Legendary buys film and tv rights to Dune [movie] Dune 2021

[Daehawk]

http://nerdist.com/legendary-acquires-d ... tv-rights/

We'll see what a communist owned company can do but having Dune back would be sweet.

[Grifman]

The first book was good, but each one after that took a turn for the strange. The one where the son took young sandworm larva and attached them to himself as a second skin just was too weird for me. I don't see them creating a cinematic universe from this material unless they create some new stories, but that's just me.

[Isgrimnur]

His son has shepherded an expansion of the universe beyond the original descent into weirdness.

[Sepiche]

The first book was good, but each one after that took a turn for the strange. The one where the son took young sandworm larva and attached them to himself as a second skin just was too weird for me. I don't see them creating a cinematic universe from this material unless they create some new stories, but that's just me.

Agents will be coming for your nerd card momentarily. For your protection please don't resist.

[El Guapo]

The first book was good, but each one after that took a turn for the strange. The one where the son took young sandworm larva and attached them to himself as a second skin just was too weird for me. I don't see them creating a cinematic universe from this material unless they create some new stories, but that's just me.

Agents will be coming for your nerd card momentarily. For your protection please don't resist.

Isn't Grifman's view here pretty much consensus in the nerd community (at least before recent efforts)? As for me, I loved the original book but didn't get past the halfway point of the second book.

[LordMortis]

The first book was good, but each one after that took a turn for the strange. The one where the son took young sandworm larva and attached them to himself as a second skin just was too weird for me. I don't see them creating a cinematic universe from this material unless they create some new stories, but that's just me.

Agents will be coming for your nerd card momentarily. For your protection please don't resist.

Isn't Grifman's view here pretty much consensus in the nerd community (at least before recent efforts)? As for me, I loved the original book but didn't get past the halfway point of the second book.

I absolutely loved the original. I don't remember the 2nd but I read it, something about protecting his kids. I got halfway through the 3rd before setting it down, have read 100s of pages with no impression being left on me whatsoever.

[TiLT]

The first 4 books are generally considered to be masterpieces and required reading for any self-respecting sci-fi fan. The series was intended to consist of two trilogies with a separate book to bridge the two. Sadly though, Frank Herbert died before he could finish the final book, and the first two books of the second trilogy are weaker than the earlier books and fall into the classic trap of any sci-fi series that runs on too long: it ends up focusing way too much on sex. The first trilogy caps off wonderfully with the fourth book's bridge, leaving it at a great point to stop reading without feeling like you're missing anything important.

In other words, read Dune, Dune Messiah, Children of Dune, and God Emperor of Dune. In that order. Keep in mind though, many people who are familiar with the basic story of Dune, or who read the first book completely fresh, expect these books to be about a specific, classic story trope. They're not. They're actually a deconstruction of the trope. That can leave some readers feeling bewildered as they get to Dune Messiah and the carpet is pulled out from under them. Just stick with it and keep an open mind. It pays off, but not in the ways you might expect while you're reading the first book.

As for potential movies or TV series, I'm all for it. I'm surprised it has taken them this long considering the success of Game of Thrones. Dune could be set to catch large portions of that audience when GoT comes to a close in 1 1/2 years, considering that Dune can feel like the sci-fi version of A Song of Ice and Fire.

[El Guapo]

A Dune TV series done right would be amazing, and seems like a potential cash machine.

[Holman]

In other words, read Dune, Dune Messiah, Children of Dune, and God Emperor of Dune. In that order. Keep in mind though, many people who are familiar with the basic story of Dune, or who read the first book completely fresh, expect these books to be about a specific, classic story trope. They're not. They're actually a deconstruction of the trope. That can leave some readers feeling bewildered as they get to Dune Messiah and the carpet is pulled out from under them. Just stick with it and keep an open mind. It pays off, but not in the ways you might expect while you're reading the first book.

Well said!

Dune (meaning the first novel) is brilliant, and none of the others are as well-written or as rich, but they do a fascinating job of complicating the heroic/messianic myth that made the first novel so powerful. I think you really have to read them to understand the whole meaning of Paul Muad'Dib. Plus I've honestly always thought Leto II (of the fourth book) is a terrific character, and that book takes the world-making in some really interesting directions.

There's no real reason to read on after God-Emperor, though, and the Brian Herbert travesties should all be dumped into acid.

Now that we've had Lynch and the SyFy miniseries, I'm of the opinion that we can't have too much Dune. Eventually someone might get it right.

By the way, who has seen the documentary Jodorowsky's Dune? It's as mind-blowing as the books themselves.

[Jeff V]

I enjoyed all of the Brian Herbert books, at least the prequels and the ones he did filling gaps between the original trilogy. If you're looking for lots of material for a TV series, there you have it.

[Zarathud]

Brian's prequels were not high literature or comparable to his father's work.

But in many ways that was a BONUS. Their simplicity in driving forward the Atrides/Harkonnen and Theilaxu/Bene Geserit/Guild narratives across millennia does help develop the world and universe in hugely beneficial ways -- especially the themes that come out by Books 3-4 of the original series. Dune is about Paul's inevitability as a messiah figure after our downfall and humanity trying to overcome his legacy.

Worth reading if you want to better understand. Even Jeff V approved, if I remember clearly.

[Jeff V]

Worth reading if you want to better understand. Even Jeff V approved, if I remember clearly.

Look up!

My main complaint about the prequels was that events covered thousands of years (IIRC) before Dune, but everything had such relevance to Dune itself that it might as well been a generation before. Post-God Emperor was thousands of years beyond, and very much changed; the events of Dune were more mythical than anything (except for the recurring Duncan Idaho clones). I think Brian wrote a book or two in the far future, those I didn't read. I didn't care for where Frank was going with it, and I don't think I read past Heretics.

Add the Dune prequels/fillers to James Bond on the list of things that even when bad, I still enjoy them a lot.

[hitbyambulance]

By the way, who has seen the documentary Jodorowsky's Dune? It's as mind-blowing as the books themselves.

yup. read _The Incal_ and its spinoffs (e.g. _The Metabarons_) series of eurocomix to see where some of these ideas and themes ended up.

[Holman]

I don't want to get into a fanwar over this, but Brian Herbert's stuff is awful both because he's a terrible writer (weak style, weak plotting, weak ideas) and because the stuff he invents is utterly unworthy of the themes and scope of the originals. These books make Star Wars' Episodes I-III look like masterpieces.

They can't hurt my Dune, though, because I refuse to acknowledge their existence.

[Archinerd]

I love all of Frank's Dune books, even the weird ones.

I only read one of Brian's, and the only nice thing I can say about it is that it was better than the Star Wars prequels.

[Archinerd]

By the way, who has seen the documentary Jodorowsky's Dune? It's as mind-blowing as the books themselves.

The "Soundtrack" for it is pretty good too. Here's my favorite track. Parallel World.

It's not actually the Soundtrack for the film, but is more of a concept album of what the soundtrack for the film might have sounded like. I could do without the clips of Jodorowsky's voice though.

Building upon director Frank Pavich’s idea for a score with a “Tangerine Dream-type feel,” Stenzel lays out a cosmic arsenal of analog synthesizers that would make any collector green at the gills: among other gems are a rare Moog Source, CZ-101s, and a Roland Juno 6, as well as unorthodox instruments like a toy Concertmate organ and a Nintendo DS. “I also played guitar and did vocals,” says Stenzel, “some chanting… and some screaming, which comes naturally to me.” The score also features narration by Jodorowsky himself. As Stenzel notes, “Jodo’s voice is actually the soundtrack’s main musical instrument–listening to him was almost like hypnosis, like going to the guru every night.”

[Holman]

I recommend the documentary to everybody who loves Dune, weird SF, or idea that art can change the world.

The movie came up in a thread here about 2.5 years ago. Here's what I posted then:

Jodorowsky comes off as a megalomaniac ("My picture would have changed the world! It would have opened the minds of an entire generation!"), but he also seems like a sweet and lovely soul.

The documentary itself was completely neutral--there is no interviewer's presence to suggest whether the filmmakers believe J's Dune project was genius or lunacy. (However, most of the people interviewed about J. lack any industry stature, which may be an editorial message in itself.) There's a lot of nice discussion of the creative process and the sheer ambition involved in it, but there is frustratingly little about what the movie itself would have been like.

Of course the documentary isn't about Dune at all, but about Jodorowsky. It's not a science-fiction fan piece; it's about 1970's grandiosity and overreach. I enjoyed it, but not for the reasons I expected.

[Daehawk]

I think the music from both tv miniseries were just amazing. I still listen to tracks to this day on Youtube.

I can say I proudly own a 1976 first edition hardback of Children of Dune

[Jeff V]

I don't want to get into a fanwar over this, but Brian Herbert's stuff is awful both because he's a terrible writer (weak style, weak plotting, weak ideas) and because the stuff he invents is utterly unworthy of the themes and scope of the originals. These books make Star Wars' Episodes I-III look like masterpieces.

They can't hurt my Dune, though, because I refuse to acknowledge their existence.

I don't expect him to be his father. Kevin J. Anderson, his sidekick, is a decent writer. And in recent years where any hack can get published digitally (and I am periodically obliged to read and review such things), just about anything that has gotten some love by a professional editor is a joy to read.

There was a lot of implied history in Dune, and Brian fleshes it out. The Machine Wars was a seminal incident in Dune lore that forced humanity in a different direction than what we might project today. Various other factions in Dune, like the Bene Tlielax, were not wholly formed in Frank's original...we knew little more than they were a cult that could, in a fashion, resurrect people. Thanks to Brian, the horrible truth is now known.

[TiLT]

Oh yeah, that reminds me: Dune is perhaps the biggest inspiration Games Workshop lifted ideas from when they created Warhammer 40k. Some of the best ideas in that setting are straight out of Dune.

[Daehawk]

Speaking of Dune games I still say the best ever was Emperor: Battle for Dune...which I never did finish. Pretty sure I finished Dune 2000 or something on consoles.

[LordMortis]

Speaking of Dune games I still say the best ever was Emperor: Battle for Dune...which I never did finish. Pretty sure I finished Dune 2000 or something on consoles.

Dune II was by far the biggest RTS for me. It was my third. Hetzog Zwei and Dogs of War came before it and I loved both of them. But Dune II had its hooks in me.

[DD*]

I read the original book ages ago and don't remember a whole lot of it. I believe my reaction wasn't quite "meh" but the fact that I haven't re-read it (something I do regularly with books I like) once in 30+ years is not a ringing endorsement.

I'll gather my own tar and feathers, thanks.

[Jeff V]

I'll gather my own tar and feathers, thanks.

I'd call you a Heretic, but that would just conjure memories of the book Heretics of Dune, which wasn't very good and I can't fault anyone for passing on that book.

But not liking Dune? HE'S A WITCH! BURN HIM!!!

[El Guapo]

Speaking of Dune games I still say the best ever was Emperor: Battle for Dune...which I never did finish. Pretty sure I finished Dune 2000 or something on consoles.

Dune II was by far the biggest RTS for me. It was my third. Hetzog Zwei and Dogs of War came before it and I loved both of them. But Dune II had its hooks in me.

Dune II (which was great) is widely viewed as essentially establishing the RTS genre.

[morlac]

I read the original book ages ago and don't remember a whole lot of it. I believe my reaction wasn't quite "meh" but the fact that I haven't re-read it (something I do regularly with books I like) once in 30+ years is not a ringing endorsement.

I'll gather my own tar and feathers, thanks.

...this is me as well. Plus I have fallen asleep watching the movie about 6 times. I think I might have to give it another go. Hell, I used to not like Bacon when I was kid, which is just crazy. Don't tell anyone.

[LordMortis]

I seem to be the only person out there who loved the movie and that's rare for me and Lynch. Maybe that's why he disavowed it. I thought it captured the feel of the novel brilliantly. I'd love to have seen the 4 hour footage Lynch draft or even the 3 hour rough director's cut.

I found the TV show to be more true to the story but it totally failed to catch the feel. I think it lost me irretrievably when the Sadurkar arrived in Ballet uniforms.

[hentzau]

I tried reading the book back in high school, got bored out of my skull, and abandoned it about 100 pages in.

Then the movie came out, which I liked well enough, and it actually got me to read the book, since I now knew kind of where the story was going.

Then I tried the second book, got bored out of my skull, and abandoned it about 100 pages in.

[Jeff V]

I read the original book ages ago and don't remember a whole lot of it. I believe my reaction wasn't quite "meh" but the fact that I haven't re-read it (something I do regularly with books I like) once in 30+ years is not a ringing endorsement.

I'll gather my own tar and feathers, thanks.

...this is me as well. Plus I have fallen asleep watching the movie about 6 times. I think I might have to give it another go. Hell, I used to not like Bacon when I was kid, which is just crazy. Don't tell anyone.

The Lynch movie was dreadful. The miniseries was much better, because the story is far too long to be edited down to just 2 hours.

4 of us saw the movie when it came out in theaters. Me and another read the book and agreed the movie was just awful. The two that didn't read the book didn't understand most of what they just saw so could not express with any conviction that it was indeed awful.

[TiLT]

One thing to keep in mind is that Frank Herbert actually considered the first book to be incomplete. Dune and Dune Messiah were originally meant to be a single book, but for some reason I can't recall at the moment he had to split them up. In other words, Dune Messiah is actually the real ending to Dune that Frank Herbert had in mind when creating the story. As a result, Dune Messiah is also the shortest book in the series by a wide margin. Just reading Dune and then stopping will leave the reader with an incomplete and most likely incorrect impression of what kind of story this is, and I've seen a number of people make that mistake (not in this thread though, as far as I can see). As mentioned earlier, Dune looks like it's appealing to one particular trope (specifically, the Messiah/Chosen One trope), but that's not really what's going on. If you stop at the end of the first book, you might be left with the impression that the story is quite cliched in a way that it isn't really.

[Holman]

I read Dune the first time when I was 13, so my experience was colored by the fact that it begins with a young teenager also named Paul who turns out to be the Messiah of humankind.

But it was heady, heady stuff the first time in. The focus on religion and politics (taken seriously and treated with complexity) was a new thing for me in science fiction, and I spent lots of time imagining what went on in parts of society and the universe that Herbert never described. I wanted to know what other planets were like. I wanted to understand the economics of the Spacing Guild. I wanted to know where it all came from. I remember being fascinated with Count Hasimir Fenrig, the sympathetic assassin we later learn was himself a failed BG attempt at the Kwisatz Haderach.

I've reread Dune and the first few books many times. No, Frank Herbert isn't a tremendous stylist, and his moments of warmed-over Jungian psychology provide truly awful pseudo-explanations for historical forces. But his world-making is exquisite: he suggests depths as rich as Tolkien's, in that department at least, and always leaves you wanting to know more about the background. (What I hate about the new Dune books is that they bend over backwards to fill in all the blanks with material that seems so, so much weaker than what Herbert's ellipses allowed and provoked you to imagine.)

Incidentally, if you want an alternative set of explorations to the Brian Herbert books (and even the later Frank Herbert books), look for a copy of The Dune Encyclopedia, published after God-Emperor and before anything else. It's done in an entirely in-universe style, and half of the enjoyment is that it's presented as the work of scholars after Leto II's era trying to piece together what can be known of the events millennia before. (There are competing articles on Paul Atreides, for instance, one that basically reflects the canonical account from the novels and one that treats him as a mythic figure about whom little can be known.)

It's out of print, sadly, but it's not impossible to find. My copy is one of the treasures of my SF collection.

[LordMortis]

Someone back up the bus! Holman is the Messiah and no one ever told me? All these years and not one mention. The hell, man?

[Zarathud]

I couldn't follow the movie even after reading the books as a kid until my aunt bought me a Dune coloring book and the old Avalon Hill board game. With the backstory explained, the movie and books made more sense. I remember rereading them twice. It was the third time after the prequels when the whole picture made sense.

[Holman]

[Holman]

I couldn't follow the movie even after reading the books as a kid until my aunt bought me a Dune coloring book and the old Avalon Hill board game. With the backstory explained, the movie and books made more sense. I remember rereading them twice. It was the third time after the prequels when the whole picture made sense.

Dune coloring book?? I love it.

As I recall, Universal bet a lot on 1984's Dune being a blockbuster, and they even licensed a whole slew of tie-ins and toys worthy of a George Lucas project. Instead, though, it was David Lynch.

[Jeff V]

I couldn't follow the movie even after reading the books as a kid until my aunt bought me a Dune coloring book and the old Avalon Hill board game. With the backstory explained, the movie and books made more sense. I remember rereading them twice. It was the third time after the prequels when the whole picture made sense.

Dune coloring book?? I love it.

As I recall, Universal bet a lot on 1984's Dune being a blockbuster, and they even licensed a whole slew of tie-ins and toys worthy of a George Lucas project. Instead, though, it was David Lynch.

I seem to recall it being the most expensive movie ever produced at the time (when $45 million was a shocking number). And that was the crux of what was wrong with it...in universe where technology was outlawed, there was way too many special effects. The TV series with a much smaller budget had a truer vibe.

The other problem was the cartoonish buffoon that was Baron Harkonnen. Probably the best cast was Sting as Feyd Rautha, mostly because that was such a shallow character in the book.

[LordMortis]

The TV series with a much smaller budget had a truer vibe.

The vibe you get from the most feared army in the galaxy:

[xenocide]

I seem to be the only person out there who loved the movie and that's rare for me and Lynch. Maybe that's why he disavowed it. I thought it captured the feel of the novel brilliantly. I'd love to have seen the 4 hour footage Lynch draft or even the 3 hour rough director's cut.

I found the TV show to be more true to the story but it totally failed to catch the feel. I think it lost me irretrievably when the Sadurkar arrived in Ballet uniforms.

Well, you're not the only one but we're rare. I agree with you 100%. This thread is timely as I just started rereading Dune after seeing they are doing a re-read on TOR.com Just today I had to tape the cover back on my paperback as it had fallen off. One of my favorite novels of all time.

I also love the Lynch movie. You said it perfectly, "it captured the feel of the novel brilliantly". Stuff like the rubber stillsuits, steampunk vibe, Sardaukar bio suits, and the invented from whole cloth weirding modules are all different from the novel but really just set pieces. The contrast of the Harkonnens to the Atreides (in which I think the over the top Barron fits visually in contrast to Leto), the mysticism and religion of the Fremen, Paul's prescient vision and growth into the Kwisatz Haderach are all spot on. Yueh, Arrakis, and the worms were well done also. Obviously things were left out, but that happens in a movie. Chani's role was smaller but her relationship/love of/with Paul comes across. Liet/Kynes role was reduced a lot. Count Fenring is left out (I feel like this role could be done well in a shorter time frame if well written). Missionaria Proctectiva is left out Etc. There are some great scenes as well.

Spoiler:

The end of the Paul vs Feyd fight when Muad'dib shouts and cracks the floor and everyone jumps. "Usul no longer needs the weirding module". Hate on the weirding modules all you like, I love that scene.

It's true the SyFy mini series had more stuff in it, but did NOT have the right feel at all. They changed things in this version also but didn't capture the novel. Low production values (at least visually IMO, I don't know the actual figures) and bad acting did not help. Guy playing Paul was ok as Muad'dib but was terrible as young Paul A. I still consider the portrayal of Gurney Halleck in this series to be one of the worst acting performances I have ever seen.

Spoiler:

When Gurney attempts to kill Jessica because he believes her the traitor but then realizes he was wrong. I remember watching that scene and wondering "what just happened". It took me a while to realize that the actor was attempting to act sorry/abashed. bad bad bad

OK, didn't set out to write full on reviews. Oh well. A new Game of Thrones style mini series could be unbelievably awesome.

[Holman]

My sense of what Dune characters looks like was first shaped by the Avalon Hill boardgame.



But, still, nothing tops Sir Patrick's Gurney Halleck fighting while holding the Atreides pug.

[hitbyambulance]

Pug Atreides.

i was disappointed to find that House Ordos (from the Dune RTS games) never existed in the original books.