Does anyone else experience this? I really enjoy strategy games at the start, but once I get to a certain point, it starts to become a burden. This has happened to me in Civ3, RTW, among others. I would really like to actually finish at least one game at some time, but I keep restarting.
It's kind of weird, because I have no problems finishing(sometimes 2 or 3 times) long games in genres like rpg or fps(these aren't long for normal people, but I take a long time to finish them).
The only tbs game that didn't have this effect on me was HoMM3. I avoid that game now because it just sucked up so much time...but it was so much fun
This'll sometimes happen to me when I reach the point where I'm winning and far ahead that the game isn't a challenge, but rather becomes a chore of cleaning up the map. Some games do allow the player to set victory conditions (eg, capture 40% of the board) which makes it easier to end the game before the boredom hits.
I've also played TBS games where the computer time between turns became excessively long later in the game (Call To Power is the worst example of this) which seriously harms my enjoyment.
When I get toward the end of a Civ3 game, I do find myself automating all my little workers and slave workers. You just find pollution and clean it up, you clear wetlands, you um... you uh... Hmmm find something to irrigate.
In short yes I do get sick of the end game sometimes, however right when I am getting ready to say, "enough" I win a cultural victory or lose a UN vote.
I always enjoy the early part of 4X games the most. Exploration and expansion are the most fun. Once I'm certain that I'm going to win, gameplay turns tedious.
Ironrod wrote:I always enjoy the early part of 4X games the most. Exploration and expansion are the most fun. Once I'm certain that I'm going to win, gameplay turns tedious.
Exactly. Mopping up the board, whether at Civ or RoN or whatever, is just tiresome and can last a disproportionate length of time (relative to the probability of me losing at that point). That's actually been one gripe that keeps me away from playing Civ3 or RoN all that much unfortunately.
You do not take from this universe. It grants you what it will.
I mean, ignoring the fact you can set the territory win to whatever level you want (% of map), plus wonder victories, plus military victory... ignoring all that, each game is still only about an hour.
I mean, ignoring the fact you can set the territory win to whatever level you want (% of map), plus wonder victories, plus military victory... ignoring all that, each game is still only about an hour.
I have a short attention span, but MAN.
I know. I'm bad. But when I spend 20 minutes cleaning up a map when the inevitable is crashing upon the heathens, I get bored. Does that make me a bad gamer?
You do not take from this universe. It grants you what it will.
A lot of games do try to address tedium during the end game. Most have some sort of "governor" feature that automates some of the processes. Micromanagement is more important early in the game rather than late, but most people don't bother to make the hand-off when it makes sense to do so. I'm not sure what else can be done: people like games where they can expand endlessly; they don't want to adjust their playing style as the game wears on, but they complain when it suddenly becomes overwhelming.
Kind of makes you wonder why Caesar appointed governors...
Sometimes the old ways really are the best ways. The original moo had the best solution for this. Colony/base decisions were made based on sliders that could be sensibly reset with global decisions at appropriate times. Old unit's were naturally retired by the way combat was done. It's a game design problem.
Jeff V wrote:A lot of games do try to address tedium during the end game. Most have some sort of "governor" feature that automates some of the processes. Micromanagement is more important early in the game rather than late, but most people don't bother to make the hand-off when it makes sense to do so. I'm not sure what else can be done: people like games where they can expand endlessly; they don't want to adjust their playing style as the game wears on, but they complain when it suddenly becomes overwhelming.
Kind of makes you wonder why Caesar appointed governors...
Exactly. I change my expectations of how to play the game (like RTW or SEIV) as my territories increase. I stop micromanaging for the small improvements and let the governors do as they will.
I focus on the " big picture": which faction I'll eliminate next, who will I ally with, where the majority of my troops should be, etc. I pay less attention to retinue details, squalor, city improvements, local stuff in general.
Yes, things can get out of hand in places but you're the supreme commander: FOCUS. You're not the local politico promising better garbage pickup.
Strategy games can become tedious if you expect to play them the same way from the initial expansion to the ending consolidation.
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I mean, ignoring the fact you can set the territory win to whatever level you want (% of map), plus wonder victories, plus military victory... ignoring all that, each game is still only about an hour.
I have a short attention span, but MAN.
s
Are RoN games really that fast, or are you exaggerating? Because I have a copy of RoN Gold sitting on my bookshelf and I keep putting off installing it because I've only had an hour or so to play. I'm going to feel real dumb if I've been ignoring the perfect game.
I mean, ignoring the fact you can set the territory win to whatever level you want (% of map), plus wonder victories, plus military victory... ignoring all that, each game is still only about an hour.
I have a short attention span, but MAN.
s
Are RoN games really that fast, or are you exaggerating? Because I have a copy of RoN Gold sitting on my bookshelf and I keep putting off installing it because I've only had an hour or so to play. I'm going to feel real dumb if I've been ignoring the perfect game.
You're ignoring a good game. The game can play within an hour, personally I slow down the game speed a little and increase research speed a lot to give me more time to think while playing. But on the default setting an hour seems a pretty good average time for a regular game (say, 4 players).
On the topic of the late-game cleanup in pretty much every strategy game (Dominions 2 is awful about this -- as is any strategy game with little or no auto-management functions) I just put up with it as part of the game. Sure, I am bound to win, but I still want to win. So I crush my enemies as quickly as possible, possibly taking several more turns than I would have had to if I had thought everything through, and instead just building loads of units and crushing the enemy quickly. Just keep pushing that "End turn" button as fast as possible, so to speak.
Quite a few games, though, I just declare myself the winner and shut the game off. I don't have to see the "You win!" screen to know that I won.
I mean, ignoring the fact you can set the territory win to whatever level you want (% of map), plus wonder victories, plus military victory... ignoring all that, each game is still only about an hour.
I have a short attention span, but MAN.
s
Are RoN games really that fast, or are you exaggerating? Because I have a copy of RoN Gold sitting on my bookshelf and I keep putting off installing it because I've only had an hour or so to play. I'm going to feel real dumb if I've been ignoring the perfect game.
No that's a pretty good estimate for a good game. It all depends on the middle game since if things get out of hand you can go to a long drawn out war of attrition sometimes, but even then you're looking at about 2 hours for a REALLY long game. Playing solo against the computer I can't imagine a game going much longer than 1 hour.
wrt RoN, even the Conquer the World campaign is broken down into "bite-size" scenarios; in fact, they mave even move along more quickly than the regular game.
Thunderspark wrote:Does anyone else experience this? I really enjoy strategy games at the start, but once I get to a certain point, it starts to become a burden. This has happened to me in Civ3, RTW, among others. I would really like to actually finish at least one game at some time, but I keep restarting.
It's kind of weird, because I have no problems finishing(sometimes 2 or 3 times) long games in genres like rpg or fps(these aren't long for normal people, but I take a long time to finish them).
The only tbs game that didn't have this effect on me was HoMM3. I avoid that game now because it just sucked up so much time...but it was so much fun
I was so disgusted with the turn based aspects they threw into RTW that I uninstalled it. It made no sense at all to slow it down with that nonsense. The only TBS game I loved was Combat Missions, since then, other than that, they are all annoying as hell to me.
Kobra wrote:I was so disgusted with the turn based aspects they threw into RTW that I uninstalled it. It made no sense at all to slow it down with that nonsense. The only TBS game I loved was Combat Missions, since then, other than that, they are all annoying as hell to me.
Did RTW have more turn based aspects than Medieval: Total War?
/. "She climbed backwards out her
\/ window into Outside Over There."
I play probably four games at a time, completing missions or quests as I feel like. Sometimes I will stick with one game for 2 or 3 missions then try something completely different before I get tired or bored of the first game.
By switching back and forth I never get to the point I just want to quit. I finish more games and and have less back log this way.
I used to play one game at a time until it was beaten to death. This way I enjoy gaming more and it keeps it fresh.
Did RTW have more turn based aspects than Medieval: Total War?
