMC's vote post certainly wouldn't have made me think the first thing I should do is run out and find a funny picture about betrayal. I mean - betrayal only happens between teammates, right?

And stessier, of course there is the overriding concept here that we are all British Spies and 'teamed' in that way.

Right?

I took Scoop's use of 'betrayal' as being "Ohh, you've been praising my superior logic this whole game, how 'inevitable' for you to now say I'm just evil".

You think that Scoop and RMC 'setup' the use of the Firefly t-shirt. That it was all staged?
Wow.

Do people, EVER do that behind the scenes? Hell - when I was teamed with Scoop (Evil), long ago, he wanted to pay very little attention to the Wolf forum, so as not to be distracted by it - said it would mess with his style.

Posted: **Fri Mar 11, 2011 12:21 pm**

Scoop20906 wrote:I know when I have played evil in the past I usually just go into "scoop" mode and ignore my partners. I'm too fearful of showing some kind of preference to them.

HA!
see!

Posted: **Fri Mar 11, 2011 12:24 pm**

Ok, Unagi. I'm leaning to you being good. I'm not so sure about the rest so let talk votes.

How do you feel about a vote for RMC today? He is the one common player amongst all the scenarios running through my head. A Lassr, Stessier, Unagi baddie trio feels unlikely to me.

Posted: **Fri Mar 11, 2011 12:28 pm**

Unagi wrote:
Scoop20906 wrote:I know when I have played evil in the past I usually just go into "scoop" mode and ignore my partners. I'm too fearful of showing some kind of preference to them.
HA!
see!

You think you got something?

Posted: **Fri Mar 11, 2011 12:28 pm**

Unagi wrote:And, to stessier, regarding Qantaga.
1) your huge defense of him created some 'stessier is a bad-guy noise' that was/is hard to see through. (even as 'Stessier=Bad' trying to earn 'Qantaga=Good' trust, or something...) you shouldn't do that.

Why in the world would Q ever trust me for that? I'm not defending him - I'm pointing out all the reasons why it makes no sense that Q is a wolf. A wolf could do that as easily as a human.

2) it's really a mistake to think that an event that led to a player 'gettting out of the noose' actually proves them to be innocent, they could just be wise - and good at this.

It's also illuminating to me how hard you are pushing against this when a perusal of the vote shows how unlikely a Bad Q is.

Code: Select all

Scoop acc Qantaga (1)
   [*]tru1cy acc Qantaga (2)
      msteelers acc Qantaga (3)
         Lassr acc Qantaga (4)
            RMC acc Qantaga (5)

Unagi / stessier post at N-1 ... Chaos/Grund/Remus do not

            RMC wd Qantaga (4)
         Lassr WD Qantaga (3)
      Scoop wd Qantaga (2)
   msteelers wd Qantaga (1)

Before people started peeling off, we had two unknowns and 1 Baddie on the vote: Scoop, Lassr, RMC

Right now, I know there are 2 Baddies in {Q, Scoop, RMC, Unagi}. If Q is Bad, then there is 1 more in {Scoop, RMC, Unagi}. Lassr was on at N-2 and was not the first to pull his vote off. Hence, Lassr didn't care if Q died. I believe that means Q is either Good or the Zerker as there was absolutely no reason to put the other guy forward that day. If he were the Zerker and Scoop or RMC were his partner, he should have just self voted and ended it. If Unagi was his partner, Unagi had more than enough opportunity to end it. But nothing happened. People peeled off and moved on to the next vote. I just can't believe Q is bad and nothing happens on that vote.

More likely to me is that either all three Baddies were already on it trying to kill a Good Guy, or Unagi didn't want to draw attention to himself as the last vote. And that is the sticking point, because I can see both being the case quite easily.

And, I know this is self serving, but I'm amazed that anyone could re-read this game and think that Lassr and I were on a team. He tried to snare me in a number of stupid things, and I actually pushed back and was willing for it to bite him (example would be his hyper-accusational tone when I mentioned the post that looked like I was 'protected', or when I called him out for pretending there was stuff to 'catch up with'.)

See, that does nothing for me. I could see Lassr making weak attacks that everyone else sees as weak to make his attackee look innocent.

I guess I am not sure what to do with the fact that Lassr put Qantaga to N-1. Sometimes villains do that, and then remove it to 'start a new trend'. Not sure what to say. It's just the only thing that seems to clear him, nothing else really.

N-2, not N-1.

Posted: **Fri Mar 11, 2011 12:30 pm**

Scoop20906 wrote:Ok, Unagi. I'm leaning to you being good. I'm not so sure about the rest so let talk votes.

How do you feel about a vote for RMC today? He is the one common player amongst all the scenarios running through my head. A Lassr, Stessier, Unagi baddie trio feels unlikely to me.

There we go.. So now Scoop is moving against me, and I have not worked with Scoop at all. I guess it makes me the perfect patsy. I was following, and it was the wrong lead to follow.

Scoop is the evil one here.

Posted: **Fri Mar 11, 2011 12:31 pm**

Scoop20906 wrote:
Unagi wrote:
Scoop20906 wrote:I know when I have played evil in the past I usually just go into "scoop" mode and ignore my partners. I'm too fearful of showing some kind of preference to them.
HA!
see!
You think you got something?

I was just humored that you brought up the same point I did.

Posted: **Fri Mar 11, 2011 12:35 pm**

RMC wrote:
Scoop20906 wrote:Ok, Unagi. I'm leaning to you being good. I'm not so sure about the rest so let talk votes.

How do you feel about a vote for RMC today? He is the one common player amongst all the scenarios running through my head. A Lassr, Stessier, Unagi baddie trio feels unlikely to me.
There we go.. So now Scoop is moving against me, and I have not worked with Scoop at all. I guess it makes me the perfect patsy. I was following, and it was the wrong lead to follow.

Scoop is the evil one here.

Just something for RMC when he plays in future games. Attaching your vote to a player (especially me for example) makes you look like a person looking for cover to hide their true intentions for a vote. Its a very wolfy position to take and you've been very lucky up to this point that someone hasn't torn you apart for it.

I'm really leaning heavily to you being one of the baddies and you are doing nothing to change my mind with posts like this.

Did I specifically ask YOU to vote with me? If not, then how can you explain how I set you up as a patsy?

Posted: **Fri Mar 11, 2011 12:36 pm**

Scoop20906 wrote:Ok, Unagi. I'm leaning to you being good. I'm not so sure about the rest so let talk votes.

How do you feel about a vote for RMC today? He is the one common player amongst all the scenarios running through my head. A Lassr, Stessier, Unagi baddie trio feels unlikely to me.

I'm fine with it.

I am serious, I am gellin on RMC and Qantaga. I will put my vote on either of them, as I think it's them.

If it will help you, and everyone - I don't mind 'making a move'.

RMC

stessier, I simply think you are wrong to put so much into the Qantaga at N-1 moment. period.

Posted: **Fri Mar 11, 2011 12:37 pm**

Scoop20906 wrote:Its a very wolfy position to take and you've been very lucky up to this point that someone hasn't torn you apart for it.

I'm done with it.

Posted: **Fri Mar 11, 2011 12:38 pm**

Unagi wrote:
Scoop20906 wrote:Qantaga (5)- Scoop (good), Truicy(good), MSteelers(good), Lassr(evil), RMC(evil??)
I'm honestly not sure what to say Scoop.

But, let's run through this, OK?

Let's just say, for the sake of argument that you, Scoop, are indeed Good.

I can see how you would look at that vote list and say, OK - since I can't see Evil1 and Evil2 putting their final votes on Evil3, without it being a planned Evil3-explosion.

Right?

And, Good-Scoop should conclude that therefor Unagi and Stessier are perhaps the other two villains.

---
Now let's look at it from stessier's seat and, again for the sake of argument, say that Stessier is indeed Good.

He should look at that same vote list and conclude that Unagi and Scoop must be the other too.

---

I, myself, Honestly looked at that list and said to myself - It's got to be stessier and Scoop that are the other two... but, I Gotta Tell Ya, there are a number of other things that really seem to take me away from that.

Um - what?

I don't understand what you are arguing here or why you are making it seem like we should ignore RMC on that vote.

Qantaga could be the zerker. They could have been OK with him to go, but still didn't want it to look like a plan. If he self voted, then the people on the vote may have looked guilty. If they let some poor Agent put the last vote on, that player may have gotten the heat puttting the zerker 'over, and then we'd perhaps lynched that player.

Alternatively, the two of them going on at the end of that vote like that (Lassr and RMC) could have helped them create and control the N-1 moment, with the intention to back off (insurance is the zerker) - so as to - (and here we are) try and clear Qantaga off our considerations.

But why would they want to clear the Zerker? Having the Zerker off the radar is the last thing Evil should want as he is useless if lynched last.

Posted: **Fri Mar 11, 2011 12:38 pm**

Unagi wrote:
Scoop20906 wrote:
Unagi wrote:
Scoop20906 wrote:I know when I have played evil in the past I usually just go into "scoop" mode and ignore my partners. I'm too fearful of showing some kind of preference to them.
HA!
see!
You think you got something?
I was just humored that you brought up the same point I did.

I think by now almost everyone knows how I play when I am evil. I'm always a lightning rod by my actions.

BTW, quick note to Newcastle: I love how today is playing out. I know I am a big champion of making out WW games more complicated with more rulez but the simple pleasure of games like this are what make these WW games so much fun. Thanks for running it.

Posted: **Fri Mar 11, 2011 12:46 pm**

Unagi wrote:
Scoop20906 wrote:Ok, Unagi. I'm leaning to you being good. I'm not so sure about the rest so let talk votes.

How do you feel about a vote for RMC today? He is the one common player amongst all the scenarios running through my head. A Lassr, Stessier, Unagi baddie trio feels unlikely to me.
I'm fine with it.

I am serious, I am gellin on RMC and Qantaga. I will put my vote on either of them, as I think it's them.

If it will help you, and everyone - I don't mind 'making a move'.

RMC

stessier, I simply think you are wrong to put so much into the Qantaga at N-1 moment. period.

Ok, Stess. Whats your thoughts on RMC? I'm in your camp about both Qantaga and RMC can't be evil and I'm not really sure why Unagi is so interested in pushing that theory. However, I think we can agree on RMC for today. How about you?

Posted: **Fri Mar 11, 2011 12:51 pm**

Ok -

Scoop - almost claimed every good role possible
Unagi - hard after Remus the day after he was protected
RMC - Scoop's lapdog and bouncing his vote any which way

The Remus thing is hard to look past, but reading it now, it might just have been an unfortunate coincidence. Or at least, I hope that's it.

So I think the last 2 are Scoop and RMC. I think Scoop's play is more likely to be called out and get him lynched that RMC's. We tend to give newbies more rope and Scoop was designed where if he did get called on it, he might expose a Special as well, which he could then blow up on. I think Scoop is the Zerker and RMC is the Leader.

RMC

Posted: **Fri Mar 11, 2011 12:52 pm**

withdraw RMC

Posted: **Fri Mar 11, 2011 12:53 pm**

Sorry, didn't see Scoop was pushing RMC.

Re-evaluating....

Posted: **Fri Mar 11, 2011 12:55 pm**

stessier wrote:Sorry, didn't see Scoop was pushing RMC.

Re-evaluating....

Posted: **Fri Mar 11, 2011 12:59 pm**

Majority is 4

Scoop20906 (1) - RMC
RMC (1) - Unagi

No votes cast: Qantaga, MSteelers, Scoop20906, Stessier, Chaosraven,

Posted: **Fri Mar 11, 2011 1:01 pm**

Wow, whoever is the remaining bad guy is doing a fantastic job (I'm already convinced that RMC is a baddie).

I'm completely stumped.

Posted: **Fri Mar 11, 2011 1:08 pm**

stessier wrote:Ok -

Scoop - almost claimed every good role possible
Unagi - hard after Remus the day after he was protected
RMC - Scoop's lapdog and bouncing his vote any which way

The Remus thing is hard to look past, but reading it now, it might just have been an unfortunate coincidence. Or at least, I hope that's it.

So I think the last 2 are Scoop and RMC. I think Scoop's play is more likely to be called out and get him lynched that RMC's. We tend to give newbies more rope and Scoop was designed where if he did get called on it, he might expose a Special as well, which he could then blow up on. I think Scoop is the Zerker and RMC is the Leader.

Stess, I have had PLENTY of opportunities to claim a role or dispute a role and then get myself and someone else blown up real good. When I was "faking" roles I was attempting to provide cover to the real specials and hopefully draw a night kill on myself. Trouble is no one ever takes me seriously.

The funny thing is the whole game people grumbled about my posts but I never had a serious bandwagon going on me. If I was the real zerker I certainly would not have done a good job, huh?

Posted: **Fri Mar 11, 2011 1:10 pm**

stessier wrote:Um - what?

I don't understand what you are arguing here or why you are making it seem like we should ignore RMC on that vote.

To understand me, you really only need to understand 3 things.

1) I have concluded, through your post on the Theohall Kill Results that you are not a villain.

2) I have concluded through a shit ton of posts that Scoop is a) not teamed with Lassr, RMC, or Qantaga

3) I happen to know that I'm not a villain.

- So I conclude that RMC and Qantaga are the last 2 villains. - Period - I don't give a rat's ass how it looks then like Evil1 (lassr) and Evil2 (RMC) put Evil3 into a state of N-1, but then the bomb never went off. I think that was done with the hopes of the outcomes I described. (either zerker kills or zerker is distanced from being teamed with Evil1 and Evil2)

Posted: **Fri Mar 11, 2011 1:14 pm**

Scoop, Unagi, RMC, Q - who do you think is Splodie?

Posted: **Fri Mar 11, 2011 1:16 pm**

Scoop20906 wrote:Wow, whoever is the remaining bad guy is doing a fantastic job (I'm already convinced that RMC is a baddie).

I'm completely stumped.

Gee, maybe it's because you REFUSE (as apparently stessier does) to think that Qantaga could be a Villain.

stessier wrote:Scoop, Unagi, RMC, Q - who do you think is Splodie?

I already said that my guess is the N-1 moment was created for Splodie. (i.e. Qantaga)

Posted: **Fri Mar 11, 2011 1:17 pm**

Unagi wrote:
stessier wrote:Scoop, Unagi, RMC, Q - who do you think is Splodie?
I already said that my guess is the N-1 moment was created for Splodie. (i.e. Qantaga)

Could you please point me to where? I think I missed that.

Posted: **Fri Mar 11, 2011 1:18 pm**

stessier wrote:Scoop, Unagi, RMC, Q - who do you think is Splodie?

In order of most likely to explode because I am not really sure:

1. RMC
2. Qantaga
3. Unagi
4. Stessier

The Qantaga thing is hard. Unagi describe a scenario where all two teammate baddies vote to put their partner at N-1. Its hard to believe but it a certainly possible scenario.

Posted: **Fri Mar 11, 2011 1:20 pm**

I think that's a valid question for each of the five to answer. How you each feel about the other four, so we can evaluate your statement and history.

Posted: **Fri Mar 11, 2011 1:25 pm**

You missed it? Or you directly quoted it?

stessier wrote:
Qantaga could be the zerker. They could have been OK with him to go, but still didn't want it to look like a plan. If he self voted, then the people on the vote may have looked guilty. If they let some poor Agent put the last vote on, that player may have gotten the heat puttting the zerker 'over, and then we'd perhaps lynched that player.

Alternatively, the two of them going on at the end of that vote like that (Lassr and RMC) could have helped them create and control the N-1 moment, with the intention to back off (insurance is the zerker) - so as to - (and here we are) try and clear Qantaga off our considerations.

stessier wrote:But why would they want to clear the Zerker? Having the Zerker off the radar is the last thing Evil should want as he is useless if lynched last.

So, you didn't miss it, stessier. I guess you forgot that you actually Read It, and had a problem with it.

It's a mistake to think that the Zerker must die. It's perfectly OK if he's not ever killed.

Posted: **Fri Mar 11, 2011 1:26 pm**

Scoop20906 wrote:
stessier wrote:Scoop, Unagi, RMC, Q - who do you think is Splodie?

In order of most likely to explode because I am not really sure:

1. RMC
2. Qantaga
3. Unagi
4. Stessier

The Qantaga thing is hard. Unagi describe a scenario where all two teammate baddies vote to put their partner at N-1. Its hard to believe but it a certainly possible scenario.

Really - you are pushing the guy you think is most likely to explode???

Posted: **Fri Mar 11, 2011 1:27 pm**

Chaosraven wrote:I think that's a valid question for each of the five to answer. How you each feel about the other four, so we can evaluate your statement and history.

Oh please don't evaluate my history. I'm not likely to have been entirely honest this whole game, and I certainly wasn't holding the opinions I hold right now, last week.

In any case, I think I've answered it...

Posted: **Fri Mar 11, 2011 1:28 pm**

Unagi wrote:It's a mistake to think that the Zerker must die. It's perfectly OK if he's not ever killed.

Huh? How do we win that way?

Posted: **Fri Mar 11, 2011 1:28 pm**

stessier wrote:Really - you are pushing the guy you think is most likely to explode???

I think he's pushing the guy he thinks has the most consensus.

Posted: **Fri Mar 11, 2011 1:29 pm**

stessier wrote:
Scoop20906 wrote:
stessier wrote:Scoop, Unagi, RMC, Q - who do you think is Splodie?

In order of most likely to explode because I am not really sure:

1. RMC
2. Qantaga
3. Unagi
4. Stessier

The Qantaga thing is hard. Unagi describe a scenario where all two teammate baddies vote to put their partner at N-1. Its hard to believe but it a certainly possible scenario.
Really - you are pushing the guy you think is most likely to explode???

He is the only one I feel confident to vote for at this point. You asked, I answered.

Posted: **Fri Mar 11, 2011 1:30 pm**

stessier wrote:
Unagi wrote:It's a mistake to think that the Zerker must die. It's perfectly OK if he's not ever killed.
Huh? How do we win that way?

The question was addressing the Villains attempt to win, and they don't need their Zerker dead to win.

as in: "Why would the Villains want to make their Zerker totally trusted?"
answer: "Why not?"

Posted: **Fri Mar 11, 2011 1:31 pm**

Unagi wrote:
stessier wrote:Really - you are pushing the guy you think is most likely to explode???
I think he's pushing the guy he thinks has the most consensus.

That is a horrible mis-characterization of what I have been doing, Unagi, and it makes you look hella wolfy to me.

Posted: **Fri Mar 11, 2011 1:32 pm**

Unagi wrote:
stessier wrote:
Unagi wrote:It's a mistake to think that the Zerker must die. It's perfectly OK if he's not ever killed.
Huh? How do we win that way?

The question was addressing the Villains attempt to win, and they don't need their Zerker dead to win.

as in: "Why would the Villains want to make their Zerker totally trusted?"
answer: "Why not?"

Ah. Ok.

Posted: **Fri Mar 11, 2011 1:33 pm**

Question to someone since I don't do numbers: If we miss on the lynch today what are our chance in winning considering even if we kill the baddies on the next two days we would still lose one person to the zerker.

THANKS!

Octopus Overlords

Bond II - The Prometheus Dawn - END!

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