The Kamala Harris presidential candidacy
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- Alefroth
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The Kamala Harris presidential candidacy
I figured she should probably have her own thread now.
Pelosi is on the Harris train-
https://thehill.com/homenews/campaign/4 ... c-nominee/
Pelosi is on the Harris train-
https://thehill.com/homenews/campaign/4 ... c-nominee/
- Jaymann
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Re: The Kamala Harris presidential candidacy
I like her advantages over Agent Orange:
Age
Intelligence
Erudition
Pro Choice
Rule of Law
Black enough
No criminal or civil convictions (against her)
Age
Intelligence
Erudition
Pro Choice
Rule of Law
Black enough
No criminal or civil convictions (against her)
Jaymann
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Leave no bacon behind.
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- waitingtoconnect
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Re: The Kamala Harris presidential candidacy
She’s a great choice. There is no question for a right minded person. And age is not an issue.
The question is can people not in the maga camp see past their racism and sexism and vote for her.
The pluses are obvious. But the real risk is the Supreme Court challenge against the interpretation of the 14th amendment.
I can see a Supreme Court challenge. An October surprise if you will.
In 1898 Wong Kim Ark, who was born in San Francisco in 1873, had been denied re-entry to the United States after a trip abroad, under the Chinese Exclusion Act, a law banning virtually all Chinese immigration and prohibiting Chinese immigrants from becoming naturalized U.S. citizens. He challenged the government's refusal to recognize his citizenship, and the Supreme Court ruled in his favor, holding that the citizenship language in the Fourteenth Amendment encompassed the circumstances of his birth and could not be limited in its effect by an act of Congress.
It’s also why Biden can’t resign until after the election. Because if he does Harris’ eligibility will be challenged at once and she will be pushed out. Johnson will then become president and democracy will likely end.
The question is can people not in the maga camp see past their racism and sexism and vote for her.
The pluses are obvious. But the real risk is the Supreme Court challenge against the interpretation of the 14th amendment.
I can see a Supreme Court challenge. An October surprise if you will.
In 1898 Wong Kim Ark, who was born in San Francisco in 1873, had been denied re-entry to the United States after a trip abroad, under the Chinese Exclusion Act, a law banning virtually all Chinese immigration and prohibiting Chinese immigrants from becoming naturalized U.S. citizens. He challenged the government's refusal to recognize his citizenship, and the Supreme Court ruled in his favor, holding that the citizenship language in the Fourteenth Amendment encompassed the circumstances of his birth and could not be limited in its effect by an act of Congress.
It’s also why Biden can’t resign until after the election. Because if he does Harris’ eligibility will be challenged at once and she will be pushed out. Johnson will then become president and democracy will likely end.
Last edited by waitingtoconnect on Mon Jul 22, 2024 5:28 pm, edited 1 time in total.
- Alefroth
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Re: The Kamala Harris presidential candidacy
If any 'undecideds' are put off by her gender or race, I don't think they were really ever going to vote for Biden.
- LordMortis
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Re: The Kamala Harris presidential candidacy
Gotta admit, I went to all the profiles I've long since ghosted of FB for propaganda posting. Only 2 mentions of Biden dropping out. None mentioning Harris at all. Are marching orders not yet sent? I can't imagine there was no contingency plan in place to hate on her, especially as they loved to hate on her as VP when she was mostly incognito for the last three years. One would think that bad thing about her, but being incognito is about the best any VP has done in my adult lifetime.
My assumption is the bigot crowd are some of TFGs biggest supporters even if they don't speak their bigotry out loud or even deny supporting him. Harris won't move the needle with that crowd one way or another. They were already voting for TFG and they weren't staying at home. The volume of their numbers was a terrifying wake up call to me in 2016 though.
Last edited by LordMortis on Mon Jul 22, 2024 5:34 pm, edited 2 times in total.
- waitingtoconnect
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Re: The Kamala Harris presidential candidacy
There is a “brown tax” for successful people of color. And a “woman tax” for successful women. That compounds if you are a successful woman of color.
And if you are biracial you often get it even worse because you aren’t “black” enough or “Indian” enough and that means you always have to contend with people calling you an imposter and an appropriator.
How much doubt and crap she would have to have put up with cannot be underestimated.
Let’s not forget that as a young girl she had to be bussed to school - and back then that meant having protestors scream at you the whole way.
We are in the reality television era of politics now. The Idiocracy is real. And a lot of people want segregation and hatred back. You should see the vile (insert swear word) here she is being subjected to. And Elon musk seems to be joining in on Twitter.
And if you are biracial you often get it even worse because you aren’t “black” enough or “Indian” enough and that means you always have to contend with people calling you an imposter and an appropriator.
How much doubt and crap she would have to have put up with cannot be underestimated.
Let’s not forget that as a young girl she had to be bussed to school - and back then that meant having protestors scream at you the whole way.
We are in the reality television era of politics now. The Idiocracy is real. And a lot of people want segregation and hatred back. You should see the vile (insert swear word) here she is being subjected to. And Elon musk seems to be joining in on Twitter.
- Unagi
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Re: The Kamala Harris presidential candidacy
All of this, exactly my take.LordMortis wrote: ↑Mon Jul 22, 2024 5:29 pmMy assumption is the bigot crowd are some of TFGs biggest supporters even if they don't speak their bigotry out loud or even deny supporting him. Harris won't move the needle with that crowd one way or another. They were already voting for TFG and they weren't staying at home. The volume of their numbers was a terrifying wake up call to me in 2016 though.
- YellowKing
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Re: The Kamala Harris presidential candidacy
She'll be fine. There's absolutely no evidence that there is a demographic of hidden "shadow bigots" that were going to vote for Biden but now have to vote for fascism because they can't vote for a woman of color. And in fact, there's quite a bit of evidence to the contrary.
The biggest strength she brings is that she completely nullified the so-called "double hater" demographic that didn't like the choice they were given and would have likely sat out this election.
The biggest strength she brings is that she completely nullified the so-called "double hater" demographic that didn't like the choice they were given and would have likely sat out this election.
- Unagi
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Re: The Kamala Harris presidential candidacy
I think a legitimate concern is that there are probably some number of people who may have sat it out before now - but Harris is a total deal breaker for them and they must keep a woman of color from taking the office. And they may be in key swing states with a really slim chance of winning already... So, the 'shadow bigots' are just the people who would have assumed Trump was winning, and no need for them to vote.YellowKing wrote: ↑Mon Jul 22, 2024 6:35 pm She'll be fine. There's absolutely no evidence that there is a demographic of hidden "shadow bigots" that were going to vote for Biden but now have to vote for fascism because they can't vote for a woman of color. And in fact, there's quite a bit of evidence to the contrary.
The biggest strength she brings is that she completely nullified the so-called "double hater" demographic that didn't like the choice they were given and would have likely sat out this election.
Of course, the GOP is freaking out that Harris may have awoken and invigorated a body of voters that have not been counted properly before (or expected to turn out).
I need to put a cap on my optimism though, it's just been so long before I let any of it in that it's really easy to leave the faucet on too long.
- Smoove_B
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Re: The Kamala Harris presidential candidacy
Just have to hope this has inspired more people to vote because they're excited to see her as the nominee than it has inspired troglodytes. It's only been a few days and I don't know anything officially, but anecdotally people seem energized.
Maybe next year, maybe no go
- Victoria Raverna
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Re: The Kamala Harris presidential candidacy
I'm surprised that people are surprised about this. You give the people a better choice than two old guys, people are going to be more excited. I think now there is a hope for Democrats to win against Trump.
Last edited by Victoria Raverna on Mon Jul 22, 2024 7:42 pm, edited 1 time in total.
- Unagi
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Re: The Kamala Harris presidential candidacy
I can tell you my oldest kid thinks it's a massive improvement and easily the best shift in our timeline in years. And this kid is never remotely optimistic. (to be fair, still isn't, but...)
- Smoove_B
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Re: The Kamala Harris presidential candidacy
I don't think there was ever a question as to whether or not there were better choices. The question was whether or not it would be a good idea to switch candidates in the final ~100 days of the election. It was a HUGE risk - huge. Initial impressions seem like it was a good move; let's hope that it continues to build.Victoria Raverna wrote: ↑Mon Jul 22, 2024 7:36 pm I'm surprised that people are surprised about this. You give the people a better choice than two old guys, people are going to be more excited.
Maybe next year, maybe no go
- Kurth
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Re: The Kamala Harris presidential candidacy
Same here. My oldest (will be a junior in college) has rarely been interested in politics, but he's all in right now. He was despondent about the Biden v. Trump race, but he seems much more optimistic with Harris v. Trump.
I just watched some clips from her speech today. Maybe there's good reason for that. It's early days, but I liked what I saw from her so far.
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- LawBeefaroni
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Re: The Kamala Harris presidential candidacy
Yeah, do not under estimate racism and misogyny.Unagi wrote: ↑Mon Jul 22, 2024 7:28 pmI think a legitimate concern is that there are probably some number of people who may have sat it out before now - but Harris is a total deal breaker for them and they must keep a woman of color from taking the office. And they may be in key swing states with a really slim chance of winning already... So, the 'shadow bigots' are just the people who would have assumed Trump was winning, and no need for them to vote.YellowKing wrote: ↑Mon Jul 22, 2024 6:35 pm She'll be fine. There's absolutely no evidence that there is a demographic of hidden "shadow bigots" that were going to vote for Biden but now have to vote for fascism because they can't vote for a woman of color. And in fact, there's quite a bit of evidence to the contrary.
The biggest strength she brings is that she completely nullified the so-called "double hater" demographic that didn't like the choice they were given and would have likely sat out this election.
Don't don the cap just yet. Go watch videos of Clinton victory parties in 2016.
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- Victoria Raverna
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Re: The Kamala Harris presidential candidacy
I don't think the risk is huge. When the old guy option is impossible to win in November, a switch to another option is not a huge risk. At worst, you still lose in November which is not worse than staying with the old guy option.Smoove_B wrote: ↑Mon Jul 22, 2024 7:43 pmI don't think there was ever a question as to whether or not there were better choices. The question was whether or not it would be a good idea to switch candidates in the final ~100 days of the election. It was a HUGE risk - huge. Initial impressions seem like it was a good move; let's hope that it continues to build.Victoria Raverna wrote: ↑Mon Jul 22, 2024 7:36 pm I'm surprised that people are surprised about this. You give the people a better choice than two old guys, people are going to be more excited.
- Isgrimnur
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Re: The Kamala Harris presidential candidacy
Look at the world events in which they've grown up. Have they had an environment in which to be optimistic?
It's almost as if people are the problem.
- Unagi
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Re: The Kamala Harris presidential candidacy
I think you misunderstood. The 'cap' was meant to mean a 'limit' to how optimistic I would let myself get.LawBeefaroni wrote: ↑Mon Jul 22, 2024 7:50 pmDon't don the cap just yet. Go watch videos of Clinton victory parties in 2016.
There is no cap in the 'donning' sense, that I own, that speaks to any pre-2016 levels of optimism.
That world is gone. Forever on guard.
- waitingtoconnect
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Re: The Kamala Harris presidential candidacy
The only shadow bigots that matter right now is are there enough of them of the 6 conservatives on the Supreme Court bench to implement John Eastmans legal theory every true legal scholar said was wrong.YellowKing wrote: ↑Mon Jul 22, 2024 6:35 pm She'll be fine. There's absolutely no evidence that there is a demographic of hidden "shadow bigots" that were going to vote for Biden but now have to vote for fascism because they can't vote for a woman of color. And in fact, there's quite a bit of evidence to the contrary.
The biggest strength she brings is that she completely nullified the so-called "double hater" demographic that didn't like the choice they were given and would have likely sat out this election.
This is a maga political theory from John Eastman who tried to get trump s loss overturned in the wake of losing the 2020 election.
https://www.newsweek.com/some-questions ... on-1524483
It says that Harris is naturalised and not a natural born American despite being born here. Thus ineligible.
Right now Americans couldnt trust the Supreme Court won’t follow this argument.
And even if they won’t - Republican lower court judges could wreak havoc before the Supreme Court weighs in.
One risk we should be prepared for is that a lower court judge closely aligned with Maga might issue a court order forcing Biden’s name back on the ballot. It’s far from clear what the legal basis of such a decision would be, but there are judges — think of figures like Christian Right crusader Matthew Kacsmaryk or Aileen Cannon, the trial judge who has behaved like a member of Trump’s criminal defense team — who’ve shown an extraordinary willingness to bend the law to achieve Republican goals.
Last edited by waitingtoconnect on Mon Jul 22, 2024 8:07 pm, edited 1 time in total.
- Unagi
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Re: The Kamala Harris presidential candidacy
Oh man, you can't can begin to understand the times I've talked to my wife and close friends about that very point. To grow up with Trump being the figurehead of one of our very serious parties... it's just heartbreaking. Climate change is also a serious source of depression in that context as well.Isgrimnur wrote: ↑Mon Jul 22, 2024 7:55 pmLook at the world events in which they've grown up. Have they had an environment in which to be optimistic?
- LawBeefaroni
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Re: The Kamala Harris presidential candidacy
Ah, sorry. Reading too fast. Stay vigilant!Unagi wrote: ↑Mon Jul 22, 2024 7:58 pmI think you misunderstood. The 'cap' was meant to mean a 'limit' to how optimistic I would let myself get.LawBeefaroni wrote: ↑Mon Jul 22, 2024 7:50 pmDon't don the cap just yet. Go watch videos of Clinton victory parties in 2016.
There is no cap in the 'donning' sense, that I own, that speaks to any pre-2016 levels of optimism.
That world is gone. Forever on guard.
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- Isgrimnur
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Re: The Kamala Harris presidential candidacy
Unagi wrote: ↑Mon Jul 22, 2024 8:02 pmOh man, you can't can begin to understand the times I've talked to my wife and close friends about that very point. To grow up with Trump being the figurehead of one of our very serious parties... it's just heartbreaking. Climate change is also a serious source of depression in that context as well.Isgrimnur wrote: ↑Mon Jul 22, 2024 7:55 pmLook at the world events in which they've grown up. Have they had an environment in which to be optimistic?
Add twenty years of war in the Iraq and Afghanistan, a resurgent Russia just taking parts of Ukraine with the rest of the world going, "eh, what are you gonna do?", etc.
It's almost as if people are the problem.
- Victoria Raverna
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Re: The Kamala Harris presidential candidacy
The Anti-Trump:
- Smoove_B
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Re: The Kamala Harris presidential candidacy
I respectfully disagree as we've not seen anything like this (changing an incumbent Presidential candidate) in our collective lifetimes.Victoria Raverna wrote: ↑Mon Jul 22, 2024 7:54 pm I don't think the risk is huge. When the old guy option is impossible to win in November, a switch to another option is not a huge risk. At worst, you still lose in November which is not worse than staying with the old guy option.
That said, the short attention span of the average American coupled with a ~100 day election campaign might be enough to overcome the 4+ year hate campaign that has been run by a sexual assaulting felon. I guess we'll see.
Maybe next year, maybe no go
- Kraken
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Re: The Kamala Harris presidential candidacy
One that I hope she will hammer on hard and often, because TFG will be an environmental catastrophe.
- hepcat
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Re: The Kamala Harris presidential candidacy
That “old guy” helped avoid an economic crisis in the U.S., has been trying to keep Russia in check, and attempting to get Israel to talk. Let’s not trivialize a good leader like that. He did the right thing in the end. Something I doubt very few others would willingly do.Victoria Raverna wrote: ↑Mon Jul 22, 2024 7:54 pmI don't think the risk is huge. When the old guy option is impossible to win in November, a switch to another option is not a huge risk. At worst, you still lose in November which is not worse than staying with the old guy option.Smoove_B wrote: ↑Mon Jul 22, 2024 7:43 pmI don't think there was ever a question as to whether or not there were better choices. The question was whether or not it would be a good idea to switch candidates in the final ~100 days of the election. It was a HUGE risk - huge. Initial impressions seem like it was a good move; let's hope that it continues to build.Victoria Raverna wrote: ↑Mon Jul 22, 2024 7:36 pm I'm surprised that people are surprised about this. You give the people a better choice than two old guys, people are going to be more excited.
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Re: The Kamala Harris presidential candidacy
There was 0% chance Biden was winning. Any change at this point is a positive, even if it’s only a fraction of a percent.Smoove_B wrote: ↑Mon Jul 22, 2024 8:18 pmI respectfully disagree as we've not seen anything like this (changing an incumbent Presidential candidate) in our collective lifetimes.Victoria Raverna wrote: ↑Mon Jul 22, 2024 7:54 pm I don't think the risk is huge. When the old guy option is impossible to win in November, a switch to another option is not a huge risk. At worst, you still lose in November which is not worse than staying with the old guy option.
That said, the short attention span of the average American coupled with a ~100 day election campaign might be enough to overcome the 4+ year hate campaign that has been run by a sexual assaulting felon. I guess we'll see.
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- YellowKing
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Re: The Kamala Harris presidential candidacy
I keep being told this, but I've seen no evidence that there's enough of it to cost her the presidency. Racism and misogyny did little to keep her out of the White House in 2020. And she's starting out slightly better than Biden against Trump in early polling. One would expect if racism and misogyny were so rampant, she'd be doing significantly worse than the white guy. And Michelle Obama certainly wouldn't be leading Trump by double digits in hypothetical matchups.Lawbeefaroni wrote:Yeah, do not under estimate racism and misogyny.
At any rate, it is what it is. I don't think we should be making decisions based on how racists and misogynists are going to react.
- waitingtoconnect
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Re: The Kamala Harris presidential candidacy
The racists and sexists are in the minority - but we need to make sure that they aren’t the majority of the actual voters on election day.
Vote. And tell every decent person you know to vote.
Vote. And tell every decent person you know to vote.
- Smoove_B
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Re: The Kamala Harris presidential candidacy
BREAKING: Kamala Harris CLINCHES Democratic nomination.
It only took her about 31 hours — while raising $231 million.
This was like a political D-Day — we’ve never seen anything like this.
DEMOCRATS. IN. ARRAY
Maybe next year, maybe no go
- Alefroth
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Re: The Kamala Harris presidential candidacy
That was fast. I read that the campaign was hoping to have enough pledges by Wednesday night-
https://apnews.com/article/harris-biden ... 4fe61a73e9
https://apnews.com/article/harris-biden ... 4fe61a73e9
edit: Bammed by seconds!WASHINGTON (AP) — Vice President Kamala Harris has secured the support of enough Democratic delegates to become her party’s nominee against Republican Donald Trump, according to an Associated Press survey, as top Democrats rallied to her in the aftermath of President Joe Biden’s decision to drop his bid for reelection,
The quick coalescing behind Harris marked an attempt by the party to put weeks of internecine drama over Biden’s political future behind them and to unify behind the task of defeating Trump with just over 100 days until Election Day. Prominent Democratic elected officials, party leaders and political organizations quickly lined up behind Harris in the day after Biden’s exit from the race and her campaign set a new 24-hour record for presidential donations on Monday.
Several state delegations met late Monday to confirm their support for Harris, including Texas and her home state of California. By Monday night, Harris had the support of at least 2,579 delegates, according to the AP tally of delegates, more than the 1,976 delegates she’ll need to win on a first ballot. No other candidate was named by a delegate contacted by the AP.
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Re: The Kamala Harris presidential candidacy
My daughter (turned 29 today) is also hopeful for the future for the first time in a long time. She’s told me that Tik Tok has blown up with people excited for Harris.Kurth wrote:Same here. My oldest (will be a junior in college) has rarely been interested in politics, but he's all in right now. He was despondent about the Biden v. Trump race, but he seems much more optimistic with Harris v. Trump.
I just watched some clips from her speech today. Maybe there's good reason for that. It's early days, but I liked what I saw from her so far.
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- Smoove_B
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Re: The Kamala Harris presidential candidacy
Nah, you have an actual news story, not some post on social media. It's still pretty crazy, regardless.
Maybe next year, maybe no go
- Victoria Raverna
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Re: The Kamala Harris presidential candidacy
I guess now Trump is going to change his mind again and support banning Tiktok.Dramatist wrote: ↑Mon Jul 22, 2024 11:18 pmMy daughter (turned 29 today) is also hopeful for the future for the first time in a long time. She’s told me that Tik Tok has blown up with people excited for Harris.Kurth wrote:Same here. My oldest (will be a junior in college) has rarely been interested in politics, but he's all in right now. He was despondent about the Biden v. Trump race, but he seems much more optimistic with Harris v. Trump.
I just watched some clips from her speech today. Maybe there's good reason for that. It's early days, but I liked what I saw from her so far.
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- waitingtoconnect
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Re: The Kamala Harris presidential candidacy
It was my birthday as well. A glorious day. A viable candidate for president!Dramatist wrote: ↑Mon Jul 22, 2024 11:18 pmMy daughter (turned 29 today) is also hopeful for the future for the first time in a long time. She’s told me that Tik Tok has blown up with people excited for Harris.Kurth wrote:Same here. My oldest (will be a junior in college) has rarely been interested in politics, but he's all in right now. He was despondent about the Biden v. Trump race, but he seems much more optimistic with Harris v. Trump.
I just watched some clips from her speech today. Maybe there's good reason for that. It's early days, but I liked what I saw from her so far.
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- Jaymann
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Re: The Kamala Harris presidential candidacy
Nikki Haley PAC is supporting Harris. Haley is a turd, but she showed well against Agent Orange and demonstrates not all Republicans are giving Florida Man the seig heil.
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- waitingtoconnect
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Re: The Kamala Harris presidential candidacy
The only question is which VP will she pick to counter unhinged paranoia?
- waitingtoconnect
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Re: The Kamala Harris presidential candidacy
To be clear it’s not the woman herself, but the people she voted for her.
haley already sold her soul back to Trump.
- em2nought
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Re: The Kamala Harris presidential candidacy
I guess it plays in her favor that she never even showed up for her job as the border czar? Along that same line of thinking the current "secret" darling of the democrats might be a good choice as VP.
Em2nought is garbage
- Unagi
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Re: The Kamala Harris presidential candidacy
Just to be clear, that voter’s PAC was already named Nikki Halley voters for Biden, and had bailed on NH when she rekissed Trump’s ring