Octopus Overlords

Unagi wrote:

triggercut wrote:

Unagi wrote: 1st. I think it's a joke to think Dooku would blindly cast his extra vote on a potential 'Special' on day 1.

I totally agree, but what stessier would tell you if he were here was that Dooku and Yoda's overvotes are immovable once placed. If Dooku believed CR was a Rebel before CR hinted at his Empire-ness and role and placed a vote, he can't remove it even after CR's reveal.

That said, I would bet that if Dooku is active he would hold his vote until very very late in the proceedings.

Back to the point at hand (IMO, this isnt' at all about Dooku) - Is Coop Rebel/or Not - Based upon the N-1 moment.

Here is what I am willing to say. If Triggercut is Empire (and hence, the N-1 back-off wasn't a Rebel thing) THEN I can see how coop is also perhaps not a Rebel.

Conversly, if Triggercut is Rebel, I think that puts Coop right back in the hot-seat, as his "N-1" vote was immediately mitigated by:
(1. Coops' expressed desire for everyone to give Scoop a lot of space because Scoop can't do anything at work) and
(2. triggercuts removal of his vote.)

adding to that, that you are the one that want's us to say that Coop is likely not Rebel, it just sits wrong.

I'm amazed you are still "On Fire" with your analysis Triggercut, since you tried so hard to get us to lynch CR and save Scoop, I'd think you'd feel just a pinch of reservations at this point. Guess not.

Now you're starting to become Unagi. Which begs us to fill in the blank... Where is the Stessier to your Unagi?

Unagi wrote:I'm amazed you are still "On Fire" with your analysis Triggercut, since you tried so hard to get us to lynch CR and save Scoop, I'd think you'd feel just a pinch of reservations at this point. Guess not.

He's trying. Just because you get something wrong doesn't mean you stop trying. To me it means it's time to try harder. Day 1 you are working with so little you are just trying to find something to go on. Day2 there is 21 PAGES of posts to go on that all mean way more now that we know the team of infinitely (1) more people than we did on Day1. I'm actually a bit concerned Trig is on the Rebels hit list because he is trying so hard, despite the fact he was wrong.

I was pushing for CR as hard as anyone, though as with votes on Scoop I was really just pushing for a lynch to move the game forward and hoping that we picked right.

Unfortunately we'll go into Day2 two down and the Scoop lynch isn't going to tell us anything. The Rebs will likely be on Scoop as fast as the Empire to avoid exposure. Is there a way around this? Shoot scoop instead? It doesn't say in greedo's description if he is revealed when he shoots, right? I guess once he shoots it doesn't matter.

Unagi wrote:
I'm amazed you are still "On Fire" with your analysis Triggercut, since you tried so hard to get us to lynch CR and save Scoop, I'd think you'd feel just a pinch of reservations at this point. Guess not.

So if I'm the Rebel target tonight, does that clarify things on coopasonic a bit?

coopasonic wrote:The Rebs will likely be on Scoop as fast as the Empire to avoid exposure. Is there a way around this? Shoot scoop instead? It doesn't say in greedo's description if he is revealed when he shoots, right? I guess once he shoots it doesn't matter.

I'm not sure why this is a problem. Yes, rebels are likely to recognize that a Scoop lynch is inevitable and vote for him, so any player voting for Scoop is going to get little or no "Empire cred" by doing so. But I'm not clear on why rebels voting for Scoop is a problem.

There are good reasons to shoot him, though. First, if he turns out to be either Chewie or Lando then we avoid their ability. Second, shooting him also has the advantage of using the shot rather than risk having it be lost due to a rebel kill or lynch miss.

Also, since the rules say for some characters that they are exposed when they shoot but not for others, and since Greedo doesn't say, I read it that Greedo is not exposed when he shoots. Or Vader when he chokes, I think.

El Guapo wrote:

coopasonic wrote:The Rebs will likely be on Scoop as fast as the Empire to avoid exposure. Is there a way around this? Shoot scoop instead? It doesn't say in greedo's description if he is revealed when he shoots, right? I guess once he shoots it doesn't matter.

I'm not sure why this is a problem. Yes, rebels are likely to recognize that a Scoop lynch is inevitable and vote for him, so any player voting for Scoop is going to get little or no "Empire cred" by doing so. But I'm not clear on why rebels voting for Scoop is a problem.

If we have a fast no discussion lynch where everyone wants to be the first to jump on the bandwagon, we don't learn anything.

coopasonic wrote:

El Guapo wrote:

coopasonic wrote:The Rebs will likely be on Scoop as fast as the Empire to avoid exposure. Is there a way around this? Shoot scoop instead? It doesn't say in greedo's description if he is revealed when he shoots, right? I guess once he shoots it doesn't matter.

I'm not sure why this is a problem. Yes, rebels are likely to recognize that a Scoop lynch is inevitable and vote for him, so any player voting for Scoop is going to get little or no "Empire cred" by doing so. But I'm not clear on why rebels voting for Scoop is a problem.

If we have a fast no discussion lynch where everyone wants to be the first to jump on the bandwagon, we don't learn anything.

Fair enough. We can control that just by agreeing not to rush on lynching Scoop, though, since the rebels aren't a majority.

I'm inclined to think that we ought to shoot Scoop anyhow if we have that capacity, but we'll figure that out in the morning I imagine.

Gonna be out tonight. Will catch up tomorrow on this discussion. It's not like it's night time or anything when we shouldn't be giving the Rebels ideas.

As the night wore on, people could not sleep and everyone stared at each other wondering what had just happened. Lassr finally announced, "We should really figure out how the vote count went down. No matter how many times I count, I don't get to eleven."

"Yes," said Newcastle, "this isn't sitting well with me either. I keep going over the last few minutes before Kenetickid shot Chaosraven and I can't figure it out. Let's see if we can reconstruct what happened."

Everyone slowly gathered back around the table. They painstakingly went through who said what when. Finally, a picture of the final moments started to form. Everyone looked at the ending vote tally in horror. Chaosraven never did make it to eleven, he only made it to 8.

"Wait, that can't be right!" cried Semaj. "I've got the print out right here, it clearly states the vote total was eleven!"

Coopasonic grabbed the piece of paper away from Semaj and felt a hard knot form in his stomach. Finally, in a very tired sigh he said, "He's right. It does say eleven. I think we have been sabotaged again."

"Well, we are not falling for that for a second time," announced El Guapo with determination radiating from him. "From now on, we are not going to put our votes in the computer, we will do paper ballots. We can't afford another mistake like that."

Everyone agreed.

Exhausted, the group quickly broke up and settled in for the night, finding whatever corner in the rooms they could to give them a little privacy. This definitely was going to take longer than they originally thought. And where was that rescue ship anyway? Shouldn't it be here by now?


Final Day 1 Votes

1 Lassr ----------------->
2 RMC ------------------> Chaosraven
3 Tru1cy --------------- > Unagi
4 Remus West ---------> Triggercut
5 Qantaga -------------->
6 Newcastle ------------> Chaosraven
7 Mr. Bubbles ----------> Semaj
8 Theohall --------------> Chaosraven
9 Chaosraven ----------> Scoop20906
10 Scoop20906 ----------> Chaosraven
11 Coopasonic -----------> Chaosraven
12 El Guapo --------------> Chaosraven
13 Lord Mortis -----------> Chaosraven
14 Stessier --------------->
15 Unagi ------------------> Mr. Bubbles
16 Pr0ner -----------------> Scoop20906
17 Semaj -----------------> Scoop20906
18 Kenetickid ------------> Chaosraven
19 Triggercut ------------>
20 Isgrimnur -------------> Triggercut
21 Grundbegriff ---------> Tru1cy

Unagi 1 <----------------- Tru1cy
Tru1cy 1 <---------------- Grundbegriff
Semaj 1 <----------------- Mr Bubbles
Scoop20906 3 <---------- Pr0ner, Semaj, Chaosraven
Triggercut 2 <----------- Isgrimnur, Remus West
Chaosraven 8 <---------- Kenetickid, RMC, Newcastle, Scoop20906, El Guapo, Coopasonic, Theohall, Lord Mortis
Mr. Bubbles 1 <---------- Unagi


Majority is 11
Deadline: It is night

sure sure, single me out to cry foul...

lolz

i guess CR was good bad eh?

Well... I am just home from work and that sucks..I didn't remove my vote, because I was at work when it all went down.
I really need to reread about 5 or more pages to see if I can find any patterns. And make heads or tails on what happened during the day..

bb2112 wrote:"Well, we are not falling for that for a second time," announced El Guapo with determination radiating from him. "From now on, we are not going to put our votes in the computer, we will do paper ballots. We can't afford another mistake like that."

Everyone agreed.

Well, thank goodness we have a determined, sensible imperial lawyer around here.

So clearly R2D2 then since he jumped 3 votes. I think it likely that Scoop is R2D2 due to using that ability. It would have been so very much more powerful saved for late game that I can not imagine them using it today when even if we did not lynch Chaosraven we were unlikely to get another lynch done - let alone on one of them. Thus I think we go ahead and lynch Scoop tomorrow rather than waste any potential shots on a robot. I think we shoot triggercut. I think the way he has been playing screams that he thinks he can avoid a lynch - Lando style - and make us waste some time that way. We shall see what happens in the night though. His constant "I'm going to be a target tonight" makes me think him Rebel that much more because if it was so important he live then he would make his claim rather than make any protector guess whether he is worth protecting or not. Hints are not always worth anything and setting up hints that you refuse to back up while also announcing you are special only makes me think he wants to at least try and avoid a counter claim when he is forced to openly claim a role.

El Guapo wrote:

bb2112 wrote:"Well, we are not falling for that for a second time," announced El Guapo with determination radiating from him. "From now on, we are not going to put our votes in the computer, we will do paper ballots. We can't afford another mistake like that."

Everyone agreed.

Well, thank goodness we have a determined, sensible imperial lawyer around here.

How the hell do you get that from that quote?

Remus West wrote:

El Guapo wrote:

bb2112 wrote:"Well, we are not falling for that for a second time," announced El Guapo with determination radiating from him. "From now on, we are not going to put our votes in the computer, we will do paper ballots. We can't afford another mistake like that."

Everyone agreed.

Well, thank goodness we have a determined, sensible imperial lawyer around here.

How the hell do you get that from that quote?

Well the determined is obvious - it was literally radiating from me.. Sensible because, well, everyone agreed. Attorney because well, I am an attorney. And imperial because, well, that's what bb2112 PM'd to me.

Remus West wrote:So clearly R2D2 then since he jumped 3 votes. I think it likely that Scoop is R2D2 due to using that ability. It would have been so very much more powerful saved for late game that I can not imagine them using it today when even if we did not lynch Chaosraven we were unlikely to get another lynch done - let alone on one of them. Thus I think we go ahead and lynch Scoop tomorrow rather than waste any potential shots on a robot. I think we shoot triggercut. I think the way he has been playing screams that he thinks he can avoid a lynch - Lando style - and make us waste some time that way. We shall see what happens in the night though. His constant "I'm going to be a target tonight" makes me think him Rebel that much more because if it was so important he live then he would make his claim rather than make any protector guess whether he is worth protecting or not. Hints are not always worth anything and setting up hints that you refuse to back up while also announcing you are special only makes me think he wants to at least try and avoid a counter claim when he is forced to openly claim a role.

If I survive, I think it would be a singularly bad play to shoot me instead of the guy who we are 99.9% sure is a Rebel (Scoop), but ok, so be it.

All I ask is that before someone takes the shot that I get a sec to show how much Remus is wrong on this first. That's all.

I think at the least whomever (it's whomever, right?) has a shot / force choke / etc. should hold off until we have agreed on who we want to shoot (if anyone) tomorrow. Fortunately since we have a lynch target in hand (Scoop) we'll have the luxury of time tomorrow, so I don't see any reason to be hasty there.

Of course, it's possible (I think) that we don't have anyone with a shot, so...if so just keep holding on in that case, imaginary people.

That would be hilarious if we debate for like three days and say, "ok, go ahead and shoot X", and then...nothing happens.

If Scoop is R2, why shoot him? He doesn't have any power any more. Save the shot for someone else to prevent them from using their power and just lynch him.

If Scoop isn't R2, shooting him would make sense to prevent him from using his power, since all of the rebels have powers.

The problem - how the heck are we going to know if Scoop is R2 or not? The rebels just killed our Emperor.

Remus West wrote:So clearly R2D2 then since he jumped 3 votes. I think it likely that Scoop is R2D2 due to using that ability. It would have been so very much more powerful saved for late game that I can not imagine them using it today when even if we did not lynch Chaosraven we were unlikely to get another lynch done - let alone on one of them. Thus I think we go ahead and lynch Scoop tomorrow rather than waste any potential shots on a robot. I think we shoot triggercut. I think the way he has been playing screams that he thinks he can avoid a lynch - Lando style - and make us waste some time that way. We shall see what happens in the night though. His constant "I'm going to be a target tonight" makes me think him Rebel that much more because if it was so important he live then he would make his claim rather than make any protector guess whether he is worth protecting or not. Hints are not always worth anything and setting up hints that you refuse to back up while also announcing you are special only makes me think he wants to at least try and avoid a counter claim when he is forced to openly claim a role.

This all the way, but I'll add that I am right with raven on kk and coop.

triggercut wrote:If I survive, I think it would be a singularly bad play to shoot me instead of the guy who we are 99.9% sure is a Rebel (Scoop), but ok, so be it.

All I ask is that before someone takes the shot that I get a sec to show how much Remus is wrong on this first. That's all.

I'd bet Scoop is R2 and was happy to put down his 3 votes on raven, knowing that he'd go down tomorrow. Shooting scoop is downright silly and we can that to the growing list.

theohall wrote:The problem - how the heck are we going to know if Scoop is R2 or not? The rebels just killed our Emperor.

We're not going to know who anyone is until after they use their power. The only reason I would suggest shooting Scoop is because the *only* way we have to learn anything useful now is lynch voting. If we lynch Scoop on day2 we don't learn anything. At this point I think the rebels have us over the barrel, we have to find some way to get some info that might give us something to go on.

coopasonic wrote:

theohall wrote:The problem - how the heck are we going to know if Scoop is R2 or not? The rebels just killed our Emperor.

We're not going to know who anyone is until after they use their power. The only reason I would suggest shooting Scoop is because the *only* way we have to learn anything useful now is lynch voting. If we lynch Scoop on day2 we don't learn anything. At this point I think the rebels have us over the barrel, we have to find some way to get some info that might give us something to go on.

With that reasoning, fire away.

bb2112 wrote:Final Day 1 Votes

1 Lassr ----------------->
2 RMC ------------------> Chaosraven
3 Tru1cy --------------- > Unagi
4 Remus West ---------> Triggercut
5 Qantaga -------------->
6 Newcastle ------------> Chaosraven
7 Mr. Bubbles ----------> Semaj
8 Theohall --------------> Chaosraven
9 Chaosraven ----------> Scoop20906
10 Scoop20906 ----------> Chaosraven
11 Coopasonic -----------> Chaosraven
12 El Guapo --------------> Unagi
13 Lord Mortis -----------> Scoop20906
14 Stessier --------------->
15 Unagi ------------------> Mr. Bubbles
16 Pr0ner -----------------> Scoop20906
17 Semaj -----------------> Scoop20906
18 Kenetickid ------------> Chaosraven
19 Triggercut ------------>
20 Isgrimnur -------------> Triggercut
21 Grundbegriff ---------> Tru1cy

Unagi 1 <----------------- Tru1cy
Tru1cy 1 <---------------- Grundbegriff
Semaj 1 <----------------- Mr Bubbles
Scoop20906 3 <---------- Pr0ner, Semaj, Chaosraven
Triggercut 2 <----------- Isgrimnur, Remus West
Chaosraven 8 <---------- Kenetickid, RMC, Newcastle, Scoop20906, El Guapo, Coopasonic, Theohall, Lord Mortis
Mr. Bubbles 1 <---------- Unagi


Majority is 11
Deadline: It is night

As an aside, the vote count should have me on KK, but that doesn't effect anything really.

If the rest of the vote count is correct, then Chaos was dead sometime between trig's withdrawl and El Guapo's withdrawl. That window was literally 5 minutes. It was 6 minutes from the time Chaos definitively stated he was the Emperor. 15 from when he said he knew Scoop must be a rebel.

In that time I suspect a mess of people were on, but we have posts from El Guapo, trig, pr0ner, Chaos (RIP), LM, and theohall. It should be also noted that El Guapo took the time to post "are you serious" rather than immediately withdraw his vote after Chaos made his Emperor claim.

To be fair, five minutes seemed like a reasonable amount of time to think - Chaos' posts had an odd "grasping at straws" vibe to them when I first read them. Guess I was a little too slow on the trigger, though.

What's also interesting is that the R2 vote evidently came in before the KK train gained steam. I was wondering if the R2 vote was possibly driven by the train towards KK (suggesting that KK is a rebel), but the R2 vote went down before a single vote went to KK, apparently. It's still possible insofar as KK was bandied about as a possible quiet target if neither Scoop nor Chaos were lynched...but not great evidence.

El Guapo wrote:What's also interesting is that the R2 vote evidently came in before the KK train gained steam. I was wondering if the R2 vote was possibly driven by the train towards KK (suggesting that KK is a rebel), but the R2 vote went down before a single vote went to KK, apparently. It's still possible insofar as KK was bandied about as a possible quiet target if neither Scoop nor Chaos were lynched...but not great evidence.

Doubtful. had to happen before you withdrew your vote or you wouldn't have been in on the kill. The plan was there to go off when CR his 8 votes or got thrown on right as he expressed that he was emperor.

I'm guessing it was the later. I'm guessing it's scoop who threw in the extra votes, knowing that his time was limited. That said, I still think kk is a good target.

KK
Coop
Trig
Guapo

Though I'm notoriously wrong in my guesses.

SO if R2's vote came that fast then it is possible that R2 did not confer with his teammates. All this talk of Scoop being R2 is not necessarily true. R2 could just have a quick trigger finger and did this on his own thinking it was the best option (remember the sedation of theohall in BSG game).

Or perhaps R2 was gravely worried about taking the gallows, and for reasons I cannot understand chose to spoof the ONE role guaranteed by rule to be in-game and put in a conditional request to bb2112.

R2 expected to not be in the game after Day1 or 2 and so decided to use his special power rather than die with it.

Scoop is R2, I'd wager.

Ho hum.

Anyone dead yet? Maybe the rebels all left.

El Guapo wrote:Anyone dead yet? Maybe the rebels all left.

triggercut and you are still standing here....so no, they haven't.

After a few hours sleep, people started to stir. Semaj was even found in the galley preparing some food along with RMC. "No use starting the day's bickering with an empty stomach," Remus West overheard Semaj saying from the kitchen.

Soon everyone was gathered back around the conference table eating a hardy breakfast when Triggercut looked around. "Wait, someone is missing. Yesterday started out with 21 of us, Chaosraven died, so that would make 20, however, there are only 19 of us at the table. Ok, who overslept?"

Unagi quickly ticked off the people in the room, "It's Stessier. I will go get him," and walked out to the waiting area. He quickly poked his head back into the room, "guys you better see this!"

When everyone filed into the waiting area, they saw Stessier lying there with a shocked look on his face. A vibroblade stuck out of his neck where it was slashed from one side to the other spilling out his blood in a gory mess all over the floor.

Stessier is quite DEAD

1. Lassr
2. RMC
3. Tru1cy
4. Remus West
5. Qantaga
6. Newcastle
7. Mr. Bubbles
8. Theohall
9. Chaosraven -------> Lynched Day 1
10. Scoop20906
11. Coopasonic
12. El Guapo
13. Lord Mortis
14. Stessier ----------> Killed Night 1
15. Unagi
16. Pr0ner
17. Semaj
18. Kenetickid
19. Triggercut
20. Isgrimnur
21. Grundbegriff

Majority is 10
Deadline: July 25th 9PM

stessier wrote:Ho hum.

So that's what that humming sound was... Now we just have to find the ho.

Sorry, a bit loopy after my workout. I'm gonna shower and hit the sack.

Well lookie there. Night ended and triggercut survived. Color me unshocked. Let's hear the explanation. Should be funny....er fun.

triggercut wrote:

Qantaga wrote: Are you two just speculating (based on the Scoop train)? Or have you seen something definite?

Just speculating on the Scoop train.

We got to N-1.

Cases:

1. Scoop is Empire, Yoda is in-game, but was not active during the Scoop train formation. I find this to be fairly unlikely...Scoop's train didn't form up that rapidly. Could happen, I guess.
2. Scoop is Empire, Yoda is in-game, but didn't cast his overvote for him even though he was playing during the last 48 hours. Can't see it.
3. Scoop is Empire, Yoda is in-game, but cast his vote earlier for another player. Not too likely, unless Yoda mis-played. I would assume that anyone with an overvote knows that it can't be changed during the day and will thus hold it until they're sure of what the play will be. Yoda would wait for the train to start, not try to anticipate it.
4. Yoda is not in game.
5. Scoop is a Rebel.

I miss any possibilities here?

Yes, triggercut, you missed one and told everyone what your role was. Guess what? Like Britney, Oops you did it again:

triggercut wrote:So we're saying that both Yoda and R2 fired away on KK as a possibility?

Yuck.

Someone--was it Remus?--wanted to know how I could be so sure that coopasonic's N-1 vote on Scoop was proof of his Empire-leaningness. Easy. I know who has the Empire overvote, and coopasonic doesn't.

I will also tell you that the Empire over-vote was *not* placed on anyone on Day 1--it was held in order to be able to use it if needed to get someone to the gallows at the arrival of the deadline on deadline day.

I will also tell you that what I read as a "slip" by CR having knowledge of Rebel over-vote intelligence was based on the fact that *I* had made a similar slip about revealing knowledge of whom the over-vote for the Empire was on before, as quoted above.

I am Count Dooku.

bb2112 wrote:Votes

1 Lassr -----------------> Scoop20906
2 RMC ------------------> Unagi
3 Tru1cy --------------- > Unagi
4 Remus West ---------> Scoop20906
5 Qantaga --------------> Tru1cy
6 Newcastle ------------> Grundbegriff
7 Mr. Bubbles ----------> Semaj
8 Theohall --------------> Unagi
9 Chaosraven ----------> Scoop20906
10 Scoop20906 ----------> Remus West
11 Coopasonic -----------> Grundbegriff
12 El Guapo --------------> Lassr
13 Lord Mortis ----------->
14 Stessier ---------------> Scoop20906
15 Unagi ------------------> Scoop20906
16 Pr0ner -----------------> Scoop20906
17 Semaj -----------------> Mr Bubbles
18 Kenetickid ------------> Scoop20906
19 Triggercut ------------> Scoop20906
20 Isgrimnur -------------> Newcastle
21 Grundbegriff ---------> Scoop20906

Lassr 1 -----------------> El Guapo
Mr Bubbles 1 -----------> Semaj
Unagi 3 -----------------> Tru1cy, RMC, Theohall
Newcastle 1 ------------> Isgrimnur
Tru1cy 1 ----------------> Qantaga
Remus West 1 ---------> Scoop20906
Grundbegriff 2 ---------> Newcastle
Semaj 1 -----------------> Mr Bubbles
Scoop20906 10 ----------> Triggercut, Unagi, Stessier, Lassr, Kenetickid, Chaosraven, Pr0ner, Remus West, Grundbegriff, coopasonic


Majority is 11
Deadline: July 13th 9PM EST

A very important snapshot of the game when Scoop went to N-1.

Scoop is a Rebel. We know that now. Are there any Rebel votes on him at N-1?

I placed my vote first, and it was on there a while. (Dooku says: "I wanted to see Scoop squeal a little under pressure; with 5 days to go before deadline, I didn't want to use my power until I saw something more definitive since my overvote cannot be moved to another player once placed.")
Unagi's vote was on there a while.
stessier was kind of the one who broke the ice. From stessier to Grundbegriff, the train took about...what, 6 hours? 7 tops? coopasonic's N-1 vote hit a couple of hours after Grund.

Question:
Are there any Rebel votes in Scoop's bandwagon?
I'll pre-empt speculation on myself. When/if I'm shot today, my faction will reveal that I am, indeed, Empire. Unagi seems Empire. The real question to answer then is whether any Rebels had giant cast-iron balls to join this train and let it ride to N-1? KK is the only one in that list I am unsure of, but even he seems to have a slight Empire lean. Maybe not.

The next question to ask (and please revisit this vote spread if I am to be shot and once my faction is revealed) is who the Rebels were trying to build a bandwagon on.

RMC, tru1cy, and theohall had standing votes on Unagi. theohall can at least show that he had a vote on Scoop to go to N-2 at one point...but that may not exonerate him. tru1cy and RMC reek of Rebel.

Next question: when Scoop got back up to N-2, who didn't have a vote on him of the remaining folks?

Here's where the vote sat on Wednesday morning:

Unagi 1 <----------------- Tru1cy
Tru1cy 2 <---------------- Qantaga, Grundbegriff
Semaj 1 <----------------- Mr Bubbles
Scoop20906 6 <---------- Stessier, Pr0ner, Lord Mortis, Semaj, Chaosraven, Lassr
Triggercut 3 <----------- Isgrimnur, Unagi, Remus West
Chaosraven 8 <---------- Kenetickid, Triggercut, RMC, Coopasonic, Newcastle, Theohall, Scoop20906, El Guapo

Then Qantaga, coopasonic, and theohall all switched to Scoop to put him at N-2. Scoop flinched and "revealed" himself.

This is also VERY helpful. Ask this question: would a Rebel go to the extreme of badly spoofing a role that was sure to backfire when at N-2 if there were other Rebel votes on him?

I say no way to that. He'd be much more likely to say to his teammates "Would you kindly remove your vote from me?"

I submit that it is incredibly unlikely that any of the following players were Rebels on Day 1:

stessier
pr0ner
LordMortis
Semaj
CR
Lassr
Qantaga
coopasonic
theohall

We also clear the water on who R2 was a bit here. R2 cannot use his 3-vote power without an Imperial vote placed against him. Once my death reveals that I truly am Empire, you'll see that the only other players with votes against them were:

Unagi (on the Scoop train at N-1), seems seemly to a great degree
Semaj (on the Scooop train to N-2 leading to Scoop's "outing") alibi almost airtight
Triggercut (guilty seeming as all hell, but Empire.)
Chaos (Empire-ness proven, sadly.)
tru1cy
Scoop

Scoop knew his "reveal" was going to be counterclaimed. For whatever reason he picked the ONE role that was GUARANTEED to be in the game to spoof. (I guess he was trying to sacrifice himself to reveal our seer. While that might have seemed a fair trade to him, in reality it still gives us enough information to root out at least 2 more rebels, perhaps 3 or 4 more.) Scoop knew that he was going to be dead today, so using his R2 power made as much sense as any of the rest of his play did.

BTW--who never voted for Scoop in the game?

Small set of players, I think. Can anyone find a case where:

Isgrimnur
Mr. Bubbles
Newcastle

cast votes against Scoop? I cannot find any such cases.

I would then submit that this set of players:

Scoop
tru1cy
RMC
Isgrimnur
Mr. Bubbles
Newcastle

is the motherlode. None of those players joined either Scoop train. Kenetickid bears watching, but within that list of 6 there may be as many as 6 Rebels, unless I'm truly once again missing something very obvious.

Dear trig...
I o so love you....

I will consider your outting a planned and not you shooting prematurely move.. but at some point., I will have to wake up (I worked tonight, just got out... gonna wow it up for an hour) and re-read.

as such,.. bravo... until the re-read...

Hmm. I left El Guapo out of the equation. With good reason, since he spent much of Tuesday/Wednesday playing vote Hokey-Pokey (He put his left vote in, he pulled his right vote out, he put his left vote in and he shook it all about.)

Analyzing over morning coffee.

Alert heightened on El Guapo. While he expressed interest in voting for either Scoop or Chaosraven with varying degrees of enthusiasm, his only actual votes--unless I'm missing them--were two very late (as in at the point where the matter was decided) votes once on tru1cy, and then on Kinetickid. Oh, and a very early vote on Lassr that went nowhere, way back right when the game first started.

Players I think are empirically Empire:
triggercut (yes, I know)
Lassr
pr0ner
Remus West
Grundbegriff
coopasonic
LordMortis
Semaj
Qantaga
theohall

Players I think are extremely, very likely absolutely to be Empire
Unagi

Players who--based on votes placed or the timing thereof--are difficult to get a read on
Kinetickid
El Guapo

Players who I'd bet know all the best places to get a burger on Alderaan
Scoop (likely R2D2)
tru1cy
RMC
Isgrimnur
Newcastle
Mr. Bubbles

(Players whom I stupidly got killed):
Chaosraven

Players who got taken out by the Rebs:
stessier

(Edited to add underlining for format consistency)

Trig I don't know if you are Count Dooku or not, but you are wrong about me. If that's the best you have then clearly the Sith and the Empire are in trouble. if there is a Vader hopefully he can redeem your order